IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Religion and Philosophy
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags !MOD BOX WARNING!

Reply
Old 15th July 2022, 02:14 AM   #1681
Emre_1974tr
Graduate Poster
 
Emre_1974tr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Turkey
Posts: 1,102
I said;

Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Emre_1974tr is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2022, 03:14 AM   #1682
aleCcowaN
imperfecto del subjuntivo
 
aleCcowaN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: stranded at Buenos Aires, a city that, like NYC or Paris, has so little to offer...
Posts: 9,521
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
I said;
Yet you didn't. Why don't you admit you are with no answer to that? It's pretty clear you episodically post here your whim of the day.
__________________
Horrible dipsomaniacs and other addicts, be gone and get treated.These fora are full of scientists and specialists. Most of them turn back to pumpkins the second they log out.
If the horse reasons the Kentucky Derby is over
aleCcowaN is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd August 2022, 04:02 PM   #1683
Emre_1974tr
Graduate Poster
 
Emre_1974tr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Turkey
Posts: 1,102
HEAVEN IS NOT PARADISE IT IS UNIVERSE

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0


Noah's Flood was regional and targeted at one community

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611988.0
Emre_1974tr is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd August 2022, 05:44 PM   #1684
Gord_in_Toronto
Penultimate Amazing
 
Gord_in_Toronto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,134
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
HEAVEN IS NOT PARADISE IT IS UNIVERSE

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611687.0


Noah's Flood was regional and targeted at one community

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611988.0
If you throw away the silliest parts of the Flood Story it does not make any of the rest of it true. The Holy Bible (Blessed be Its Words) clearly says that all creatures were to be killed, that the rain fell for forty days and nights and waters covered the mountains of the Earth. Besides which Christians have discovered all sorts of evidence that it happened. Are you calling them liars?

__________________
"Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick
Gord_in_Toronto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd August 2022, 06:45 PM   #1685
junkshop
Graduate Poster
 
junkshop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: By a rock. Tempted to crawl under it.
Posts: 1,334
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
HEAVEN IS NOT PARADISE IT IS UNIVERSE
Syntax error


Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Noah's Flood was regional and targeted at one community
That seems a bit vindictive.
__________________
Not a Cockney, but possibly Australian...so Dick Van Dyke, basically.
junkshop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd August 2022, 06:46 PM   #1686
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Ngunnawal Country
Posts: 79,046
Originally Posted by junkshop View Post
That seems a bit vindictive.
OT God vindictive? Inconceivable!
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd August 2022, 08:19 PM   #1687
Norman Alexander
Penultimate Amazing
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Gundungurra
Posts: 12,916
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Noah's Flood was regional and targeted at one community

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611988.0
And quoting that page:

Quote:
Here, too, it is clearly stated that it was the people of Noah who were drowned in the water and taken into the Fire in the Hereafter
So... First soaked, then roasted? Is there a recipe for a nice basting sauce there as well?
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornetsí nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st August 2022, 03:27 AM   #1688
heydarian saeed
Graduate Poster
 
heydarian saeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: Iran-Kashan
Posts: 1,117
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Examples:

Quran 50:38 We have created the heavens, the earth and what is between them in six days, and no fatigue touched Us.

Quran 7:40 Those who have denied Our signs, and reacted to them with arrogance, the gates of the sky will not open for them, nor will they enter paradise until the camel passes through the eye of a needle. It is such that We recompense the criminals.


1- God is not tired.

2- Not rich people, the disbelievers/bad peoples will go to hell.
Hi everyone
Unfortunately, you do not have a complete knowledge of Arabic language and Quranic literature and the revelation of its verses. Even in terms of the history of the Qur'an and the content of the verses of the Qur'an, you have very little information. Therefore, you cannot comment on the Quran and the content of its verses. I recommend that you first complete your knowledge about the content of the Qur'an and then comment. God alone has never said anything illogical or correct without reason in the Quran and other holy books. And in this field, his knowledge is complete. And he is not tired. You only see the apparent meaning of the Qur'anic verses. And even incompletely!
You are not tired. I recommend you rest.
heydarian saeed is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st August 2022, 05:37 AM   #1689
Emre_1974tr
Graduate Poster
 
Emre_1974tr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Turkey
Posts: 1,102
Originally Posted by heydarian saeed View Post
Hi everyone
Unfortunately, you do not have a complete knowledge st.
Under names like Sufism, Şiaism, they have made you adopt these deviant beliefs.

Because they cannot touch the verses, this time they give them symbolic meanings and make you spiritists.

The Quran is a clear book. But some verses have secondary and tertiary meanings besides their first clear meaning. But as I said, first you have to believe in the first clear meaning of the verse. Then you will do mental gymnastics on the other meanings.

Secondly, right now we have only one holy book, the Quran.

You don't know the history of the Quran, you don't know the verses of the Quran. You have only swallowed the lies that the Shiite religion or other sects have imposed on you as religion and you have been deceived.

Peace
Emre_1974tr is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st August 2022, 06:08 AM   #1690
junkshop
Graduate Poster
 
junkshop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: By a rock. Tempted to crawl under it.
Posts: 1,334
Originally Posted by heydarian saeed View Post
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Examples:

Quran 50:38 We have created the heavens, the earth and what is between them in six days, and no fatigue touched Us.

Quran 7:40 Those who have denied Our signs, and reacted to them with arrogance, the gates of the sky will not open for them, nor will they enter paradise until the camel passes through the eye of a needle. It is such that We recompense the criminals.


1- God is not tired.

2- Not rich people, the disbelievers/bad peoples will go to hell.
Hi everyone
Unfortunately, you do not have a complete knowledge of Arabic language and Quranic literature and the revelation of its verses. Even in terms of the history of the Qur'an and the content of the verses of the Qur'an, you have very little information. Therefore, you cannot comment on the Quran and the content of its verses. I recommend that you first complete your knowledge about the content of the Qur'an and then comment. God alone has never said anything illogical or correct without reason in the Quran and other holy books. And in this field, his knowledge is complete. And he is not tired. You only see the apparent meaning of the Qur'anic verses. And even incompletely!
You are not tired. I recommend you rest.
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Originally Posted by heydarian saeed View Post
Hi everyone
Unfortunately, you do not have a complete knowledge st.
Under names like Sufism, Şiaism, they have made you adopt these deviant beliefs.

Because they cannot touch the verses, this time they give them symbolic meanings and make you spiritists.

The Quran is a clear book. But some verses have secondary and tertiary meanings besides their first clear meaning. But as I said, first you have to believe in the first clear meaning of the verse. Then you will do mental gymnastics on the other meanings.

Secondly, right now we have only one holy book, the Quran.

You don't know the history of the Quran, you don't know the verses of the Quran. You have only swallowed the lies that the Shiite religion or other sects have imposed on you as religion and you have been deceived.

Peace
__________________
Not a Cockney, but possibly Australian...so Dick Van Dyke, basically.
junkshop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st August 2022, 08:56 AM   #1691
Gord_in_Toronto
Penultimate Amazing
 
Gord_in_Toronto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,134
Originally Posted by junkshop View Post
Needs more popcorn!

You pervert the Holy Word of the Lord. I interpret it.
__________________
"Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick
Gord_in_Toronto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 1st September 2022, 08:56 AM   #1692
Lukraak_Sisser
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,736
Oh I wondered when our two experts on Islam would start commenting in each other's threads.

Both of you claim your holy book is perfect and incorruptible and totally clear and open to only one way of reading.
You disagree with each other.

How is that possible?
Lukraak_Sisser is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 1st September 2022, 09:17 AM   #1693
catsmate
No longer the 1
 
catsmate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 27,612
Originally Posted by Gord_in_Toronto View Post
Needs more popcorn!

You pervert the Holy Word of the Lord. I interpret it.
Ah, an irregular verb.
__________________
As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.
catsmate is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 1st September 2022, 09:56 AM   #1694
heydarian saeed
Graduate Poster
 
heydarian saeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: Iran-Kashan
Posts: 1,117
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Under names like Sufism, Şiaism, they have made you adopt these deviant beliefs.

Because they cannot touch the verses, this time they give them symbolic meanings and make you spiritists.

The Quran is a clear book. But some verses have secondary and tertiary meanings besides their first clear meaning. But as I said, first you have to believe in the first clear meaning of the verse. Then you will do mental gymnastics on the other meanings.

Secondly, right now we have only one holy book, the Quran.

You don't know the history of the Quran, you don't know the verses of the Quran. You have only swallowed the lies that the Shiite religion or other sects have imposed on you as religion and you have been deceived.

Peace
Hi
No, it is not as you imagine and judge. Your scientific knowledge about the history of the Qur'an, the content of its verses and the different meanings of the words of the Qur'an, as well as the history of Shia, is little and weak. Please increase your knowledge in this field and then comment.
Thanks
heydarian saeed is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 1st September 2022, 10:11 AM   #1695
Gord_in_Toronto
Penultimate Amazing
 
Gord_in_Toronto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,134
Originally Posted by heydarian saeed View Post
Hi
No, it is not as you imagine and judge. Your scientific knowledge about the history of the Qur'an, the content of its verses and the different meanings of the words of the Qur'an, as well as the history of Shia, is little and weak. Please increase your knowledge in this field and then comment.
Thanks
Are you the one interpreting? Or perverting? If God speaks ambiguously, who gets to interpret what he means?
__________________
"Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick
Gord_in_Toronto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 1st September 2022, 01:59 PM   #1696
Emre_1974tr
Graduate Poster
 
Emre_1974tr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Turkey
Posts: 1,102
Originally Posted by heydarian saeed View Post
Hi
No, it is not as you imagine and judge. You
Thanks
On the contrary, you are the ignorant one, my friend.

I know your pagan Shia religion very deeply.

I hope that one day you can leave it and turn to God's religion of Islam.

If you want to see the first signs that you don't know the Quran at all, start with this, my friend: Why did you adopt pagan beliefs that are not in the Quran, but are in the false Bible, such as stoning, circumcision, the spirit world, communism, asceticism, wearing a headscarf, holy people, black stone? Why did you make people your masters/lords/Rabbis if Allah should be the only master? Why did you adopt a doctrine that is the exact opposite of Islam and disobey Allah who created you? Good luck to you.

Peace

Last edited by Emre_1974tr; 1st September 2022 at 02:11 PM.
Emre_1974tr is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 2nd September 2022, 08:33 AM   #1697
Jim_MDP
Philosopher
 
Jim_MDP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: N.Cal/S.Or
Posts: 9,197
Originally Posted by junkshop View Post
Lol... like watching Vulcans bitch slap one another.


.
https://youtu.be/bZ6wBgSu5Ak
__________________
----------------------
Anything goes in the Goblin hut... anything.

"Suggesting spurious explanations isn't relevant to my work." -- WTC Dust.
"Both cannot be simultaneously true, and so one may conclude neither is true, and if neither is true, then Apollo is fraudulent." -- Patrick1000.
Jim_MDP is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 2nd September 2022, 09:41 AM   #1698
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 41,990
This thread is like watching a Toynbee Tile argue with a bottle of Dr. Bronner's soap.
__________________
"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong.
JoeMorgue is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th September 2022, 09:37 AM   #1699
Emre_1974tr
Graduate Poster
 
Emre_1974tr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Turkey
Posts: 1,102
Why are Christian women converting to Islam?

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611569.0
Emre_1974tr is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th September 2022, 11:03 AM   #1700
Lukraak_Sisser
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,736
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Why are Christian women converting to Islam?

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611569.0
Depends on the case I guess?

I most cases I know if it's because they love someone who is so insecure in his faith they cannot marry someone who does not follow it.

But in many Islamic countries because they'll be killed otherwise?
Lukraak_Sisser is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th September 2022, 03:06 PM   #1701
Norman Alexander
Penultimate Amazing
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Gundungurra
Posts: 12,916
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Why are Christian women converting to Islam?

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611569.0
Why are you spamming stuff from your own forum that is over a year old, and you got your ass soundly spanked on the subject even there? Are you just ignoring that, pretending it didn't happen, and trying to get a rerun here for a different result?
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornetsí nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015

Last edited by Norman Alexander; 11th September 2022 at 03:07 PM.
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th September 2022, 04:24 PM   #1702
Crossbow
Seeking Honesty and Sanity
 
Crossbow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 14,312
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Why are Christian women converting to Islam?

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611569.0
It is all my fault.

For the last few months I have given five dollars and a t-shirt to every woman who converts to Islam.
__________________
On 29JUL2022, 'Gaetan' said: "We all know here that the moderators are for the use of firearms and they don't mind if some people recieve a bullet in their head."

On 15FEB2019 'BobTheCoward' said: "I constantly assert I am a fool."

A man's best friend is his dogma.
Crossbow is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th September 2022, 01:57 AM   #1703
Cosmic Yak
Philosopher
 
Cosmic Yak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Where there's never a road broader than the back of your hand.
Posts: 6,367
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
Why are Christian women converting to Islam?

https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9611569.0
The ironic thing is that, if this is actually true, it means there will be more people who know enough about Islam to recognise that Emre's version of it is heretical.
__________________
'Of course it can be OK to mistreat people.'- shuttlt

Cosmic Yak on this forum.
Cosmic Yak is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th September 2022, 02:36 AM   #1704
Emre_1974tr
Graduate Poster
 
Emre_1974tr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Turkey
Posts: 1,102
Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak View Post
The ironic thing is that, if this is actually true, it means there will be more people who know enough about Islam to recognise that Emre's version of it is l.
On the contrary, they send me thank you e-mails and say that because of me they have turned to the true Islam in the Quran.

Peace
Emre_1974tr is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th September 2022, 02:39 AM   #1705
Susheel
Master Poster
 
Susheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hyderabad, India
Posts: 2,975
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
On the contrary, they send me thank you e-mails and say that because of me they have turned to the true Islam in the Quran.

Peace
Do they all also stand up and clap?
__________________
I've got to get to a library...fast Robert Langdon
Susheel is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th September 2022, 03:32 AM   #1706
Norman Alexander
Penultimate Amazing
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Gundungurra
Posts: 12,916
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
On the contrary, they send me thank you e-mails and say that because of me they have turned to the true Islam in the Quran.

Peace
You send yourself emails pretending to be women??
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornetsí nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th September 2022, 04:08 AM   #1707
Crossbow
Seeking Honesty and Sanity
 
Crossbow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 14,312
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
On the contrary, they send me thank you e-mails and say that because of me they have turned to the true Islam in the Quran.

Peace
Well then, if this is the case, then I am sure that your god will be very happy having you as his spokesperson.
__________________
On 29JUL2022, 'Gaetan' said: "We all know here that the moderators are for the use of firearms and they don't mind if some people recieve a bullet in their head."

On 15FEB2019 'BobTheCoward' said: "I constantly assert I am a fool."

A man's best friend is his dogma.
Crossbow is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th September 2022, 04:59 AM   #1708
Cosmic Yak
Philosopher
 
Cosmic Yak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Where there's never a road broader than the back of your hand.
Posts: 6,367
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
On the contrary, they send me thank you e-mails and say that because of me they have turned to the true Islam in the Quran.

Peace
__________________
'Of course it can be OK to mistreat people.'- shuttlt

Cosmic Yak on this forum.
Cosmic Yak is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th September 2022, 12:55 AM   #1709
Cosmic Yak
Philosopher
 
Cosmic Yak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Where there's never a road broader than the back of your hand.
Posts: 6,367
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
On the contrary, they send me thank you e-mails and say that because of me they have turned to the true Islam in the Quran.

Peace
I note a distinct lack of emails from grateful women in that thread you linked to.
How about you cover up the personal details, and then post some screenshots of these gushing tributes to your manly preaching ability? Let us see some evidence for your claim.
Incidentally, Saudi internet will not let me access your site. It seems the Custodians of the Two Holy Mosques do not consider your beliefs to be 'the true Islam'. Is there any Islamic authority that does?
__________________
'Of course it can be OK to mistreat people.'- shuttlt

Cosmic Yak on this forum.
Cosmic Yak is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th September 2022, 03:19 PM   #1710
Thor 2
Philosopher
 
Thor 2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Tiny town west of Brisbane.
Posts: 7,119
Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak View Post
I note a distinct lack of emails from grateful women in that thread you linked to.
How about you cover up the personal details, and then post some screenshots of these gushing tributes to your manly preaching ability? Let us see some evidence for your claim.
Incidentally, Saudi internet will not let me access your site. It seems the Custodians of the Two Holy Mosques do not consider your beliefs to be 'the true Islam'. Is there any Islamic authority that does?

I thought there was no authority, that was accepted as being representative of true Islam in a wide ranging way. Unlike the Catholic Church, having the one wearing the "shoes of the fisherman" (for those naive enough to believe it), Islam does not have one figurehead, handed down some authority bestowed by Mohamed. No wonder there are so many versions of the true meaning of the Koran.
__________________
Thinking is a faith hazard.

Last edited by Thor 2; 17th September 2022 at 03:26 PM.
Thor 2 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 18th September 2022, 04:47 AM   #1711
Cosmic Yak
Philosopher
 
Cosmic Yak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Where there's never a road broader than the back of your hand.
Posts: 6,367
Originally Posted by Thor 2 View Post
I thought there was no authority, that was accepted as being representative of true Islam in a wide ranging way. Unlike the Catholic Church, having the one wearing the "shoes of the fisherman" (for those naive enough to believe it), Islam does not have one figurehead, handed down some authority bestowed by Mohamed. No wonder there are so many versions of the true meaning of the Koran.
Well, yes and no.
There is no central authority, some Islamic equivalent of the Pope, but there are authorities.
These can range from respected scholars (muftis), to institutions like Cairo's Al Azhar University, to groups like Saudi Arabia's Council of Senior Scholars, and the Permanent Committee for Scholarly Research. Because of their learning and high postions within the Islamic community, their statements are considered to be more authoritative than those who do not share this status.
My question to Emre, then, was asking if any of these scholars or groups had stated that his version of Islam has a solid basis within Islamic scholarship and orthodoxy.
It is an interesting point, too, because essentially anyone can set themselves up as an Islamic authority, claim any kind of interpretation of the Quran is valid, no matter how far-fetched (Hi, heydarian!), reject any and all of the Hadiths, and still claim to be preaching the authentic word of Allah.
You'd think Allah would stop this kind of thing going on, wouldn't you? Muddles the message somewhat.
Of course, if he doesn't exist at all, that would explain his curious absence....
__________________
'Of course it can be OK to mistreat people.'- shuttlt

Cosmic Yak on this forum.
Cosmic Yak is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 18th September 2022, 02:41 PM   #1712
sackett
Philosopher
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Detroit
Posts: 7,959
How on God's green earth is this thread still alive?

The Model 1974 _Emre connects the false wearers of Torah injils' undies tr, & after that it's every imam for himself.
__________________
If you would learn a man's character, give him authority.

If you would ruin a man's character, let him seize power.
sackett is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 11:22 AM   #1713
Crossbow
Seeking Honesty and Sanity
 
Crossbow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 14,312
Oh gee whiz!

This is almost too much for the Forum.

Originally Posted by heydarian saeed View Post
Hi
No, it is not as you ['Emre_1974tr'] imagine and judge. Your scientific knowledge about the history of the Qur'an, the content of its verses and the different meanings of the words of the Qur'an, as well as the history of Shia, is little and weak. Please increase your knowledge in this field and then comment.
Thanks
Originally Posted by Emre_1974tr View Post
On the contrary, you are the ignorant one, my friend.

I know your pagan Shia religion very deeply.

I hope that one day you ['heydarian saeed'] can leave it and turn to God's religion of Islam.

If you want to see the first signs that you don't know the Quran at all, start with this, my friend: Why did you adopt pagan beliefs that are not in the Quran, but are in the false Bible, such as stoning, circumcision, the spirit world, communism, asceticism, wearing a headscarf, holy people, black stone? Why did you make people your masters/lords/Rabbis if Allah should be the only master? Why did you adopt a doctrine that is the exact opposite of Islam and disobey Allah who created you? Good luck to you.

Peace
To 'heydarian saeed' and 'Emre_1974tr':

Just in case you have missed it, the fact that both of you are so very sure that your particular religious view is the correct religious view, even though both of you have very different ideas about these religious views, only serves to show how very wrong both of you actually are.

After all, there are most likely millions and millions of other people in the world who are just as convinced as you both are that their religious view is the correct religious view and that everyone else who holds a different religious view is wrong.

But in this case, since both of you all were kind enough to post some of your religious inanity to the same Forum at the same time, then your behavior has provided an excellent example of just how delusional religion can be.
__________________
On 29JUL2022, 'Gaetan' said: "We all know here that the moderators are for the use of firearms and they don't mind if some people recieve a bullet in their head."

On 15FEB2019 'BobTheCoward' said: "I constantly assert I am a fool."

A man's best friend is his dogma.
Crossbow is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 12:41 PM   #1714
Gord_in_Toronto
Penultimate Amazing
 
Gord_in_Toronto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,134
Originally Posted by Crossbow View Post
Oh gee whiz!

This is almost too much for the Forum.





To 'heydarian saeed' and 'Emre_1974tr':

Just in case you have missed it, the fact that both of you are so very sure that your particular religious view is the correct religious view, even though both of you have very different ideas about these religious views, only serves to show how very wrong both of you actually are.

After all, there are most likely millions and millions of other people in the world who are just as convinced as you both are that their religious view is the correct religious view and that everyone else who holds a different religious view is wrong.

But in this case, since both of you all were kind enough to post some of your religious inanity to the same Forum at the same time, then your behavior has provided an excellent example of just how delusional religion can be.
One of the things that finally confirmed my atheism was the realization that others in the world believed in just the same sort silly **** I had been taught but that it was a different sort of silly ****.
__________________
"Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick
Gord_in_Toronto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 03:00 PM   #1715
Thor 2
Philosopher
 
Thor 2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Tiny town west of Brisbane.
Posts: 7,119
Originally Posted by Gord_in_Toronto View Post
One of the things that finally confirmed my atheism was the realization that others in the world believed in just the same sort silly **** I had been taught but that it was a different sort of silly ****.



This is why there are 40,000 or more different versions of Christianity alone. Different groups just can't agree on what **** their god is on about, and raises to the top. I will go further than this and suggest there are differences between each persons perception of their god. So you could say there are billions of gods, one unique to the mind of each believer, and the only place that god exist, is in that individuals brain.
__________________
Thinking is a faith hazard.
Thor 2 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 07:03 PM   #1716
Gord_in_Toronto
Penultimate Amazing
 
Gord_in_Toronto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,134
Originally Posted by Thor 2 View Post


This is why there are 40,000 or more different versions of Christianity alone. Different groups just can't agree on what **** their god is on about, and raises to the top. I will go further than this and suggest there are differences between each persons perception of their god. So you could say there are billions of gods, one unique to the mind of each believer, and the only place that god exist, is in that individuals brain.
In the past I have posted a list of gods that was generated in some Usenet Newsgroup (alt.atheism, maybe). I can't seem to find it right now but this guy has a list of over 3000: List of Gods.

All the way from Aakuluujjusi to Zywie. Take your pick, there is almost enough choice for everybody.
__________________
"Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick
Gord_in_Toronto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 07:06 PM   #1717
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Ngunnawal Country
Posts: 79,046
Originally Posted by Gord_in_Toronto View Post
One of the things that finally confirmed my atheism was the realization that others in the world believed in just the same sort silly **** I had been taught but that it was a different sort of silly ****.
This was one of mine too. What is more likely - that 399,000 religions are wrong and one is right, or that 400,000 religions are wrong?
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 10:10 PM   #1718
Lukraak_Sisser
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,736
I say praise be to Bastet.

Her divine messengers clearly show they are touched by a god and grace us mere mortals with their presence.

Now feed us human!
Lukraak_Sisser is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th September 2022, 11:28 PM   #1719
LongFuzzy
Critical Thinker
 
LongFuzzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 372
That always reminds me of the conversation in Contact (movie), after her 'boyfriend' kills her chance of being on the machine. It's been a while, but as I remember it,she asks why he did it, and he said something like, billions of people believe in some form of God, but you don't. You think billions of people are wrong, and you are right. She doesn't really answer, but I was thinking, YES they are all wrong!
LongFuzzy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 20th September 2022, 02:41 AM   #1720
catsmate
No longer the 1
 
catsmate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 27,612
Originally Posted by Gord_in_Toronto View Post
In the past I have posted a list of gods that was generated in some Usenet Newsgroup (alt.atheism, maybe). I can't seem to find it right now but this guy has a list of over 3000: List of Gods.

All the way from Aakuluujjusi to Zywie. Take your pick, there is almost enough choice for everybody.
Still a few billion to go
__________________
As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.
catsmate is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Religion and Philosophy

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:32 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.