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Tags DeSantis , electioneering , florida , immigration

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Old 26th September 2022, 05:12 AM   #521
The Don
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
This sounds more idiotic every time I hear it parroted around here. As though conservatives and Republicans are a group of aspiring Supervillains.
If only they had the intelligence, talent and work ethic to become aspiring Supervillains.

Instead they're more like the jocks and mean girls in '80s high school drama films picking on the smart kids or anyone else who fails to meet their standards of "worthy" while showing a cartoonish complete lack of intelligence or empathy.
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Old 26th September 2022, 05:46 AM   #522
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Iím just enjoying the irony, intentionally or not, of complaining about being treated like a stereotypical villain while simultaneously monologue-ing about the worthless, dirty under-class. Honestly, the only thing that would make it more perfect would be idly twirling a mustache with one finger.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:18 AM   #523
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Iím just enjoying the irony, intentionally or not, of complaining about being treated like a stereotypical villain while simultaneously monologue-ing about the worthless, dirty under-class. Honestly, the only thing that would make it more perfect would be idly twirling a mustache with one finger.
My problem with this is, the poster you refer to is doing what they always seem to do. In this case, turning the thread away from a discussion of DeSantis and his policies and turning it into a thread about themselves, their feelings and the shortcomings of other posters. They find the migrants to be "nauseating," other people's positions are "idiotic." This gets repeated over and over and based on experience I doubt we can expect to see anything else.

That isn't taking part in a discussion about DeSantis and his policies, it's the opposite.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:29 AM   #524
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I've been reminding everyone I know that enjoys being all up Trump's ass lately, that early in his term he was offered a deal to get his wall money, in exchange for dealing with DACA, 700,000 kids that were already here.
But the "deal maker" wouldn't do it, and as such, any problems that exist today could have been stopped there and then, and Trump could have claimed a campaign promise kept, even if Mexico didn't pay for it. Surprisingly, most seem to have never heard about it, or flat out call it a lie, despite plenty of evidence to the contrary.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...l-daca/551288/
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:38 AM   #525
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Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
I've been reminding everyone I know that enjoys being all up Trump's ass lately, that early in his term he was offered a deal to get his wall money, in exchange for dealing with DACA, 700,000 kids that were already here.
But the "deal maker" wouldn't do it, and as such, any problems that exist today could have been stopped there and then, and Trump could have claimed a campaign promise kept, even if Mexico didn't pay for it. Surprisingly, most seem to have never heard about it, or flat out call it a lie, despite plenty of evidence to the contrary.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...l-daca/551288/

What does Trump have to do with DeSantis and the shouldn't-be-legal aliens that were transported to Martha's Vineyard? Or even the pathetic Dem immigration policies that the GOP is protesting with such action?
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:42 AM   #526
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
...As though conservatives and Republicans are a group of aspiring Supervillains.
Oh no, I would never use the word "supervillains" to describe Republicans. First, the "super" part implies an intellectual capacity they do not possess. Second, "villain" kind of soft-pedals the very real damage they do. I think it's sufficient to strip away the rhetoric and simply call them bad people who want bad things to happen to people with whom they do not agree. And I have no doubt whatsoever that future historians will consider them such, when they record all the ways Republicans of this era damaged this country. As contemporaries, our chore today is to devote ourselves to doing all we can to limit the length of that future list.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:44 AM   #527
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
That isn't taking part in a discussion about DeSantis and his policies, it's the opposite.

Sure it is. It is discussing the justification and motivation for his actions. These people should have been deported in the first place. The discussion of their hardship getting here is about as big a tangent as anything else. It is like saying, "we should let the bank robbers have their freedom, they traveled across 20 states to rob that bank!" These people are truly criminals, and they are being pandered to.

But yeah, liberals are just weeping for these "mistreated" migrants.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:45 AM   #528
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Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
But the "deal maker" wouldn't do it, and as such, any problems that exist today could have been stopped there and then, and Trump could have claimed a campaign promise kept, even if Mexico didn't pay for it.
I do recall that, actually. The problem is that immigration, like abortion, is subject that conservative politicians want people to be mad at, but not actually "fix". Once the conservative position beats out, it immediately shows all the gaping problems with that position that they then need to defend but desperately don't want to defend.

DeSantis's criminal stunt doesn't land as well once you realize that he's trafficking 100% legal, but impoverished, refugees across the country like pawns in a human-sized game of chess.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:48 AM   #529
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
DeSantis's criminal stunt doesn't land as well once you realize that he's trafficking 100% legal, but impoverished, refugees across the country like pawns in a human-sized game of chess.

It all sits perfectly well once you realize that they very likely tried to enter this country illegally.

The symbolism of telling them to GTFO of FL is perfect. We don't want those types on our soil, is the message.

And conservative voters are going to love that thinking.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:51 AM   #530
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
These people are truly criminals, and they are being pandered to.
Has this been evidenced?
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:53 AM   #531
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Originally Posted by RecoveringYuppy View Post
Has this been evidenced?

Plenty of discussion earlier of why this is 100% true. Of course Dems will say "they have a special exception!". I don't give a damn about that. If they are crawling across the borders illegally, they are criminals, imo. They committed the same crime as Mexicans who are being deported for the same actions.
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Old 26th September 2022, 06:58 AM   #532
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
...DeSantis's criminal stunt doesn't land as well once you realize that he's trafficking 100% legal, but impoverished, refugees across the country like pawns in a human-sized game of chess.
This is the thing that gets me. A governor of one state selects people in another state, lies to them about where they are going and what will happen to them once they got there, and sends them to a third state. And there are people actually defending and applauding this action?

It seems incredible that the country we're talking about here is the U.S.A. How did our political behavior fall to such a disgustingly low standard? What weaknesses in our system produced the (apparently substantial) number of Americans who think this is a good idea? Sure most people are outraged, but 10 years ago something like this would have seemed inconceivable.

I wish I could understand, but all explanations inevitably boil down to the same thing: we want to get our way, and we don't care what happens to you if you don't agree with us. How have so many people grown to hate every ideal on which this country was founded?
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:01 AM   #533
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Plenty of discussion earlier of why this is 100% true. Of course Dems will say "they have a special exception!". I don't give a damn about that. If they are crawling across the borders illegally, they are criminals, imo. They committed the same crime as Mexicans who are being deported for the same actions.
Your post 4 says they are not illegals.
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:06 AM   #534
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Originally Posted by RecoveringYuppy View Post
Your post 4 says they are not illegals.

At that point I did not know the facts about the special exception made to Venezuelans who cross illegally. As I posted a couple pages back, that revelation changed my viewpoint of this whole event.
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:08 AM   #535
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
At that point I did not know the facts about the special exception made to Venezuelans who cross illegally. As I posted a couple pages back, that revelation changed my viewpoint of this whole event.
Isn't that exception a law, thus making them legal?
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:12 AM   #536
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
At that point I did not know the facts about the special exception made to Venezuelans who cross illegally. As I posted a couple pages back, that revelation changed my viewpoint of this whole event.
Isn't that exception a law, thus making them legal?

ETA: Here's a link. Some reason this exception isn't legal? Appears to be a rule change authorized by law.

https://www.federalregister.gov/docu...-of-employment
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:14 AM   #537
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Originally Posted by RecoveringYuppy View Post
Isn't that exception a law, thus making them legal?

It is a suck ass law. Any reasonable person can see this. If anything, I'm surprised libs aren't up-in-arms about the massive amount of people being deported for the same crime of crossing illegally (some are, no doubt). It is a law that is unequally enforced, based upon country of origin.

"We made murder legal for Hatians. All others face the death penalty". These stupid immigration policies need to be changed, and I hope more attention is being drawn to them by stunts like DeSantis pulled.
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:19 AM   #538
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International human rights organizations urge people in places where the rule of law is compromised, where a society has become dysfunctional to the point ordinary citizens are in danger with no effective state agency to turn to, LEAVE. Leave by any means available, but leave. Even if you have to enter another country illegally...at least you're still going to be alive.

From the NPR report:
Quote:
"My kids' future was very uncertain in Venezuela Ė that's why we wanted to leave," said Denny Velasco, a migrant traveling with his wife, Kimberly GonzŠlez, and their two young kids, ages 3 and 10 months. "It's not safe, you live in fear," Velasco said in Spanish. Both Velasco and GonzŠlez have degrees in business, and they were both working at a car dealership in Caracas. But they say the economy in Venezuela has collapsed. They could barely afford to feed their kids, and their neighborhood was overrun by gangs. NPR link
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:20 AM   #539
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If DeSotted becomes the new face of the republican party, as is altogether fitting and proper, then good! hooooray! say I. That animal-looking SOB was born for the part.

He sure & hell isn't good for anything else.
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Old 26th September 2022, 07:26 AM   #540
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
It is a suck ass law.
But it is a law so they are not illegal. You've been lying every time you said this since you obviously knew the facts.

Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Any reasonable person can see this.
I can't. It's perfectly obvious why Venezuelan's should be an exception right now.

Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
If anything, I'm surprised libs aren't up-in-arms about the massive amount of people being deported for the same crime of crossing illegally (some are, no doubt).
No. This isn't a crime so it can't be "the same crime".

Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
It is a law that is unequally enforced, based upon country of origin.
No it's law that is being properly enforced and includes an exception for a country.

We treat other countries differently all the time. Sometimes that has been for bad reasons but this doesn't appear to be one of those time to me.

Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"We made murder legal for Hatians. All others face the death penalty". These stupid immigration policies need to be changed, and I hope more attention is being drawn to them by stunts like DeSantis pulled.
The fact that you can be stupid doesn't mean that everything is stupid.

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Old 26th September 2022, 07:58 AM   #541
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#RecoveringYuppy: Let me edit a tiny bit:

"Just because you're stupid doesn't mean everything's stupid."

Goddamn! I'm stealing that 'un!

RY, let me add that you are a terrible, awful, dreadfully mean person. Don't ever change.
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Old 26th September 2022, 08:19 AM   #542
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
It is a suck ass law.
Only to suck-ass people whose first question upon hearing about asylum-seeking refugees fleeing from starvation, economic collapse and government hit squads is, "what color is their skin".

Quote:
Any reasonable person can see this.
Well poisoning fallacy. I'm getting close to BINGO now.

Quote:
If anything, I'm surprised libs aren't up-in-arms about the massive amount of people being deported for the same crime of crossing illegally (some are, no doubt). It is a law that is unequally enforced, based upon country of origin.
Yeah, because not all countries are the same. If someone were to illegally sneak in from Norway or Canada, I say send him back and tell him to apply for a visa. But people are fleeing Venezuela because things have gotten really, really bad there. People are making dangerous journeys seeking asylum, often with their young children, because they're sure that staying home is far more dangerous. That's why the laws have been amended so that people from Venezuela can turn themselves in to U.S. authorities and legally begin the asylum application process.

Quote:
"We made murder legal for Hatians. All others face the death penalty".
Seriously, Warp, what the **** are you doing? What the **** does that even mean? That's one of the ********* attempts at an argument I've ever seen. How the **** do you compare, "making an exception allowing people from a dystopian nightmare country, where they face a high probability of being murdered, to apply for legal asylum", with, "making it legal for Haitians to commit murder"? You're making a ridiculous parody of your own arguments.

Quote:
These stupid immigration policies need to be changed, and I hope more attention is being drawn to them by stunts like DeSantis pulled.
You're right, Warp. These dirty, brown Venezuelans should go through the proper channels to apply for visas before they try to leave their country controlled by a violently repressive totalitarian regime, or at least have the decency to be white before they try to enter the U.S.
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Old 26th September 2022, 08:33 AM   #543
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
International human rights organizations urge people in places where the rule of law is compromised, where a society has become dysfunctional to the point ordinary citizens are in danger with no effective state agency to turn to, LEAVE. Leave by any means available, but leave. Even if you have to enter another country illegally...at least you're still going to be alive.

From the NPR report:
Venezuela used to have a strong middle class - people with educations who worked in trades, owned businesses, worked in offices... All that's collapsed in a nightmare political tragedy that's destroyed the economy and the most basic personal security. Watching people portray these desperate refugees as "uneducated and diseased" - referring to them like they're sub-human savages who lived in filthy, mud-floored straw huts because that's all they were capable of, and not giving a **** what happens to them as long as they don't come here for help, really serves to illustrate the face of bigotry and racism in the U.S.
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Old 26th September 2022, 09:39 AM   #544
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I swear, watching our impulse drive poster struggle with reality, and getting jerked bald headed for it, has made my morning.

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Old 26th September 2022, 09:52 AM   #545
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Plenty of discussion earlier of why this is 100% true. Of course Dems will say "they have a special exception!". I don't give a damn about that. If they are crawling across the borders illegally, they are criminals, imo. They committed the same crime as Mexicans who are being deported for the same actions.
I know, right? Why do cops get to run red lights when I can't?

This is quite astute moral reasoning, this is. Some things are illegal for some people but not others. That's just not fair.

If anyone wants a cheap appendectomy, let me know. I've already washed my pocket knife.
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Old 26th September 2022, 09:54 AM   #546
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
It all sits perfectly well once you realize that they very likely tried to enter this country illegally.

The symbolism of telling them to GTFO of FL is perfect. We don't want those types on our soil, is the message.
Not quite so perfect, since they were first flown to Florida by DeSantis.

Quote:
And conservative voters are going to love that thinking.
Perhaps.
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Old 26th September 2022, 10:34 AM   #547
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Originally Posted by Foster Zygote View Post
You're right, Warp. These dirty, brown Venezuelans should go through the proper channels to apply for visas before they try to leave their country controlled by a violently repressive totalitarian regime, or at least have the decency to be white before they try to enter the U.S.

I don't care about the color of their skin. Like i would embrace homeless, jobless, infectious, poorly-vetted whites? Of course, that is the "go-to" accusation for liberals, where everything is about race. I don't endorse illegals, it's that simple. And yes these folks arrived as illegals, as do tens of thousands of them, apparently monthly. I don't GAF what you call them now, they are still illegals to me.

I hope if DeSantis does run and get elected in 2024, he is able to get these illegal immigration loopholes closed. This country is under no obligation to make special exceptions for any of these people, no matter what their sob stories may be.
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Old 26th September 2022, 10:45 AM   #548
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
And yes these folks arrived as illegals, as do tens of thousands of them, apparently monthly. I don't GAF what you call them now, they are still illegals to me.
And they turned themselves in, as is required by law.

Have you ever broken a law? Any law at all? Driven over the speed limit, perhaps? J-walked, maybe?

Are you an illegal?
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Old 26th September 2022, 10:53 AM   #549
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
And they turned themselves in, as is required by law.

Have you ever broken a law? Any law at all? Driven over the speed limit, perhaps? J-walked, maybe?

Are you an illegal?

"Turned themselves in"?

Quote:
In August alone, the Border Patrol recorded more than 50,000 apprehensions in the Del Rio sector, which includes Eagle Pass — tens of thousands more than in traditional migration corridors like the Rio Grande Valley and El Paso.The number of migrants arriving from Venezuela, Cuba and Nicaragua was nearly equal to the number from Mexico and northern Central America.

You think these Venezuelans are all "turning themselves in"? I mean, they should...since they are allowed to enter illegally. But apparently a hell of a lot of them are too stupid to even do that.

The rest of your post is too idiotic to consider.
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Old 26th September 2022, 11:29 AM   #550
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"Turned themselves in"?




You think these Venezuelans are all "turning themselves in"? I mean, they should...since they are allowed to enter illegally. But apparently a hell of a lot of them are too stupid to even do that.

The rest of your post is too idiotic to consider.
Actually, they do turn themselves in. Why? Because they know they can apply for asylum. Try doing a little research.



Quote:
In Mexicali, he paid the smuggler $800 to ferry him into Arizona, where he turned himself over to border patrol and was held in a migrant detention center for six weeks before being released to await his asylum hearing.

Antonio, a smuggler from El Salvador, said in early July that he had taken more Venezuelan clients in the past five months than ever before. From southern Mexico he charges $3,000 to take them to the U.S. border, where he instructs them to turn themselves in to U.S. border agents to request asylum.
https://www.reuters.com/world/americ...us-2021-07-14/

ETA:
Quote:
A group of migrants prepare to turn themselves in to authorities after wading through the Rio Grande and crossing the U.S.-Mexico border at Del Rio, Texas, June 15, 2021. Record numbers of Venezuelans — often bankers, doctors and engineers — are crossing the U.S.-Mexico border as overall migration swells.
(https://leads.ap.org/best-of-the-wee...ross-us-border)

I bet those bankers, doctors, and engineers are just totally disease-ridden when they come here to become drug dealers and commit crime.

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Old 26th September 2022, 11:32 AM   #551
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Originally Posted by stacyhs
Actually, they do turn themselves in. Why? Because they know they can apply for asylum. Try doing a little research.

You think of 50,000 illegals apprehended in one month, none are Venezuelans? That is rich.

Quote:
In August alone, the Border Patrol recorded more than 50,000 apprehensions in the Del Rio sector, which includes Eagle Pass — tens of thousands more than in traditional migration corridors like the Rio Grande Valley and El Paso.The number of migrants arriving from Venezuela, Cuba and Nicaragua was nearly equal to the number from Mexico and northern Central America.
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Old 26th September 2022, 11:37 AM   #552
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
You think of 50,000 illegals apprehended in one month, none are Venezuelans? That is rich.

[/hilite]
"Apprehensions" does not necessarily mean being taken against their will. Someone can be apprehended when they turn themselves in. It means to take into custody, which they are.
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Old 26th September 2022, 11:41 AM   #553
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
ETA:
([url]https://leads.ap.org/best-of-the-w
I bet those bankers, doctors, and engineers are just totally disease-ridden when they come here to become drug dealers and commit crime.

"Often" bankers, doctors, and engineers....lol. That doesn't sound like liberal propaganda at all.

Regardless, they are illegals. They just aren't being deported like they should be. Instead, they are here being flown to Martha's Vineyard with complaint, and filing lawsuits. Probably a whole lot are lawyers, too.
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Old 26th September 2022, 11:48 AM   #554
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"Often" bankers, doctors, and engineers....lol. That doesn't sound like liberal propaganda at all.
Yeah, damn that Associated Press story reporting on facts. They must be just making crap up in order push their liberal agenda. Especially all those pictures in the article showing the migrants turning themselves in, including the woman who left a paid off home and was an elementary school teacher. Stinking liars. FAKE NEWS!!

Quote:
Regardless, they are illegals. They just aren't being deported like they should be. Instead, they are here being flown to Martha's Vineyard with complaint, and filing lawsuits.
No, you think they should be illegals. The law says they aren't.

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Probably a whole lot are lawyers, too.
I wouldn't doubt it at all.
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Old 26th September 2022, 11:55 AM   #555
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"Often" bankers, doctors, and engineers....lol. That doesn't sound like liberal propaganda at all.
You know, if you actually looked it up, you could find out that Venezuela's turmoil has lead to a "brain drain" that the US has been a beneficiary of.

Quote:
Compared to foreign- and U.S.-born adults (ages 25 and older), Venezuelan immigrant adults have considerably higher levels of education, especially in terms of four-year college degrees. In 2018, more than half of Venezuelan immigrants held at least a bachelorís degree (57 percent), significantly higher than all foreign-born and U.S.-born adults (32 percent and 33 percent, respectively). Venezuelan immigrants were also more likely to have a graduate or professional degree than the other two groups (21 percent, versus 14 percent for all immigrants and 12 percent for the U.S. born). Only 6 percent of Venezuelan immigrants lacked a high school diploma, compared to 27 percent of all immigrant adults.
https://www.migrationpolicy.org/arti...ed-states-2018
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Old 26th September 2022, 12:03 PM   #556
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
I’m just enjoying the irony, intentionally or not, of complaining about being treated like a stereotypical villain while simultaneously monologue-ing about the worthless, dirty under-class. Honestly, the only thing that would make it more perfect would be idly twirling a mustache with one finger.
"Villains who twirl their mustaches are easy to spot. Those who cloak themselves in good deeds are well camouflaged, waiting for the right climate in which to flourish, spreading fear in the name of righteousness"
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
My problem with this is, the poster you refer to is doing what they always seem to do. In this case, turning the thread away from a discussion of DeSantis and his policies and turning it into a thread about themselves, their feelings and the shortcomings of other posters. They find the migrants to be "nauseating," other people's positions are "idiotic." This gets repeated over and over and based on experience I doubt we can expect to see anything else.

That isn't taking part in a discussion about DeSantis and his policies, it's the opposite.
True to form then!
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Old 26th September 2022, 12:03 PM   #557
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Originally Posted by RecoveringYuppy View Post
You know, if you actually looked it up, you could find out that Venezuela's turmoil has lead to a "brain drain" that the US has been a beneficiary of.



https://www.migrationpolicy.org/arti...ed-states-2018

I have to admit that would be surprising, if it still holds true after the special exception has been made for illegals (I doubt it does). However, they are still entering illegally. And the article also points out that 53% of Venezuelan immigrants reside in FL..so much for that state being a poor choice for them. Of course the data is also 4 years old, before the most recent massive surge and open door policy for illegals was made. So, who knows the accuracy of the information...on either count.
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Old 26th September 2022, 12:09 PM   #558
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If doctors, bankers, and other professionals are leaving Venezuela, lawyers are likely leaving, too. As this report says:

Quote:
In a briefing paper released today, the International Commission of Jurists (ICJ) calls attention to the numerous obstacles and restrictions that Venezuelan lawyers face in exercising their profession.

Lawyers acting independently are frequently subjected to harassment, intimidation, and even criminal sanction. Lawyers acting in high-profile actions, particularly politically charged cases, or those involving human rights violations are at particular risk.
Quote:
A Lawyer in Venezuela, She Started From Scratch in the U.S.
As her country’s economy collapsed, Yolanda Molina sought respite in New York. “Not all immigrants arrive here to be a burden,” she says.
Quote:
When Jesus Manuel Gomez crossed the border from Ecuador into Peru in February 2018 after traveling 1,300 miles from Venezuela, his life changed markedly.

In Venezuela, he was an accomplished lawyer with specialized training.

“I am a lawyer with much responsibility, with a postgraduate degree in agrarian and environmental law,” said Gomez, whose wife and children remain in Venezuela. “Few in my country have that title.”
Quote:
After a day of working manual labor, Paredes, who was a lawyer in Venezuela, returned home in Princes Town. Paredes, 40, also has a doctoral degree. RIGHT: Carlos Paredes, second left, with his family in their makeshift home in Princes Town, Trinidad. He and thousands of Venezuelans fled to the island nation; up to 160 a week are still arriving.
Venezuelans aren't just immigrating to the US, but to many other Latin American countries like Peru and Argentina to escape what's happening in their home country. What makes you think Venezuelan professionals, including lawyers, aren't coming to the US?
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Old 26th September 2022, 12:16 PM   #559
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
I have to admit that would be surprising, if it still holds true after the special exception has been made for illegals (I doubt it does). However, they are still entering illegally. And the article also points out that 53% of Venezuelan immigrants reside in FL..so much for that state being a poor choice for them. Of course the data is also 4 years old, before the most recent massive surge and open door policy for illegals was made. So, who knows the accuracy of the information...on either count.
They are entering illegally but they aren't here illegally once they turn themselves in and apply for asylum.
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Old 26th September 2022, 12:17 PM   #560
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"Often" bankers, doctors, and engineers....lol. That doesn't sound like liberal propaganda at all.

Regardless, they are illegals. They just aren't being deported like they should be. Instead, they are here being flown to Martha's Vineyard with complaint, and filing lawsuits. Probably a whole lot are lawyers, too.
"I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einsteinís brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops."
- Stephen Jay Gould
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