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Tags barack obama , Mike Gallagher , Obama Conspiracies

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Old 11th June 2019, 05:05 AM   #41
Delvo
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Originally Posted by SpitfireIX View Post
Several of these require proving a negative. You should point out that there's no evidence, if appropriate.
I can confirm that half of one of them is true: he did in fact say "Holy Qur'an" instead of just "Qur'an". If he hadn't, I would have seen a lack of examples of it, so I wouldn't know if maybe he had at some time that I wasn't aware of, but this is a case where I have positive experience that he did. He also put the break in after the R and pronounced the second syllable open, close to "on", instead of more like the name "Anne", meaning he was putting in at least some effort to try to say it the Arabic way instead of a more common westernization (although I don't recall how well his Arabic "q" was distinguished from a K). For the Bible, on the other hand, I saw & heard him say it several times without ever adding "holy" in any case I knew of, which brings us to "proving a negative" territory; establishing that he never did so would require going through the entire length of every public statement he ever made. And even if he didn't, this is an an argument that he had different levels of pandering for two different groups, not an that he was a member of one of them.

Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Other than his wedding ring, I'm not aware of Obama wearing much jewelry at any time.
There was also some hubbub about his not wearing an American flag pin on his lapel as other Presidents had tended to do, regardless of time of year, so one could find a picture or comment about that from a day that happened to be part of Ramadan, and one still wouldn't be looking at evidence that he'd skipped the pin because of Ramadan.

Originally Posted by Hans View Post
Other note: Muslim men are not to wear gold which I presume his wedding ring is made of.

https://archive.islamonline.net/?p=1289

Quote:
Islam has, however, prohibited two kinds of adornment for men, while permitting them to women. These are, first, gold ornaments and, second, clothing made of pure silk. `Ali reported that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) took some silk in his right hand and some gold in his left, declaring, “These two are haram for the males among my followers.”(Reported by Ahmad, Abu Dawud, an-Nasa’i, Ibn Hayyan, and Ibn Majah, who reports the additional phrase, “but halal for the females.”) `Umar reported that he heard the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) say, “Do not wear silk, for those who wear it in this life shall not wear it in the Hereafter.” (Reported by al-Bukhari and Muslim) On another occasion, referring to a silken garment, he said, “This is the dress of a man who has no character.” (Reported by al-Bukhari and Muslim)
That would mean he was a rather bad fake Muslim too.
The highlighted phrases are indicators of ḥadīth. A ḥadīth is a saying for which which some kind of path back to Muhammad is given, but not considered solid enough to make it into the Qur'an. Different sects disagree with each other about which ones to accept, so every ḥadīth is accepted by some and not others.

Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
I once met a clever scammer on the side of the road, playing rich Saudi with gold rings on. He offered me some of his expensive rings if I could give him $100 to fix his car. He even greeted me in arabic "Salaam Alekum," and was shocked when I replied "wa alekum a salaam." I should have told him that he wasn't a true muslim with the rings.
There are alloys that would look a lot like gold without being gold, but using that to defend himself against this accusation might defeat the purpose of offering to use the not-gold in payment/trade.
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Old 11th June 2019, 08:14 AM   #42
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It was you alright, but perhaps you wasn't Barack Obama but Michelle Obama (doing the dancing)? "Jezebel" by Frankie Lane. Sorry for the lack of quality of the early TV kinoscope:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fw9j2EN4TU4
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Old 11th June 2019, 08:39 AM   #43
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I´d like to comment about whether it is necessary to reply to this kind of nonsense. Something similar happened to me years ago, I had a female friend with whom I used to chat, write emails etc. Even if we didn´t live in the same city any more, we were friends and had regular contact. One day she sent me a ******** list of refutations of Evolution, that a muslim friend had sent her, you know the kind (the one with the fishing lure fly probably). I didn´t pay much attention and just answered that it was all B.S. and didn´t engage any points properly. A few months later I wrote her an email and all I got was a sort of automated response saying that she had married a muslim man and she could not had any contact with any men and so on. That was many years ago. I´ve never heard from her again. I hope she´s OK, but judging from the BS crackpot list that she sent me, the kind of man he married (if it was the same muslim man) is not very educated or rational. I´ve since had a bad feeling, that I failed her, that I should have answered a more detailed response... that I could have avoided her falling into a dangerous cult. There was probably little I could have done, but I can´t help feeling remorse.

So this thread reminded me of this story. I think OP is right in trying to work a good answer to the BS Obama list, even if for an informed skeptic it can seem so transparently idiotic, for some people isn´t so, and it may help steer them away from falling into extremist ideologies etc.
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Old 11th June 2019, 10:37 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
For the Bible, on the other hand, I saw & heard him say it several times without ever adding "holy" in any case I knew of, which brings us to "proving a negative" territory; establishing that he never did so would require going through the entire length of every public statement he ever made. And even if he didn't, this is an an argument that he had different levels of pandering for two different groups, not an that he was a member of one of them.

Remarks by Obama at the National Prayer Breakfast [2015]
. . . The Torah says “Love thy neighbor as yourself.” In Islam, there is a Hadith that states: “None of you truly believes until he loves for his brother what he loves for himself.” The Holy Bible tells us to “put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony.” Put on love.
Barack Obama's 2009 Cairo speech on relations with the Muslim world [2009]
The Holy Quran tells us: “O mankind! We have created you male and a female; and we have made you into nations and tribes so that you may know one another.”

The Talmud tells us: “The whole of the Torah is for the purpose of promoting peace.”

The Holy Bible tells us: “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.” (Applause.)
These are the only two I could find in about 10 pages of Google hits, and there were several duplicates. A similar search for "Obama" and "Holy Koran [or Quran]" mostly turned up the above, or references to other quotes from the same speech.
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Old 11th June 2019, 10:43 AM   #45
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Barrack Obama, "The Most Divisive President Ever".
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Old 11th June 2019, 04:55 PM   #46
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They should give up. Even if their kind are right, it doesn't matter any more. Obama won. He was elected to two terms, served eight years, retired to semi private life. There's nothing anyone can do about it. If he lied, if he wasn't a citizen, if he was a Muslim, if it's all true, he got away with it. Game over.
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Old 11th June 2019, 05:44 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
They should give up. Even if their kind are right, it doesn't matter any more. Obama won. He was elected to two terms, served eight years, retired to semi private life. There's nothing anyone can do about it. If he lied, if he wasn't a citizen, if he was a Muslim, if it's all true, he got away with it. Game over.
This. I'm really wondering why they, Ladewig's interlocutor, Ladewig himself, Travis, or anyone else even gives a **** about this.

Imagine how pathetic it would be, if one of our esteemed progressives were to come around in 2026 with some lame-ass "President Trump, it was you" list. And how pathetic it would be if anyone bothered to try to debunk it.
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Old 11th June 2019, 06:39 PM   #48
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By 2026, I expect you'll have to go to great lengths to find people who care enough about Trump to write this sort of thing and only his most rabid followers will bother to defend him. By then, his staff will be trying to repair the damage to their reputations and his surrogates will have moved on, Hoping the world will forget their treason. I expect the Epsilon Minuses from his rallies will have moved to their next distraction.
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Old 11th June 2019, 07:08 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
By 2026, I expect you'll have to go to great lengths to find people who care enough about Trump to write this sort of thing and only his most rabid followers will bother to defend him. By then, his staff will be trying to repair the damage to their reputations and his surrogates will have moved on, Hoping the world will forget their treason. I expect the Epsilon Minuses from his rallies will have moved to their next distraction.
Exactly.
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Old 11th June 2019, 09:06 PM   #50
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Even if we were having this conversation 8 years ago, refuting the conspiracy theory point-by-point is largely a waste of time. You're dealing with people who make stuff up in a tenth the time it takes you to research/refute it. By the time you've even decided to make it into a "project" and ask for assistance, you've invested more resources than they have and you haven't even accomplished anything.

Just promote general skepticism. It's better for everyone in the long run.
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Old 11th June 2019, 10:46 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
They should give up. Even if their kind are right, it doesn't matter any more. Obama won. He was elected to two terms, served eight years, retired to semi private life. There's nothing anyone can do about it. If he lied, if he wasn't a citizen, if he was a Muslim, if it's all true, he got away with it. Game over.

It’s because they hate the constitution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Religious_Test_Clause
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Old 12th June 2019, 05:27 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
This. I'm really wondering why they, Ladewig's interlocutor, Ladewig himself, Travis, or anyone else even gives a **** about this.

Imagine how pathetic it would be, if one of our esteemed progressives were to come around in 2026 with some lame-ass "President Trump, it was you" list. And how pathetic it would be if anyone bothered to try to debunk it.
Well, the thread is rightfully in Conspiracy Theories. You can't really count on anything other than not being able to count on the orderliness of conspiracy whackjobs. If one were to post this in Politics, you'd still have ten to a dozen right wingers jumping on the Get 'Im bandwagon. You don't think there's an active section of the current Spawn of Robert Welch brand of conservatives who would be all over this and spewing the same nonsense?

It's not the date of the material but the fact that Obama is still out there and a target for the reprobates. Have you not noticed who's in the White House?

So I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it because you know as well as I do that there's an excellent chance the Donnie, Don Jr. or Eric will tweet it out next week!
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Old 12th June 2019, 05:41 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
This. I'm really wondering why they, Ladewig's interlocutor, Ladewig himself, Travis, or anyone else even gives a **** about this.

Imagine how pathetic it would be, if one of our esteemed progressives were to come around in 2026 with some lame-ass "President Trump, it was you" list. And how pathetic it would be if anyone bothered to try to debunk it.


The list was reposted by Gallagher in January, 2015, after the Charlie Hebdo attack, and it was already outdated by then. Paying attention to this in 2019 is like paying attention to the 9/11 Truthers at this point.
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Old 12th June 2019, 06:07 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
This. I'm really wondering why they, Ladewig's interlocutor, Ladewig himself, Travis, or anyone else even gives a **** about this.

Imagine how pathetic it would be, if one of our esteemed progressives were to come around in 2026 with some lame-ass "President Trump, it was you" list. And how pathetic it would be if anyone bothered to try to debunk it.

I think Trump is exactly why it's still current. If they can "prove" that Obama was a Secret Mulsim Atheist Commie Manchurian Candidate From Kenya, they can turn around and say, "Well, sure, Trump may be a Russian stooge, but at least he's not a SMACMCFK*! Why didn't you all care about the "Dignity of the Office" when you were voting for that SMACMCFK?!??!?"




*Pronounced "Smack Mick ****"


ETA: "Smack Mick ****". Racist epithet, or kinky night in Dublin? Discuss.
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Last edited by Horatius; 12th June 2019 at 06:10 AM.
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Old 12th June 2019, 10:08 AM   #55
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He has been known to go to the United Church of Christ, and they allow Muslims.
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Old 12th June 2019, 11:33 AM   #56
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He's also been seen eating food other than pork. Muslims eat food other than pork.
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Old 14th June 2019, 04:39 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
Barrack Obama, "The Most Divisive President Ever".
You would have to give Lincoln that honor...
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Old 14th June 2019, 05:54 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
You would have to give Lincoln that honor...

And in the same vein, Trump isn't as bad as James Buchanan. Yet.
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3) "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." --Inigo Montoya
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Old 15th June 2019, 11:33 PM   #59
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Again I ask: Why would Obama being a Muslim matter?
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Old 16th June 2019, 02:50 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by Allen773 View Post
Again I ask: Why would Obama being a Muslim matter?
Because that would prove he was part of the international Jewish conspiracy.

Oh, hang on.

No, you're right: that is a good question. Why would it matter?
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