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Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , donald trump , lying charges , Russia conspiracies , Trump controversies , Trump-Russia connections , US-Russia relations , vladimir putin

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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:28 PM   #321
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
No, not sure. A Guardian writer says Bannon is quoted as such in a book "obtained by the Guardian ahead of publication from a bookseller in New England" by a writer known for his ********, and a first quote in that book is already denied before publication if you scroll to the last paragraph in the Guardian piece and read it.

You are sure. It isn't.
Oddly enough, Breitbart is reporting on the Guardian article and saying nothing about the article being false.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:30 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Trump rules!

Finally you're accepting it. The ruler of the free world.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:32 PM   #323
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Oddly enough, Breitbart is reporting on the Guardian article and saying nothing about the article being false.

Well, that and Trump's response are indications that the quotes are true. I was commenting on the so far presented evidence, which was no reason to be "sure".
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:36 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Well, that and Trump's response are indications that the quotes are true. I was commenting on the so far presented evidence, which was no reason to be "sure".
"Highly likely", perhaps?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:42 PM   #325
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Well, well, well. Wormtongue finally stuck the knife into Saruman.

Of course, Sauron in this case is still sitting in HIS tower. And laughing his head off.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 01:09 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Wow, talk about throwing Bannon under the bus. And not just your average bus, we're talking bi-articulated, 14 wheels of mauling. I, mean, just wow.

"Just a staffer", "Very little to do with..victory"?!

Bannon is getting a harsh lesson on how little Trump values loyalty towards others.


I'm pretty sure this site allows for hotlinking. I think we'll need many more popcorn gifs by the time we're done.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 01:14 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Bannon is getting a harsh lesson on how little Trump values loyalty towards others.

I doubt Bannon has ever been under any illusion in regard to this.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 01:29 PM   #328
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Oddly enough, Breitbart is reporting on the Guardian article and saying nothing about the article being false.
Sounds like they have no problem throwing Kushner under the bus. We shouldn't be surprised Bannon et al is going in that direction.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:40 PM   #329
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Wow, talk about throwing Bannon under the bus. And not just your average bus, we're talking bi-articulated, 14 wheels of mauling. I, mean, just wow.

"Just a staffer", "Very little to do with..victory"?!

Bannon is getting a harsh lesson on how little Trump values loyalty towards others.
It's telling that Trump's first response isn't to dispute Wolff's reporting or the substance of Bannon's treason claim.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:44 PM   #330
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More Bannon leaks.

Quote:
Steve Bannon privately expressed ambivalence about Donald Trump as a presidential candidate before taking over his campaign, calling Trump a "narcissist" and stating that he didn't care if Trump won, according to emails obtained by BuzzFeed News.

...

At the time of the Iowa primary, Texas Sen. Ted Cruz slammed Trump to the state's evangelical voters by saying that he had never asked God for forgiveness.

"He NEVER asks for forgiveness!!!" Bannon wrote back. "It's a joke having him discuss god."

Still, Bannon approved the story, on the condition that then-Breitbart editor-at-large Ben Shapiro write a dueling column in support of Cruz.
In response to Bannon's criticism of Trump's lack of humility before God,

Breitbart's Washington political editor Matthew Boyle chimed in. "...He can't do anything wrong, at least in his mind," Boyle wrote. "Trump is a genius at showing absolutely no weakness whatsoever and projecting macho man confidence. He is a giant walking, living, breathing self-fulfilling prophecy."
"Narcissist," Bannon wrote back.

Seven months later, Bannon left Breitbart to lead the Trump campaign.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:45 PM   #331
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So apparently now Manafort is going to try and sue his way out of this, because that works. In true Trump style, he's claiming that Rosenstien didn't have the authority to hire Mueller, and if he did, Mueller has stepped outside of that scope.

Basically, "we didn't do it. If we did, they shouldn't have been able to find out about it. And even though they did, it's not really illegal. And if it is, then stop it."

Classic.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:47 PM   #332
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Sounds like they have no problem throwing Kushner under the bus. We shouldn't be surprised Bannon et al is going in that direction.
I always wondered how that alliance even came to be. Bannon is antiestablishment, and Trump is pretty much the poster child for The Man. (OK, OK... I need to work on that metaphor)

I keep circling back to the theory that Trump did not want or expect to win... that the future of Trump Media was to be raking it in as a rightwing blowhard on extensive platforms (such as Brietbart, FoxNews, perhaps his own channels) until he had so many strokes his speech was incomprehensible.

Then, uhoh, he's president. Trump's ambition went from paying off his debt with radio op/eds to plans for the first American monarchy. Bannon's dream of partnering up with a cash cow was shattered by waking up one morning as the Little People, and maybe especially Bannon getting the boot because he's not on board with that whole oligarchy thing.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:49 PM   #333
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
"Highly likely", perhaps?

By now, maybe. But remember that Steve Bannon is allegedly an evil genius and there might be something not visible on the surface to him telling this "controversial" author these things. Just don't go down the "if Bannon says it it must be true" road. I never would do that with Lindsey Graham.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:53 PM   #334
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More intrigue.
Confirmed: Rosenstein is meeting with Ryan about Russia investigation, aide says
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:53 PM   #335
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
By now, maybe. But remember that Steve Bannon is allegedly an evil genius and there might be something not visible on the surface to him telling this "controversial" author these things. Just don't go down the "if Bannon says it it must be true" road. I never would do that with Lindsey Graham.
I'm also cynical about the media choice... a book.

If Bannon really wanted to cut up Trump, and if he really had evidence (instead of hyperbole and insults) he would have picked up the phone and called the FBI. Instead we're to believe there's something actionable, but he decided to hold off and publish it in a book months later. Nah, he's full of **** as usual.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:23 PM   #336
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Originally Posted by blutoski View Post
I'm also cynical about the media choice... a book.

If Bannon really wanted to cut up Trump, and if he really had evidence (instead of hyperbole and insults) he would have picked up the phone and called the FBI. Instead we're to believe there's something actionable, but he decided to hold off and publish it in a book months later. Nah, he's full of **** as usual.
So what if he's full of it? What's the strategy here? To call out Trump as too inept to successfully collude? By implying that The Three Stooges running the campaign behaved like such rank amateurs that they should be laughingly written off as not worthy of investigating?

I wonder if Trump knew this was coming, if Bannon's use of the word "treasonous" is a way to get that word out of the way, to pre-empt the shock value of it. Just a guess of course.

Anyway, how do we know Bannon didn't contact the FBI? I can't remember if that's come up before. I wonder if Trump and Bannon are playing us somehow.

Bannon is manipulative; who is he trying to manipulate?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:31 PM   #337
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
So what if he's full of it? What's the strategy here? To call out Trump as too inept to successfully collude? By implying that The Three Stooges running the campaign behaved like such rank amateurs that they should be laughingly written off as not worthy of investigating?

I wonder if Trump knew this was coming, if Bannon's use of the word "treasonous" is a way to get that word out of the way, to pre-empt the shock value of it. Just a guess of course.

Anyway, how do we know Bannon didn't contact the FBI? I can't remember if that's come up before. I wonder if Trump and Bannon are playing us somehow.

Bannon is manipulative; who is he trying to manipulate?
I think he's trying to sell books, to make money. This 'manipulation' just smells like marketing.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:35 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
So what if he's full of it? What's the strategy here? To call out Trump as too inept to successfully collude? By implying that The Three Stooges running the campaign behaved like such rank amateurs that they should be laughingly written off as not worthy of investigating?

I wonder if Trump knew this was coming, if Bannon's use of the word "treasonous" is a way to get that word out of the way, to pre-empt the shock value of it. Just a guess of course.

Anyway, how do we know Bannon didn't contact the FBI? I can't remember if that's come up before. I wonder if Trump and Bannon are playing us somehow.

Bannon is manipulative; who is he trying to manipulate?
Bannon's long term goal is to burn down the current Republican party and replace it with one of his own vision. It appears Bannon is signaling:
  • The Bannon brand should survive in politics even if major people go down in the Russia investigation
  • He thinks some people deserve to go down and probably will for their inept treason
  • He won't
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:40 PM   #339
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Originally Posted by blutoski View Post
I think he's trying to sell books, to make money. This 'manipulation' just smells like marketing.
Well, marketing is manipulation.

As much as I like the idea of these unpleasant individuals turning on each other I wonder if some of these "feuds" are all they're cracked up to be.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:42 PM   #340
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Bannon's long term goal is to burn down the current Republican party and replace it with one of his own vision. It appears Bannon is signaling:
  • The Bannon brand should survive in politics even if major people go down in the Russia investigation
  • He thinks some people deserve to go down and probably will for their inept treason
  • He won't
These are all good points. I just have a hard time believing Bannon would be torching the bridge to the White House/Trump presidency without having some backup plan.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:48 PM   #341
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Well, marketing is manipulation.

As much as I like the idea of these unpleasant individuals turning on each other I wonder if some of these "feuds" are all they're cracked up to be.
Yep. I think we're on the same page about celebrity feuds/marriages.

Some are just so transparently staged, and it's not a secret that this is a soft collusion among their respective publicists to shove their brands to the front page of the Weekly World News and maintain their clients' currency.

So, yes, sadly, I think we have a TV show producer in the White House, spinning his brand the same way he has been for a decade running The Apprentice. His income is mostly branding - his actual business ventures have been colossal failures. Stick with your strengths I guess: get attention and the money will follow.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:50 PM   #342
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
These are all good points. I just have a hard time believing Bannon would be torching the bridge to the White House/Trump presidency without having some backup plan.
He's a dogmatic believer in his politics. He's a white nationalist that cares deeply about the economic nationalist part that Trump abandoned with the tax bill. He wasn't just in it for the culture war and winning. He's a true fanatic that wants to unleash his vision and Trump is no longer of any use. You saw the start of this with the Moore/Strange endorsements split in Alabama.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:58 PM   #343
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Originally Posted by blutoski View Post
I'm also cynical about the media choice... a book.

If Bannon really wanted to cut up Trump, and if he really had evidence (instead of hyperbole and insults) he would have picked up the phone and called the FBI. Instead we're to believe there's something actionable, but he decided to hold off and publish it in a book months later. Nah, he's full of **** as usual.
Yes but at the moment, there is plenty of evidence - what is lacking is the political will in the GOP to do anything about it. Bannon doing this, and using Brietbart as well might be enough to start a bit of a civil war amongst Trump's core support.

As far as impeachment, the threat of getting primaried is probably currently working in Trump's favour. This *might* be the start of that changing.

I agree that it is of little material importance - unless he has been cooperating with the FBI, though.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:02 PM   #344
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
These are all good points. I just have a hard time believing Bannon would be torching the bridge to the White House/Trump presidency without having some backup plan.
I wonder if he's distancing because he's getting more confident there's imminent danger with being associated with convicted felons and traitors. If the goal is to persuade the public that he's completely uninvolved in Russian skulduggery, provoking the principal suspect to put it in writing like this, for all the world to see, helps.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:03 PM   #345
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Originally Posted by blutoski View Post
I think he's trying to sell books, to make money. This 'manipulation' just smells like marketing.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it is not currently Bannon who's selling a book, but Wolff, who quotes Bannen in said book.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:07 PM   #346
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
He's a dogmatic believer in his politics. He's a white nationalist that cares deeply about the economic nationalist part that Trump abandoned with the tax bill. He wasn't just in it for the culture war and winning. He's a true fanatic that wants to unleash his vision and Trump is no longer of any use. You saw the start of this with the Moore/Strange endorsements split in Alabama.
Does this mean white nationalists have to pick a side? Or is that too inside baseball?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:14 PM   #347
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Does this mean white nationalists have to pick a side? Or is that too inside baseball?
There will be some but I think Trump as President gets the win until it all falls apart.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:22 PM   #348
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Correct me if I am wrong, but it is not currently Bannon who's selling a book, but Wolff, who quotes Bannen in said book.
Yes, sorry, I wasn't very clear about that. My impression is that whether Bannon said this or not, it's Wolff trying to sell books.

The questions being: if it's false, wouldn't Bannon accuse Wolff of fabricating; if it's true, why would Bannon be so loose lipped.

Which is why I think there's two layers of ******** here, unfortunately. Wolff is cherry picking a conversation with Bannon, out of context, and Bannon was just ********ting anyway.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 06:08 PM   #349
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Old 3rd January 2018, 06:17 PM   #350
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
These are all good points. I just have a hard time believing Bannon would be torching the bridge to the White House/Trump presidency without having some backup plan.
Machiavelli's famous advice is not to attack the Prince but the Prince's advisors. The Prince cannot back down, but can be shocked - shocked! - to discover the evil being done in his name. Heads roll, and none of them are yours.

Bannon isn't going for Trump directly, he's going for the amateurs in Trump's team. And if Trump suffers from it that's their fault, not Bannon's.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 06:29 PM   #351
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Does this mean white nationalists have to pick a side? Or is that too inside baseball?
Bannon owns the white nationalists. Perhaps his intent is to make Trump choose sides - Bannon and the alt-right or his lightweight familiars.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 06:51 PM   #352
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Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
Machiavelli's famous advice is not to attack the Prince but the Prince's advisors. The Prince cannot back down, but can be shocked - shocked! - to discover the evil being done in his name. Heads roll, and none of them are yours.

Bannon isn't going for Trump directly, he's going for the amateurs in Trump's team. And if Trump suffers from it that's their fault, not Bannon's.
“I’m a Leninist,” Bannon proudly proclaimed.

...

“Lenin wanted to destroy the state, and that’s my goal too. I want to bring everything crashing down, and destroy all of today’s establishment.”
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Old 3rd January 2018, 07:59 PM   #353
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Wow, talk about throwing Bannon under the bus. And not just your average bus, we're talking bi-articulated, 14 wheels of mauling. I, mean, just wow.

"Just a staffer", "Very little to do with..victory"?!
Does "staffer" outrank "coffee boy"?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 08:00 PM   #354
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Does this mean white nationalists have to pick a side? Or is that too inside baseball?
One side has lost its benefactor.

Quote:
Bannon has in recent weeks also alienated his main financial backer, Rebekah Mercer, after he told several other major conservative donors that he would be able to count on the Mercers’ financial support should he run for president, a person familiar with the conversations said. The person said

Mercer now does not plan to financially support Bannon’s future projects — and that she was frustrated by his moves in Alabama and some of his comments in the news media that seemed to stoke unnecessary fights.
A person close to Bannon said he was not running for president. Bannon and Mercer declined to comment through representatives.

“The core constituency for Breitbart is what you would call the Trump Deplorables. That’s the audience. And if they’re asked to choose between Steve and Trump, they’re going to choose Trump. That’s clear,” said a person familiar with the company’s ownership.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 08:57 PM   #355
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Originally Posted by blutoski View Post
Yes, sorry, I wasn't very clear about that. My impression is that whether Bannon said this or not, it's Wolff trying to sell books.

The questions being: if it's false, wouldn't Bannon accuse Wolff of fabricating; if it's true, why would Bannon be so loose lipped.

Which is why I think there's two layers of ******** here, unfortunately. Wolff is cherry picking a conversation with Bannon, out of context, and Bannon was just bulshitting anyway.
The White House begs to differ:
EXCLUSIVE: Lawyers for @realDonaldTrump sending a cease-and-desist letter to former Sr adviser Steve Bannon tonight, arguing he has violated an NDA with his comments in new Wolff book. @washingtonpost
It's hard to square, "Wolff made this up!" with, "we're demanding that Bannon stop saying these protected things!"

Eta: Link

Eta 2: How does one cease and desist what has been said to the author of a book?

Last edited by Stacko; 3rd January 2018 at 09:00 PM.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 09:11 PM   #356
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It’s amusing, the mutual bus-throwing-under from both of these wretched and treasonous dirtbags.

Actually, Bannon’s appearance would probably be improved by getting run over by an actual bus. He looks like the dried residue of a solution of syphilis and Ripple.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:24 PM   #357
thaiboxerken
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Do confidentiality agreements apply to illegal activities?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:31 PM   #358
Skeptic Ginger
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Do confidentiality agreements apply to illegal activities?
Contracts cannot require a person to break the law or allow someone to break the law. Such contracts are unenforcible.

So, for example, US law requires some employers to provide hepatitis B vaccine to employees. If a contract requires an employee to hold the employer harmless should the employee decline the vaccine and the employee contracts hepatitis B it would be unenforcible because such a hold harmless clause is illegal.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 3rd January 2018 at 10:32 PM.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 11:03 PM   #359
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
The White House begs to differ:
EXCLUSIVE: Lawyers for @realDonaldTrump sending a cease-and-desist letter to former Sr adviser Steve Bannon tonight, arguing he has violated an NDA with his comments in new Wolff book. @washingtonpost
It's hard to square, "Wolff made this up!" with, "we're demanding that Bannon stop saying these protected things!"

Eta: Link

Eta 2: How does one cease and desist what has been said to the author of a book?
What happened after The Hair was sworn in is not a matter for Trump lawyers; it's a matter for government attorneys if what he says is related to a NDA he signed as a government officer. No private pledge, has binding on public duty. The phrase is on the cover of the handbook you get issued when you get sworn in. A federal employee cannot have a private NDA that covers the conduct of his public duty.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 11:05 PM   #360
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I agree with Bannon. That Trump Tower meeting was treasonous.
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