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16th April 2020, 03:20 AM | #161 |
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We do these things not because they are easy, but because we thought they were going to be easy. Everything is possible, but not everything is probable. “Perception is real, but the truth is not.” - Imelda Marcos |
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16th April 2020, 04:03 AM | #162 |
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pfffft...... I'm waiting for Corona 37
I mean this isn't Corona 1 people. |
16th April 2020, 04:20 AM | #163 |
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I have no idea what you're trying to say, but I'm still pretty sure that you're wrong. -Akhenaten I sometimes think the Bible was inspired by Satan to make God look bad. And then it backfired on Him when He underestimated the stupidity of religious ideologues. -MontagK505 |
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16th April 2020, 04:27 AM | #164 |
Penultimate Amazing
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16th April 2020, 05:04 AM | #165 |
Poisoned Waffles
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You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara. |
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16th April 2020, 05:14 AM | #166 |
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They seem like Trump supporters. Hopefully they'll be the only ones to get the virus and die. Michigan is a swing state after all. The danger of course here is that the Trumptrash from the rally could spread it to Americans. Scientist strongly suspect the virus is capable of zoonotic transmission.
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Ashley Babbit was a good start. |
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16th April 2020, 05:17 AM | #167 |
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16th April 2020, 05:27 AM | #168 |
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Minor nitpick, but it seems to be the thread for it
It's a Catholic doctrine. Most Protestant versions of Christianity deny the concept of Original Sin, based on the various verses where Jesus says something like "be like the little kids, |
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History does not always repeat itself. Sometimes it just yells "Can't you remember anything I told you?" and lets fly with a club. - John w. Campbell |
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16th April 2020, 05:45 AM | #169 |
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It's not completely clear. I thought perhaps that the hundreds referred to the people who actually marched on the capital and the 60,000 was people all over the state who staged the "gridlock" protest. This source suggests that 3-4,000 engaged in the gridlock protest in the capital, and 150 got out of their cars and marched. This source suggests that the 60,000 figure may have come from the number of additional people who signed an online petition.
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I don't trust atoms. They make up everything. |
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16th April 2020, 05:55 AM | #170 |
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There were enough people to block access to a hospital and get in the way of ambulance during a global pandemic.
So that's too many. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 06:00 AM | #171 |
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16th April 2020, 06:01 AM | #172 |
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Like as the waves make towards the pebbled shore, So do our minutes hasten to their end . . . WS |
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16th April 2020, 06:03 AM | #173 |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 06:05 AM | #174 |
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One opinion I read suggested the majority of the protesters were cowards for protesting without leaving their cars: they want other people to stop isolating and return to normal life despite the disease, but aren't willing to risk leaving their cars and exposing themselves. I think I agree with this assessment. Let those who want to "open the economy" gather together, without face masks, and see how well the gods favor their proposal.
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You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara. |
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16th April 2020, 06:06 AM | #175 |
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I've praised Gretchen Whitmer's response to Covid-19. She jumped on it quickly and did everything she could. However, her most recent stay at home order really did go too far. It literally made it illegal to visit your family, not to mention friends and lovers, unless you had a good excuse. That goes too far.
I wouldn't go to a protest, for fear of catching the disease, but an order like that really does need to be rolled back. |
16th April 2020, 06:08 AM | #176 |
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16th April 2020, 06:08 AM | #177 |
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Now stepping back a little further.
For a while now my go-to retort to every reason given why Trump is sure to lose in 2020 was "No. You ain't beating an incumbent President with record low unemployment in Ohio. No I don't care that it's a house of cards smoke and mirror act of stagnant wages, underemployment, and a billion other valid factors, he has a number he can point out that voters love." Well... that's changed obviously. That's why he's so gung-ho to "restart the economy" (either literally or in narrative.) The economy has always been his strongest Trump Card, no pun. Again standard caveat the rules and trends apply to Trump only some of the time so... no nothing is certain but I don't think Trump wants to roll into the meat of the campaign cycle with a bunch of really bad unemployment numbers in the news. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 06:14 AM | #178 |
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Wasn't the entire protest breaking the law by defying the stay-at-home order in the state? So they're willing to break one law, but not another. And it just works out that the one they're willing to break inconveniences others, while the one they're not willing to break protects themselves alone. Hmmm. What noble protesters they are, just like MLK and the civil rights era.
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You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara. |
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16th April 2020, 06:45 AM | #179 |
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I don't think it's illegal. It's a civil fine.
But it's not too far. Michigan currently has 193 deaths per million population. If Michigan were a country that would make it the 8th highest per capita death rate in the world, joint with the Netherlands. It's 5th highest in the States. The UK has had the same rules for 3 weeks now, and the UK is generally recognised as being an absolute ******** at the moment, with a government that hasn't done enough quickly enough. Yet the UK's per capita death rate is below Michigan's, although admittedly not by much (190 per million). Seriously, you should be questioning whether she's done enough. |
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I don't trust atoms. They make up everything. |
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16th April 2020, 06:47 AM | #180 |
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Probably merely travelling to the protest was illegal, but it's a lot harder to be arrested in a car.
In some of the calls for protest, the organizers said to stay in your car so that you couldn't be accused of violating the social distancing guidelines. Actually, as far as compliance to the law is concerned, that wouldn't matter. Leaving the house was illegal, except for certain defined purposes, one of which was not "engaging in protest". But, think about that for a minute. It's literally illegal to leave your house, according to an executive decree. it wasn't even a law. It was a pronouncement by the governor. The legislature didn't pass it. In practice, the cops aren't running around arresting people for visiting their moms, and I see groups of teenagers in our neighborhoods sitting on lawns, six feet apart, so I don't feel like we are living under a dictatorship. However, the decree went too far. You shouldn't have to hope that the cops will exercise discretion and not arrest you for visiting a friend, lover, or relative. If it's really, really, important, then you ought to be able to get the legislature to agree. That's too much power to be in the hands of a single person. |
16th April 2020, 06:50 AM | #181 |
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Yes. George Orwell was totally talking about a government not letting you go to Auntie Mildred's house and infect her with the Andromeda Strain because of "But Mah Rights!" when he was writing 1984.
Again there's a difference between libertarianism and "Just who the hell do you think you are to dare tell me what to do"-ism. Nobody is winning when you poke yourself in the eye with a sharp stick to get back at the government for their restrictions on sharp sticks being broader then you like. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 06:51 AM | #182 |
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He has a perfect set of scapegoats for the economic downturn:
FOXNews and talk radio will be a foghorn to blame the economic downturn on those scapegoats. It's also likely that the recovery will be nearly as sharp as the downturn and even though 25 million may have been put out of work, a significant proportion of those may quickly be back in work. Donald Trump will likely be able to boast of some of the best job numbers of all time - and he'll simply ignore the fact that's because he had some of the worst job numbers of all time. Kinda like him boasting about recent DJIA gains and completely ignoring the losses. |
16th April 2020, 06:52 AM | #183 |
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An interesting splatter of words you emitted there, to attempt to weasel out of acknowledging the hypocrisy of these protestors whose cause you apparently briefed yourself to defend. I urge you to put your principles into action and go forth! live your freedom! Because if you are isolating at home in obedience to these dreadful dictators who don't want you to kill Grandma by visiting her with the plague then you would be a hypocrite.
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You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara. |
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16th April 2020, 06:54 AM | #184 |
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You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara. |
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16th April 2020, 06:55 AM | #185 |
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What more could she do? Carry out food is still legal. I suppose she could ban that. There's not much left that's legal.
Like I said, I praised her for the actions that she did take, initially, but in my opinion this goes too far, and even if you think it's a good idea to take these measures, it ought to be the case that the legislature should have to sign off on it. Having that sort of power invested in the executive branch is too much. |
16th April 2020, 06:57 AM | #186 |
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Wow it's almost as if people want the government to fail no matter what they do to maintain a "Government can't do anything and we deserve to be punished for depending on them" narrative going.
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 07:12 AM | #187 |
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It seems discussion of the doctrine of separation of powers is a bit too abstract for some people in these times.
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16th April 2020, 07:15 AM | #188 |
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Your house is burning down and you want to have a talk about the environmental damage done by mining the radium they need to make smoke detectors and increased CO2 emissions from the fire extinguisher. When your house isn't burning down you want to talk about your God Given Right(TM) to juggle balls of oily rags by the fireplace. When your neighbor's house is burning down you're a libertarian, when your house is burning down you're a socialist.
It's not abstraction, it's argumentative levels of convenience and becoming a favored tactic by too many people to get their way. If the real world isn't going the way you want, argue broad philosophical arguments. If the real world is going the way you want, argue real world. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 07:33 AM | #189 |
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That's why I said "at best."
All the advocates are acting like this is going to be a game changer. As I noted, even with something that works (Tamiflu) the flu still kills thousands a year. What we need is a vaccine to stop people from getting it in the first place. Even then, it may not be perfect (again see the flu) but we need that exposure. |
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Gunter Haas, the 'leading British expert,' was a graphologist who advised couples, based on their handwriting characteristics, if they were compatible for marriage. I would submit that couples idiotic enough to do this are probably quite suitable for each other. It's nice when stupid people find love. - Ludovic Kennedy |
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16th April 2020, 08:15 AM | #190 |
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And, when all else fails, make stuff up about people. In my opinion, allowing one person to impose these kinds of incredibly strict restrictions on every aspect of our lives is too much power to put in one person's hands. If Gretchen Whitmer can do it, then Donald Trump can do it. I don't like that idea. |
16th April 2020, 08:34 AM | #191 |
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Well I don't like the idea of dying because Billy Bob can't differentiate between stopping a pandemic and the Deep State taking over.
Don't Bob. Don't go "I'm not really loyal to my ideals until I apply them in scenarios, and only in scenarios, where they are counterproductive, self destructive, or outright harmful." |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 08:44 AM | #192 |
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Insist that people entering Michigan from other states have to self-isolate for 14 days, for a start.
Quote:
I don't know enough about Michigan's legislature, how friendly or hostile it is to Whitmer, or how long it takes to get legislation passed, but I'm pretty sure that she did it the way she did because she thought it was the best way to save the greatest number of lives, rather than because she was on a power-trip or was trying to annoy you personally. |
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I don't trust atoms. They make up everything. |
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16th April 2020, 08:51 AM | #193 |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 08:58 AM | #194 |
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This article takes a broader view of these protests happening in the dumbest pockets of the populace all over America.
I think the comparison to the Tea Party is apt. Just another group of idiotic and self-entitled hypocrites. Because we all know that every one of these morons will vote for the guy who created this situation in the first place come November. |
16th April 2020, 09:24 AM | #195 |
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The distance between the linguistic dehumanization of a people and their actual suppression and extermination is not great; it is but a small step. - Haig Bosmajian |
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16th April 2020, 09:25 AM | #196 |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 09:46 AM | #197 |
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It is so painfully obvious what this is all about: Linda McMahon and her Trump re-election SuperPac fundraiser get special treatment from the Idiot in Chief.
Quote:
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16th April 2020, 09:55 AM | #198 |
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And WWE held a mass firing of a lot of its on-screen and behind the scenes talent yesterday.
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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16th April 2020, 09:59 AM | #199 |
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Idiots. When I saw the picture of these idiots I was completely unsurprised: Right wing extremists.
Quote:
ETA: ninja'd by johnny karate |
16th April 2020, 10:06 AM | #200 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Agreed. The psychology of religion is what's always fascinated me. People are not comfortable with "I don't know". They want answers for everything and are willing to accept almost any explanation, no matter how unfounded on logic, history, science, common sense or how contradictory, rather than accept there is no answer. Religion truly is the opium of the masses.
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