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16th May 2020, 05:35 PM | #81 |
Nasty Woman
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16th May 2020, 06:25 PM | #82 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get to me. . |
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16th May 2020, 06:34 PM | #83 |
Penultimate Amazing
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We use Kool Aid because who the hell as ever heard of Flavor Aid?
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16th May 2020, 06:48 PM | #84 |
Philosopher
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And the difference is?
Quote:
For example, Trump refuses to release his tax returns because it would prove he was lying about his net worth - a lie he created to deceive people into believing he would be a fit president. Technically it is lying if you 'care' for the truth and know it would hurt you if it came out. |
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We don't want good, sound arguments. We want arguments that sound good. |
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16th May 2020, 07:30 PM | #85 |
Penultimate Amazing
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My heros are Alex Zanardi and Evelyn Glennie. |
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16th May 2020, 07:56 PM | #86 |
Nasty Woman
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You can still use Kool-aid. Just remember it's about drinking acid (LSD) laced Kool-aid and not cyanide laced Kool-aid which if you think about it makes a lot more sense anyway.
You don't drink the Kool-aid to die, you drink it to alter your reality. Or your reality is altered because you drank it. |
16th May 2020, 11:13 PM | #87 |
Penultimate Amazing
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17th May 2020, 12:22 AM | #88 |
Seasonally Disaffected
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"When you believe in things you don't understand, then you suffer . . . " - Stevie Wonder. "It looks like the saddest, most crookedest candy corn in an otherwise normal bag of candy corns." Stormy Daniels I hate bigots. |
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17th May 2020, 01:01 AM | #89 |
Schrödinger's cat
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The pee tape, if it exists, is something I suspect most of Trump's supporters would cheer - they'd happily pay prostitutes to pee on a bed Barack Obama slept in whilst they watched too, if they had the opportunity. Whatever Putin has on him it must surely be more than that.
As well as the evidence of money laundering for the Russian mafia, it's also been claimed Putin bought Trump's debts from the Deutsche Bank. If that's true Trump owes a lot of money to Putin personally. |
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"If you trust in yourself ... and believe in your dreams ... and follow your star ... you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things" - Terry Pratchett |
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17th May 2020, 02:13 AM | #90 |
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“If only it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago |
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17th May 2020, 02:16 AM | #91 |
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“If only it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago |
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17th May 2020, 04:25 AM | #92 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting. |
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17th May 2020, 12:42 PM | #93 |
Penultimate Amazing
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He lies to troll libs or anyone, really, that he's annoyed with at the moment. That's why calling him out on his lies is a double-edged sword. There's always the risk that it simply amplifies the lie, or that the issue becomes about the controversy generated and not the truth of what he said in the first place.
There must be techniques to counter this dynamic but I don't know what they are. Maybe just patient, dogged attention to bringing the facts to light in a neutral, non-threatening way. Which may not be a fiery enough response for some people. What's the saying, aim to generate light, not heat? |
17th May 2020, 05:22 PM | #94 |
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"I know my brain cannot tell me what to think." - Scorpion "Nebulous means Nebulous" - Adam Hills |
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31st May 2020, 03:43 AM | #95 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I don't think he thinks he's lying. I think he thinks he creates reality.
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Ashley Babbit was a good start. |
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31st May 2020, 04:06 AM | #96 |
Maledictorian
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Trump considers telling the truth a wasted opportunity - if you are more or less correct, why not exaggerate a bit?
And if you are wrong - well, there is a right against self-incrimination, isn't there? Therefore, Trump thinks he has the right, nay the mandate to lie and gaslight. Only weaklings tell the truth. |
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“Don’t blame me. I voted for Kodos.” |
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31st May 2020, 06:50 AM | #97 |
Penultimate Amazing
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This hyper-literal pushback is really goofy. In the name of reasoned discourse, please consider the intent.
That said, I don't imagine there to be a great deal of variation that explains the constant stream of lies in varying contexts. Never mind "day trader", as that murderer Joe Scarborough calls him. Trump is a minute trader. Whatever glorifies him at the moment, from the standpoint of a putridly narcissistic, Cartman-like mindset. |
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To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot.
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1st June 2020, 09:27 AM | #98 |
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"Anything's possible, but only a few things actually happen" |
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1st June 2020, 10:42 AM | #99 |
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Trump lies because it works for him. It suits his purpose and his purpose is usally to make himself look good, because he is a narcissist. Let's take some recent "Pants on Fire" lies: "We have now Tested more than 5 Million People. That is more than any other country in the World, and even more than all major countries combined!" The goal of this is obviously to exaggerate what he has done.
His lie about "total authority?" To make himself look stronger than he actually is. His lie about inhereting a "broken test?" To make himself look good in comparison to Obama. He lies to make himself look good, either on his own or in comparison to his political opponents. Pretty simple actually and we don't need to invoke "mental illness," to explain it. In the end, it doesn't really matter if he lies because he "can't control it," or he conciously chooses to do so because he is just a shady salesman. The fact is that he does it all the time and has throughout his life. Everything he does is the "best," "huge," and "beautiful." If you didn't know that about him before he was President, you have to have been living under a rock. |
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1st June 2020, 10:54 AM | #100 |
NWO Litter Technician
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Yup. Just take a look at all the Clutch Cargo clips from Late Night with Conan O'Brien on Youtube. That's exactly the stuff they made fun of 10 - 15 years ago. Sure, the Trump of 2020 does sound more demented and disoriented and is even less articulate than the 2007 version, but that's just who he is and has always been.
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When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realised that the Lord, in his wisdom, doesn't work that way. I just stole one and asked Him to forgive me. - Emo Philips
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1st June 2020, 01:56 PM | #101 |
Penultimate Amazing
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FTFY. I can recommend the article that Bob001 linked to in the thread about Trump's dangerous mental illness:
It explains 1) what makes Trump a psychopath instead of a narcissist. It also explains why the difference is important. 2) how he lies without considering the long-term (sometimes just a couple of minutes) effect of his lies. It doesn't really make him look good to lie about things that are easily revealed to be lies: the number of people at his inauguration, the availability of coronavirus tests, the allegede beneficial effects of hydroxychloroquine and bleach, having the virus under control. When his pandemic advisers have to correct the lies he spreads only minutes after he has told them, it becomes obvious to a majority of Americans that he is lying. Some of them - fewer and fewer, apparently - don't seem to mind, but the majority are made aware of the fact that he is a liar who can't even stop lying when his lies are easy to expose as such, and that doesn't really work for him. |
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/dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx |
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1st June 2020, 02:10 PM | #102 |
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1st June 2020, 02:26 PM | #103 |
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Since my previous response to this got removed, I'd like to resubmit an amended (to fall under MA guidelines) response: This is like responding to the question, "Why do the oceans contain all of the world's water", and you respond, "Well, they don't contain all the world's water, so what you're really asking is 'Why do the oceans contain some of the world's water?'" While your side comments are accurate, you've completely changed the intent of the original question. You present a straw man variation in its place (everybody lies "about some things", your presentation completely misses the original issue: Frequency of Trump's lies). Also, your presentation changes it in another way: It's absolutely not the same to answer the question on a case by case basis. While he may have an individual reason for each individual lie (I doubt it; I agree with xjx that he generally lies to make himself look good), exploring those lies on an individual basis still does not capture the original question of frequency--Knowing why he told each lie is independent from knowing why he tells so many. It's a completely different question; why did you feel the need to change the question so dramatically, hmm? And while you, yourself may disagree with notion that Trump lies an inordinate amount of time compared to your average politician/businessman/human being, you're still being disingenuous and misrepresentative in this post by changing the nature of the argument presented by someone else--AKA Straw Man. |
2nd June 2020, 05:00 PM | #104 |
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A somewhat related question to the one in the OP, why does Trump keep getting a free pass with his unending childish taunts. This moron openly calls his opponents "sleepy", and "crooked", and worse, yet his opponents don't call him 'Trump the chump', or describe him as a fat despicable entirely repulsive creature, or a semi-literate and mostly incoherent intellectual midget, or suchlike.
Why this restraint? Is it because his opponents are not, unlike Trump, low-lifes? Should they, perhaps, change gears, and start stooping to the orange buffoon's level? (They seem to have started trying, of late, but far too self-consciously and tentatively to be really effective. It takes practice, I guess, to be an effective anal orifice -- of course, it works best when, like Trump, one is born that way, and when has nothing of substance in their head). |
2nd June 2020, 05:14 PM | #105 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting. |
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2nd June 2020, 07:01 PM | #106 |
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Much too milquetoast, even if that did play out. Which is my point. Trump brawls* with no holds barred, and his opponents invariably go Quuensbury with him, with the inevitable result that the best man does NOT win in the ensuing scuffle. * Only with words and debate (or what passes for debate with this dribbling imbecile). In a real fight I'll wager this draft-dodger would turn up his yelloww tail and waddle off on his flat feet as he could. |
2nd June 2020, 09:32 PM | #107 |
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3rd June 2020, 12:27 AM | #108 |
NWO Litter Technician
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When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realised that the Lord, in his wisdom, doesn't work that way. I just stole one and asked Him to forgive me. - Emo Philips
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3rd June 2020, 08:47 AM | #109 |
Penultimate Amazing
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My heros are Alex Zanardi and Evelyn Glennie. |
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3rd June 2020, 08:50 AM | #110 |
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Can you name a time in Trump's life when it hasn't worked for him? His shady salesman persona worked brilliantly for him in his business life. It just sucks as a Presidential persona. I knew that, you knew that but too many voters were taken in.
Quote:
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Hello. |
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3rd June 2020, 08:53 AM | #111 |
Orthogonal Vector
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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3rd June 2020, 06:26 PM | #112 |
Penultimate Amazing
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3rd June 2020, 06:27 PM | #113 |
Penultimate Amazing
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3rd June 2020, 06:31 PM | #114 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Trump hates being belittled and mocked. The best way to do that is not to call him names which would make Biden appear equally bad, but to have some well prepared cutting but clever remarks prepared. For example, Biden could look at him and say something like, "Would Melania's Be Best program approve of that?" or "Is that the kind of behavior you learned in church?"
ETA: Mocking him shows disdain and Trump couldn't handle that. He'd go ballistic and lose it making himself look even worse. |
3rd June 2020, 06:33 PM | #115 |
Philosopher
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No it doesn't. He's lost money hand over fist. If his daddy wasn't filthy rich he'd have bottomed out and been a used car salesman by now. He's lost everything and been bailed out over and over, first by his daddy and then by forces using him for money laundering. For all his bluster and insults, one of the few people he's never said a single harsh word about is Vladimir Putin. Putin owns him. That's not brilliant business.
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3rd June 2020, 06:48 PM | #116 |
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Democrats have "had Trump's number" since before he took office and we're constantly getting told of how he is and/or is going to any second start "breaking down behind the scenes."
The idea that the Democrats are "getting to Trump" is a dangerous assumption. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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4th June 2020, 04:01 AM | #117 |
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Bingo
Since it is trolling and the best way to defeat trolls is just ignore them, I have been just ignoring Trumps words. They are meaningless anyway, so no harm in ignoring the words. Unfortunately his actions can't be ignored, and that has got me spitting mad. It's a damn shame the Republican party didn't just ignore Trump when he decided to flip parties in the first place. The guy is unfit for any leadership position. He considers himself a ruler, and not a public servant. The very concept that we somehow elected a ruler instead of a public servant is making blood boil. And no I am not some pantywaist pseudo-Marxist leftist like so many commentators at ISF. My natural support has always gone to either Libertarians or Republicans my entire life. But no way in hell am I voting for that *******. |
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Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management |
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4th June 2020, 07:03 AM | #118 |
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You can't ignore Trump anymore than George Floyd could ignore the cop kneeling on his neck.
He's a troll in the mentality, but not in the "Harmless because he's only online" way. We're ignore Trump and he's gonna nuke Luxembourg or something. He WILL get his attention, one way or another. |
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"If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. |
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4th June 2020, 08:44 AM | #119 |
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Doesn't matter. The fact remains that, if nothing else, he and his personality built the Trump name into something that generated money all on it's own. He parlayed it into licensing deals, a popular TV show and the US Presidency. Even if the image is all myth and he is worth far less than he says he is, the lying still works for him. That part of it was and is pretty brilliant, even if it's a twisted kind of brilliance.
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4th June 2020, 08:46 AM | #120 |
Orthogonal Vector
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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