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31st August 2015, 05:43 PM | #561 |
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And I thought I was having a pleasant conversation with the people in this thread, how rude of me.
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1st September 2015, 02:16 AM | #562 |
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1st September 2015, 02:38 AM | #563 |
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You're making things up as you go, here. It might feel good to believe so, but that's it.
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1st September 2015, 09:41 AM | #564 |
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If we exist eternally then I would think this would be some kind of alternate kind of game to allow us to experience what it's like to live with others, and whether that experience was bad or good would be irrelevant judging by our standards here on earth. We would take what we learn here and apply it to another sim lab situation.
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1st September 2015, 09:52 AM | #565 |
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It won't be magic if it's real. A lot of people around the world care if it's a possibility, myself included, but no one can agree on what it might be like. I don't think that's a very realistic expectation to have anyway. I'm making do just fine, better than most people in the world, but there is nothing wrong with considering if there is more to life than here.
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1st September 2015, 10:02 AM | #566 |
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Your If ... then statement is invalid. There is not the slightest evidence for your 'if'.
The only thing coming after your life is the life of others. In your life you may choose to improve the quality of life of those sharing your life or of those coming after you in any way you like. That could be your contribution to humanity. Instead, you appear to judge such as irrelevant. You choose to escape in fantasies rather than to make a contribution to humanity. How selfish. |
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1st September 2015, 10:11 AM | #567 |
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Since you don't know what I do or anything about me I'm going to have to say that you're rather presumptuous in judgement. That shows a lack of critical thinking in and of itself. Nothing in the conversation thus far mentioned anything about descendents until you brought it up to demonstrate some kind of personal attribute I might have, that's a straw man argument.You've basically imagined what kind of person I am so how is that different from my considering what an afterlife might be like?
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1st September 2015, 10:18 AM | #568 |
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1st September 2015, 11:04 AM | #569 |
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Jodie, Daylightstar mentioned the lives of others, not of descendants. It's your assumption here, not his.
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Like many humorless and indignant people, he is hard on everybody but himself, and does not perceive it when he fails his own ideal (Molière) A pedant is a man who studies a vacuum through instruments that allow him to draw cross-sections of the details (John Ciardi) |
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1st September 2015, 03:51 PM | #570 |
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Sorry, I'm a nurse-midwife, I immediately went to reproduction.
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"When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse out of the corner of my eye. I turned to look but it was gone, I cannot put my finger on it now. The child is grown, the dream is gone. I have become comfortably numb. " Pink Floyd |
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1st September 2015, 04:00 PM | #571 |
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When I asked whether you could think of ways to provide the in between bit (between being born and before dying) with meaning, you immediately went to other realms of existence.
Could the work you say you do perhaps have any meaning? |
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1st September 2015, 05:32 PM | #572 |
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I'm sure it does, it and prostitution are the oldest professions in the world.
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"When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse out of the corner of my eye. I turned to look but it was gone, I cannot put my finger on it now. The child is grown, the dream is gone. I have become comfortably numb. " Pink Floyd |
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1st September 2015, 07:33 PM | #573 |
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1st September 2015, 07:47 PM | #574 |
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A God interested in remaining elusive could still intervene in the world on a massive scale.
Is there any evidence for such a god? No, not if it's powerful enough to intervene only in situations that won't be observed (or the occasional observed situation/phenomena (e.g., occasional veridical NDE account) to keep the faith alive). Here's the tricky one: is there any evidence against such a god? What is the evidence, and what kind of future searches would be expected to turn up disconfirming evidence of such a being? |
1st September 2015, 07:53 PM | #575 |
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"They want to make their molehills equal to the mountains by cutting the mountains down." -turingtest "The universe did not come from nothing, it came from 'We don't know'." -Dancing David "Cry, booga, booga, booga! and let slip the Hamsters of Silly!" -JFDHintze |
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1st September 2015, 07:59 PM | #576 |
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Someone linked a tape earlier about quantum physics that states the evidence doesn't support the concept of an afterlife.
However I think physics is far from complete but my understanding of it is limited. I can't agree or disagree at this point without delving more deeply into the subject. I doubt that will make much difference without completely starting over with basic math. I did run across this new research, it may or may not be relevant: https://earthchangesmedia.wordpress....ton-particles/ |
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"When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse out of the corner of my eye. I turned to look but it was gone, I cannot put my finger on it now. The child is grown, the dream is gone. I have become comfortably numb. " Pink Floyd |
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1st September 2015, 08:59 PM | #577 |
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If you presume that there is a purpose in life, you have to invent a purpose in death as well, since that's one thing we know occurs. But what evidence is there for any purpose in death, other than the logical one that a purpose in life requires it? We know we live and we know we die. All the rest is made up. It's made up even if it's a lucky guess and turns out to be true.
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Like many humorless and indignant people, he is hard on everybody but himself, and does not perceive it when he fails his own ideal (Molière) A pedant is a man who studies a vacuum through instruments that allow him to draw cross-sections of the details (John Ciardi) |
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2nd September 2015, 01:50 AM | #578 |
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Physics does not support the concept of anything that we currently regard as paranormal, for the simple reason that we have cleaned out any possibility of interactions that are not explained by physics in the energy range that we live in. An afterlife would only make sense if souls or spirits exist, because that is what is supposed to continue living, but souls have to interact with physics, or we could not move our bodies or experience anything physical, so souls are ruled out.
You can dream up a fantasy world where souls live, but they can never be connected to the real world where our bodies exist.
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ETA: Alternatively, you can postulate that our physics models need to be completely scrapped. If you could construct a new model that explains everything that we currently know, spanning every bit of chemistry, atomic decay, tunnel effects, neutrino detection, you name it, and allows for spirits and an afterlife, then you have a case. You probably would not need to flesh out the new theory to the last bit, but just make it very likely that such a model exists. Solid evidence of an afterlife, or practically any other paranormal activity, would go a long way to make current physics tumble. |
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6th September 2015, 07:46 AM | #579 |
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The problem here is that many people are asking for too much evidence in an area wich is still unknown territory.
We are just taking the first steps in this new landscape. A few propositions are important and neglected by many people here: - We don't know everything there is to know. - What we think we know, can be wrong, seen through the window of a much broader perspective. - We can't expect that people can provide all evidence of NDE's and the afterlife. It's just the beginning of a scientific journey. Maybe new evidence in the future, will provide us knowledge of a much broader perspective then what we know now. This broader perspective could give us totally different meaning to what science has discovered till now. So, don't be close minded here. Don't think you know everything there is to know and that your little scientific knowledge of the world is absolutely true. |
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'Where' is the image in the mind? What 'space' is the image in your mind in? Where is the dream? Where is your inner voice? It's not the same spacetime then where the electrical and chemical pulses are in the brain, causing this image or the dream. The image you see in your mind's eye is in a completely different dimension than where the chemistry in the brain is. (Maarten Vergucht) |
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6th September 2015, 07:51 AM | #580 |
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"They want to make their molehills equal to the mountains by cutting the mountains down." -turingtest "The universe did not come from nothing, it came from 'We don't know'." -Dancing David "Cry, booga, booga, booga! and let slip the Hamsters of Silly!" -JFDHintze |
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6th September 2015, 07:59 AM | #581 |
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"If I hadn't believed it with my own mind, I would never have seen it." - thanks sackett "If you stand on a piece of paper, you are indeed closer to the moon." - MRC_Hans "I was a believer. Until I saw it." - Magrat |
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6th September 2015, 08:04 AM | #582 |
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Any evidence at all in Maartenn's mind is too much. Ha. Brilliant.
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6th September 2015, 08:59 AM | #583 |
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6th September 2015, 11:09 AM | #584 |
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6th September 2015, 11:24 AM | #585 |
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6th September 2015, 11:35 AM | #586 |
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This is not at all a difficulty for a particular group of our posters. That and a complete lack of functional knowledge of physics and much related to it!!!! Not to mention, which I am however, a corresponding lack of research skills - which mostly seem to consist of finding an article or two - often from less than competent sites - very often, indeed, that seems to vaguely support what they deeply want to be true.
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6th September 2015, 11:37 AM | #587 |
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6th September 2015, 09:36 PM | #588 |
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How do we know we have consciousness? If we can figure that out it might indicate whether non corporeal consciousness is possible.
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"When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse out of the corner of my eye. I turned to look but it was gone, I cannot put my finger on it now. The child is grown, the dream is gone. I have become comfortably numb. " Pink Floyd |
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6th September 2015, 09:38 PM | #589 |
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6th September 2015, 09:51 PM | #590 |
a carbon based life-form
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6th September 2015, 09:57 PM | #591 |
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6th September 2015, 10:18 PM | #592 |
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Like many humorless and indignant people, he is hard on everybody but himself, and does not perceive it when he fails his own ideal (Molière) A pedant is a man who studies a vacuum through instruments that allow him to draw cross-sections of the details (John Ciardi) |
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6th September 2015, 10:19 PM | #593 |
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Looks like they found a mechanism that ties consciousness to the brain through quantum vibrational computations in microtubules which are "orchestrated" ("Orch") by synaptic inputs and memory stored in microtubules, and terminated by "objective reduction" ('OR'), hence "Orch OR." Microtubules are major components of the cell structural skeleton. I'm not sure how that relates to something non corporeal. I haven't read much about this to comment one way or the other but it looks like there is more debate about it both pro and con. I'll have to read it later but here is the link if you have the time to read it before I will:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...71064513001188 |
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"When I was a child I caught a fleeting glimpse out of the corner of my eye. I turned to look but it was gone, I cannot put my finger on it now. The child is grown, the dream is gone. I have become comfortably numb. " Pink Floyd |
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6th September 2015, 11:17 PM | #594 |
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I predict a quantum ergo.
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7th September 2015, 12:30 AM | #595 |
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7th September 2015, 12:35 AM | #596 |
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That article was discussed to some extent in other forums. Firstly they isolated those tubule in a way it does not happen in the brain. Once you remove the isolation guess what happens. Secondly, again those are PHYSICAL properties. Eliminate the tubule and you have a lot of nothing. Furthermore there is no indication that such system would even influence neuron potential in a way that chemico processes do today.
Conclusion : you meed a physical media even if the case above was even remotely applicable to the brain. It does not help your NDE stuff in any way whatsoever. |
7th September 2015, 01:58 AM | #597 |
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7th September 2015, 02:04 AM | #598 |
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Get near a dying person, put nozzle of running vacuum cleaner on or near dying person, as soon person is fully dead, put a stick in contents of vacuum cleaner bag and put in freezer.
Next day you have non corporeal consciousness popsicle. Self referencing ability on a stick from the freezer |
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7th September 2015, 03:09 AM | #599 |
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Ha ha. An ectosicle.
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7th September 2015, 04:48 AM | #600 |
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