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Tags Nicolas Maduro , Venezuela economy , Venezuela issues , Venezuela politics

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Old 10th December 2013, 04:02 AM   #161
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Maybe Danny Glover and Sean Penn should go back to check on the socialist revolution they championed a few years ago.

Jay-Z could put on a rap concert in his Che T-shirt.
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Last edited by Virus; 10th December 2013 at 04:07 AM.
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Old 11th December 2013, 11:21 PM   #162
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Financial times has a great article on the topic.
http://blogs.ft.com/beyond-brics/201...#axzz2mxLDwWsO

It requires registration to read, but is free of charge. A former Chavez minister explains how Mark Weissbrot is totally wrong (no surprises there) and how Venezuela could be fixed with reasonable economic measures. Currently the problems are still fixable, but the task grows harder each day.

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Old 11th December 2013, 11:33 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by Darth Rotor View Post
Are the lights back on yet, or not?

Doesn't look like there's any enlightenment here.
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Old 12th December 2013, 12:25 AM   #164
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Doesn't look like there's any enlightenment here.
Careful, you'll blow the irony meter.

I see you've given up carrying the torch for the great socialist revolution since it all collapsed into crap. Which anyone with half a brain knew would happen.
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Old 12th December 2013, 12:26 AM   #165
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Doesn't look like there's any enlightenment here.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...&postcount=156

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Old 12th December 2013, 02:14 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Doesn't look like there's any enlightenment here.
Did you expect the current troubles, CE, or were you caught by surprise? And remember, this is for posterity so be honest.
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Old 12th December 2013, 03:42 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
And remember, this is for posterity so be honest.
Wait, are we talking about Venezuela or Florin?
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Old 12th December 2013, 04:15 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Did you expect the current troubles, CE, or were you caught by surprise? And remember, this is for posterity so be honest.
There are no current troubles. Even if there were, it's all due to some Zio/Merican project.
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Old 12th December 2013, 10:22 PM   #169
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I'm sure one of the usual apologists will come along with a link to venezuelaanalysis.com that says everything is just fine and all the bad news is imperialist lies.
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Old 12th December 2013, 11:20 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by WildCat View Post
I'm sure one of the usual apologists will come along with a link to venezuelaanalysis.com that says everything is just fine and all the bad news is imperialist lies.
Funnily enough, the VA offers no "insight" into the current economic mess. It's all about how they won the election battle. I do wonder how (if?) they will cover the devaluation and gas price increases that will come within the 1-2 weeks

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Old 12th December 2013, 11:44 PM   #171
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Venezuela's Bolivian regime one of the most corrupt on the face of the planet.

Quote:
Claims of corruption involve some of the most senior figures in Mr Chávez’s “Bolivarian revolution” (named for Simón Bolívar, Venezuela’s independence hero). In an audio tape leaked in May, Mario Silva, a presenter on state television and (it now appears) a Cuban agent, enumerated to his handler the sources of illicit finance he said were available to Diosdado Cabello, speaker of parliament and leader of the ruling socialist party, who is a potential rival to Mr Maduro. They included the tax authority, headed by Mr Cabello’s brother, and Cadivi. Mr Cabello dismissed the audio tape as a fake, the public prosecutor has yet to investigate and Mr Silva lost his job
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Old 13th December 2013, 01:10 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
Venezuela's Bolivian regime one of the most corrupt on the face of the planet.
Redistribution of wealth.
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Old 13th December 2013, 10:11 AM   #173
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Doesn't look like there's any enlightenment here.
Ahhh, condescention. While you are stopping by the thread, why don't you bother providing some intellectual gravitas? How about something regarding Cuban ties, or how well cult of personality works as a governing model for a nation the size of Venezuela?
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Old 16th December 2013, 06:29 AM   #174
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Mark Weissbrot offers us his 'wisdom':

http://blogs.ft.com/beyond-brics/201...#axzz2ncYIECi4

Summary: Venezuela is doing just great! I know this because I can point to a three month period in 2012 when annualized inflation was just 12.9% and monthly inflation between August and October wasn't as bad as in July and had a slight downwards trend.

That Venezuela experienced more inflation in each of these three months than healthy economies experience in a year, during an oil boom, apparently doesn't bother him in the slightest. Oh, and November inflation is considered a state secret or something, no numbers were published, but the deadline for that was about 10 days ago.

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Old 23rd January 2014, 11:42 PM   #175
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HRW strongly criticized Venezuela in it's latest report.
http://www.hrw.org/world-report/2014...nezuela?page=1

If just some of the claims are true, it pretty much demolished any claims Venezuela has to being a democracy.

The response by Government and it's foreign propaganda office was surprisingly weak, containing mostly calls for evidence to be included in the report even when they were (not that the report is a place to put the evidence in the first place), non sequiturs and such. It also uses tu queque attacks against opposition, i.e. alleging opposition supporters destroyed government health centers, without providing any evidence for that, anywhere, in the past 8 months (hoax, most probably), and completely ignoring that a report on human rights in a country is not a comprehensive review of the bad events in the country - it deals with how the government respects human rights.

http://venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/10301

I'd say this amounts to an outright admission of guilt. Human rights situation in Venezuela is grim and worsening, Venezuela no longer has any claim to democratic process. Your thoughts?

McHrozni

Last edited by McHrozni; 23rd January 2014 at 11:48 PM.
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Old 24th January 2014, 01:32 AM   #176
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Originally Posted by Darth Rotor View Post
+1


It is easier to destroy than to create.
Ditto.
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Old 24th January 2014, 02:52 AM   #177
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
I'd say this amounts to an outright admission of guilt. Human rights situation in Venezuela is grim and worsening, Venezuela no longer has any claim to democratic process. Your thoughts?

McHrozni
I think the country is on the brink of civil war and that's why the ruling party has been arming street-toughs and leftist drug gangs in Columbia.
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Old 24th January 2014, 03:03 AM   #178
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Originally Posted by Virus View Post
I think the country is on the brink of civil war and that's why the ruling party has been arming street-toughs and leftist drug gangs in Columbia.
Hmm. This depends slightly on what you mean by civil war, but I disagree with both of the two options that I see.

The first one is the classic civil war where one side takes up arms against the other. I don't see this coming, because of the quasi coup in 2002, with disastrous results. Few people left in Venezuela wish to try that again, so I think it won't happen in the near future. It would likely be an improvement over the current situation, sadly, but I don't see anything that would trigger it. Except maybe a fall of oil price back to 1998 levels.

The second one is Venezuela falling into a failed state category, with lawlessness and violence spreading all over the country. I think this was already the case five years ago and it still is now. The country is already well over the brink of that one.

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Old 24th January 2014, 03:24 AM   #179
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
HRW strongly criticized Venezuela in it's latest report.
http://www.hrw.org/world-report/2014...nezuela?page=1

If just some of the claims are true, it pretty much demolished any claims Venezuela has to being a democracy.

The response by Government and it's foreign propaganda office was surprisingly weak, containing mostly calls for evidence to be included in the report even when they were (not that the report is a place to put the evidence in the first place), non sequiturs and such. It also uses tu queque attacks against opposition, i.e. alleging opposition supporters destroyed government health centers, without providing any evidence for that, anywhere, in the past 8 months (hoax, most probably), and completely ignoring that a report on human rights in a country is not a comprehensive review of the bad events in the country - it deals with how the government respects human rights.

http://venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/10301

I'd say this amounts to an outright admission of guilt. Human rights situation in Venezuela is grim and worsening, Venezuela no longer has any claim to democratic process. Your thoughts?

McHrozni
My thoughts having close friends and work colleagues from there is that it is utterly sad. The place could do so well and they are throwing it all away.

I have not met one single Venezuelan who wants to go home. Not one (50% of my team are Venezuelan). Even those till inside the country want to leave forever.
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Old 24th January 2014, 03:47 AM   #180
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Originally Posted by funk de fino View Post
My thoughts having close friends and work colleagues from there is that it is utterly sad. The place could do so well and they are throwing it all away.
It's tragic, really. And day by day the chance of improvement slips away a little bit further. Especially with the comment below.

Quote:
I have not met one single Venezuelan who wants to go home. Not one (50% of my team are Venezuelan). Even those till inside the country want to leave forever.
I'm not surprised, we might as well talk about Zimbabwe. A scarily similar way to burn the country down so one could rule the ashes. Oily ashes, in Venezuelan case. The Chavistas and ZANU-PF both pulled out a political equivalent of a scam turned into armed robbery.

The one last hope that I see are the legislative elections in late 2015. It is possible that the economic crisis will become so acute by then the electorate will strongly reject Chavistas and things will snowball from there. It's a long shot, I know, and I wouldn't bet more than an unused toothpick on it, but it's still a faint glimmer of hope.
If it doesn't pan out, Venezuela will enter a modern equivalent of the dark age for at least another generation

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Old 27th January 2014, 09:54 AM   #181
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
The one last hope that I see are the legislative elections in late 2015. It is possible that the economic crisis will become so acute by then the electorate will strongly reject Chavistas and things will snowball from there. It's a long shot, I know, and I wouldn't bet more than an unused toothpick on it, but it's still a faint glimmer of hope.
... unless they go into full "it's not the people who vote, it's the people who count the votes" mode.
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Old 27th January 2014, 06:56 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by funk de fino View Post
My thoughts having close friends and work colleagues from there is that it is utterly sad. The place could do so well and they are throwing it all away.

I have not met one single Venezuelan who wants to go home. Not one (50% of my team are Venezuelan). Even those till inside the country want to leave forever.
That is heartbreaking.
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Old 27th January 2014, 07:11 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by timhau View Post
... unless they go into full "it's not the people who vote, it's the people who count the votes" mode.
AKA... "defending the revolution" mode.
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Old 27th January 2014, 11:22 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by timhau View Post
... unless they go into full "it's not the people who vote, it's the people who count the votes" mode.
Yeah. But if 80% of electorate votes against Chavizmo, such shenanigans could lead to an uprising. Venezuela is awash with millions of illegal weapons and with new toys from Russia. They are also a colony of Cuba by now, courtesy of Chavizmo, so elements in the army may help it.

It's worth risking an unused toothpick, I wouldn't bet anything more on it.

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Old 28th January 2014, 12:03 AM   #185
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I wonder if Argentina is going down the same path.

Anyway, the official inflation rate is now 56%.

Venezuela grapples with 56% inflation (FT)
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Old 28th January 2014, 12:41 AM   #186
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
I wonder if Argentina is going down the same path.

Anyway, the official inflation rate is now 56%.

Venezuela grapples with 56% inflation (FT)
The inflation reading is likely false, courtesy of regime propaganda. Whereas inflation for November was released only in late December (it should be by 10th December at latest) with no reason or explanation given, the December reading of just 2.2% was given simultaneously - even though the month hasn't even ended yet. The Bolivarian revolution took I think 18 days more than they were allowed to for November, but were able to 'accurately' forecast December inflation at the same time.

The only reasonable conclusion is this was done in order to massage the numbers and that the inflation was substantially higher in the last two months at least.

Maduro promised a deflation of 5% for November, the official late number was 4.6% inflation, so this likely played a role.

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Old 28th January 2014, 01:45 AM   #187
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How do such countries get themselves out of such a mess. So much suffering because of greed and ego.
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Old 28th January 2014, 05:41 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
How do such countries get themselves out of such a mess. So much suffering because of greed and ego.
Some invade an island. Curacao better watch its back ...
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Old 29th January 2014, 12:10 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by Darth Rotor View Post
Some invade an island. Curacao better watch its back ...
Also Guayana. Venezuela claims over half the country. External policy is currently against pushing it, but a severe pre-election internal turmoil could change than within a month or two.

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Old 29th January 2014, 03:25 AM   #190
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And speaking of toppling dominoes (and I am), I understand the World Cup in Brazil thing is having a few minor problems also.............. Oddly, I am completely not surprised. The cost of these things to host countries and the area where they specifically take place is getting more ridiculous each new one.....
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Old 29th January 2014, 05:14 AM   #191
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Originally Posted by fuelair View Post
And speaking of toppling dominoes (and I am), I understand the World Cup in Brazil thing is having a few minor problems also.............. Oddly, I am completely not surprised. The cost of these things to host countries and the area where they specifically take place is getting more ridiculous each new one.....
Oh yeah, definitely. Another flashpoint - Russia and $50 billion Ponzi Sochi games. If Ukrainian revolutionaries have their say, Putin may well be next.

Spring could be very ugly.

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Old 29th January 2014, 01:33 PM   #192
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Simon Bolivar must be turning over in his grave at the misuse of his good name that the "Bolivian " Goverments have been up to.
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Old 29th January 2014, 01:35 PM   #193
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
Oh yeah, definitely. Another flashpoint - Russia and $50 billion Ponzi Sochi games. If Ukrainian revolutionaries have their say, Putin may well be next.

Spring could be very ugly.

McHrozni
ANd,considering it's exact location in Russia, having an Olympics in Sochi is like hanging out a huge "attack me" sign to the many terrorist groups that are based in the Caucausan region.
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Old 29th January 2014, 08:57 PM   #194
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International airlines are getting tired of flying Venezuelans for free.

Quote:
CARACAS, Venezuela — Three more international airlines on Friday joined the list of companies that have suspended ticket sales in Venezuela, complaining that the government owes them billions of dollars.
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Old 30th January 2014, 12:14 AM   #195
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
ANd,considering it's exact location in Russia, having an Olympics in Sochi is like hanging out a huge "attack me" sign to the many terrorist groups that are based in the Caucausan region.
Hm, yeah. I'd even call that a bit of an understatement
That said, I think that a terrorist attack at the Olympics could/would benefit Putin. He could order a nation-wide crackdown without too much internal hassle and arrest a few opposition activists in the confusion, plus stage another round of Caucasian wars. People would rally behind him, for a time. Not everyone, but enough to cement his throne a little bit more.

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Old 30th January 2014, 01:25 AM   #196
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
That said, I think that a terrorist attack at the Olympics could/would benefit Putin.
So by CT logic, if there is a terrorist attack, it will be assumed to be an "inside job".
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Old 30th January 2014, 01:59 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
So by CT logic, if there is a terrorist attack, it will be assumed to be an "inside job".
No, like imperialism that only happens when in the West. If there is a terrorist attack in Sochi, it will be blamed on the CIA.

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Old 13th February 2014, 03:26 AM   #198
Puppycow
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Protests turn violent. Could a revolution be brewing?

http://m.washingtonpost.com/world/th...962_story.html

Sorry for the mobile link.

Are these so-called 'vigilantes' really that?
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Old 13th February 2014, 11:58 AM   #199
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The only difference between Venezuela and any other Latin American "EL Presidente" type dictatorship is that Venezuela uses Left Wing Rhetoric .
And even that is not working all that well anymore. Quite a few on the Left have jumped off the Venezuela bandwagon since more and more has come out about how plain old incompetent the regime has been.
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Old 13th February 2014, 12:48 PM   #200
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Interesting factoid - every one of the graduates on my colleagues Engineering degree course has left the country. Every single one. Not one of them say they will ever return. The future of the country is leaving and they never want to go back. That is sad.
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