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Tags russia , ukraine

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Old 27th November 2022, 04:05 AM   #1001
jeremyp
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
Ah, sorry. I assumed you are concerned about safety. If it was just time wasted, wouldn't clicking be way faster than making a post about it ?
It’s fairly inconsiderate to post link only comments. Unfortunately, behaviour won’t be changed if everybody else just sucks it up.
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Old 27th November 2022, 05:29 AM   #1002
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I did follow the link and spent longer dismissing ads and trying to navigate down the page while panes kept jumping around than I did actually reading the text. I'd have appreciated a one-sentence summary.

I got that the FSB claimed to have raided a pro-Ukrainian terrorist cell and killed a guy but the photo evidence they posted of terrorist paraphernalia looked like merch from some online game and now a player of that game has suddenly and mysteriously become uncontactable.
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Old 27th November 2022, 10:09 AM   #1003
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Winter is going to cause problems for Russian troops

https://twitter.com/ChrisO_wiki/stat...UjgRhI9uo8NoXg

Even before being finishing training, there are outbreaks of infectious disease
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Old 27th November 2022, 06:06 PM   #1004
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Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
Ah, sorry. I assumed you are concerned about safety. If it was just time wasted, wouldn't clicking be way faster than making a post about it ?
I would appreciate it if you actually read my entire post instead of only the first sentence. I covered that point in detail later in the post.
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Old 28th November 2022, 01:31 AM   #1005
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Russia's still openly propagandizing future goals.

Quote:
Russia's strategy for decades to come is discussed on Russian state TV. Along with the claim that the Ukrainian language does not exist, pundit predicts Russia's absorption of the neighboring countries into "one big Russian home," with eventual expansion to the Balkans & Poland.
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Old 28th November 2022, 01:51 AM   #1006
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
Russia's still openly propagandizing future goals.
It makes sense. When successes are very thin on the ground and you've suffered a couple of humiliating reverses then claiming that it's all part of a much larger masterplan which is sure to succeed is the only way to keep the public upbeat and onside.
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Old 28th November 2022, 08:47 AM   #1007
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UK Intelligence reports that Russia continues to bombard the civilian concentration known as Kherson.
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Old 28th November 2022, 08:51 AM   #1008
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Reuters (and probably others) is running a story about Boeing "proposing" to the US government a combo of the M26 rocket with the small diameter bomb for a relatively cheap precision weapon w/ a range out to 120-130 km. Nothing novel there, though it may be news to the scribblers. I think that "proposal" in this context means "Hey, Unca Sam we'll sell ya these rocket booms CHEAP! Like only $40K each, 'n they're old tech, so you don't spill no secrets!"

Fine by this taxpayer. Keeping a static front hot isn't the same as advancing, but it maintains a degree of initiative.
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Old 28th November 2022, 12:17 PM   #1009
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
It makes sense. When successes are very thin on the ground and you've suffered a couple of humiliating reverses then claiming that it's all part of a much larger masterplan which is sure to succeed is the only way to keep the public upbeat and onside.
Yeah there's that side of it...

Or you can look at it as, that was always the master plan. Ukraine was just the first step.

If they'd fallen in 3 days then we'd either be neck deep in step two, or on the brink of it

But yeah Ukraini was always just the first step they just aren't pretending so much anymore
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Old 28th November 2022, 12:25 PM   #1010
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
UK Intelligence reports that Russia continues to bombard the civilian concentration known as Kherson.
If AFU can't push them back from the left bank either cutting down from north past nova kakohka or just crossing the dinypro river then Kherson will just end up like Mariupol

Except this time the citizens can actually flee. Although not sure where hundreds of thousands are going to flee to

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Old 28th November 2022, 01:19 PM   #1011
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...droidApp_Other

I don't know how much Wagner is paying but it's not enough. No wonder they can't recruit anymore.
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Old 28th November 2022, 07:07 PM   #1012
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Russia Strategy with these attacks seems to be like the German bombing of London after the battle of Britian:No military use, just an attempt to break the spirit of your enemy.
I don;t think it will work; Ukraine, like London, can take it.
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Old 29th November 2022, 10:39 PM   #1013
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Russia Strategy with these attacks seems to be like the German bombing of London after the battle of Britian:No military use, just an attempt to break the spirit of your enemy.
I don;t think it will work; Ukraine, like London, can take it.
I hope so, though there is the fact that in 1940 personal heating and cooking in houses was still done by wood or coal (at least in most cases) so less dependent on a vulnerable infrastructure and the winters in the UK are far less severe than in Ukraine.

I hope NATO countries (can) come trough with their promise of support for the civilians in that area as well.
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Old 30th November 2022, 12:31 PM   #1014
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Russia Strategy with these attacks seems to be like the German bombing of London after the battle of Britian:No military use, just an attempt to break the spirit of your enemy.
I don;t think it will work; Ukraine, like London, can take it.
The destruction wrought on German cities during the same war was worse by orders of magnitude. It didn't break them either.
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Old 30th November 2022, 01:11 PM   #1015
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Originally Posted by jeremyp View Post
The destruction wrought on German cities during the same war was worse by orders of magnitude. It didn't break them either.
What does it look like when a population is broken? Do we have any cases where that's happened?

What would a broken population do under a nazi regime?
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Old 30th November 2022, 01:18 PM   #1016
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
What does it look like when a population is broken? Do we have any cases where that's happened?

What would a broken population do under a nazi regime?
Bomber Harris' objective was de-housing the population. No it didn't lead to large scale uprisings by the German people, or even a mass refusal to work. But it certainly had an effect on their capability to continue the war. How many missiles is Russia sending that are getting through, 10 a day maybe? Whats the sum total of that explosive power? I'd wager a tiny little fraction of the amount of tonnage that the RAF and USAF dropped on Germany in WW2.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dehousing
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Old 30th November 2022, 01:59 PM   #1017
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
Bomber Harris' objective was de-housing the population. No it didn't lead to large scale uprisings by the German people, or even a mass refusal to work. But it certainly had an effect on their capability to continue the war. How many missiles is Russia sending that are getting through, 10 a day maybe? Whats the sum total of that explosive power? I'd wager a tiny little fraction of the amount of tonnage that the RAF and USAF dropped on Germany in WW2.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dehousing
Roger. Reading you numbah one. But I'm asking if any cities' inhabitants have ever cracked under bombardment. Villages and small towns have certainly been abandoned by their populations, and I'd call that breaking. Who could blame people for running for their lives?

I sure don't wish it on Kyiv or any other Ukrainian cities.

Do I wish it on, say, St. Petersburg or Moscow? No, not them either.
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Old 30th November 2022, 02:04 PM   #1018
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
What does it look like when a population is broken? Do we have any cases where that's happened?

What would a broken population do under a nazi regime?
Strategic bombing worked with nukes. But there were many other circumstances. The population was not broken .. but the leadership was, namely the emperor.
But Ukraine is different. They know Russians would kill many of them if they gave up anyway. So I think they won't give up even if nukes are used.
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Old 30th November 2022, 03:03 PM   #1019
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
Reuters (and probably others) is running a story about Boeing "proposing" to the US government a combo of the M26 rocket with the small diameter bomb for a relatively cheap precision weapon w/ a range out to 120-130 km. Nothing novel there, though it may be news to the scribblers. I think that "proposal" in this context means "Hey, Unca Sam we'll sell ya these rocket booms CHEAP! Like only $40K each, 'n they're old tech, so you don't spill no secrets!"

Fine by this taxpayer. Keeping a static front hot isn't the same as advancing, but it maintains a degree of initiative.
I'm sure Boeing will be able to produce a non-working prototype by the mid 2030's or so.
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Old 30th November 2022, 03:27 PM   #1020
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
It makes sense. When successes are very thin on the ground and you've suffered a couple of humiliating reverses then claiming that it's all part of a much larger masterplan which is sure to succeed is the only way to keep the public upbeat and onside.
Of course that those plans would cause World War 3 (attacking Nato Contries)
might dampne that a bit.
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Old 30th November 2022, 11:55 PM   #1021
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These days electrical power is critical for just about everything. Knock out the power and just about everything else is gone too.
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Old 1st December 2022, 12:16 AM   #1022
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
These days electrical power is critical for just about everything. Knock out the power and just about everything else is gone too.
There are reports that the Ukrainians are using diesel locomotives to move military supplies about.
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Old 1st December 2022, 12:46 AM   #1023
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
There are reports that the Ukrainians are using diesel locomotives to move military supplies about.
Which is good, but signals still need power.
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Old 1st December 2022, 01:50 AM   #1024
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https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ee-2022-11-30/

Letter bombs at Ukrainian embassy in Spain and Spanish arms manufacturer making grenade launchers for Ukraine
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Old 1st December 2022, 02:18 AM   #1025
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Meanwhile the Russians continue to grind on towards Bakhmut with another village in the area, Andrivka, taken in the last 24 hours.

Viewed one way, it's a trivial gain, a small village (though in this case they've at least managed a successful river crossing) taken slowly and doubtless at great loss.

Viewed another it seems to indicate that Russia can still take ground even against well dug-in Ukrainian defenders and that the new conscripts and/or forces redeployed from Kherson are making a difference.

Captain Swoop correctly pointed out that forces which have been "hollowed out" can suddenly collapse - the successful Ukrainian counterattack in Kharkiv is an excellent example - I wonder (fear) whether this could be the case w.r.t. Ukrainian defenders on the Eastern front.

I guess time will tell.
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Old 1st December 2022, 09:41 AM   #1026
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
I'm sure Boeing will be able to produce a non-working prototype by the mid 2030's or so.
It's in the current US Army inventory. I said old tech for a reason.

It's just a tube launched glide bomb fired from a self propelled launcher. That means it can deliver a quick ripple of silent, low-IR, guided warheads (after high-altitude separation from the rocket motor, natch) and skedaddle. Worth a try, sez Field Marshal Sackett, World's Leading Expert On Anything You Can Think About.
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Old 1st December 2022, 09:46 AM   #1027
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Has Russia decided to go ahead and act like a terrorist state, now that they've been named one, or are these letter bombs completely unrelated?

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ts-2022-12-01/
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Old 1st December 2022, 10:03 AM   #1028
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
It's in the current US Army inventory. I said old tech for a reason.

It's just a tube launched glide bomb fired from a self propelled launcher. That means it can deliver a quick ripple of silent, low-IR, guided warheads (after high-altitude separation from the rocket motor, natch) and skedaddle. Worth a try, sez Field Marshal Sackett, World's Leading Expert On Anything You Can Think About.
I'm pretty sure that Trebuchet knows that, and I seem to recall him saying that he's worked for Boeing.
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Old 1st December 2022, 01:48 PM   #1029
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Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
Has Russia decided to go ahead and act like a terrorist state, now that they've been named one, or are these letter bombs completely unrelated?

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ts-2022-12-01/

I doubt the Russians had anything to do with this. They have almost nothing to gain, and a lot to lose if they're discovered. My guess is it's some especially deranged Putin fanboy.
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Old 1st December 2022, 10:38 PM   #1030
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Originally Posted by SpitfireIX View Post
I doubt the Russians had anything to do with this. They have almost nothing to gain, and a lot to lose if they're discovered. My guess is it's some especially deranged Putin fanboy.
I think Russia actually is distinctly plausible, though, especially if the point was simply performative for an intended Russian audience. With that said, personally, I'd go with simply saying that I've not seen enough information to speculate meaningfully on probability. There are a lot of possibilities and no actually firm evidence about the culprit(s) to work with that I've seen.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 12:44 AM   #1031
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Originally Posted by SpitfireIX View Post
I doubt the Russians had anything to do with this. They have almost nothing to gain, and a lot to lose if they're discovered. My guess is it's some especially deranged Putin fanboy.
What, exactly, do they have left to lose?

The West is pretty much universal in its condemnation and repudiation of Putin and his terror state already, and it's not like they haven't done overseas operations before, ie. Salisbury, where they pretty much gave the West the middle finger in response to outrage.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 03:12 AM   #1032
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Lindybiege interviews brit who just returned from fighting in Ukraine. He had earlier interviewed him when he was about to first go out there. He had no previous military experience, but wasn't naive. He has led an interesting life doing all sorts, so has a variety of life skills.

You may recall the rocket attack on the base for training foreign nationals early in the war. Looks like he was there.

Anyway, its interesting as an on the ground perspective from the Ukarine side.

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Old 2nd December 2022, 05:37 AM   #1033
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
What, exactly, do they have left to lose?

The West is pretty much universal in its condemnation and repudiation of Putin and his terror state already, and it's not like they haven't done overseas operations before, ie. Salisbury, where they pretty much gave the West the middle finger in response to outrage.

Sending letter bombs to a NATO military base, and now a NATO embassy, are grounds for invoking Article 5. Further, Putin's entire strategy at this point is predicated on turning Western public opinion against support for Ukraine. But such pinprick attacks can only serve to stiffen Western resolve, as the Spanish have already shown with their reiteration of support.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 09:53 AM   #1034
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Well, looks like Russia is ready to talk.

And all they want is to be given everything, after which they'll compromise somehow I guess.

Maybe by promising not to take more land?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63832151
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Old 2nd December 2022, 12:02 PM   #1035
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Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser View Post
Well, looks like Russia is ready to talk.

And all they want is to be given everything, after which they'll compromise somehow I guess.

Maybe by promising not to take more land?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63832151
They even want land that they briefly held and have now lost. They are truly delusional.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 12:08 PM   #1036
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
They even want land that they briefly held and have now lost. They are truly delusional.

Even worse, they want territory they've never held, such as Zaporizhzhia city.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 12:20 PM   #1037
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Originally Posted by SpitfireIX View Post
Even worse, they want territory they've never held, such as Zaporizhzhia city.
Sadly enough, to me, that actually makes it sound like a more like a sincere offer for a temporary ceasefire, given Russia.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 12:36 PM   #1038
The Don
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
Sadly enough, to me, that actually makes it sound like a more like a sincere offer for a temporary ceasefire, given Russia.
Why would anyone give Russia an opportunity to regroup and re-equip on their terms ?
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Old 2nd December 2022, 12:48 PM   #1039
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The general consensus seems to be:

No talking until you leave the Ukraine.

This is a fair stance.

Russian has illegally been in Ukraine since 2014.
Russia has committed severe war crimes.

Biden is doing what Obama should have done in 2014.
Much easier to say now, knowing the deplorable condition/readiness of the Russian military.
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Old 2nd December 2022, 01:00 PM   #1040
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Also knowing the great strides Ukraine has made in military reform and readiness since 2014.
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