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Old 23rd August 2019, 12:36 PM   #241
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Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
It is an interesting discussion that is actually covering some of the same ground for the umpteenth time.
You might wish to read the last thread.
You want me to read a 50-60 page thread so I don't repeat stuff? Please feel free to not respond to any single one of my posts if you feel you've covered it too much. Until then, I'll continue my discussion as per usual. Thanks.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 12:41 PM   #242
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Originally Posted by Blue Mountain View Post
Do you live in an apartment block or a house? I'm going to repeat an earlier post because you seem to have missed it.
I currently live in a house. Up until about 10 years ago I lived in nothing but apartments. I didn't miss it, I saw it. It's just anecdotal so I didn't give it any weight.

Originally Posted by Blue Mountain View Post
I'll add that I likely would notice an unexpected red mat in front of what I thought was my door, pause to ask why it was there, and then realise I was on the wrong floor. In all the years I've lived in this block no one has ever gifted me a door mat.
As I said, an individual mistake...sure. I'll buy it. At the very lowest count having 3 mistakes strung together? Nope.

My buildings were even more generic than these ones. All white walls, same exact doors, and for 2 of my buildings we couldn't have door mats. I never once walked into the wrong apartment. I walked up to the wrong door a few times, but never once walked into or turned the door knob on the wrong apartment door.

ETA: Also, walking into the wrong door on your same floor might be a bit more believable. This would involve her not seeing the floor signs in the parking garage while she was driving, looking straight ahead, and going to a parking spot.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 12:43 PM   #243
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Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
Can't actually think of one.
If the mistake is a reasonable one. And no other motives apparent. And the act would not be criminal if the perpetrator was not mistaken.

Strict liability crimes, especially sex with someone underage. I don't have a list of specifics handy, but there are some states where if the person is underage and shows you a fake ID showing them to be 18+, you're still on the hook for diddling a minor. What you thought, even if you had every reason in the world to believe was true, doesn't matter in those cases if you are in fact mistaken.

Edit to add : the above is just a casual aside. Doesn't change my view of Quickdraw's guilt in the case at hand.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 12:54 PM   #244
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A similar mistake of fact type case would be a police officer shooting a kid with a cap-gun or airsoft gun.

The cop thought it was a real gun in the situation and shot the person with it.

In this case, the cop thought it was a real intruder in their apartment, and shot the person.

Why is this different? If we allow for the mistake of going into the wrong apartment, is it not the same as mistaking a toy gun for a real gun?
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Old 23rd August 2019, 12:58 PM   #245
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
If we allow for the mistake of going into the wrong apartment, is it not the same as mistaking a toy gun for a real gun?
No one but you is doing that, so no it's not.

ETA: It was her negligence that caused her to enter the wrong apartment, which means at the very minimum she's guilty of negligent homicide as that negligence lead to the death of an innocent man.
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Last edited by plague311; 23rd August 2019 at 12:59 PM.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:02 PM   #246
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
A similar mistake of fact type case would be a police officer shooting a kid with a cap-gun or airsoft gun.

The cop thought it was a real gun in the situation and shot the person with it.

In this case, the cop thought it was a real intruder in their apartment, and shot the person.

Why is this different? If we allow for the mistake of going into the wrong apartment, is it not the same as mistaking a toy gun for a real gun?
The difference (moral, not legal) would be coarse level vs. fine level target assessment. In one case your brain parses out 'person with a gun' based on data-points which actually fit that interpretation. It'd take more time to get to the level of 'oh, just an airsoft' or whatever, time which may or may not be reasonable to expect of the shooter, depending on the specifics of the situation.

In the case at hand you had a target assessment which consisted of 'person <BANG>'. Taking the time to discriminate between 'guy fixing my a/c', 'stranger sitting passively on my couch' and 'man rushing at me with something in his hand' is far far less demanding that what would be required to differentiate toy vs real gun, at least in most situations.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:03 PM   #247
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The defense will argue it was not negligence, it was reduced cognition due to lack of sleep.

They will call experts that will say the lack of sleep in this case would cause reduction in performance, which could be seen in the form of car accidents, poor decision making, lack of comprehension.

In your expert opinion, is going to the wrong apartment, with this level of sleep deprivation, a reasonably expected mistake, that her supervisors were aware of?

"YES."
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:07 PM   #248
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
The defense will argue it was not negligence, it was reduced cognition due to lack of sleep.

They will call experts that will say the lack of sleep in this case would cause reduction in performance, which could be seen in the form of car accidents, poor decision making, lack of comprehension.

In your expert opinion, is going to the wrong apartment, with this level of sleep deprivation, a reasonably expected mistake, that her supervisors were aware of?

"YES."
Cool story, bro.

They can argue whatever they want, but being awake for 16 hours doesn't cause sleep deprivation, as far as I know. Just because they argue it doesn't mean it will be believed as well. In fact, if the prosecution can come up with any other time that she was awake that long and didn't shoot someone it kind of shoots that defense to ****.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:07 PM   #249
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
A similar mistake of fact type case would be a police officer shooting a kid with a cap-gun or airsoft gun.

The cop thought it was a real gun in the situation and shot the person with it.

In this case, the cop thought it was a real intruder in their apartment, and shot the person.

Why is this different? If we allow for the mistake of going into the wrong apartment, is it not the same as mistaking a toy gun for a real gun?
Mistaking a fake gun for a real one is at least a perception of a threat to your life. Walking in on a maintenance worker is not a grievous threat, and it should have at least crossed her mind before killing Jean that she didn't own the property and others have rights to be there, unannounced in some circumstances.

If she gunned down a plumber repairing a leak, would you excuse her?
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:15 PM   #250
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Mistaking a fake gun for a real one is at least a perception of a threat to your life. Walking in on a maintenance worker is not a grievous threat, and it should have at least crossed her mind before killing Jean that she didn't own the property and others have rights to be there, unannounced in some circumstances.

If she gunned down a plumber repairing a leak, would you excuse her?
*DISCLAIMER FOR DISTRACTED1, THIS MIGHT HAVE BEEN COVERED*

There's a video from someone in the same apartment that goes through the process of opening the door that blows the cover off of this sleep deprivation or wrong apartment nonsense. In order to get into the door you have to put the key into the lock, hold it, then when it turns green you have to turn the lock and go in. The doors also auto shuts fairly aggressively so there's really no reason to think the door was open, but anything is possible.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:27 PM   #251
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
*DISCLAIMER FOR DISTRACTED1, THIS MIGHT HAVE BEEN COVERED*

There's a video from someone in the same apartment that goes through the process of opening the door that blows the cover off of this sleep deprivation or wrong apartment nonsense. In order to get into the door you have to put the key into the lock, hold it, then when it turns green you have to turn the lock and go in. The doors also auto shuts fairly aggressively so there's really no reason to think the door was open, but anything is possible.
Last I recall, it is still unclear what exactly happened with the key. Guyger said her key didn't work, and the door was ajar. The doors should close strongly, assuming the self closing hinges are well adjusted. That's not really a guarantee, though. Depends more on how thorough the maintenance guy is. Just a hunch: I think it's likely she tried to open it, Jean got up and opened it to find out what the hell was going on, and she shot him while he was backing the **** up in cold fear of this crazy homicidal bitch. Fits the physical facts most neatly.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:43 PM   #252
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Last I recall, it is still unclear what exactly happened with the key. Guyger said her key didn't work, and the door was ajar. The doors should close strongly, assuming the self closing hinges are well adjusted. That's not really a guarantee, though. Depends more on how thorough the maintenance guy is. Just a hunch: I think it's likely she tried to open it, Jean got up and opened it to find out what the hell was going on, and she shot him while he was backing the **** up in cold fear of this crazy homicidal bitch. Fits the physical facts most neatly.
Possibly.

Another possibility is that Jean would leave the door ajar by turning the deadbolt, and having the bolt rest against the door jam. This is what we did in college, and I do when I stay in hotels so my wife or kid doesn't need to take a key to the pool.

Like this picture https://www.tripadvisor.com/Location...h_Georgia.html
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Old 23rd August 2019, 01:54 PM   #253
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Possibly.

Another possibility is that Jean would leave the door ajar by turning the deadbolt, and having the bolt rest against the door jam. This is what we did in college, and I do when I stay in hotels so my wife or kid doesn't need to take a key to the pool.

Like this picture https://www.tripadvisor.com/Location...h_Georgia.html
Its possible, but I think unlikely. Who was he keeping the door open for? Wouldn't we have heard from them by now, if not on that night when they arrived to find their friend dead?
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:01 PM   #254
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
I blame it on Google.
Did you mean I blame it on Gogle?

Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
The defense will argue it was not negligence, it was reduced cognition due to lack of sleep.

They will call experts that will say the lack of sleep in this case would cause reduction in performance, which could be seen in the form of car accidents, poor decision making, lack of comprehension.

In your expert opinion, is going to the wrong apartment, with this level of sleep deprivation, a reasonably expected mistake, that her supervisors were aware of?

"YES."
So? "I was just following orders" hasn't been an excuse for over seventy years now.If she knew or reasonably should have known that fatigue has such deleterious effects, then any resulting damages due to those effects are still her responsibility and hers alone.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:04 PM   #255
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
And besides her being or not being a cop makes no difference.

1. If she was "in the moment" a cop, her training dictates that she IDENTIFIES THE GODDAMN TARGET before shooting.

2. If she was "in the moment" a citizen she still had a legal, moral, and hell logical mandate to IDENTIFY THE GODDAMN TARGET before shooting.

Citizen, cop, MIB secret agent... none of them are allowed to just fire into the dark.

But the racist apologist are demanding this lady remain "Schrodinger's Cop in Schrodinger's Situation" where the apartment is perfectly light enough for her see that there is someone in there but perfectly dark enough for her to not know he is unarmed oh and IT'S NOT HER GODDAMN APARTMENT, and when faced with the "threat" she just reflexively followed her "cop training" except the part about identifying the target and I need to be 100% clear here... that perfect balanced place DOES NOT GODDAMN EXIST.

If it's too dark to identify the target, you don't shoot. If it's light enough to identify the target it's light enough to identify the GODDAMN APARTMENT.

End of discussion. There is no weasel room in there. She either shot a man in his own apartment and SHE KNEW IT or she didn't properly identify the target.
Let it not be forgotten she had more than ample room to retreat and call for backup before engaging
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:04 PM   #256
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Its possible, but I think unlikely. Who was he keeping the door open for? Wouldn't we have heard from them by now, if not on that night when they arrived to find their friend dead?
And, again, putting her key in the door should have caused the door to open a bit, then make some noise when she took the key out as it closed again; however, if she put her key in the lock then she was looking at the deadbolt. Why would a robber leave the door open? He's already in, and doesn't need the door ajar to get back out.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:11 PM   #257
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Are we projecting the most innocent activities we can on Jean, with confirmation bias, or looking levely?
sitting in one's own apartment watching tv is a crime? if not, it's an innocent activity. holy ****.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:42 PM   #258
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Originally Posted by Whip View Post
sitting in one's own apartment watching tv is a crime? if not, it's an innocent activity. holy ****.
Don't criticize content. The move is to lob character assassinations about the typo in the last word.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:46 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
And, again, putting her key in the door should have caused the door to open a bit, then make some noise when she took the key out as it closed again; however, if she put her key in the lock then she was looking at the deadbolt. Why would a robber leave the door open? He's already in, and doesn't need the door ajar to get back out.
I could even give her a pass for not thinking that through in the moment. My objections start with the decision to draw her weapon. Sleepy head excuses go right out the window when you make a calculated decision to take a life.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:49 PM   #260
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I could even give her a pass for not thinking that through in the moment. My objections start with the decision to draw her weapon. Sleepy head excuses go right out the window when you make a calculated decision to take a life.
The only reason I disagree with this is because she shows repeated negligence previous to that particular point. Passing multiple signs that show what floor she's on, not noticing the doormat, not noticing the lit up sign with the apt # on it, her key didn't work (it had to have flashed red), the door being a jar.

There were enough red flags that they can't be written off, not that you're doing that.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 02:54 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
The only reason I disagree with this is because she shows repeated negligence previous to that particular point. Passing multiple signs that show what floor she's on, not noticing the doormat, not noticing the lit up sign with the apt # on it, her key didn't work (it had to have flashed red), the door being a jar.

There were enough red flags that they can't be written off, not that you're doing that.
It was posed way back that she literally murdered him, either as a secret lovers thing or psychopathic retaliation for loud music. Are you suggesting this was premeditated?

Eta: I meant could have been premeditated
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Old 23rd August 2019, 03:16 PM   #262
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
*DISCLAIMER FOR DISTRACTED1, THIS MIGHT HAVE BEEN COVERED*

There's a video from someone in the same apartment that goes through the process of opening the door that blows the cover off of this sleep deprivation or wrong apartment nonsense. In order to get into the door you have to put the key into the lock, hold it, then when it turns green you have to turn the lock and go in. The doors also auto shuts fairly aggressively so there's really no reason to think the door was open, but anything is possible.
Of course.
We didn't cover this over 25 pages already.

See: door ajar
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Old 23rd August 2019, 03:22 PM   #263
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
.....
If you say that he was sitting at the counter eating cereal and did not run at her, you are stating as fact sever things at once that are not on the record. Was he not said to have been watching football earlier? If he was sitting at the counter, he would seemed to have moved quite a bit to where his body lay. I think it is just as likely he was watching the game and jumped up at the ruckus at his door. I sure would have. But it sounds more Dewey-eyed to claim he was just eating his bweakfast and was a sitting duck.
.....
Are we sure her story is confirmed? I seem to recall a video showing that the apartment doors in that building are spring-loaded and close automatically. And wasn't there a neighbor who claimed to hear a woman say something like "Let me in!" Most residential doors lock unless they are intentionally set to do otherwise. Is it likely that she just happened to push on a door that just happened to be unlocked late at night? Or is it likely that she heard the TV in what she thought was her apartment and banged on the door, he got up and opened it, and she killed the scary black guy in her house as he backed away from a woman waving a gun?

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Old 23rd August 2019, 05:53 PM   #264
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
The only reason I disagree with this is because she shows repeated negligence previous to that particular point. Passing multiple signs that show what floor she's on, not noticing the doormat, not noticing the lit up sign with the apt # on it, her key didn't work (it had to have flashed red), the door being a jar.

There were enough red flags that they can't be written off, not that you're doing that.
You ever seen this ball counting experiment.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vJG698U2Mvo

You might be surprised what one can overlook when attention is elsewhere.
And, being off duty, she had no particular duty to show more attention than any average person.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 05:55 PM   #265
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Are we sure her story is confirmed? I seem to recall a video showing that the apartment doors in that building are spring-loaded and close automatically. And wasn't there a neighbor who claimed to hear a woman say something like "Let me in!" Most residential doors lock unless they are intentionally set to do otherwise. Is it likely that she just happened to push on a door that just happened to be unlocked late at night? Or is it likely that she heard the TV in what she thought was her apartment and banged on the door, he got up and opened it, and she killed the scary black guy in her house as he backed away from a woman waving a gun?
Most hotel doors operate that way.
I still check before leaving my room, because sometimes the lock does not engage if I just leave it to shut itself.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 08:38 PM   #266
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
Cool story, bro.

They can argue whatever they want, but being awake for 16 hours doesn't cause sleep deprivation, as far as I know. Just because they argue it doesn't mean it will be believed as well. In fact, if the prosecution can come up with any other time that she was awake that long and didn't shoot someone it kind of shoots that defense to ****.
I can vouch for this. My standard workday Monday to Friday is 6.75 hours sleep 17.25 hours awake. I still manage to park in my own garage when I get home each day. I live in a townhome strata so there is a similarity of appearance between many of the buildings.

For the record, I do not own a gun. If I came home and found someone inside what I thought was my home I suspect my reaction would be to exit much more quickly than I entered.

No doubt the defence lawyers in this case will try any bizarre claim they think might convince a jury. If the jury actually buys it, it will be because the prosecutor is totally incompetent in countering the defence.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 09:06 PM   #267
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Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
You ever seen this ball counting experiment.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vJG698U2Mvo

You might be surprised what one can overlook when attention is elsewhere.

That's a good example of how something can be overlooked when someone's attention is focused carefully on a single, separate, and somewhat complicated task.

Quote:

And, being off duty, she had no particular duty to show more attention than any average person.

What task was she focusing on which would demand that sort of careful concentration?

That video is often enlightening the first time someone sees it, but it isn't all that germane to her mental state as she was returning home, engaging in nothing in particular.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 11:00 PM   #268
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
A similar mistake of fact type case would be a police officer shooting a kid with a cap-gun or airsoft gun.

The cop thought it was a real gun in the situation and shot the person with it.

In this case, the cop thought it was a real intruder in their apartment, and shot the person.

Why is this different? If we allow for the mistake of going into the wrong apartment, is it not the same as mistaking a toy gun for a real gun?
She did not accidentally take her gun out, aim it, pulled the trigger, aimed it again and pulled the trigger again. They were all deliberate actions she took.
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Old 24th August 2019, 12:44 AM   #269
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
The only reason I disagree with this is because she shows repeated negligence previous to that particular point. Passing multiple signs that show what floor she's on, not noticing the doormat, not noticing the lit up sign with the apt # on it, her key didn't work (it had to have flashed red), the door being a jar.

There were enough red flags that they can't be written off, not that you're doing that.
For me the two that are questionable are not noticing or questioning the unexpected door mat and not asking why the door was ajar, although upon noticing the door she might have immediately jumped to the conclusion there was an intruder in her suite. (More on this in the next paragraph.) When you have no reason to suspect you're on the wrong floor there's no need to look at the suite numbers, lit up or not. On my walk from the elevator to my apartment I'm often fiddling with keys, trying to get the door key ready to insert into the lock. So my attention is focused on the keys. I can see the walls and doors in my peripheral vision so I know how many I've passed, but I certainly don't notice the apartment numbers on the doors.

Are you familiar with the idea that the human brain has two separate thought processes? One is very fast and jumps to conclusions, allowing for quick action in the case of a threat. It runs on a hair trigger and often makes mistakes, but can be life saving in an emergency. The second system is the analytical one, but it's slower to start up and takes longer to come to conclusions. I suggest that upon seeing "her" door was ajar (although that means she ignored the unexpected door mat) the fast system leapt to the conclusion "intruder!" And there was one, so she took quick and decisive action against it. Only then did the slower system kick in and start to really analyse what was going on. (Oh boy ... I can just see JoeMorgue saying "fan fiction!" And, Darat, based on this idea it was her "fast" system that governed the sequence of draw gun, aim, fire, aim again and fire again. It's possible her police training helped her with that—although I there's no way I can say that for certain because I don't know what her department's training procedures are.)

Having said that, there was no reason for her to draw a gun and fire at an unexpected person. Drawing the gun on what she likely thought was a burglar is likely to be expected, but as others have pointed out she should have immediately retreated. Had she done so there would have been some words and apologies exchanged, and life for both of them would go on.

At the very least she's guilty of whatever Texas law uses for "manslaughter."
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Old 24th August 2019, 04:33 AM   #270
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
That's a good example of how something can be overlooked when someone's attention is focused carefully on a single, separate, and somewhat complicated task.




What task was she focusing on which would demand that sort of careful concentration?

That video is often enlightening the first time someone sees it, but it isn't all that germane to her mental state as she was returning home, engaging in nothing in particular.
I have a rich internal life. It is not uncommon for me to be "lost in thought" while going through routine daily activities.
I expect I am not alone in that.
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Old 24th August 2019, 04:37 AM   #271
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Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
I have a rich internal life. It is not uncommon for me to be "lost in thought" while going through routine daily activities.
I expect I am not alone in that.
Pulling a gun, aiming a gun, firing a gun, aiming a gun for the second time, firing a gun for the second time are routine daily activities for you?
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Old 24th August 2019, 04:41 AM   #272
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Originally Posted by Blue Mountain View Post
For me the two that are questionable are not noticing or questioning the unexpected door mat and not asking why the door was ajar, although upon noticing the door she might have immediately jumped to the conclusion there was an intruder in her suite. (More on this in the next paragraph.) When you have no reason to suspect you're on the wrong floor there's no need to look at the suite numbers, lit up or not. On my walk from the elevator to my apartment I'm often fiddling with keys, trying to get the door key ready to insert into the lock. So my attention is focused on the keys. I can see the walls and doors in my peripheral vision so I know how many I've passed, but I certainly don't notice the apartment numbers on the doors.



Are you familiar with the idea that the human brain has two separate thought processes? One is very fast and jumps to conclusions, allowing for quick action in the case of a threat. It runs on a hair trigger and often makes mistakes, but can be life saving in an emergency. The second system is the analytical one, but it's slower to start up and takes longer to come to conclusions. I suggest that upon seeing "her" door was ajar (although that means she ignored the unexpected door mat) the fast system leapt to the conclusion "intruder!" And there was one, so she took quick and decisive action against it. Only then did the slower system kick in and start to really analyse what was going on. (Oh boy ... I can just see JoeMorgue saying "fan fiction!" And, Darat, based on this idea it was her "fast" system that governed the sequence of draw gun, aim, fire, aim again and fire again. It's possible her police training helped her with that—although I there's no way I can say that for certain because I don't know what her department's training procedures are.)



Having said that, there was no reason for her to draw a gun and fire at an unexpected person. Drawing the gun on what she likely thought was a burglar is likely to be expected, but as others have pointed out she should have immediately retreated. Had she done so there would have been some words and apologies exchanged, and life for both of them would go on.



At the very least she's guilty of whatever Texas law uses for "manslaughter."
Police training should* be about ensuring people don't act in instinctive and unconscious ways. So if she was acting as a police officer I'd say there is even less excuse for the "fast reaction" as you describe it.

(*Granted that some police training in the states is bad.)
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Old 24th August 2019, 04:47 AM   #273
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Pulling a gun, aiming a gun, firing a gun, aiming a gun for the second time, firing a gun for the second time are routine daily activities for you?
Generally not.
Making my way home after work, however, I am frequently focused on internal matters.
Is that negligent?
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Old 24th August 2019, 05:46 AM   #274
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Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
Generally not.
Making my way home after work, however, I am frequently focused on internal matters.
Is that negligent?
How many times have you shot someone in their home?
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Old 24th August 2019, 07:18 AM   #275
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Don't criticize content. The move is to lob character assassinations about the typo in the last word.
what?
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Old 24th August 2019, 07:30 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
How many times have you shot someone in their home?
Or in your own? I'm a little tired of this idea that it would be reasonable to shoot someone because you came home and saw them in your rented living room. Not only are there good reasons someone might enter a rental, or even an owned condo-type, property (things like gas and water leaks) but if you're not inside you have non-lethal options like calling the on-duty police. Why would anyone want a killing on their conscience when it can easily be avoided?
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Old 24th August 2019, 09:06 AM   #277
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Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
Generally not.
Making my way home after work, however, I am frequently focused on internal matters.
Is that negligent?
It is if you, say, run over a kid because you weren't paying attention to your driving. And you can go to prison for it.
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Old 24th August 2019, 09:33 AM   #278
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Mostly I just check in on this thread to see how long everyone can keep batting the same shuttlecock back and forth, without introducing any new insight.
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Old 24th August 2019, 11:29 AM   #279
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Are we sure her story is confirmed? I seem to recall a video showing that the apartment doors in that building are spring-loaded and close automatically. And wasn't there a neighbor who claimed to hear a woman say something like "Let me in!" Most residential doors lock unless they are intentionally set to do otherwise. Is it likely that she just happened to push on a door that just happened to be unlocked late at night? Or is it likely that she heard the TV in what she thought was her apartment and banged on the door, he got up and opened it, and she killed the scary black guy in her house as he backed away from a woman waving a gun?
Or the red mat slipped back over threshold and the door didn't shut all the way?
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Old 24th August 2019, 11:34 AM   #280
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Mostly I just check in on this thread to see how long everyone can keep batting the same shuttlecock back and forth, without introducing any new insight.
You must lead a rather dull life.
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