ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories » 9/11 Conspiracy Theories
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags Mark Basile

Reply
Old 22nd January 2017, 09:08 AM   #681
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,264
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
Thanks for documenting that
a) funds were solicited and many sent in before Chris relayed Millette's intention to publish a paper
b) this is explictly not included in what Millette is being contracted and payed for out of the donations, but a goodie on top
c) Chris hoped that there will be a reviewed paper in the end

So I was right: Ziggi lied about Chris "promising" a reviewed paper. He never did such a thing, nor did I, and certainly neither of us did in connection with soliciting funds.

Thanks again for your effort, Criteria! You Truthers can always be dependet on to debunk yourselves
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd January 2017, 09:09 AM   #682
LSSBB
Devilish Dictionarian
 
LSSBB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: An elusive house at Bachelors Grove Cemetery
Posts: 14,717
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
Where is there an explicit promise made of when publishing would happen?
__________________
"Realize deeply that the present moment is all you ever have." (Eckhart Tolle, 2004)
LSSBB is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd January 2017, 09:11 AM   #683
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,264
Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Where is there an explicit promise made of when that publishing would happen?
FTFY.
Can you answer the fixed question?
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd January 2017, 09:21 AM   #684
jaydeehess
Penultimate Amazing
 
jaydeehess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: 40 miles north of the border
Posts: 20,776
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
The attempt to pin a "he did it too", even if true, on Millette, would not change the fact that Basile has not produced as promised. It does not address my questions above concerning ziggi's claim that no one knew it would take 3+ years.
Nor does it not address the title of this thread.
jaydeehess is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd January 2017, 03:15 PM   #685
beachnut
Penultimate Amazing
 
beachnut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Dog House
Posts: 24,739
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
The "lab report", the paper, debunks the liars in 9/11 truth. Jones made up thermite with no evidence, and he was fired for spreading lies. Gullible followers of 9/11 truth take it on faith, and ignore the fact Jones paper lied about thermite. Reading comprehension is required, and exposes the conclusion for thermite in the Jones vanity journal paper of woo is not supported by the evidence and statements found in the paper.

Have someone read the paper for you, so you can see the conclusion has no foundation except in the failed paranoid conspiracy mind of Jones, fired for going nuts on 9/11. Where is Jones now? Jones best work is about Christ walking in the New World; better work than his thermite fraud.
__________________
"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen" - Albert Einstein
"... education as the means of developing our greatest abilities" - JFK
https://folding.stanford.edu/ fold with your computer - join team 13232
beachnut is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 24th January 2017, 12:52 PM   #686
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,264
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Ziggi, two weeks ago:

http://911debunkers.blogspot.de/2017...continues.html
"On December 27, 2016, I had a short phone conversation with Mr. Mark Basile. He continues to work on his red/gray chip study in his spare time and he will contact us as soon as he is ready to write up some results - which he hopes to do in a few months time. We apologize for the delays and thank our supporters for their patience. The results will be worth the wait. Finally, we would like to remind readers that new WTC dust samples are welcome in case anyone knows about a possible supply."
This documents three facts:
  1. Mark Basile is not actually working on the samples at all. A competent analyst would not need more than a few weeks.
  2. Mark Basile no longer intends to send any samples to any independent lab. For why else would HE be working on them?
  3. The samples that he has contain red-gray chips (he has shown examples years ago), but he know or at least suspects already that not a single one is actually "thermitic".
Ziggi edited this blog post and added the following:
"Clarification: An independent lab will double-check results, and the donated money goes to independent tests as advertised. Mr. Basile will contact us when the independent testing has concluded."
Ok, I am glad they are still at least talking about labs.
Doesn't help their questionable legal position much. Mark promised, when donation were solicited, that he would let independent labs do all the tests, and that he would report whatever the labs found. That the lab test would be "blind tests", i.e. the labs would not get a hint of what results to get.

Now the deal is changed to that he will only report what he finds, and the labs will be told what to find.

This is akin to saying "I test and test and test until I happen on a set of data that can be construed as confirming my bias, and then hire a lab to confirm my bias".

Ziggi essentially announced Basile's intention to commit scientific fraud.
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 24th January 2017, 01:32 PM   #687
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 24,148
Ziggi is making it up as he goes along. The chance of anything scientific coming out of this next to nil.
__________________
"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

"How many leaves on the seventh branch of the fourth tree?" is meaningless when you are in the wrong forest: ozeco41
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 24th January 2017, 01:42 PM   #688
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 24,148
Has Rich Shaddock had anything to say on the study lately? At one time he was trying to get the money back from Mark and do his own study (as per the original promise).
__________________
"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

"How many leaves on the seventh branch of the fourth tree?" is meaningless when you are in the wrong forest: ozeco41
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 24th January 2017, 01:53 PM   #689
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,264
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Has Rich Shaddock had anything to say on the study lately? At one time he was trying to get the money back from Mark and do his own study (as per the original promise).
I haven't seen or heard anything from Rick since ... well, at least since his hero Trump won the election
I didn't look or ask specifically, though
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th February 2017, 02:18 PM   #690
Gamolon
Master Poster
 
Gamolon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,054
I just looked over the "Proposal for Labs to Study the Building Fire Dust" located on the http://www.markbasile.org/ site and saw this, which I found interesting...

Quote:
Analytical Costs:

The following work is in need of funding to be run at independent facilities.

- DSC costs are $190 per scan and an estimated 5 to20 scans are desired, to look at the following materials in both air and inert atmospheres;

2 samples each of known building primer paint

2 samples each of red chips of suspected primer from building dust

5 sample each of red/gray chips or red layer only from red/gray chips

-ESCA costs are $330 per hour and a total of 4 to 8 hours is desired. This should allow for evaluation of at least two known thermitic red/gray chips with some sputtering for depth profile information as well.
The hilited portion is the part Mark is having an issue with and why it's taking him so long. He's identifying the two kinds of primer paint used in the buildings contained within the dust and cannot find any of the suspected thermite red/gray chips as there are none. They're all turning out to be primer paint.
Gamolon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 25th April 2017, 03:47 PM   #691
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 24,148
The months click by and still no progress..........
__________________
"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

"How many leaves on the seventh branch of the fourth tree?" is meaningless when you are in the wrong forest: ozeco41
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th April 2017, 05:49 AM   #692
Crazy Chainsaw
Illuminator
 
Crazy Chainsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,703
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
The months click by and still no progress..........
I wouldn't be surprised if he actually does find a paint at world trade center that can be ignited in an inert atmosphere, because I found a paint that was there that contained aluminum.
Red Aluminum metal flake paint, Some of it has a base similar to Laclade.

It was commonly used on motor cycles, cars and fire engines.

So potential for it's existence in the buildings is there though it would be very rare.
Crazy Chainsaw is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th April 2017, 05:52 AM   #693
Mark F
Graduate Poster
 
Mark F's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,051
Originally Posted by Crazy Chainsaw View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if he actually does find a paint at world trade center that can be ignited in an inert atmosphere, because I found a paint that was there that contained aluminum.
Red Aluminum metal flake paint, Some of it has a base similar to Laclade.

It was commonly used on motor cycles, cars and fire engines.

So potential for it's existence in the buildings is there though it would be very rare.
Fire trucks were damaged and destroyed during the collapse, as of course were cars.
__________________
So I'm going to tell you what the facts are, and the facts are the facts, but then we know the truth. That always overcomes facts.
Mark F is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th April 2017, 04:08 PM   #694
Crazy Chainsaw
Illuminator
 
Crazy Chainsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,703
Originally Posted by Mark F View Post
Fire trucks were damaged and destroyed during the collapse, as of course were cars.
And motorcycles, people love metal flake paint, and a lot of metal flake paint, contains Aluminum.
Crazy Chainsaw is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 27th April 2017, 09:50 PM   #695
skyeagle409
Master Poster
 
skyeagle409's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,094
Exclamation

.
The sun will burn out in a few billion years and I hope that he will have completed his study by then.
skyeagle409 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 28th April 2017, 04:27 AM   #696
Crazy Chainsaw
Illuminator
 
Crazy Chainsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,703
Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
.
The sun will burn out in a few billion years and I hope that he will have completed his study by then.
Have hope he may infact complete his studies before, the milky way becomes a quazar in a few trillion years.
Crazy Chainsaw is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd May 2017, 04:08 PM   #697
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 24,148
Wow how time flies. Another month goes by and still no progress reported.

Seven and a half years ago when Mark requested quotes on costs for tests seems like yesterday.............
__________________
"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

"How many leaves on the seventh branch of the fourth tree?" is meaningless when you are in the wrong forest: ozeco41
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd May 2017, 04:57 PM   #698
BasqueArch
Graduate Poster
 
BasqueArch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,858
Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
4. Mark Basile "continues to work on his red/gray chip study in his spare time and he will contact us as soon as he is ready to write up some results - which he hopes to do in a few months time".
Originally Posted by jaydeehess View Post
Really?

24th November 2015, 05:42 PM


That "update" from Ziggi, was over a year ago.

Shall we check back again in another year, or just check in every second year?
Originally Posted by pgimeno View Post
Well, "a few months" is a subjective concept. For some people, "more than 60 months" may still be "a few".
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Wow how time flies. Another month goes by and still no progress reported.

Seven and a half years ago when Mark requested quotes on costs for tests seems like yesterday.............

Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time.

-Steven Wright
__________________
In Your Guts You Know They're Nuts. "There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true." -Kierkegaard . "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. "- Marcus Aurelius
A Truther is a True Believer convinced by lies. You can't reason someone out of a thing they weren't reasoned into.
BasqueArch is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 24th May 2017, 10:27 AM   #699
Crazy Chainsaw
Illuminator
 
Crazy Chainsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,703
Originally Posted by BasqueArch View Post
Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time.

-Steven Wright
By the time Basile actually starts it will be debunked so what is the point?
Crazy Chainsaw is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2017, 11:38 AM   #700
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,264
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Ziggi, two weeks ago:

http://911debunkers.blogspot.de/2017...continues.html
"On December 27, 2016, I had a short phone conversation with Mr. Mark Basile. He continues to work on his red/gray chip study in his spare time and he will contact us as soon as he is ready to write up some results - which he hopes to do in a few months time. We apologize for the delays and thank our supporters for their patience. The results will be worth the wait. Finally, we would like to remind readers that new WTC dust samples are welcome in case anyone knows about a possible supply."
This documents three facts:
  1. Mark Basile is not actually working on the samples at all. A competent analyst would not need more than a few weeks.
  2. Mark Basile no longer intends to send any samples to any independent lab. For why else would HE be working on them?
  3. The samples that he has contain red-gray chips (he has shown examples years ago), but he know or at least suspects already that not a single one is actually "thermitic".
Ziggi edited this blog post and added the following:
"Clarification: An independent lab will double-check results, and the donated money goes to independent tests as advertised. Mr. Basile will contact us when the independent testing has concluded."
...
Correction:
Ziggi made that clarification in a separate blog post on January 22, 2017 - two days after I made the first of the quoted posts above:
http://911debunkers.blogspot.de/2017...gray-chip.html
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th June 2017, 12:10 PM   #701
benthamitemetric
Critical Thinker
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 439
So how long has it been exactly since the $5000 was provided to Mark Basile?
benthamitemetric is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th June 2017, 12:30 PM   #702
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 24,148
I don't think anyone knows for sure. There has not really been anything that comes close to transparency in this matter (or this study).

If we assume the money was transferred immediately after the goal ($5000) was raised it would be Jan, 2014.
__________________
"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

"How many leaves on the seventh branch of the fourth tree?" is meaningless when you are in the wrong forest: ozeco41
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th June 2017, 02:29 PM   #703
Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
 
Oystein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,264
Yes, by Jan 2014.
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
I am dumping an old link (February 6, 2014) here of a radio talk between JM Talboo and Ziggi Zugam about the Basile study:
http://noliesradio.org/archives/76313
...
JM says the goal of $5000 has been reached - although at the time it was already known that Mark really wants $10,000.
On 07/31/2013, Basile had told the 9/11 Truth Teleconference that he was at $1500.

Some of the money was raised directly to a PayPal account in Mark's name.
__________________
Thermodynamics hates conspiracy theorists. (Foster Zygote)
Oystein is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th June 2017, 02:40 PM   #704
MileHighMadness
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Just Southeast of Hell
Posts: 620
This is too funny...
__________________
“I don’t look forward to heaven, it sounds as boring as hell.” Lord Postsettle
MileHighMadness is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories » 9/11 Conspiracy Theories

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:49 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2014, TribeTech AB. All Rights Reserved.
This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.