ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Economics, Business and Finance
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
View Poll Results: Your savings
10-100,000 14 28.00%
100-200K 5 10.00%
200-300K 4 8.00%
300-400K 4 8.00%
400-500K 4 8.00%
More than 500,000 19 38.00%
Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
Old 30th March 2017, 07:27 AM   #1
Tero
Muse
 
Tero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North American prairie
Posts: 987
Poll: how much have you saved?

How much have you saved?
Other than homes and cars, how much is in your savings, IRA accounts and other investments? If you own a second house or a golf course etc, add that.

I'm going to use dollars, but for this, we can use dollar=euro roughly.
__________________
Let's see, new Republican ideas...er, cut taxes? Take down big government? Fresh out of new ideas. It's like thinking up a new ad for Charmin toilet paper.Trump: What collusion?Us: Collusion is your middle name, Mr President. You never invented anything, just borrowed ideas and offered your services to foreigners desperate to get their money out of their country.
Tero is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 07:44 AM   #2
Yeggster
Master Poster
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,412
Unless they are collectable or antique etc ... Automobiles are a liability.

You are overly optimistic ... having no thought whatsoever, that many people do not have the option to save money.
Yeggster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 08:06 AM   #3
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,265
I have a hard time with this because I don't have much cash as compared to my net assets. We try to keep one year of expenses in savings and then everything else is invested in either real estate or stocks. So, my savings are pretty low as compared to my investments, and I don't really consider my investments as savings. They are working assets, for the most part, and I expect them to produce in the form of growth, dividends, or rents. These assets are not liquid and I have no intention of ever selling them. In fact, selling them would completely gut my retirement plans.

Savings implies a more passive account, like our cash savings account. So, I answered by the balance shown on my savings account, although I could see the rationale for trying to total up the value of my investments instead. It is just that their total value matters less to me than their production. A bit like a farmer's land, I suppose.
__________________
I once proposed a fun ban.

Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 08:11 AM   #4
Tero
Muse
 
Tero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North American prairie
Posts: 987
Originally Posted by Yeggster View Post
Unless they are collectable or antique etc ... Automobiles are a liability.

You are overly optimistic ... having no thought whatsoever, that many people do not have the option to save money.
Depends on where you are. And what you earned. In the US, the safety net is weak. Socail security and Medicare as long as it lasts. So people DO save if they can. My European friends save for luxury things in retirement. That winter condo in Spain etc. Their lives are safe at home, though not luxurious, past the age of 60. You may be unemployed for some time rather than retired, depends on country.
__________________
Let's see, new Republican ideas...er, cut taxes? Take down big government? Fresh out of new ideas. It's like thinking up a new ad for Charmin toilet paper.Trump: What collusion?Us: Collusion is your middle name, Mr President. You never invented anything, just borrowed ideas and offered your services to foreigners desperate to get their money out of their country.
Tero is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 08:13 AM   #5
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,265
Originally Posted by Yeggster View Post
Unless they are collectable or antique etc ... Automobiles are a liability.

You are overly optimistic ... having no thought whatsoever, that many people do not have the option to save money.
Agreed. I saw something recently that 1/3 of Americans could not get access to $2000 if they need to in an emergency. That is frightening, but I remember that feeling when we started out. Likely I could have gotten the money, but it would have involved cashing in some chips with family and friends.

The one year in expenses rule we have tried to live by over the last two decades has certainly hampered our ability to live la vida, but it has lead to a very secure life even in the face of tough times or tough circumstances. Looking at a house purchase and thinking that an extra $500 in payments means I also have to have an extra $6000 in savings keeps you from overspending on things. It also makes paying off cars and limiting other monthly expenses more attractive. I'm not against debt, but it is too easy to let debt overrun your financial life if you are not careful.
__________________
I once proposed a fun ban.

Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 08:31 AM   #6
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Cymru
Posts: 21,670
Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
Agreed. I saw something recently that 1/3 of Americans could not get access to $2000 if they need to in an emergency. That is frightening, but I remember that feeling when we started out. Likely I could have gotten the money, but it would have involved cashing in some chips with family and friends.

The one year in expenses rule we have tried to live by over the last two decades has certainly hampered our ability to live la vida, but it has lead to a very secure life even in the face of tough times or tough circumstances. Looking at a house purchase and thinking that an extra $500 in payments means I also have to have an extra $6000 in savings keeps you from overspending on things. It also makes paying off cars and limiting other monthly expenses more attractive. I'm not against debt, but it is too easy to let debt overrun your financial life if you are not careful.
Debt, in order to make an investment, can make sense. That investment could be a house, a car to allow you to get to work or indeed an investment in a good business idea. Debt to fund ongoing expense IMO is not. I have friends and acquaintances who have borrowed money to go on holiday, pay for Christmas or buy some frippery they didn't need and no longer use.

I'm also a cheapskate who keeps cars til they become uneconomic to run (the newest of our 4 cars is 9 years old), buys own-label goods wherever possible, only buys new clothes when the old ones wear out and so on. As we've got older we've started to loosen the purse strings, we're just about to go on a (for us) expensive 2 week holiday in South Africa, but we still make sure that we keep saving for our retirement.

The "pain" of not having a new car every few years is more than offset by the comfort of knowing that my current car is paid for and, if necessary, we could fund its replacement out of our current account.
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 08:33 AM   #7
Yeggster
Master Poster
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,412
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
Depends on where you are. And what you earned ....
My point exactly.
Yeggster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 08:36 AM   #8
Yeggster
Master Poster
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,412
Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
Agreed. I saw something recently that 1/3 of Americans could not get access to $2000 if they need to in an emergency. That is frightening, but I remember that feeling when we started out. Likely I could have gotten the money, but it would have involved cashing in some chips with family and friends.

The one year in expenses rule we have tried to live by over the last two decades has certainly hampered our ability to live la vida, but it has lead to a very secure life even in the face of tough times or tough circumstances. Looking at a house purchase and thinking that an extra $500 in payments means I also have to have an extra $6000 in savings keeps you from overspending on things. It also makes paying off cars and limiting other monthly expenses more attractive. I'm not against debt, but it is too easy to let debt overrun your financial life if you are not careful.
Up until 8 years ago I could raise $50,000 over night on my credit line.

A serious of tragic events, medical problems, poor economy, and miss management of the little bit of remaining funds, has left me with almost nothing .,.

The first time since I was 14 I don't even own a vehicle now ... managing to keep my house so far ... but manly because it's cheaper by one third, compared to rent in my area.
Yeggster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 09:07 AM   #9
Aepervius
Non credunt, semper verificare
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Sigil, the city of doors
Posts: 14,457
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
How much have you saved?
Other than homes and cars, how much is in your savings, IRA accounts and other investments? If you own a second house or a golf course etc, add that.

I'm going to use dollars, but for this, we can use dollar=euro roughly.
Why don't home count as saving ? It is a wealth. By your count, I have less than zero saved because i am repaying part of my home, and will be finished in 7 years. But it is still an asset.
Aepervius is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 09:13 AM   #10
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,265
Originally Posted by Yeggster View Post
Up until 8 years ago I could raise $50,000 over night on my credit line.
I remember when my banker suggested that I apply for a home equity line of credit just in case I "needed it in the future". Apparently he was unaware that his bank would retract that line of credit if I ever actually needed it. So long as you don't need money, banks will always be there to lend it to you.
__________________
I once proposed a fun ban.

Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 09:15 AM   #11
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,265
Originally Posted by Aepervius View Post
Why don't home count as saving ? It is a wealth. By your count, I have less than zero saved because i am repaying part of my home, and will be finished in 7 years. But it is still an asset.
I don't count meh one as an asset because if I sold it I would have to find somewhere else to live. I also don't count the mortgage as a giant hole in my savings since I would have a similar payment if I rented.

By the time I sell the house I will have enough equity to buy or build my next house. But there will always be monthly payments, even if just taxes and insurance.
__________________
I once proposed a fun ban.

Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 09:16 AM   #12
Yeggster
Master Poster
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,412
Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
I remember when my banker suggested that I apply for a home equity line of credit just in case I "needed it in the future". Apparently he was unaware that his bank would retract that line of credit if I ever actually needed it. So long as you don't need money, banks will always be there to lend it to you.
Mine was a financial decision to save money ... It saved me $300 a month AND I was paying down the balance faster.

Now it's still working as I am paying interest only and that makes the "mortgage payment) very low.

Last edited by Yeggster; 30th March 2017 at 09:19 AM.
Yeggster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 11:38 AM   #13
madurobob
Philosopher
 
madurobob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Blue Heaven
Posts: 7,141
Only real "savings" I have is in my 401(k). If I add current equity in the house I rent out, but don't count the house I live in or the land I own, I'm at the $500K threshold.

Still, if I had to raise as little as $500 quickly I'd be hard pressed to do it until payday (tomorrow!).
__________________
I love you and I vote.
madurobob is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 11:52 AM   #14
Beady
Philosopher
 
Beady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: 42d 45'23.3"N, 84d 35' 10.8'W, 840'>MSL
Posts: 6,523
We each entered retirement with about 20 years' worth of savings. We paid cash for our retirement house and car, live on Social Security and pensions (pensions include health insurance), and use our "retirement money" for big-ticket items such as home repair. We live within our means, take a major vacation every couple of years, and are reasonably comfortable.

This signature is intended to irritate people.
__________________
Ahh, screw it!
Beady is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:17 PM   #15
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
 
psionl0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: 3157'S 11557'E
Posts: 11,062
Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
I remember when my banker suggested that I apply for a home equity line of credit just in case I "needed it in the future". Apparently he was unaware that his bank would retract that line of credit if I ever actually needed it. So long as you don't need money, banks will always be there to lend it to you.
LOL That reminds me of a saying about banks: They will let you have an umbrella when the sun is shining but take it off you when it starts to rain.
__________________
"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975
psionl0 is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:20 PM   #16
Beady
Philosopher
 
Beady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: 42d 45'23.3"N, 84d 35' 10.8'W, 840'>MSL
Posts: 6,523
Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
LOL That reminds me of a saying about banks: They will let you have an umbrella when the sun is shining but take it off you when it starts to rain.
How about, "Your bank will give you the shirt off your back"?

This signature is intended to irritate people.
__________________
Ahh, screw it!
Beady is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:21 PM   #17
Tero
Muse
 
Tero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North American prairie
Posts: 987
Aepervius, you can certainly sell your home at some point and survive on that money. But the point was to seehow much we think we need. This money is just earning a profit for most of us and then can be used when you have no salaried income. On whatever. For necesessities, insurance etc. Those who did not save up work past 65. You can even earn 15 000 while collecting soc sec.
__________________
Let's see, new Republican ideas...er, cut taxes? Take down big government? Fresh out of new ideas. It's like thinking up a new ad for Charmin toilet paper.Trump: What collusion?Us: Collusion is your middle name, Mr President. You never invented anything, just borrowed ideas and offered your services to foreigners desperate to get their money out of their country.
Tero is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:25 PM   #18
Cainkane1
Philosopher
 
Cainkane1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: The great American southeast
Posts: 8,340
I made such a crappy salary that I was unable to save much money. A little but not much. My parents seeing this and me being their only child pitched in and my monthly checks to 25.00 pension fund supplied by my parents and the bank are as follows. $1200.00 social security, 425.00 pension that I earned, 725.00 out of a retirement account purchased for me by my father. Mother gave me her life savings of $200,000 and $90,000 in her checking account after she passed away. The house I am living in would sell for $150,000.

I owe my parents a lot. Without them I would have ended my days in a cardboard box on the street and thats if I was lucky.
__________________
If at first you don't succeed try try again. Then if you fail to succeed to Hell with that. Try something else.
Cainkane1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:26 PM   #19
MikeG
Now. Do it now.
 
MikeG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 18,853
Take on the restoration of a wreck of an old house by yourself, and take 2 or 3 years off work to do it, then come back to me and talk about savings, OK?
__________________
The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place. The Don

That's what we've sunk to here.
MikeG is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:42 PM   #20
fagin
Illuminator
 
fagin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: As far away from casebro as possible.
Posts: 4,135
What's the square root of **** all?
__________________
There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda
fagin is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:46 PM   #21
Trebuchet
Penultimate Amazing
 
Trebuchet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Great Northwet
Posts: 11,994
On Planet X, it's NOYDB.
__________________
Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.
Trebuchet is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 12:49 PM   #22
Yeggster
Master Poster
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,412
Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post

I owe my parents a lot. Without them I would have ended my days in a cardboard box on the street and thats if I was lucky.
Out living my last remaining parent is my only retirement plan

It's not a good plan
Yeggster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 01:06 PM   #23
fagin
Illuminator
 
fagin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: As far away from casebro as possible.
Posts: 4,135
That's why I'm really nice to my son.

Just hope he remembers.
__________________
There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda
fagin is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 03:29 PM   #24
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 15,338
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
How much have you saved?
Other than homes and cars, how much is in your savings, IRA accounts and other investments? If you own a second house or a golf course etc, add that.

I'm going to use dollars, but for this, we can use dollar=euro roughly.
I own my home outright with no encumberances. Where does that go? Savings?
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 03:41 PM   #25
Tero
Muse
 
Tero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North American prairie
Posts: 987
Certainly the home is savings, but I did not want to make this too complicated. You need to own or rent a home, that is clear. The same house is worth 100 000 to 500 000 depending on location.
__________________
Let's see, new Republican ideas...er, cut taxes? Take down big government? Fresh out of new ideas. It's like thinking up a new ad for Charmin toilet paper.Trump: What collusion?Us: Collusion is your middle name, Mr President. You never invented anything, just borrowed ideas and offered your services to foreigners desperate to get their money out of their country.
Tero is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 03:57 PM   #26
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 15,338
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
Certainly the home is savings, but I did not want to make this too complicated. You need to own or rent a home, that is clear. The same house is worth 100 000 to 500 000 depending on location.
Indeed. See, some years ago I was indebted to the tune of almost a million. I worked my way out of that in short order to the point where I owe nobody nothing. It wasn't easy, but it is possible to accomplish, for anyone in such straits. There is always hope, but there must also be drive to do something about it.

Therein lies the rub. Is my current scenario savings or assets? One could cast it either way.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 04:22 PM   #27
Joecool
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,013
Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
I own my home outright with no encumberances. Where does that go? Savings?

Wouldn't you count that as a part of your net worth? Not sure about savings as the asset is not liquid.
Joecool is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 04:49 PM   #28
Loss Leader
Would Be Ringing (if a bell)
Moderator
 
Loss Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: New York
Posts: 22,903
We just sold a house and have yet to buy, but in the long term we have just nothing whatsoever.
__________________
I have the honor to be
Your Obdt. St

L. Leader
Loss Leader is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 30th March 2017, 04:55 PM   #29
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 15,338
Originally Posted by Joecool View Post
Wouldn't you count that as a part of your net worth? Not sure about savings as the asset is not liquid.
Sure, but it isn't my poll. I don't get to set the standard of measure, I am simply trying to find out what measure fits where in terms of the metric in use.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st March 2017, 05:49 AM   #30
JoeBentley
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeBentley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 7,035
In raw, liquid assets I have roughly 10 grand I could access either immediately or in a very short time (2-3 business days). I have another 40,000 or so in equity in my house which is accessible even without selling the house, but much harder to access and would take some significant time.

But I also have a very rare thing these days, an actual honest to God pension, a small but not insignificant amount (It would royally suck and we'd be just scraping by, by me and the wife could survive on it in a pinch) that's going to be dropped into my bank account until the day I die which probably worth a lot more then any reasonable amount I could ever save up.
__________________
Hemingway once wrote that "The world is a fine place and worth fighting for." I agree with the second part.
JoeBentley is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 31st March 2017, 09:59 AM   #31
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,265
Originally Posted by JoeBentley View Post
But I also have a very rare thing these days, an actual honest to God pension, a small but not insignificant amount (It would royally suck and we'd be just scraping by, by me and the wife could survive on it in a pinch) that's going to be dropped into my bank account until the day I die which probably worth a lot more then any reasonable amount I could ever save up.
My wife is going to have one of those when we retire. Except that GOP politicians in our state are trying to convert the pension into a 401K type plan. This is the first time I have seen my wife get quite passionate about politics.
__________________
I once proposed a fun ban.

Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th April 2017, 12:41 PM   #32
blutoski
Penultimate Amazing
 
blutoski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 10,578
I've been very, very lucky over the years. A small amount of savings have converted into a large amount of portfolio and primary dwelling assets.

My wife is just starting to grasp the importance of financial planning. Despite having a shared asset in the house, we otherwise do our own FP, and the scales are finally falling from her eyes about financial planners. ie: that they're mostly incompetent, but some are shady too.

The main breaking point for her was that we're reviewing our parents' investments (we have POA for our respective parents) and it's clear that the managed portfolios have vastly underperformed the unmanaged ones.

My poor dad... during this 2009 - present runup, his investments and yield have actually shrunk, but in some sort of sad Stockholm Syndrome, he continues to praise is financial advisor as a genius. Something-something-taxes. Getting rid of that parasite is on the agenda for 2017, even though it will precipitate an argument with my dad.

There's a website by a fellow Canuck that I have encouraged my wife to read: [Mr. Money Mustache — Early Retirement through Badassity]. Early retirement (50-55) has always been my goal, and I wish this site had existed 30 years ago when I was younger so I didn't have to learn the hard way.

My wife is somewhat avoidant, so unable to answer direct questions about her financial planning ("when do you want to retire?") which makes it difficult for me to contribute suggestions for her. I have a feeling we'll be living on my savings even though her earnings are twice mine at the moment.
__________________
"Sometimes it's better to light a flamethrower than curse the darkness." - Terry Pratchett
blutoski is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 11:45 AM   #33
Distracted1
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 1,989
Why are there no negative number options in this poll?

Were I to die tonight, there would be a good deal more bad debt on numerous ledgers.
__________________
The man with one watch knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure.
Distracted1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 12:10 PM   #34
Giordano
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 12,784
It is reassuring to me that many of the ISF members do have reasonable levels of savings. Many surveys indicate that the majority of people in the USA have little or no savings, or literally owe more than than own. When asked, many people in the USA would have trouble obtaining just a few thousand dollars for an emergency without borrowing it from someone. This is a frightening idea to me, but I certainly know in person of many people in this situation. Some are just careless or stupid with money, but there are many jobs that simply do not pay enough for an average family to be able to save enough money for future needs. For example the average household income in California in 2013 was $60,000 a year- given the cost of housing, etc. in this state it is not easy to set aside much of that for retirement. And although some people lucky enough to buy a home think of it as part of their savings, one has to live somewhere! So the potential value of one's home is not going to mean very much in retirement unless one plans to sell it and move somewhere a lot cheaper (or into a tent in the woods). Or take out a reverse mortgage I guess.
Giordano is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 12:52 PM   #35
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 13,265
Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
(or into a tent in the woods)
I think "a van down by the river" was the phrase you were looking for.
__________________
I once proposed a fun ban.

Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 12:56 PM   #36
blutoski
Penultimate Amazing
 
blutoski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 10,578
Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
So the potential value of one's home is not going to mean very much in retirement unless one plans to sell it and move somewhere a lot cheaper (or into a tent in the woods). Or take out a reverse mortgage I guess.
To some extent, I feel the same way about an investment portfolio... there's an interesting story in the media right now about Steve Bannon's retired dad selling off his AT&T shares in a panic in 2009ish because the market cap dropped.

My thinking about this is that, ok, yes, the market cap dropped, but the dividend actually went up that year. If the point of the exercise is to use the investments to generate income, it doesn't matter what the share can be sold for today if it's still providing you with $4 a year.

AT&T is currently yielding 4.70%, which is pretty typical for an old utility.
__________________
"Sometimes it's better to light a flamethrower than curse the darkness." - Terry Pratchett
blutoski is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 03:06 PM   #37
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
 
psionl0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: 3157'S 11557'E
Posts: 11,062
Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
And although some people lucky enough to buy a home think of it as part of their savings, one has to live somewhere!
I own my home free and clear and I haven't had to pay rent for quite a few years. It would probably cost $500+ a week to rent the place I live in right now so that is a significant boost to my income.

There are those who say that the stock market gives a better return than a house but you would never be able to borrow a comparable amount to invest in the stock market.
__________________
"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975
psionl0 is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 06:26 PM   #38
Seismosaurus
Illuminator
 
Seismosaurus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,919
Off the bottom of your scale.
__________________
Promise of diamonds in eyes of coal
She carries beauty in her soul
Seismosaurus is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th April 2017, 11:28 PM   #39
McHrozni
Philosopher
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 9,944
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
How much have you saved?
Other than homes and cars, how much is in your savings, IRA accounts and other investments? If you own a second house or a golf course etc, add that.

I'm going to use dollars, but for this, we can use dollar=euro roughly.
Absolute numbers in this context are somewhat meaningless. I'm below 10k (but well above my peers), but I have to work for another 30 years at least.

McHrozni
__________________
لا إله إلا رجل والعلوم والتكنولوجيا وأنبيائه
McHrozni is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th April 2017, 12:00 AM   #40
lionking
In the Peanut Gallery
 
lionking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 40,721
Thanks to Australia's superannuation system, now just over $500k. I will spend a bit of this before retiring, and it won't hurt me as I will receive a higher rate of pension. In fact I'm in a better position than someone with over $1m, believe it or not.
__________________
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.

Sir Winston Churchill
lionking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Economics, Business and Finance

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:51 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2014, TribeTech AB. All Rights Reserved.
This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.