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16th August 2018, 07:17 AM | #201 |
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to some degree you are correct that arguing with trolls doesn't make them go away. HOWEVER, for years the only side of this story that was heard was the cockamaimy nonsense that trolls continue to argue. This has lead to things like the PEOPLE magazine article that was never fact-checked and the ID channel show based of the article(s). Thus we now have a new generation of persons who believe the bs and have begun advocating for the mass murderer.
I cannot and do not let the nonsense go without countering with the FACTS. This is true here, and any place that I find people posting comments that are not based in fact. I will continue to do so until inmate is dead. watch out trolls the fire brigade is still here! There once was a wrinkled old gnome, who called Federal Prison his home, he whined and he moaned, and he lied then he groaned, for these murders I will not atone. a classic ditty presented by bynthebard |
16th August 2018, 09:28 AM | #202 |
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I disagree. there is a fair and just article in MacDonald's own words about the matter at:
https://medium.com/@lajp/dr-jeffrey-...s-6f09003ac918
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16th August 2018, 10:59 AM | #203 |
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Oh, geesh, there are two of you walking around with hard-ons for federal inmate macdonald?
So, your man crush lies to others who have crushes on him. And I want to know how these alleged people were walking around carrying candles in the rain? (Your beau left out that the neighbor said the candles were lit and it was raining, I noticed.) Half his (Macdonald's) lies do not make sense. A bunch of druggies come into his house and when he goes down in the fight, they lose interest in him (like giant tiger beetles that only react to motion) and walk away instead of what happens in real life fights: they kick the stuffing out of you. No broke ribs from these druggies, no, their mothers raise them to be polite and never kick a man when he's down. But.....they slaughter a pregnant woman and two small children they find. But they leave him be, leave the drugs and medical supplies (including syringes) he stole from the Army in the closet because it's rude to look through people's stuff, I guess - even if you're bent on killing them. And when they've gone and he's safe, he performs CPR on children in their beds, moves his wife back into the master bedroom where he removes an impaled object from her and he does all this in the dark. Uh, that makes no sense. Medically, the CPR on a hard, flat surface and non-removal of the impaled object are things you learn in the Red Cross First Aid Course. I bet they also teach them in medical school. And Federal Inmate Macdonald had been to med school. Sad, so sad. He's a nasty piece of work, your man crush. He's more interested in looking good than being good, his only goal for 47 years has been HIS gratification, HIS pleasure, HIS freedom and he doesn't give a damn about that beautiful woman Colette Stevenson who made the mistake of falling in love with him or the two beautiful children she had with him (or the one on the way). It's always about pathetic Jeff. And pathetic he is. He slaughtered four beautiful souls in a night of rage and to this day he will not face his crimes. He's not man enough to own what he did. |
16th August 2018, 11:34 AM | #204 |
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What a shocker! I know you hate it when we insist on crowding out your delusions with FACTS. Too bad for you....I wonder what you see in this narcissistic sociopathic familial slaughterer to champion? I guess you think slaughtering a pregnant woman and 2 little girls (plus and unborn baby) is something to celebrate....I find it disgusting, sickening, gross, unthinkable, irrational, not to mention illegal.
roflmao! there is nothing fair or just or even TRUE in statements made by inmate. he was a cheating b@$t@rd who didn't deserve the precious family he had and he IS the narcissistic sociopathic b@$t@rd that slaughtered those precious beings. There once was a wrinkled old gnome, who called Federal Prison his home, he whined and he moaned, and he lied then he groaned, for these murders I will not atone. a classic ditty presented by bynthebard |
16th August 2018, 11:41 AM | #205 |
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16th August 2018, 11:57 AM | #206 |
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As as been pointed out to (and ignored by) henri - inmate's story makes no sense. For example he claims he did CPR on his children yet BOTH children were found in their beds, Kimmie totally tucked in and on her back and Kristy partially covered and on her side. Ignoring the fact that Kimmie's injury would have made standard mouth to mouth breathing impossible one must consider the following from the Standard First Aid and Personal Safety Manual (page 84)
CardioPulmonary Resuscitation (CPR) is a combination of artificial respiration and artificial manual circulation that is recommended for use in cases of cardiac arrest. Technique for External Cardiac Compression: Effective performance of external cardiac compression requires more than just pushing on the chest. There are numerous small details that make the difference between effective and ineffective, safe and unsafe, proper and improper, performance of external cardiac compression. Strict attention should be given to the details. For external cardiac compression to be effective, the victim must be on a FIRM SURFACE, such as the ground, the floor, or a spine board on a wheeled litter. As for a knife impaled in the chest: If the object is fixed OR it protrudes more than a few inches from the body, it should be left in place and be secured carefully to prevent movement that would cause further damage. OF course, I only took Advanced First Aid and Emergency Care and CPR multiple times, and I learned these things. Maybe medical school was different...but I highly doubt it! |
16th August 2018, 01:44 PM | #207 |
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Circular Logic
The link put forth by Henriboy is simply an excerpt taken from Fatal Justice where inmate is venting to the authors about how he was railroaded by the CID. Inmate's mixing and matching investigative timelines is a form of circular logic that has been adopted by most, if not all, of his advocates.
In regards to Paul Stombaugh's 1974 analysis of the saran fibers, Henriboy again plays dumb by intimating that Stombaugh never examined the fibers in question. All one has to do is read Stombaugh's handwritten lab notes to verify what Henriboy already knows. FBI Exhibits Q46 and Q49. Stombaugh listed the fibers as "synthetic filament yellow, type used on dolls, Halloween costumes, etc." For those interested in an accurate timeline... 1970 Janice Glisson was a CID chemist at Fort Gordon. Glisson performed a majority of the serological tests in this case and at the time of the murders, she was in training in regards to hair and fiber analysis. Dillard Browning asked her to assist him with specific hair and fiber comparisons. One of Glisson's responsibilities was to analyze the saran fibers and she concluded that the fibers were of different lengths, blonde in color, and synthetic. Due to his heavy workload, Browning was unable to analyze the saran fibers. 1974 Paul Stombaugh analyzed the saran fibers and determined that they were the type of filament "used on dolls, Halloween costumes, etc." 1990 Robert Webb's chemical composition analysis determined that the 22 inch saran fiber differed in chemical composition to the 24 and 9 inch saran fibers. This indicated that the 3 fibers came from 2 separate source materials. 1990 Michael Malone's fiber comparisons led to a match between the 24 inch saran fiber and doll hair in the FBI's massive exemplar collection. Despite the conclusions leveled by Stombaugh/Webb/Malone, inmate and his advocates continued to argue that Stoeckley, and Stoeckley alone, wore a wig on 2/17/70 and was present at 544 Castle Drive during the commission of a triple homicide. Due to Stoeckley's testimony at trial that she wasn't wearing a wig on 2/17/70, and the defense being unable to produce a wig exemplar from Stoeckley and/or a cosmetic saran wig used for human wear, this argument fell flat before Judge Dupree, Judge Fox, and the 4th Circuit Court. http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com |
16th August 2018, 02:01 PM | #208 |
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The point is that we don't know if the FBI lab was inventing the forensic evidence. The defense experts were never allowed to test it. There have been scandals at the FBI lab, which are now being made public, and not just in the MacDonald case. I'm willing to admit there was saran in those mystery fibers but the defense were never allowed to double check that. All that stuff from Stombaugh and Malone about saran in dolls was guesswork. The doll manufacturers themselves never backed the FBI up about that. That story from Stoeckley that her boyfriend at the time, Mitchell, didn't like her wearing a blond wig was just some cock and bull story from Helena to cover her tracks.
There is a bit of advertising waffle on the internet from some forensic company which MacDonald might find useful if the MacDonald defense fund could run to the expense of it: https://www.forensic-access.co.uk/im...of-re-testing/ |
16th August 2018, 02:24 PM | #209 |
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16th August 2018, 04:41 PM | #210 |
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Trolling Tactics
HENRIBOY: For the past 15 years, you've derived pleasure from playing the circus troll on several true crime forums, but it must be frustrating to see your special brand of illogic being called out by posters who have taken the time to read the documented record. Your current cognitive instability is demonstrated by your reliance on conspiracy narratives and your penchant for refusing to provide proof of your absurd claims.
Stating that "we don't know if the FBI lab was inventing the forensic evidence," speaks to your inherent laziness and the fact that you have nothing tangible to bring to the case discussion. Hate to break it to ya, but the CID collected and processed the physical evidence BEFORE the FBI analyzed the SAME data. If you had bothered to read the documented record, you would know that every single evidentiary item in this case had a CID and FBI exhibit number. According to your conspiracy narrative, the men and women at the CID/FBI must be top-flight magicians for they were able to invent (e.g., whatever the hell that means) the same type and number of evidentiary exhibits in this case. In terms of the analysis of the saran fibers, chemical composition analysis is hardly "guesswork" and the defense did not formulate a rebuttal to Malone's conclusion that the 24 inch saran fiber microscopically matched doll hair in the FBI's exemplar collection. The only salient explanation for the saran fibers is that the MacDonald children used their mother's hairbrush to brush the hair of two of the dolls in their respective collections. Microscopic comparisons, chemical composition analysis, and a lack of alternative matching exemplars verify this position whereas the defense couldn't even produce a cosmetic saran wig used for human wear. http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com |
17th August 2018, 02:56 AM | #211 |
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The CID presented their so-called evidence to the Article 32 proceedings in 1970 and MacDonald was cleared, or there was insufficient evidence as Byn keeps saying. The FBI then took over and invented their arithmetically lunatic pajama folding experiment, and their inventions for fibers with no known source, supported by biased and awful judges.
There is criticism of judges mainly in America at this website: www.uglyjudge.com/judges-2/ |
17th August 2018, 06:24 AM | #212 |
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17th August 2018, 08:40 AM | #213 |
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Judicial corruption is relevant to the MacDonald case and it's the reason he was wrongly convicted and is still in prison. You don't prosecute and imprison an innocent man in a civilised country. The matter is discussed at this website:
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/....Fatal_Justice
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17th August 2018, 09:59 AM | #214 |
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17th August 2018, 12:43 PM | #215 |
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Again, all this folderol over the "blonde wig hair" is pointless. Just for the sake of argument, let's stipulate that the strand did in fact come from a human wig. So what? There's no evidence of when that strand was left or who left it. Therefore, it cannot in any way "prove" inmate's innocence. Besides, Stoeckley's always stated she didn't wear a wig that night (that's almost the only thing about that night that she was always consistent on).
And, yes, the scene was badly managed. But no one disputes that "pig" was written at the scene in blood (exactly replicating a Manson element). Why would Stoeckley or Mitchell do that? There's NO reason for THEM to do that. None. Neither of them ever evidenced any thoughts or motives in that direction. "pig" is there clearly ONLY to make it look like a cult killing, which is proof enough that inmate himself -- rather ham-handedly, really -- wrote it. |
17th August 2018, 01:03 PM | #216 |
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17th August 2018, 01:17 PM | #217 |
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It's quite ludicrously unsatisfactory evidence.
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18th August 2018, 03:01 AM | #218 |
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Inmate Is A Legend In His Own Mind
After hitting his wife and 5 year old daughter with a 31 inch piece of lumber, inmate had two choices. He could either call Fort Bragg dispatch and fess up to assaulting his wife and daughter or concoct a story involving a band of murderous home invaders.
Inmate has always thought he was the smartest guy in the room, so on 2/17/70, inmate concocted a story that he believed would fool the CID. His confidence lay in his decision to conflate the physical descriptions of the following individuals with the details of the Manson murders. New York Four Law enforcement officers arrested Kenneth Barnett, Annette Cullity, Gary Burnett, and Joseph Lee in Suffolk County, New York on May 9, 1970. The Suffolk County police subsequently contacted the CID due to the fact that these four individuals matched the physical descriptions of the intruder suspects in the MacDonald murders. CID agent Bennie Hawkins subsequently traveled to Suffolk County to discuss the case with police officials. Hawkins discovered that these four individuals had rented a house in Fire Island with Jeffrey MacDonald's brother, Jay, in the summer of 1969. Jeffrey MacDonald had visited his brother during that summer and was seen conversing with people who matched the descriptions of the New York Four at the Shortstop Bar in Long Island. Joseph Lee was an African-American male, Gary Burnett and Kenneth Barnett were Caucasian males, and Annette Cullity was a Caucasian female. Lee was seen wearing an army field jacket and Cullity was known to wear a floppy hat and hip boots. The number of intruders, their racial make-up, and their clothing items all matched the descriptions provided by Jeffrey MacDonald. Hawkins obtained fingerprint exemplars of the New York Four and their prints did not match any of the prints found at 544 Castle Drive. In December of 1970, Jeffrey MacDonald and his lawyer, Judge Rogers (William Rogers), went to the Suffolk County Police Department to read the May 9, 1970 arrest report. This trip occurred several months after the completion of the Article 32 hearings. Despite the New York Four matching the descriptions of the four intruders, MacDonald never publicly commented on this visit to the Suffolk County Police Department. Inmate's story did not sway CID investigators who were convinced that he was the lone perp in this case. The FBI and DOJ concurred with the CID's position and the end result was that inmate was convicted of killing his pregnant wife and two daughters. http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com |
18th August 2018, 08:43 AM | #219 |
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A few months before the MacDonald murders MacDonald went to the New York area, including the Suffolk County area, to help his brother Jay who was a drug addict. Jay was in with some bad characters who were never stopped and searched by the police because of racial problems. Unfortunately, it ended with MacDonald punching Jay's drug dealer in a bar room brawl. After the MacDonald murders MacDonald quite rightly suspected that that incident could be connected to the MacDonald murders. Mazerolle came from the New York area, though he was born in Maine, and Mazerolle could have arranged the hit on MacDonald's family using the Stoeckley group to do the dirty work.
Errol Morris quite rightly thinks it's a miscarriage of justice: https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/14/o...is-served.html
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18th August 2018, 08:54 AM | #220 |
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18th August 2018, 09:01 AM | #221 |
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IIRC the sole source for the punching the drug dealer story is your man crush. I suspect he may have recycled a version of his "Me and my buddies killed the killers" ******** story he told his father-in-law.
Morriss can believe what he wants to believe, but it doesn't change the fact that your man crush murdered his family. |
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18th August 2018, 01:44 PM | #222 |
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It was what MacDonald told the Grand Jury on oath in 1975 and it could have been verified if the matter had been thoroughly and properly investigated:
http://www.thejeffreymacdonaldcase.c...3-gj-jmac.html
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18th August 2018, 02:26 PM | #223 |
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Henri, I thought you were on his side. And here you are, quoting him as having a nasty temper and that he thinks beating someone is a good way to resolve a conflict. Which is what he did to his pregnant wife and his daughters. Thanks for pointing out this out. However, it's only news to you and Cleo (his Queen of Denial second wife)….oh, and JP, a man after your own heart (man crushes on mac).
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18th August 2018, 06:25 PM | #224 |
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On the Isola di non fatti where you reign that might be enough, but in an actual courtroom with actual judges, juries and attorneys on both sides that "on oath" (actually the phrase in the U.S. is "under oath) statement isn't anything more than the hot air you push here.
As an side, is your man crush the only person on the Island of no facts that truthfully testifies under oath? It seems pretty clear that you reject out-of-hand any court testimony that properly identifies your man crush as the murderer that he is. |
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19th August 2018, 03:01 AM | #225 |
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The FBI are total liars.
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19th August 2018, 08:42 AM | #226 |
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There is an interesting website about recent developments in the MacDonald case at:
https://www.newsobserver.com/news/lo...128281484.html
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19th August 2018, 11:35 PM | #227 |
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Old And Debunked Information
HENRIBOY: I see that your penchant for fashioning your own definitions is alive and well. Your link was NOT to a website, but to the Raleigh News Observer and that article did NOT cover "recent developments in the MacDonald case." The newspaper article was published several days prior to Oral Arguments before the 4th Circuit Court in January of 2017.
Despite the article's attempt to provide the case narratives of both the government and the defense, Anne Blythe couldn't help but print erroneous information. For example, inmate had a singular bump or contusion over his left eye just above the hairline, yet Anne attempted to beef up the defense narrative by claiming that inmate suffered blunt-force trauma injuries to the left and right side of his head. Anne also states inmate suffered several stab wounds, but conveniently ignores the type and severity of those wounds. The medical record is easily accessible, but it appears that Anne didn't want to reveal to her readers that all but one of inmate's wounds were superficial. Anne places great emphasis on the prosecutors not presenting "a clear motive for why a man with no signs of a violent past would snap, bludgeon his family, stage a crime scene and inflict wounds on himself. His case exposed extramarital affairs, but there was no testimony or evidence of one going on at the time of the murders." This statement indicates that Anne is a young and inexperienced investigative journalist. A prosecutor is not required to provide a motive, so the prosecutors at the MacDonald trial were smart enough to let the physical evidence provide the proof of inmate's guilt. Anne is also coy about what constitutes an affair occurring "at the time of the murders." If Anne had researched this case, she would have known that in the weeks prior to the murders, inmate had told Colette that he was accompanying the Fort Bragg Boxing Team to Russia during the time when she was due to give birth to their 3rd child. The CID collected information from several sources indicating that the trip to Russia was a ruse, and that he would be spending that time with an ex-girlfriend. The prosecution decided not to include that information at trial, but that was not an unusual decision as evidenced by the fact that they only presented about 60 percent of their massive case file. http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com |
20th August 2018, 02:37 AM | #228 |
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Without getting too academic about that proposed boxing trip to Russia in the MacDonald case, it has been discussed endlessly on the MacDonald forums in the past. It's inadmissible under the rules of evidence. There is a different opinion about it to JTF at this website:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!ms...Y/6Qg7ivmReuMJ
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20th August 2018, 02:50 AM | #229 |
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The severity of MacDonald's injuries have also been discussed endlessly on the MacDonald forums in the past. The dishonest prosecutors and corrupt judges and other internet posters, always tried to insist the he just had a few self-inflicted cuts and bruises. That was patently false. This is an opinion by a medically qualified expert about the matter:
http://www.crimearchives.net/1979_ma...12_manson.html
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20th August 2018, 07:56 AM | #230 |
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It's pure speculation and fabrication for Stombaugh of the FBI to suggest that Colette hit MacDonald on the head with a hairbrush after a violent argument about a boxing trip to Russia. That proposed boxing trip was mentioned on August 24th 1979 at the MacDonald trial:
http://www.thejeffreymacdonaldcase.c...macdonald.html
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20th August 2018, 11:22 AM | #231 |
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21st August 2018, 09:13 AM | #232 |
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Quote:
They never argued the killing of Colette was premeditated, so their was no original "motive" in the traditional sense for him killing her. It was an outburst of rage. Kristy was the one that had to be premeditated, since she at least was still alive after the initial rage killing(s). |
21st August 2018, 09:29 AM | #233 |
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Americans seem to be very vociferous in the Amanda Knox case, even on this forum, that there was no motive, and defects in the forensic evidence in that case, but not it seems in the MacDonald case in America.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...45a2abc70c0d49
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21st August 2018, 01:32 PM | #234 |
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Cognitive Chaos
HENRIBOY: For the past decade plus, I've challenged you to produce a single piece of trace evidence that was sourced to a member of the New York Four or Stoeckley Seven. You've repeatedly failed to produce that evidentiary item, yet your reference to the Amanda Knox Case is another example of your special brand of cognitive chaos. Unlike the MacDonald Case, there were several evidentiary items in the Knox Case that were sourced to another suspect. Similar to inmate, the sourced evidentiary items led to that suspect being convicted of murder.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com |
22nd August 2018, 04:46 AM | #235 |
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He was an Emergency Room physician here.
Correction HE SHOULD HAVE KNOWN what he was doing. whatever his comments in relation to the knife he "allegedly removed" from Colette's chest is (1) a BIG FAT LIE because there were no injuries to Colette's chest made by the knife he claimed to have removed (2) as an ER Doctor he WOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER THAN TO REMOVE AN IMPALED OBJECT FROM COLETTE'S (or anyone's) CHEST. PERIOD. |
22nd August 2018, 08:42 AM | #236 |
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Yes, assuming he wanted the person to do better medically. He likely did remove anything that was actually impaled in her since he was determined that she die. I think you basically have to invert normal "doctor thinking" in this case, because inmate was not trying to "do no harm": indeed, he was doing the ultimate harm.
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26th August 2018, 02:26 AM | #237 |
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Where's The Beef?
It comes as no surprise to those familiar with this case that inmate's advocates have been unable to produce a single piece of sourced evidence that inculpates someone other than Jeffrey MacDonald. In a legal sense, this philosophy of relying on hearsay testimony and tenuous forensic links, is best encapsulated in the government's 6/29/12 notice to Judge Fox. Despite the defense having 28 years to gather the exculpatory goods, they asked for yet another delay to collect additional information to present at the evidentiary hearing.
1) The government argues that depositions are not needed to "develop additional facts relevant to the disposition of MacDonald's successive 2255 claim" and that "any facts relevant to the disposition of MacDonald's successive 2255 claim can be fully developed" at the 8/20/12 hearing. 2) The government adds, "As the Court noted, MacDonald has not made any effort to depose or to seek to depose any witness in the more than six (6) years that his successive 2255 claim has been pending." Talk about waiting until the last minute! 3) I love how the government points out that the defense is simply using this process as a "fishing expedition" in order to "turn up additional 2255 claims." 4) The following is my favorite part of the government's notice to Judge Fox. "MacDonald has been provided discovery in a criminal trial, has received numerous documents from extensive FOIA requests, has filed 5 previous collateral attacks on his conviction, and has had six years to develop the evidence related to his current claims. He should not be allowed now, just seven weeks before the oft-continued (at his request) evidentiary hearing, to launch a fishing expedition for more evidence, at great expense to the taxpayers." 5) Janice Glisson is the only person on the deposition list whose affidavit was appended to the government's response. The government argues that if Judge Fox allows depositions to be taken by the defense, it should be limited to Glisson and Glisson alone. Incredibly, the defense never called Glisson nor any other qualified forensic examiner to testify at the evidentiary hearing. Once the government began to present their case, most of the media outlets broke the sound barrier when leaving town. They had already viewed the government destroying the defense's case on cross, so they weren't going to wait around to view the government putting the final nail in inmate's legal coffin. http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com |
26th August 2018, 03:07 AM | #238 |
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I'm not medically qualified. I appreciate that the advice is to leave an impaled knife alone, but there are exceptions which I think apply to the MacDonald case:
https://www.verywellhealth.com/how-t...object-1298804
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26th August 2018, 09:39 AM | #239 |
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27th August 2018, 09:43 AM | #240 |
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But all irrelevant since inmate himself stated that he knew she was already dead. Since she was so clearly dead, she must have been dead for at least some period of time.
Which points out the other common sense issue about his story and these crimes: How did the "intruders" manage to have such pin-point timing? By inmate's own story, he is awake until past 2 reading, doing dishes, etc.. Yet by ~3:30AM, he's calling for help (he dropped the receiver and had to call back several minutes later). This after having fought the "intruders" and been "unconscious" for at least several minutes (again, by inmate's own story). So somehow the "intruders" manage to arrive at almost exactly the moment he fell asleep? Just not believable, just too much and too many "coincidences". |
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