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Old 26th November 2018, 07:34 AM   #1
The Great Zaganza
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Genetically Modified Humans born

He Jiankui, a Chinese scientist, claims to have modified human embryos before implanting them in a women who brought twin girls to term this month.
The modification is supposed to confer a resistance to HIV/AIDS.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/healt...c-rss_20181126


Too soon or not soon enough?
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Old 26th November 2018, 08:10 AM   #2
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As long as Soylent Green is labeled contains GMO I've no objections.
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Old 26th November 2018, 08:11 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
He Jiankui, a Chinese scientist, claims to have modified human embryos before implanting them in a women who brought twin girls to term this month.
The modification is supposed to confer a resistance to HIV/AIDS.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/healt...c-rss_20181126


Too soon or not soon enough?
He should have used one of the alterations that imparts bioluminescence.
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Old 26th November 2018, 08:13 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
He should have used one of the alterations that imparts bioluminescence.
I have long advocated for introducing GFP into kids to keep them safe in traffic at night.
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Old 26th November 2018, 09:05 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
He should have used one of the alterations that imparts bioluminescence.
Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I have long advocated for introducing GFP into kids to keep them safe in traffic at night.
YFP to keep yellowish headlamps and green-lights?
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Old 26th November 2018, 09:39 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I have long advocated for introducing GFP into kids to keep them safe in traffic at night.
Are you crazy? Green means go: they'll cause traffic accidents whenever they try to cross the street!

Go with DsRed if you want to keep them safe.
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Old 26th November 2018, 12:02 PM   #7
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I've been thinking about a Human with "perfect genes".

My Mitochondrial DNA has about 60 SNP 'mutations' since Mito Eve. But I don't think Eve was perfect, she was merely the earliest to meet the definition of "Human". Someday we may be able to define each SNP variant and GMO the perfect human. Numbers though: For $500 Genos.com will do a 'full exome sequence", FES. 40 million SNPs. The result they give you are a list of the Variants, 300,000 points that are not like everybody else. So merely GMO me 300,000 times, and I my children can fly to Krypton!
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Old 26th November 2018, 12:06 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
He Jiankui, a Chinese scientist, claims to have modified human embryos before implanting them in a women who brought twin girls to term this month.
The modification is supposed to confer a resistance to HIV/AIDS.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/healt...c-rss_20181126


Too soon or not soon enough?
And how are they going to test the girls?

But yeah, HIV susceptibility is genetic. ALL diseases are. I'm glad they found the guy(s) who were immune and ran their genes.
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Old 26th November 2018, 12:22 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
He Jiankui, a Chinese scientist, claims to have modified human embryos before implanting them in a women who brought twin girls to term this month.
The modification is supposed to confer a resistance to HIV/AIDS.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/healt...c-rss_20181126


Too soon or not soon enough?
We'll have to see how they develop, no?
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Old 26th November 2018, 12:40 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
As long as Soylent Green is labeled contains GMO I've no objections.
Oh, that's a better one than the one I had in mind.
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Old 26th November 2018, 12:41 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I've been thinking about a Human with "perfect genes".
Yeah, I think about Scarlet Johansson too.
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Old 26th November 2018, 01:07 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Yeah, I think about Scarlet Johansson too.
Yeah, I like her jeans too.
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Old 26th November 2018, 01:13 PM   #13
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Genetically Magnificent Organism.
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Old 26th November 2018, 01:17 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
We'll have to see how they develop, no?
They probably already know about HIV immunity, via a blood test? No,hmmn., most blood tests fro things like viruses look for antibodies to the virus. But if you have a genetic immunity, would your body even feel the need to make antibodies? Perhaps they need cells growing in a petri dish?
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Old 26th November 2018, 01:37 PM   #15
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Of all the things to correct genetically, increased resistance to HIV is pretty low on my list.
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Old 26th November 2018, 01:43 PM   #16
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Not exactly X-Men, is it?
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Old 26th November 2018, 01:44 PM   #17
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According to the article, two embryos were implanted, one homozygous for the desired deletion and the other not (meaning it won't likely infer disease resistance, but may result in other outcomes). I agree with the scientist quoted in the article that this suggests that the “main emphasis was on testing editing rather than avoiding this disease,”. So if one is a proponent of using human embryos (and human babies/children/adults if they successfully gestate and survive) as subjects for very preliminary testing on gene editing, then one ought to have no objection to this work. In my opinion though, if true. this is unconscionable and irresponsible (not to mention poorly controlled) scientific experimentation (with a side of blind capitalistic ambition thrown in for good measure).

Last edited by attempt5001; 26th November 2018 at 02:13 PM. Reason: correct a type-o
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Old 26th November 2018, 02:02 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by attempt5001 View Post
According to the article, two embryos were implanted, one homozygous for the desired deletion and the other not (meaning it won't likely infer disease resistance, but may result in other outcomes). I agree with the scientist quoted in the article that this suggests that the “main emphasis was on testing editing rather than avoiding this disease,”. So if one is a proponent of using human embryos (and human babies/children/adults if they successful gestate and survive) as subjects for very preliminary testing on gene editing, then one ought to have no objection to this work. In my opinion though, if true. this is unconscionable and irresponsible (not to mention poorly controlled) scientific experimentation (with a side of blind capitalistic ambition thrown in for good measure).
And violates the rules, regulations and laws in most parts of the world, including the PRC as far as I understand. The potential of an experimental treatment to benefit the individual being treated is balanced against the potential risks. Experiments with quite questionable benefits to the individual treated, particularly highly invasive ones such as this one, with plausible, if poorly understood risks would not pass the ethics committees in almost all places I am aware of.
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Old 26th November 2018, 02:02 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by attempt5001 View Post
According to the article, two embryos were implanted, one homozygous for the desired deletion and the other not (meaning it won't likely infer disease resistance, but may result in other outcomes). I agree with the scientist quoted in the article that this suggests that the ďmain emphasis was on testing editing rather than avoiding this disease,Ē. So if one is a proponent of using human embryos (and human babies/children/adults if they successful gestate and survive) as subjects for very preliminary testing on gene editing, then one ought to have no objection to this work. In my opinion though, if true. this is unconscionable and irresponsible (not to mention poorly controlled) scientific experimentation (with a side of blind capitalistic ambition thrown in for good measure).
We should also consider the very distinct possibility that this is all simply a scam. It wouldn't be the first time.
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Old 26th November 2018, 02:07 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
And violates the rules, regulations and laws in most parts of the world, including the PRC as far as I understand. The potential of an experimental treatment to benefit the individual being treated is balanced against the potential risks. Experiments with quite questionable benefits to the individual treated, particularly highly invasive ones such as this one, with plausible, if poorly understood risks would not pass the ethics committees in almost all places I am aware of.
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
We should also consider the very distinct possibility that this is all simply a scam. It wouldn't be the first time.
Agreed on both points. Will wait to hear more about this one. I hope it's a scam/hoax of some kind.
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Old 26th November 2018, 02:15 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
I have long advocated for introducing GFP into kids to keep them safe in traffic at night.

Couldnít you just move to Windscale?
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Old 26th November 2018, 02:22 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by attempt5001 View Post
Agreed on both points. Will wait to hear more about this one. I hope it's a scam/hoax of some kind.
I rhink its a scam, but it will happen sooner or later and eventually, one day it will be a mainstream practice.
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Old 26th November 2018, 04:18 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Genetically Magnificent Organism.
Gluteus Maximus Optimal
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Old 26th November 2018, 04:27 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Couldnít you just move to Windscale?
Your age is showing!
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Old 26th November 2018, 04:31 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Your age is showing!



Iím just glad someone recognised it.
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Old 26th November 2018, 07:08 PM   #26
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I think we should already know, from every movie ever made on the subject, that this will end badly.
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Old 26th November 2018, 08:27 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
I think we should already know, from every movie ever made on the subject, that this will end badly.
Quick, what is the moral of this movie? is it Man should not mess with nature/gods creation, or is it a commentry on racisim/homophobia/minorities and that we should get along with anyone no matter their race/gender/certain bilogical prefrences/GMO status?

Or is it just that we should build a superior race of androids to combat the threat? Because there is no way that that would go wrong either.
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Old 26th November 2018, 10:29 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
I think we should already know, from every movie ever made on the subject, that this will end badly.
Make millions for the creators and financiers ?
How is that a bad end?
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Old 27th November 2018, 12:24 PM   #29
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Genetically engineered, more perfect people distantly remind me of Arthur C. Clarkes novel "Childhoods End." In the novel:
A generation of children are born who are so much superior to their parents, and have abilities so far beyond normal, they are totally alien to their parents and to all prior existing humans. In the book this eventually happens spontaneously to almost all intelligence species on all planets, and a special contingent of extraterrestrials has been sent to Earth in advance to protect this new generation from the old. The connection with genetic engineering is, if genetic engineering is pushed to plausible future extremes, how a clearly superior generation of humans would see, and be seen, by their progenitors.

I think about the book from time to time because although I am no doubt prejudiced being a father, I do see my two (genetically unmanipulated) adult children as significantly smarter than I am, and I often wonder if they share this view and if they see me more as an amusement or embarrassment than a useful source of advice or information. Fortunately if so they have learned to hide their views.

Last edited by Giordano; 27th November 2018 at 12:30 PM.
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Old 27th November 2018, 12:32 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by baron View Post
Not exactly X-Men, is it?
Give them time. I'm still waiting on my super-speed.
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Old 27th November 2018, 12:56 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by attempt5001 View Post
Agreed on both points. Will wait to hear more about this one. I hope it's a scam/hoax of some kind.
This is my take on it, too. For a few reasons, some already mentioned above:
  • very out of the blue
  • shockingly criminal human experimentation if true. CRISPR produces a lot of genetic damage outside the target area, which is why it's mostly useful for microbes. We can incinerate the bad batches. Best defense for He at this point is 'i made it up'
  • mechanism does not pass my sniff test as a MSc in research medicine who specialized in HIV resistance - CCR5 is not the only binding receptor for HIV, HIV adapts to use other receptors (CCR4 &c), and it's not clear what He did exactly but if he botched CCR5 the costs for a person who is not exposed to HIV are probably higher than the benefits of resistance. CCR5 is a white cell recognition receptor. Munging it provides temporarly slight HIV resistance at the cost of lifelong immune system damage. Were the parents informed about this when they provided consent?
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Old 27th November 2018, 02:13 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Give them time. I'm still waiting on my super-speed.
I think the kids call that "bath salts" nowdays.
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Old 27th November 2018, 03:01 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
Genetically engineered, more perfect people distantly remind me of Arthur C. Clarkes novel "Childhoods End." In the novel:
A generation of children are born who are so much superior to their parents, and have abilities so far beyond normal, they are totally alien to their parents and to all prior existing humans. In the book this eventually happens spontaneously to almost all intelligence species on all planets, and a special contingent of extraterrestrials has been sent to Earth in advance to protect this new generation from the old. The connection with genetic engineering is, if genetic engineering is pushed to plausible future extremes, how a clearly superior generation of humans would see, and be seen, by their progenitors.

I think about the book from time to time because although I am no doubt prejudiced being a father, I do see my two (genetically unmanipulated) adult children as significantly smarter than I am, and I often wonder if they share this view and if they see me more as an amusement or embarrassment than a useful source of advice or information. Fortunately if so they have learned to hide their views.
It's been a long time since I read it, but one of the ideas in the book is that:
The aliens look like Satan.
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Old 28th November 2018, 10:41 AM   #34
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[quote=blutoski;12515853]This is my take on it, too. For a few reasons, some already mentioned above:[list]
(snipped)

Yes. Good points all 'round. And anyone who has looked at the web of interactions between genes (more accurately the proteins they express most of the time) will tell you the interplay is incredibly complex. Do a google image search "protein interactome" for some nice examples. The naivety that would be required to think "this gene is involved with AIDS infection, so removing or altering it will be prophylactic with an acceptably low risk of side-effects" is pretty hard to imagine from anyone with experience in the field.

I hope an "I made it all up" is pending.
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Old 29th November 2018, 07:33 AM   #35
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Some initial response from China reported in the news today:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world...ies/ar-BBQeurQ
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