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9th December 2018, 08:13 PM | #281 |
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Canada is self governing because the people elect their own government.
In the early years of Australia's history, the King (or British Parliament) appointed governors to rule over the Australian colonies. As the colonies "matured", they were granted the right to hold elections and govern themselves but with the crown still having the final say. Since the early parts of last century, it has been extremely rare for the a Governor or Governor General to do anything other than the bidding of the parliamentary executive. |
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9th December 2018, 08:15 PM | #282 |
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And for the last time I will explain again: IT DOES NOT HAVE TO. The specificity you seek is not there because it does not have to be there. But if you were to cut me off then I would be heartbroken.
Or maybe not. Whatever.
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 08:27 PM | #283 |
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Yep, inertia.
Quote:
While some people will never let the 11-Nov-75 sozzled-Kerr situation die, it is now nearly 50 years ago, a couple of generations. So the relevance of the royal family interfering in Australian governance is minimal to none. The prime motivator to republicanism in Australia is the notion of having an Australian head of state rather than a foreign citizen. We would probably not allow the Tongan, Japanese or Thai monarchs to be our HoS, so why some Brit from a lot further away! |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 08:28 PM | #284 |
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9th December 2018, 08:30 PM | #285 |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 08:31 PM | #286 |
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An oath, regardless of the content, is a solemn promise, is it not?
Anyone who swears an oath with fingers crossed is being highly dishonest, are they not? What percentage of MPs and MPPs would you guess swore the oath with (figuratively speaking) their fingers crossed? Would you swear a solemn oath with fingers crossed? |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 08:44 PM | #287 |
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I'm not dismissing evidence. Abdicating is not quite the same as being fired. from Merriam-Webster:
abdicate: - to relinquish (something, such as sovereign power) formally relinquish: 1 :to withdraw or retreat from: leave behind 2 :GIVE UP // relinquish a title Words have meaning. You can say he was 'forced' to abdicate, but the fact remains he abdicated - he voluntarily stepped down because it was his best choice under the circumstances. If Parliament could just 'fire' him, why didn't they? |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 08:46 PM | #288 |
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Have you met humans? Because that's not how they work.
MP's don't have to intend to violate their oath when they make it. They just need to have an incentive to do so at the point in time that they violate it. And it may well be that they never expected to have such an incentive. In the present case, for example, most Canadian MP's probably take the oath in the full expectation that the Queen would never try to command the Canadian military contrary to the wishes of the Canadian government. Were that to happen, they might feel that the Queen has violated an implicit oath, fully justifying their own disobedience of the Queen. You might feel like they've betrayed some trust, but that doesn't mean they will view it that way. |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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9th December 2018, 08:49 PM | #289 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 08:50 PM | #290 |
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Worth noting this oath as well:
Quote:
Her Majesty, Queen Elizabeth II, at her coronation in 1952. |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 08:57 PM | #291 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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9th December 2018, 09:00 PM | #292 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 09:02 PM | #293 |
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Here is a pretty solemn promise made under oath in 1953 since you are so hot for oaths and the written word:
Quote:
Norm |
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9th December 2018, 09:03 PM | #294 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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9th December 2018, 09:04 PM | #295 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 09:36 PM | #296 |
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Norman:
In post #25 you said,"I have only just read your Canadian constitution for the first time, particularly the bit on Executive Powers. And in just about all respects, it clearly defines just how titular the Queen's role is in Canadian law." You skirted every request to post a few words that 'clearly define' anything. Now in post #282 you say, "The specificity you seek is not there because it does not have to be there." Why didn't you say that the first time I asked? Were you stalling for time to dream up an answer that you thought would get you off the hook? I'll ask you again, Norman. How on Earth do you expect me to take you seriously? |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 09:45 PM | #297 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 09:46 PM | #298 |
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I am thinking that BobtheCoward has a padawan.
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9th December 2018, 09:50 PM | #299 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 10:00 PM | #300 |
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9th December 2018, 10:06 PM | #301 |
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Because the wording and intent of the Canadian constitution is a living, breathing example of what "titular" actually means in regard to the Queen's position. As I said, it doesn't have to say it because it does not have to. The word "titular" describes how the wording and intent of the law operates. She has a titular position - a title only, no real power.
Honestly, I do wonder if we are dealing with a grown-up here. Perhaps if you stopped being offended and started reading and thinking, you might understand a bit better. Then again, if you had done that from the start, you would not have been posting your conspiracy nonsense here in the first place, I imagine. |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 10:13 PM | #302 |
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Politicians aren't the only ones to swear allegiance to the Queen.
The Armed Forces must do so. The RCMP must do so. New immigrants must do so. Supreme and Federal court judges all employees of CSIS For a complete list, see here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oath_o...giance_(Canada) From the same link: The Oath of Allegiance was implemented to secure the supremacy of the reigning monarch of Canada, From Miriam-Webster: supreme: highest in rank or authority |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 10:15 PM | #303 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 10:18 PM | #304 |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 10:20 PM | #305 |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 10:25 PM | #306 |
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If bills to be passed into law originated from her directives she would have no reason to refuse RA unless the final wording was not to The Crown's liking. Bills that originate from other sources still have to get RA before becoming law. The Crown would be apprised of those bills beforehand and if there was no objection to the purpose of the bill, it would go through the Parliamentary process and pass or fail on its own merit.
Royal Assent is The Crown's failsafe. There is nothing that legally compels the monarch to grant RA. Conventions are not enforceable in the courts. The text of the Con is enforceable by the courts. |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 10:31 PM | #307 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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9th December 2018, 10:31 PM | #308 |
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See, Norman? You always end up having to make it personal.
Even you should know that's a sure sign you have nothing concrete to argue with. "If the facts are on your side, hammer the facts. If the law is on your side, hammer the law. If neither the facts nor the law are on your side, hammer the table." You're hammering the table, Norman. |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 10:34 PM | #309 |
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9th December 2018, 10:41 PM | #310 |
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If you think so. I'm having lunch, actually. Nom!
Plenty of people besides me have put up perfectly laid out, fulsome, concrete arguments against your silly ideas backed with references and facts. It is you who keeps on ignoring, disregarding or simply dismissing them because they don't fit with your preset notions. And then you turn around and say we have no arguments... SRSLY? Meanwhile, I'll just finish my lunch. |
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...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015 |
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9th December 2018, 10:43 PM | #311 |
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You're reaching again, Zig. That's a logical fallacy known as "distinction without a difference".
Obedience is not mentioned anywhere. Allegiance is. From Miriam-Webster: allegiance: the fidelity owed by a subject or citizen to a sovereign or government. fidelity: the quality or state of being faithful faithful: firm in adherence to promises or in observance of duty |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 10:48 PM | #312 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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9th December 2018, 10:55 PM | #313 |
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I'm the only one that's quoted anything relevant from a legal document.
Everyone else has just related stories about abdications, precedents, customs, 'what if' scenarios and the like. None of that stacks up against the text of the Con. I brought meat to the table, while everyone else brought party favours. |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 11:00 PM | #314 |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 11:00 PM | #315 |
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9th December 2018, 11:06 PM | #316 |
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IF you followed the thread like you said, I posted that there's no evidence to show exactly how things flow between The Crown and the gov't.
There's no way for us to know the answer to your question. The main premise of this thread is that: - the Queen (The Crown) holds the ultimate power in Canada That's been proven simply and beyond question - it's written in the Con Another premise is that people who hold power use it. Regularly. That's not as provable as the first premise, but it's common sense. |
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It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled. - unattributed Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity. - Marshall McLuhan |
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9th December 2018, 11:09 PM | #317 |
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Yes Itchy Boy, the queen actually has all the power in Canada.
Your cunning proof of this by showing how she never openly uses this power or has ever gone against parliament by ensuring all in parliament are undyingly loyal to her so to the rest of the world it looks like she just rubber stamps everything is totally convincing. After all, what better proof of a conspiracy than the absence of any evidence. The Force is strong in her I guess as she can mind-control not only all current politicians, but every single former politician, army officer, police office and civil servant ever in never revealing her cunning web of control. Because for all of your rejection of every evidence that her role IS just a figurehead, you never actually show any evidence for your version of reality. Do you have even a single letter containing orders? A single email of the queen dictating a law that the politicians later then fake vote for so she can sign it? A single indication she manipulated voters or ordered the army/police to intimidate someone? |
9th December 2018, 11:14 PM | #318 |
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9th December 2018, 11:19 PM | #319 |
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9th December 2018, 11:22 PM | #320 |
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Let me Google some junior high school information for you. You do know this is me doing your homework for you, yes? I've finished my lunch, so I've got five minutes to look this up.
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https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia....n-elizabeth-ii https://www.canada.ca/en/canadian-he...ada/about.html
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Shall I go on?
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