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Tags 2016 elections , Clinton controversies , hillary clinton , James Comey , presidential candidates

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Old 30th October 2016, 07:05 AM   #1
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Mod Info The previous thread was getting long and generating duplicate posts, so I have opened this shiny new continuation thread. As usual, the split point was arbitrary and participants are free to respond to points made in previous iterations of the thread.
Posted By:Agatha


Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
I suppose being dismissive and sarcastic about potential new evidence is one tack to take.

I'm willing to wait and see if there's anything there.
That seems sensible. And you're not even the Director of the FBI. Would that Comey had taken as sane an approach.
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Old 30th October 2016, 07:10 AM   #2
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What criminal wrongdoing are people speculating about? Clinton used a private email server because it was compatible with her smart phone and the State Department server wasn't. That was wrong, she has apologized.

Meanwhile the other candidate, The Don, is facing a civil trial for fraud but the judge in that case -- the 'Mexican' -- agreed to delay it until after the election out of fairness to Trump.

The whole thing is becoming insane.
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Old 30th October 2016, 07:18 AM   #3
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The findings meeting (that's not the right term) for the Trump rape case is a couple weeks after too. Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, let's get this crap all out in the open Monday. All of it.
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Old 30th October 2016, 07:22 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
What criminal wrongdoing are people speculating about? Clinton used a private email server because it was compatible with her smart phone and the State Department server wasn't. That was wrong, she has apologized.

Meanwhile the other candidate, The Don, is facing a civil trial for fraud but the judge in that case -- the 'Mexican' -- agreed to delay it until after the election out of fairness to Trump.

The whole thing is becoming insane.
The coverage and reactions make sense if you assume the that people affected by it are working from the bias which presupposes that Clinton will win and Donald is a distraction. This also helps explain why the stolen Podesta/DNC emails are mined for stories with virtually no thought about the ethics. Hell, Jill Stein has built her campaign round her voters being able to claim they were a protest vote against the inevitable President Clinton.
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Old 30th October 2016, 07:34 AM   #5
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The reactions don't make sense. On one hand you have a candidate who is recommending a series of military actions that he himself will direct, claiming he "knows more than the generals." What is his military experience? He has none. What is his foreign policy experience? He has none.

On the other hand you have a candidate who used a private email server because it was compatible with her smart phone and the government server was not.

It's just insanity.
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Old 30th October 2016, 07:36 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
The investigation isn't reopened.
Oh? I thought it was. What step are they on now, then?

Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
What criminal wrongdoing are people speculating about? Clinton used a private email server because it was compatible with her smart phone and the State Department server wasn't. That was wrong, she has apologized.
Man, you just don't get it. She's EVIL. It doesn't matter what the facts say. They just know there's something, somewhere.


Man, I don't like her at all and I have to keep defending her against accusations like this all the time.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:32 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
Oh? I thought it was. What step are they on now, then?
They are still trying to get a warrant to even read the emails.
I thought that there was a legal reason for Comey to write the letter, due to his previous testimony. However, everything that I read since showed me that my first opinion, that this was a political move from a particularly bad FBI director, was correct.
He has been inserting political comments into this matter since he couldn't turn the investigation into an indictment.
I sincerely hope that he is invited to resign soon.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:34 AM   #8
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The transparency discrepancy is massive: Clinton w/unprecedented disclosure (voluntary or otherwise), Trump refusing the most basic (taxes).
But Hillary is the one some people think is hiding something... somehow.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:35 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
They are still trying to get a warrant to even read the emails.
I thought that there was a legal reason for Comey to write the letter, due to his previous testimony. However, everything that I read since showed me that my first opinion, that this was a political move from a particularly bad FBI director, was correct.
He has been inserting political comments into this matter since he couldn't turn the investigation into an indictment.
I sincerely hope that he is invited to resign soon.
If that can be proven, being invited to resign would be beyond a best case scenario for him.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:38 AM   #10
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Whoa!
GWB White House ethics lawyer Richard Painter says he's filed a Hatch Act violation complaint against James Comey
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:39 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
That seems sensible. And you're not even the Director of the FBI. Would that Comey had taken as sane an approach.
Heh:

Comey's letter, fixed

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Old 30th October 2016, 08:39 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
If that can be proven, being invited to resign would be beyond a best case scenario for him.
No, because democrats tend to avoid witch hunts. They are too busy being the sane party.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:40 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post

On the other hand you have a candidate who used a private email server because it was compatible with her smart phone and the government server was not.

It's just insanity.
You don't really believe that do you?
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:41 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
"GWB White House ethics lawyer" -- is that even a thing?
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:44 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
She's hiding her lifetime of crime. That highly motivated Republicans can't pin anything on her only proves what a criminal mastermind she is. Also, she is incompetent.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:45 AM   #16
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Trump says the election is rigged! Shillaries go crazy.

Shillaries say Comey is improperly trying to influence the election. Shillaries high five each other while making plans to drum him out of office.

Fantastic!
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:46 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
No, because democrats tend to avoid witch hunts. They are too busy being the sane party.
Given the intense and growing criticism from legal experts on all sides, his resignation seems inevitable at this point. Jeanine Pirro has joined in the chorus criticising his attempted hack job.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:48 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Voluntary or otherwise?

Otherwise?

You joshing? I let the FBI seize numerous electronic devices that contained the emails I never turned over while Secretary of State. I am so transparant!

Lolz
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:49 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
What criminal wrongdoing are people speculating about?
A single email indicating a solid quid pro quo would do it.

The Clintons are experts on walking a very fine line between impropriety and illegality. But they're not perfect at it. Who would have imagined anyone keeping a semen-stained dress, for instance? And an improperiety leading to lying under oath in an attempt to conceal it?

Not saying they will find such an email - especially since they may have been bleached away along with tens of thousands of others. But email threads have tendrils, one of which apparently just got stumbled upon.

We'll see...
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:49 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Given the intense and growing criticism from legal experts on all sides, his resignation seems inevitable at this point. Jeanine Pirro has joined in the chorus criticising his attempted hack job.
Hopefully yes. His comments after closing the investigation were already an overreach of his role, but this time he might fall on his face.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:50 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Trump says the election is rigged! Shillaries go crazy.

Shillaries say Comey is improperly trying to influence the election. Shillaries high five each other while making plans to drum him out of office.

Fantastic!
There is no evidence whatsoever that the for Donald's conspiracy that the election is rigged against. While Comey wrote a vaguely worded letter to Congress regarding emails that the FBI hasn't even read knowing that Republicans would use it to attempt to hurt Hillary.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:50 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Given the intense and growing criticism from legal experts on all sides, his resignation seems inevitable at this point. Jeanine Pirro has joined in the chorus criticising his attempted hack job.
Pitchfork futures are soaring!

It is Comey's fault that huma had thousands of emails on a computer used by her pervert husband.

Hilarious.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:51 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post
There is no evidence whatsoever that the for Donald's conspiracy that the election is rigged against. While Comey wrote a vaguely worded letter to Congress regarding emails that the FBI hasn't even read knowing that Republicans would use it to attempt to hurt Hillary.
So your conspiracy theory is valid?

Huh.

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Old 30th October 2016, 08:52 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
You don't really believe that do you?
The FBI concluded she did it out of convenience. But yeah, you know more than they do.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:55 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post
The FBI concluded she did it out of convenience. But yeah, you know more than they do.
Well, that is not what he said, now is it.

Plus who said that, Comey?

'K. Convenience was only Hillary's first lie. What a mope.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:55 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
A single email indicating a solid quid pro quo would do it.

The Clintons are experts on walking a very fine line between impropriety and illegality. But they're not perfect at it. Who would have imagined anyone keeping a semen-stained dress, for instance? And an improperiety leading to lying under oath in an attempt to conceal it?

Not saying they will find such an email - especially since they may have been bleached away along with tens of thousands of others. But email threads have tendrils, one of which apparently just got stumbled upon.

We'll see...
It will be nothing.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:55 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post
The FBI concluded she did it out of convenience. But yeah, you know more than they do.
Of course he does... he always knows better, and he is always right. That's the privilege of living in a reality of his own creation.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:57 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
The reactions don't make sense. On one hand you have a candidate who is recommending a series of military actions that he himself will direct, claiming he "knows more than the generals." What is his military experience? He has none. What is his foreign policy experience? He has none.

On the other hand you have a candidate who used a private email server because it was compatible with her smart phone and the government server was not.
The former sounds about right, and probably understated, but as I see it the email server business was not about direct criminality (as Trump maintains) but incompetence and bad judgement. Hell, when I held security clearances it was simply a given that no information whatsoever would be held or processed outside of accepted security parameters, and everyone knew that to do so would not just be a sackable offence but a criminal one. Hence I never heard of it happening. But here we have the presidential candidate doing exactly this, lying about it and then, when caught, brushing it off as no big deal.

Still, when your choice is between a bigoted louse-brained warmongering egotist and an incompetent two-faced manipulator the result is never going to be ideal. I think most people in the UK watch this fiasco still not quite believing it's real. Not just the email and the pussy incident but the whole thing, US politics as a whole. It's like a classroom role play that's got way out of hand, with maybe some surreptitious crack use thrown in.
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Old 30th October 2016, 08:57 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Pitchfork futures are soaring!

It is Comey's fault that huma had thousands of emails on a computer used by her pervert husband.

Hilarious.
It is his fault he wrote a vague letter to Congress before even reviewing the emails knowing Republicans would use it to attempt to sway the election.

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Old 30th October 2016, 08:58 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Tony Stark View Post
It will be nothing.
Until we know what's in them, "It will be nothing" ranks with "It will be something" as equally without foundation.
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:00 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Until we know what's in them, "It will be nothing" ranks with "It will be something" as equally without foundation.
These probably aren't even new emails so there's more weight on the "It will be nothing" side since that is more of what we already know about.
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:00 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Until we know what's in them, "It will be nothing" ranks with "It will be something" as equally without foundation.
Just because there are two possibilities doesn't mean they are equally likely. It is vastly more likely that it will be nothing.
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:10 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Megalodon View Post
No, because democrats tend to avoid witch hunts. They are too busy being the sane party.
Headline right now on CNN:

Clinton campaign wages new war against James Comey

You were.... saying?

Protecting Hillary and the emails on her aide's husband's filthy computer are all that matters!

It is WAR!
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:15 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
These probably aren't even new emails so there's more weight on the "It will be nothing" side since that is more of what we already know about.
well we KNOW that the emails were on an unsecured computer used by one of the creepiest people in the world.

I bet you if the FBI used a black light on it, the computer glowed like a jackson pollock painting.

Good job Hillary and Huma!
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:24 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post

Protecting Hillary and the emails on her aide's husband's filthy computer are all that matters!
To be fair, did she not publicly call for all the emails that Comey may have stumbled upon to be released ASAP?
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:26 AM   #36
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A law professor who was the chief ethics lawyer in the Bush White House filed a Hatch Act complaint against the FBI. He wrote an Op-ed in the NYT explaining why.

Quote:
On Friday, the director of the F.B.I., James B. Comey, sent to members of Congress a letter updating them on developments in the agency’s investigation of Mrs. Clinton’s emails, an investigation which supposedly was closed months ago. This letter, which was quickly posted on the internet, made highly unusual public statements about an F.B.I. investigation concerning a candidate in the election. The letter was sent in violation of a longstanding Justice Department policy of not discussing specifics about pending investigations with others, including members of Congress. According to some news reports on Saturday, the letter was sent before the F.B.I. had even obtained the search warrant that it needed to look at the newly discovered emails. And it was sent days before the election, at a time when many Americans are already voting.

Violations of the Hatch Act and of government ethics rules on misuse of official positions are not permissible in any circumstances, including in the case of an executive branch official acting under pressure from politically motivated members of Congress. Such violations are of even greater concern when the agency is the F.B.I.

It is not clear whether Mr. Comey personally wanted to influence the outcome of the election, although his letter — which cast suspicion on Mrs. Clinton without revealing specifics — was concerning. Also concerning is the fact that Mr. Comey has already made highly unusual public statements expressing his personal opinion about Mrs. Clinton’s actions, calling her handling of classified information “extremely careless,” when he announced this summer that the F.B.I. was concluding its investigation of her email without filing any charges.

But an official doesn’t need to have a specific intent — or desire — to influence an election to be in violation of the Hatch Act or government ethics rules. The rules are violated if it is obvious that the official’s actions could influence the election, there is no other good reason for taking those actions, and the official is acting under pressure from persons who obviously do want to influence the election.

Absent extraordinary circumstances that might justify it, a public communication about a pending F.B.I. investigation involving a candidate for public office that is made on the eve of an election is thus very likely to be a violation of the Hatch Act and a misuse of an official position. Serious questions also arise under lawyers’ professional conduct rules that require prosecutors to avoid excessive publicity and unnecessary statements that could cause public condemnation even of people who have been accused of a crime, not to mention people like Mrs. Clinton, who have never been charged with a crime.

This is no trivial matter. We cannot allow F.B.I. or Justice Department officials to unnecessarily publicize pending investigations concerning candidates of either party while an election is underway. That is an abuse of power. Allowing such a precedent to stand will invite more, and even worse, abuses of power in the future
http://nytimes.com/2016/10/30/opinio...his-power.html

Obama should definitely fire Comey after the election.

ETA: Missed that Stacko posted this earlier.

Last edited by Tony Stark; 30th October 2016 at 09:40 AM.
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:30 AM   #37
acbytesla
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
If that can be proven, being invited to resign would be beyond a best case scenario for him.
I don't think they can do anything more to him. I keep trying to think of a reason not to fire him and I can't. There is a long history of law enforcement doing everything they can not to influence elections in the US and he knowingly violated it.

This is one thing we can't allow.
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:36 AM   #38
The Big Dog
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
To be fair, did she not publicly call for all the emails that Comey may have stumbled upon to be released ASAP?
And also to be fair, did she not say the same thing about her other emails which she said did not contain classified matters only for it to have been loaded with classified matters all the way to Top Secret?

So to summarize she "publicly" called for something that she KNOWS is totally improper and will never happen before they are vetted

She is such a phony
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:40 AM   #39
KDLarsen
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
To be fair, did she not publicly call for all the emails that Comey may have stumbled upon to be released ASAP?
She did, and take a guess at who rounded on her for doing so...

Quote:
I hear the moron "demanded" that the FBI release all the emails immediately.

What a cretin, her last set of emails was lousy with classified intelligence including Top Secret

she is counting on people being dumb enough to fall for that nonsense.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...1#post11562131
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Old 30th October 2016, 09:43 AM   #40
The Big Dog
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
She did, and take a guess at who rounded on her for doing so...

of course I did, it is a ludicrous suggestion.

Plus the whole: I demand that the FBI release the evidence in the ongoing criminal investigation!

How dumb does she think people are???
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