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Old 29th December 2016, 11:11 PM   #281
WilliamSeger
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Mormons Petition To Stop Tabernacle Choir From Singing At Trump’s Inauguration

Originally Posted by Huffington Post
A Mormon who said his “heart sank” when he heard that the church’s beloved Tabernacle Choir will perform at Donald Trump’s inauguration has launched a petition to urge the group not to go to Washington, D.C.


“I love the Mormon Tabernacle Choir. The thought of this choir and Mormonism being forever associated with a man who disparages minorities, brags about his sexual control of women, encourages intolerance and traffics in hate speech and bullying, was unacceptable,” Randall Thacker said in a statement. “I immediately knew there were probably thousands of people who felt the same way, so I created the space on Change.org for like-minded Mormons and their friends to share their feelings.”


About 215 of the choir’s 360 members are expected to perform at the inauguration, church officials have told The Salt Lake City Tribune.
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Old 29th December 2016, 11:40 PM   #282
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
How's that boycott working out? Is it super-effective? Or is it not doing anything?

You have learned nothing.
What boycott is that? Are you arguing straw men again to distract from the fact that you fell for and are repeating right wing spin?
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Old 30th December 2016, 12:54 AM   #283
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Is there any evidence of Jackie Evancho's music sales "skyrocketing" besides Breitbart and Fox News?

It wouldn't surprise me there are enough Trump supporters to boost her sales, but I'm skeptical of "skyrocketing sales".

I've never heard of her.

Oh wait, I found this on TMZ:Restocked where?


Billboard Classical Album Chart
"We're told" sounds like they went to Trump University "people are saying"!
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Old 30th December 2016, 02:35 AM   #284
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Singer resigns from Mormon Tabernacle Choir, says she ‘could never look myself in the mirror again’ if she performed for Trump

Originally Posted by Salt Lake Tribune
"Since 'the announcement,' I have spent several sleepless nights and days in turmoil and agony. I have reflected carefully on both sides of the issue, prayed a lot, talked with family and friends, and searched my soul," Jan Chamberlin wrote in a resignation letter to the choir president and choir members. "I've tried to tell myself that by not going to the inauguration, that I would be able to stay in choir for all the other good reasons. I've tried to tell myself that it will be all right and that I can continue in good conscience before God and man."

But she could not do it, Chamberlin said in the letter, she later posted on Facebook. "I could never look myself in the mirror again with self-respect."

The choir's participation in the inauguration would "severely damage" its "image and networking," she said, adding that many "good people throughout this land and throughout the world already do and will continue to feel betrayed. ... I know that I too feel betrayed."

For the singer, it is a moral issue, she wrote. "I only know I could never 'throw roses to Hitler.' And I certainly could never sing for him."
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Old 30th December 2016, 03:07 AM   #285
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Originally Posted by tyr_13 View Post
...snip...

EDIT: *This is a rather important point I forgot to put in. Many rapists don't think they're rapists. From all the information I've looked at, there is no one clear 'type' of rapist, even if there are several personality traits that correlate with rape. They also correlate with things like success in business, so they aren't just that predictive. The thought 'I'd never rape' is comforting and in most cases true, but is often stated with more confidence than is strictly warranted. Not about you specifically 14.
And we know that Trump's legal advisor thinks that way - as he said

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...uring-sex.html
...snip...

Michael Cohen, special counsel at The Trump Organization, defended his boss, saying, “You’re talking about the frontrunner for the GOP, presidential candidate, as well as a private individual who never raped anybody. And, of course, understand that by the very definition, you can’t rape your spouse.”
“It is true,” Cohen added. “You cannot rape your spouse. And there’s very clear case law.”

...snip...
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Old 30th December 2016, 03:26 AM   #286
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Originally Posted by Spindrift View Post
How can you say it has little to do with his actual policy positions when no one knows what his policy positions are?

Trump supporters will just wave away anything inconvenient he says as just bluster and campaign rhetoric. And when he actually does something like pick a virulently anti-LGBTQ vice president, that's not supposed to reflect on his policies either.

What exactly are his policies?

When are we supposed to take him seriously?

This has been my musing - if anything he says can be written off as 'rhetoric' then what's his actual plan?

Those who voted for him must think they know but none of them seem to be able to tell me.
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Old 30th December 2016, 05:33 AM   #287
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
And we know that Trump's legal advisor thinks that way - as he said

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...uring-sex.html
...snip...

Michael Cohen, special counsel at The Trump Organization, defended his boss, saying, “You’re talking about the frontrunner for the GOP, presidential candidate, as well as a private individual who never raped anybody. And, of course, understand that by the very definition, you can’t rape your spouse.”
“It is true,” Cohen added. “You cannot rape your spouse. And there’s very clear case law.”

...snip...
That lawyer must not be aware that spousal rape is very much a thing and has precedent in legal terms. I believe several people have been convicted of committing spousal rape in multiple states at this point.
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Old 30th December 2016, 05:57 AM   #288
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Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.
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Old 30th December 2016, 06:13 AM   #289
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.
Seems like you don't understand what "the problem" is.
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Old 30th December 2016, 06:23 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
What boycott is that? Are you arguing straw men again to distract from the fact that you fell for and are repeating right wing spin?
I told you to go read the post I first responded to, but obviously you didn't.
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Old 30th December 2016, 08:08 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I told you to go read the post I first responded to, but obviously you didn't.
I read it. I don't care one way or the other about what sounded like one poster's idea of something that is a mainstay in America; using your buying power to express discontent with the social/political policies of a commercial entity. Does the name Dixie Chicks ring a bell? Duck Dynasty/Cracker Barrel? Dow Chemical/Saran Wrap boycott? Chick-Fil-A?

I have no comment on it because I have no opinion either way. What caught my eye was your choice of news source, a gossip site, and your seeming inability to vet the information you got. Is this "fake news"? No. It's slanted news. It's minor, but you fell for public relations nonsense.
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Old 30th December 2016, 08:35 AM   #292
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.
Why don't they just use the same set up the last time a serial sexual predator got sworn in in 1996?
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Old 30th December 2016, 08:44 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.
As far as I can tell, compromise is a loss.
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Old 30th December 2016, 08:56 AM   #294
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Originally Posted by marplots View Post
As far as I can tell, compromise is a loss.
Problem is that we know that Trump ignores such things.
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Old 30th December 2016, 09:25 AM   #295
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.

I see what you did there.

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Old 30th December 2016, 09:26 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.

Seems like you don't understand what "the problem" is.

Maybe you didn't see what he did there.
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Old 30th December 2016, 09:31 AM   #297
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
Presumably the people performing at the inauguration will have dressing rooms of some sort. Couldn't the organisers simply put security on the doors, with orders that Trump not be allowed into those rooms under any circumstances?

Seems like it would solve the problem.
Perhaps the Rockettes are trying to make a statement that creepy perverts walking into women's dressing rooms is not okay.
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Old 30th December 2016, 10:09 AM   #298
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
I have no comment on it because I have no opinion either way.
Edited by Agatha:  Edited breach of rule 0 and rule 12
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Last edited by Agatha; 1st January 2017 at 06:11 PM.
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Old 30th December 2016, 11:28 AM   #299
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Why doesn't Team Trump just ask supporter Kanye West to perform at the inauguration? And I'm sure there must be a bunch of right-wing country music acts proud and eager to appear.
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Old 30th December 2016, 11:40 AM   #300
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Why don't they just use the same set up the last time a serial sexual predator got sworn in in 1996?
Those resources have since been repurposed for boys' locker rooms since we have another Republican Speaker of the House. Its the lesser known Hastert Rule.
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Old 30th December 2016, 11:45 AM   #301
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Originally Posted by Donal View Post
Those resources have since been repurposed for boys' locker rooms since we have another Republican Speaker of the House. Its the lesser known Hastert Rule.
Huh, maybe they can borrow the plans the state Department used for the spouses of the former secretary and her personal assistant?
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Old 30th December 2016, 02:11 PM   #302
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Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
No kidding. I just thought it was funny. I, too, have eaten at Primanti's when we had a white president.
Primanti's is awesome food. Of course, I mean the real Primanti's, in Pittsburgh. The ones in Florida don't count.
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Old 30th December 2016, 03:40 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Primanti's is awesome food. Of course, I mean the real Primanti's, in Pittsburgh. The ones in Florida don't count.
And preferably the one in the Strip District.
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Old 30th December 2016, 04:32 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Huh, maybe they can borrow the plans the state Department used for the spouses of the former secretary and her personal assistant?
Was that really supposed to one up the fact that a revered Republican standard bearer raped boys? That he still has current GOP members of Congress speaking up for him?
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Old 30th December 2016, 05:03 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
I see Jackie Evancho is singing, and it appears her sales have gone through the roof since being announced.

Nice!
A reality TV star singing for a reality TV star. Fitting.
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Old 30th December 2016, 05:08 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
And preferably the one in the Strip District.
Oakland'll do.

But if one has the opportunity to go to the Strip, why not?

I miss Pittsburgh.
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Old 30th December 2016, 05:09 PM   #307
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Originally Posted by Donal View Post
Was that really supposed to one up the fact that a revered Republican standard bearer raped boys? That he still has current GOP members of Congress speaking up for him?
One up? Not sure what you mean? One spouse raped women, and the other spouse might be the skeeviest ************ on the planet.
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Old 30th December 2016, 05:27 PM   #308
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Edited by Agatha:  Edited breach of rule 0 and rule 12
Sorry, sheriff. I've got a press pass. I was pointing out your poor reasoning, in a post related to the subject of the thread. You don't get to lay out the parameters of the discussion. You offered up nonsense as hypothetical proof that no "shunning" was occurring and that, in fact, the opposite was happening. If you offered up such dubious evidence in a thread on homeopaths, you'd be laughed out of town.

You are quite free to ignore my posts; it's as good a way to concede without having to admit your flaws as any.

Don't you have a good Drudge Report or Virginia Dare newsfeed to read? All you have to do is admit that you were less than conscientious in your source selection.
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Old 30th December 2016, 06:08 PM   #309
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There's a way to spin it to avoid negative repercussions. Jackie isn't pandering to a sexual predator to gain album sales, she's standing up to a lout and denying him authority over her.

It's not just about Jackie, it's about Jackie being a powerful woman for all women.
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Old 30th December 2016, 06:50 PM   #310
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This thread is very unfair.

I hear that the Pipe & Drums Band of the National Union of the KKK is happy to be performing for Trump's party.

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Old 30th December 2016, 10:58 PM   #311
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Sorry, sheriff. I've got a press pass. I was pointing out your poor reasoning, in a post related to the subject of the thread. You don't get to lay out the parameters of the discussion.
You are arguing against a straw man, and ignoring the actual point. And as a matter of fact, I do get to decide what issues I discuss.
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Old 31st December 2016, 01:56 AM   #312
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
You are arguing against a straw man, and ignoring the actual point. And as a matter of fact, I do get to decide what issues I discuss.
Well, the obvious way to achieve that would be to simply shut up. 'Cuz what we've got here is a Mexican standoff. You don't want to address the point I've made, and I do. It's on topic. You can continue to post telling me that you're not going to answer or that I shouldn't answer when it'd be much simpler to either shut up or simply admit that you had a lapse in common sense. What's that old rubric? Discretion is sometimes the better part of valor.
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Old 31st December 2016, 02:31 AM   #313
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Well, the obvious way to achieve that would be to simply shut up. 'Cuz what we've got here is a Mexican standoff. You don't want to address the point I've made, and I do. It's on topic. You can continue to post telling me that you're not going to answer or that I shouldn't answer when it'd be much simpler to either shut up or simply admit that you had a lapse in common sense. What's that old rubric? Discretion is sometimes the better part of valor.
Sounds like you need a wall.
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Old 31st December 2016, 07:03 AM   #314
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Sounds like you need a wall.
But don't pay for it yourself.
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Old 31st December 2016, 07:16 AM   #315
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
It's part of the whole "rape isn't about sex" dogma, originating with Susan Brownmiller. It was nonsense, of course, but it was ideologically useful nonsense.
Why is it useful? That sexual assault sometimes or even often has non-sexual motives I can accept; but that it never has sexual motives or is "not about carnal pleasure" seems quite unsustainable as an explanation of the phenomenon. I think it's nonsense, but why would it be "useful" nonsense? I imagine that somebody must find it useful, or it wouldn't be stated at all; but if you have an explanation of its supposed utility, I would like to see it.

It makes reluctance to perform at the inauguration more understandable because whether or not the Presidency is about sex, it is very definitely about power.
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Old 31st December 2016, 03:16 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by Craig B View Post
Why is it useful?
Because it plays into the feminist dogma that all men oppress all women, and that men who don't rape still benefit from rape because it keeps women in line.
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Old 31st December 2016, 03:24 PM   #317
Skeptic Ginger
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Because it plays into the feminist dogma that all men oppress all women, and that men who don't rape still benefit from rape because it keeps women in line.
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Old 31st December 2016, 03:26 PM   #318
Ziggurat
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Well, the obvious way to achieve that would be to simply shut up.
Yes. So why don't you?

Quote:
You don't want to address the point I've made, and I do.
I don't want to address it because it's not actually relevant to the point I actually made, rather than your straw man. Whether her sales went up because of Trump or coincidentally, it's clear that she isn't being hurt by any boycott. That's the real point I was making.

Quote:
What's that old rubric? Discretion is sometimes the better part of valor.
Try it some time.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
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Old 31st December 2016, 03:27 PM   #319
Ziggurat
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Translation: I'm right, you have no counter-argument, but you don't like what I said.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
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Old 31st December 2016, 04:01 PM   #320
Donal
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
One up? Not sure what you mean? One spouse raped women, and the other spouse might be the skeeviest ************ on the planet.
Got some proof of that? Or is Trump's word good enough because he can smell his own kind?

Who am I kidding? You won't provide any proof. Just a hand wave and some innuendo.
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