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Old 6th April 2019, 10:05 AM   #121
The_Animus
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Originally Posted by Roboramma View Post
There were other choices, but none were actually viable. We have to deal with the world as it is, not as we would like it to be.

At the time of the election most people were predicting that Hillary would win. If you wanted to avoid that, the only thing that would have any use at all would be voting for Trump, who actually had a chance of beating her.
You could make this argument regarding the general election, but that doesn't explain why they chose Trump as their nominee over all the other candidates during the primary. They had choices and they picked the worst of them (with the possible exception of Ted Cruz )
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Old 6th April 2019, 10:56 AM   #122
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
White supremacy is an evil scourge. Being white and loving your Country is not. If you love your Country, you are by definition are a nationalist. A white person can still love their Country without being a white supremacist or bigot. Skin color is not a qualifier for love of one's Country. It's amazing to go back and see the twists and turns of the Leftist press and Democrat party as they have worked to associate and turn "nationalism" into "racism" and white supremacy into nationalism . In our current reality of definition twisting and relabeling, add skin color to the mix combined with the act of loving one's Country, if white, you automatically become white supremacists by association. It's insanity to do so, yet there it is in plain site.
I have a different semantic take from you on this. When I refer to white nationalism, I'm not talking about nationalists who happen to be white, I'm referring to those in support of a white nation - as in (white national)ist - where racial identity is seen as a key part of national identity.

Also, I would see "nationalism" as more politically ideological than merely loving your country, but maybe that's an unnecessary aside here. I think you do a good job of explaining your position even with the difference in understanding of some of the terms. But perhaps the semantic differences are affecting the way you view liberal commentary on the matter.

Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
I don't hold someone's opinion against them unless it's a lie. I have demonstrated in past posts that Trump has been accused of making racist statements that he in fact never made. His actual words were taken out of context as to who he was addressing and weaponized against him to influence low information voters into a false narrative of racism. When the opposing side resorts to lying to try create/further a false narrative, it should give pause for thought no matter who one voted for in 2016.

Trump is a white man and no he is not racist. The issue that many are trying to turn into racism is the fact that President Trump is not apologetic for his skin color and holds America 1st. He doesn't hold his hat in hand simply because he is a White American.
I agree that if people are basing opinions on lies, misquotes and misrepresentations that's not helpful and can feed a false narrative. Personally, I think we have enough real quotes in context from Trump to suggest that either he's a racist or that he wants the votes of racists. Plenty of racists seem to think he's their guy. Does that idea not make you uncomfortable or do you think I'm just mistaken in this assessment?

Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Likewise, I am not ashamed that my skin color is white. I have the uncanny talent to look past someone's skin color when determining their character and worth, it's really not a factor. I believe President Trump to possess very like ideals.

The travel ban was targeted at a group that have done harm to the US in the past and seek to do harm against the US now. The color of their skin is not a factor, their intention is the factor. Likewise with the Mexican border, the costs of illegal immigration have been spiraling out of control for years. Who cares what skin color these folks are? They could be purple and yet we still have a problem that needs addressing at the Southern border. Feigned outrage is not a solution to either of these issues. Action is the answer and the current agenda of the present administration.

Chris B.
There have been terrorists who described themselves as Muslim and terrorists who described themselves as Christian (and were white Americans). Is there a good reason for targeting one as a group for having some bad actors, but not the other?

I don't disagree that there are immigration issues that need addressing. There are reasonable economic and cultural discussions to be had on the issue. Do you not see how some of us might look at Trump's rhetoric on the issue as promoting fear and dehumanizing people and how we might see that as playing into race?
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Old 6th April 2019, 11:19 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
I'm sure Chris, in his quest for accuracy in attributed quotes would like to see the source of the LIE that Hillary called black kids superpredators.

It's weird that Politifact rate the claim "Mostly True" when they also write this:

Quote:
"Just as in a previous generation we had an organized effort against the mob. We need to take these people on. They are often connected to big drug cartels, they are not just gangs of kids anymore. They are often the kinds of kids that are called superpredators — no conscience, no empathy. We can talk about why they ended up that way, but first, we have to bring them to heel."

The full context of this incident does link children and superpredators, but nowhere in the speech does she directly label African-American youth this way.
Did Hillary Clinton call African-American youth 'superpredators?' (Aug. 28, 2016)
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Old 6th April 2019, 12:07 PM   #124
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ChrisB,
Who says of themselves, "I have the uncanny ability to see past skin color"?
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Old 6th April 2019, 02:43 PM   #125
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The more you hear someone speaking of some positive attribute they possess the less likely they are to actually possess that attribute.
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Old 6th April 2019, 02:58 PM   #126
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
I don't know if it's willful ignorance or not but some folks who continue to spout off about what Trump said or didn't say may want to lay down their party handbook and put on their skeptic's hat just long enough to verify a few facts before placing foot in mouth. The facts are in and Trump NEVER said neo-nazis were fine people.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...of_139815.html

IT NEVER HAPPENED. REPEAT. IT NEVER HAPPENED.......

Yet another example of how supposedly educated minds tow their party line even when it's filled with fake news and lies and proven false as fact. I refuse to believe Liberals are this stupid. It must be intentional dishonesty.

Chris B.
If the stupid bitch doesn't like it,
he should have kept his mouth shut. As it I'd, there's all that beautiful footage of the torchlight march and dumb **** saying fine people on both sides. That's enough.
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Old 6th April 2019, 02:59 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
ChrisB,
Who says of themselves, "I have the uncanny ability to see past skin color"?
The same person who would point to a rally attendee a say "Look at my African-American over here. Look at him!"
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Old 6th April 2019, 03:32 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by Egg View Post
I have a different semantic take from you on this. When I refer to white nationalism, I'm not talking about nationalists who happen to be white, I'm referring to those in support of a white nation - as in (white national)ist - where racial identity is seen as a key part of national identity.

Also, I would see "nationalism" as more politically ideological than merely loving your country, but maybe that's an unnecessary aside here. I think you do a good job of explaining your position even with the difference in understanding of some of the terms. But perhaps the semantic differences are affecting the way you view liberal commentary on the matter.
Nationalist:
"a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations."

Reporter: "President Trump, are you a nationalist?"
Trump: "Absolutely!"
Reporter: "You are White aren't you?"
Trump: "Why obviously yes of course."
Reporter then writes story about how Trump admits to being White Nationalist in support of White Supremacists.

Originally Posted by Egg View Post
I agree that if people are basing opinions on lies, misquotes and misrepresentations that's not helpful and can feed a false narrative. Personally, I think we have enough real quotes in context from Trump to suggest that either he's a racist or that he wants the votes of racists. Plenty of racists seem to think he's their guy. Does that idea not make you uncomfortable or do you think I'm just mistaken in this assessment?
I don't think his statements were race motivated at all. Not all of the white supremacy haters like Trump, he's too friendly with Israel, has a Jewish son-in-law and grandchild and he bashes White supremacists publicly. However, even if they support him for President it makes no difference, just as the same far left elements that support Democrats, both their numbers are too small to tip the scale in either direction. I'm not uncomfortable at all to cast my vote again for Trump. In fact I'll likely be first in line on election day.


Originally Posted by Egg View Post
There have been terrorists who described themselves as Muslim and terrorists who described themselves as Christian (and were white Americans). Is there a good reason for targeting one as a group for having some bad actors, but not the other?
We seem to still have a Military presence deployed around the World. At last check ISIS was down for the count and those guys are supposedly radical Muslims.

Perhaps when we have plane loads of Baptists crashing planes into buildings and declaring war on the US, the emphasis might shift.



Originally Posted by Egg View Post
I don't disagree that there are immigration issues that need addressing. There are reasonable economic and cultural discussions to be had on the issue. Do you not see how some of us might look at Trump's rhetoric on the issue as promoting fear and dehumanizing people and how we might see that as playing into race?
I see our Country's prior lack of action on immigration reform as disgusting. It's about time someone took a stand to correct the border security issues and slow down illegal immigration. I had hoped that Obama would, but he did not.

It appears that Trump is doing something to secure the border. He also needs to do something about immigration and giving these folks that are already here a path to citizenship. I don't expect him to finish but I do expect him to start the task. Democrats will fight tooth and nail to keep him from accomplishing anything regarding immigration reform. They stand to lose too many votes if the other party fixes the immigration issues they wouldn't. Personally I think we ought to all say to hell with politics and focus on being humanitarians for just long enough to solve the problem. Pointing fingers at the one person that is attempting to do so does not fit the bill.

Chris B.
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Last edited by ChrisBFRPKY; 6th April 2019 at 03:34 PM. Reason: syntx
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Old 6th April 2019, 03:42 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
If the stupid bitch doesn't like it,
he should have kept his mouth shut. As it I'd, there's all that beautiful footage of the torchlight march and dumb **** saying fine people on both sides. That's enough.
Certainly if you choose to believe a lie that has been proven as such, go for it.
Do you ever wonder if the ideology you believe in is also as false? Would that bother you knowing everything you thought was truth is also a lie?

Chris B.
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One could choose to be civil though and still disagree. For example, since I know Bigfoot does exist, I don't call others "idiot" just because they're uneducated on the subject and share a different view based on that lack of experience. Chris B.
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Old 6th April 2019, 03:43 PM   #130
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Originally Posted by The Greater Fool View Post
The more you hear someone speaking of some positive attribute they possess the less likely they are to actually possess that attribute.
Only if they're a Democrat.

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Old 6th April 2019, 04:22 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Certainly if you choose to believe a lie that has been proven as such, go for it.
Do you ever wonder if the ideology you believe in is also as false? Would that bother you knowing everything you thought was truth is also a lie?

Chris B.
I don't care what he meant. He said the words.
The video of the march is there. All you have to do is put the two together.
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Old 6th April 2019, 04:40 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Only if they're a Democrat.

Chris B.
Stayed up all night coming up with that witty retort, did ya?
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Old 6th April 2019, 05:27 PM   #133
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[quote=ChrisBFRPKY;12656377]Many White Nationalists (the White Supremacy kind) love Israel? This is news to me. Link?

I'm not sure why this would surprise you, but here's an example from NPR

Quote:
Many Evangelicals love Israel because Jesus will return and burn Jews? Link?
Jeez, if you don't know this one...

Quote:
Ah, now the backdoor that allows a Democrat to rationalize Obama's treatment of Netanyahu and Israel. You think this would also explain the Iran deal as well? Crafty twist as it allows a very powerful anti-Semite policy in play, yet you forget, US Jews vote in US elections and 2020 will come.
Since I have no issue with either, I see no need for any "backdoor".

http://www.aei.org/spotlight/the-obama-economy-perry/

" During Obama’s time in office, America has slipped in several international rankings of competitiveness, innovation and economic freedom. For example, in its annual global competitiveness report, the World Economic Forum (WEF) ranks countries on a single global competitiveness index (GCI), consisting of 12 important macroeconomic and macroeconomic aspects (or “pillars”) of competitiveness. In the 2008-09 report, the last published during the Bush Administration, the WEF ranked the U.S. No. 1 in the world on both the GCI and on the critical pillar of “innovation capacity.” In the most recent 2015-16 annual report covering the Obama presidency, the U.S. declined to No. 3 globally on the GCI, while slipping to No. 4 on the “innovation capacity” pillar."

Quote:
The Supreme Court is racist? News to me. Link?
Read what I said, and try again.

Quote:
Are these facts? Because they sound a lot like accusations from a political party opposing an incumbent. Link?
Right here, and at this point I'm done doing research into well-known facts for you.

Quote:
No, that's not even in the same Galaxy as what I said. Everyone should be allowed to apply to the school of their choice based on their actual abilities, things like entrance exam scores. Nobody should be judged on the color of their skin, but instead by the gray matter in their head. I think Dr. King would agree. To argue otherwise is to suggest that people of color are less intelligent than whites and should be given a hand up.
Yeah, everyone says that, *after* I point out the massive influence of both wealth and legacy on admissions. Even though these are even more powerful than Affermative Action, though, it's only the latter that everyone howls about.
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Old 6th April 2019, 07:27 PM   #134
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[quote=Mumbles;12657179]
Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Many White Nationalists (the White Supremacy kind) love Israel? This is news to me. Link?

I'm not sure why this would surprise you, but here's an example from NPR



Jeez, if you don't know this one...



Since I have no issue with either, I see no need for any "backdoor".

http://www.aei.org/spotlight/the-obama-economy-perry/

" During Obama’s time in office, America has slipped in several international rankings of competitiveness, innovation and economic freedom. For example, in its annual global competitiveness report, the World Economic Forum (WEF) ranks countries on a single global competitiveness index (GCI), consisting of 12 important macroeconomic and macroeconomic aspects (or “pillars”) of competitiveness. In the 2008-09 report, the last published during the Bush Administration, the WEF ranked the U.S. No. 1 in the world on both the GCI and on the critical pillar of “innovation capacity.” In the most recent 2015-16 annual report covering the Obama presidency, the U.S. declined to No. 3 globally on the GCI, while slipping to No. 4 on the “innovation capacity” pillar."



Read what I said, and try again.



Right here, and at this point I'm done doing research into well-known facts for you.



Yeah, everyone says that, *after* I point out the massive influence of both wealth and legacy on admissions. Even though these are even more powerful than Affermative Action, though, it's only the latter that everyone howls about.
An NPR opinion piece. Not particularly influential. It seems to me if Trump helps Israel, he's considered a white nationalist and if he doesn't help Israel he's anti-Semitic, I see how that works. What in your opinion should Trump do for Israel if anything at all?

Christians don't spread hate, they're about love and forgiveness. I don't think you'll find many hoping for the destruction of Jews or Israel. WWJD?

This one is hilited above, I'd really like your opinion.

I think everyone on the Supreme Court is well aware of the concept of racism. Speaking of SC Justices, Ruth Bader Ginsburg isn't getting any younger.


From your article:

"The girl’s rape case was among more than 400 sex-crime cases that were inadequately investigated or not looked into at all by Maricopa County sheriff Joe Arpaio’s office during a three-year period ending in 2007.

Sheriff’s spokeswoman Lisa Allen says Arpaio’s office agrees with the decision to resolve the lawsuit.

The botched investigations served as an embarrassment for Arpaio, who promotes himself as “America’s toughest sheriff”.

He eventually reopened the cases and apologized for the way they were handled."

I didn't say he was perfect or he never made a mistake. Not bad for taking on the police work in Phoenix as well 2004-2007. There were bound to be some cases that slipped thru the cracks.

A lot of things were going on in 2007. I liked the article from the same site below:

2007 https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...arpaio-phoenix

"The threat to the Obama administration is clear, and it is trying to stop SB 1070 with a legal injunction. If it allows Arizona to go its own way, with other states certain to follow suit, the federal government could quickly lose control of the nation's immigration policy."

I'm for equal treatment for all. I think we're on the same page there. If my kid or your kid is sharper and scores higher than a billionaire's kid, I expect him/her to be accepted before the rich kid regardless of skin color. (Big stink about this kind of thing going on now of course, I'm watching it unfold too) I only hope the parents and the bribe takers in those cases are all placed in jail for a time to ponder their mistakes.

Chris B.
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Old 6th April 2019, 07:31 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Nationalist:
"a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations."
Now look up "nation."
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Old 6th April 2019, 07:32 PM   #136
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Trump is no Nationalist - he hates all parts of the US that don't like him: see California and Puerto Rico.

He is a Mercantilist.
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Old 7th April 2019, 02:55 AM   #137
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
You could make this argument regarding the general election, but that doesn't explain why they chose Trump as their nominee over all the other candidates during the primary. They had choices and they picked the worst of them (with the possible exception of Ted Cruz )
"They" in these two cases are not all the same people, though.
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Old 7th April 2019, 07:06 PM   #138
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Catching up on the thread before I returned to panning for flakes in the little exchange about Sheriff Joe (hallowed be his name), only to come across the motherlode:
Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY
Trump is a white man and no he is not racist.
Just look at how it gleams in the light!
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Old 8th April 2019, 04:42 AM   #139
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Originally Posted by Tormac View Post
Do you think calling them neo-nazi's because they voted for Trump on 2nd amendment issues is going to make them see democratic candidates as reasonable alternatives?
Of course there is nothing wrong with listening to the ideas of nazis, and all trump supporters know this, see Trumps getting talking points from @whitegenocide(tm). Nothing wrong with that and I am sure your Trump supporting friend would agree.
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Old 8th April 2019, 04:44 AM   #140
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Originally Posted by Tormac View Post
Hi PonderingTurtle,

I get that you think Trump is a racist Jerk. I rather do to. The thing is you are totally missing the point of my posts in your eagerness to attack Trump at every turn. You sound rather unhinged and unreasonable in your rush to attack Trump.
I know Trump is a racist with a long history of racism, this was a big selling point and what got him many early votes. I mean seriously what policies did he ever articulate other than racism? Well releasing his tax returns if elected.
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Old 8th April 2019, 04:45 AM   #141
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Originally Posted by Tormac View Post
I want to single this post out as a prime example of what I am talking about.
Why should they be upset about a popular policy punishing those who haven't committed any crime? They like the policy why should their support for it suddenly be wrong?
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Old 8th April 2019, 04:48 AM   #142
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Originally Posted by Roboramma View Post
Being responsible for the deaths of 100 million people falls on one side of the equation. The VW Beetle on the other side. Yes, I think there's a problem with someone who considers the positives to outweigh the negatives.

If, on the other hand, someone were to think that Trump's economic policies were doing more good than his racism was doing bad, I wouldn't think that made him racist. I'd think he was wrong (because I don't think his economic policies are doing good), but as that issue isn't so clear cut, I would simply consider that person to be mistaken. It's also not clear to me how much harm his racism has actually done.

So I don't think the situation is at all clear cut in the way it is with Hitler. I know where I stand on Trump (I disagree with his politic and his policies), but politics is one of those areas that reasonable people can disagree because economics, foreign affairs, culture, etc. etc. are simply extremely complicated things.
Oh you say such things now, but remember Hitler was not all that bad and people shouldn't be worried over his little antisemetic statements.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/19...-times-hitler/

The fake New York Times said this

"New York Times article reported that Adolf Hitler “was merely using anti-Semitic propaganda as a bait to catch masses of followers”."

So when did Hitler become Hitler instead of just a populist leader?
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Old 8th April 2019, 04:52 AM   #143
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
They were as viable as either Trump or Hillary.
Not really they were truly awful on their own merits. But decades of slander really paid off for republicans. If only Hillary had used something secure like Whatsapp for her official communications she would be fine.
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Old 8th April 2019, 04:55 AM   #144
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
You would like that your opponents were dimwits I realize but that will not serve you well.
Where the hell did that come from? I said Ben Shapiro is an idiot and a conman. Because the arguments he uses are consistently idiotic, and he's using lies and misdirections to try and bring people to his point of view.

How does that one data point lead you to the conclusion above?

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Self contradictory, because if he's conman, he's clearly smart enough and has enough insight into the conservative mind to make a living as a conman.
Ridiculous. Idiots can be conmen as well. They're just not very good at it.
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Old 8th April 2019, 05:01 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
Your desperation is showing. Sure, he uttered the phrase "very fine people" but you're trying to shoehorn that into showing support for nazis and white supremacists. Feel free to lay out your case if you want, but you're going to run into problems unless you're just trying to preach to "the resistance".

The real racists are those who didn't vote for Trump. After all, if Hillary had won, we'd have a President that thought that black kids were superpredators!!1!
Speaking of desperation, I really don't understand why some posters here feel the need to defend Trump to the point of denying the very things he's done and said. I mean, you can be a hardline conservative and still hate the party's leader.
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Old 8th April 2019, 05:04 AM   #146
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The most obvious connection between Trump, his supporters and the Nazi movement is their disdain for the Press and for intellectual elites.
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Old 8th April 2019, 05:11 AM   #147
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
The best argument you can present in defense of Trump’s “very fine people” comment is a parsing of his word salad gibberish “proving” that he wasn’t talking about Nazis and white supremacists, but rather defenders of monuments to slavery-loving traitors who fought a losing war against the United States.

The only thing more absurd is that you somehow think this argument is a devastating takedown of liberals.
Oh come on think of all the times you innocently ended up at a white supremacist rally(defined as a rally organized by white supremacists like charlotsville was), happens to everyone constantly.
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Old 8th April 2019, 05:12 AM   #148
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
Your desperation is showing. Sure, he uttered the phrase "very fine people" but you're trying to shoehorn that into showing support for nazis and white supremacists. Feel free to lay out your case if you want, but you're going to run into problems unless you're just trying to preach to "the resistance".
Those were the people organizing the event. Why is it wrong to classify members attending a political rally by the organizers of the rally?
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Old 8th April 2019, 06:42 AM   #149
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If Hillary had just said that "half" of Trump supports are racists, misogynists, xenophobes and homophobes and left it at that, then trumpers would have been stuck arguing about that estimate and accusing Democrats of the same thing. But she called them a "basket of deplorables" and that's what triggered the outrage. Although virtually all trumpers will deny being such a person, they obviously don't consider them to be deplorable, as evidenced the very fact that they're trumpers in the first place.

As for "very fine people" only referring to the people who didn't want the statues removed, I expect very fine people to have empathy for others, so very fine people do not celebrate symbols that cause so much pain.
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Old 8th April 2019, 07:14 AM   #150
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Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
If Hillary had just said that "half" of Trump supports are racists, misogynists, xenophobes and homophobes and left it at that, then trumpers would have been stuck arguing about that estimate and accusing Democrats of the same thing. But she called them a "basket of deplorables" and that's what triggered the outrage. Although virtually all trumpers will deny being such a person, they obviously don't consider them to be deplorable, as evidenced the very fact that they're trumpers in the first place.

As for "very fine people" only referring to the people who didn't want the statues removed, I expect very fine people to have empathy for others, so very fine people do not celebrate symbols that cause so much pain.
Hilited: Huh? She actually said "half".
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Old 8th April 2019, 07:18 AM   #151
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Hilited: Huh? She actually said "half".
Apparently nobody heard. And they kept not hearing when it was pointed out everytime some Trumper blurted out "She called us all Deplorable!"

The reason for them not hearing: It was an easy pass for the Trumpists to lay it on with the "us vs them" feelz. Embrace the deplorables - no matter if they are white supremacists or conspiracy theorists - and elect a loon.
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Last edited by uke2se; 8th April 2019 at 07:19 AM.
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Old 8th April 2019, 07:19 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Hilited: Huh? She actually said "half".
True story. She does use the term "basket of deplorables", but it comes with small part of the comment with a rather lengthy description.

eta:
Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Apparently nobody heard. And they kept not hearing when it was pointed out everytime some Trumper blurted out "She called us all Deplorable!"
When I hear someone say something like that, I like to reply, "Which one are you: racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, or Islamaphobic?
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Old 8th April 2019, 07:20 AM   #153
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Hilited: Huh? She actually said "half".
Sorry, I didn't phrase that very well. Yes, she said "half"; what I was getting at was if she had just said that half fit that description, trumpers would certainly dispute the estimate but couldn't deny the descriptions. What triggered the outrage was characterizing them as "deplorables."
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Old 8th April 2019, 09:46 AM   #154
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The most obvious connection between Trump, his supporters and the Nazi movement is their disdain for the Press and for intellectual elites.
Actually, to the extent that there's any connection at all, it's the aggressive hostility towards anyone who isn't a Christian, straight, cis, white, able-bodied male.

Last edited by Mumbles; 8th April 2019 at 09:57 AM.
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Old 8th April 2019, 10:03 AM   #155
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Of course there is nothing wrong with listening to the ideas of nazis, and all trump supporters know this, see Trumps getting talking points from @whitegenocide(tm). Nothing wrong with that and I am sure your Trump supporting friend would agree.
Hi ponderingturtle,

I am sorry, but I just don’t know what you are talking about here. What is “@whitegenocide(tm)”? I think this is part of the problem from both sides. Both sides seem to assume that everyone knows the details of particular events that they are talking about, and make statements that seem shrill and nonsensical.

I find it difficult to understand most of your points. I am not sure if “@whitegenocide(tm)” is a sarcastic thing that you invented, or if this is a serious email address or what it is you are referring to.

My friend that I referenced is an immigrant from China. He understands even less of these kinds of talking points. To him it is dangerous “baizuo” nonsense.

This lack of communication seems to be in a self-reinforcing feedback loop inside each of the right and left’s own social media spheres. Each side is sure the other side is dangerous and growing violent. The thing that scares me is it does seem like there is growing intolerance and violence.
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Old 8th April 2019, 10:19 AM   #156
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
I don't know if it's willful ignorance or not but some folks who continue to spout off about what Trump said or didn't say may want to lay down their party handbook and put on their skeptic's hat just long enough to verify a few facts before placing foot in mouth. The facts are in and Trump NEVER said neo-nazis were fine people.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...of_139815.html

IT NEVER HAPPENED. REPEAT. IT NEVER HAPPENED.......
Let's discuss why this doesn't matter in the slightest.

How many times has Dolt 45 referred to asylum seekers as rapists, built like UFC fighters, driving super-vehicles with women tied up with tape over their mouths, and so forth? It's plain that he is referring to everyone, women and children including as...how should we say...superpredators. He regularly conflates parents with kidnappers, children with fighters, and so forth. In other words, it's obvious that he has a deeply bigoted view of Hispanic people in general, and Hispanic immigrants in particular, so claiming "he was only talking about MS-13" is meaningless.
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Old 8th April 2019, 10:21 AM   #157
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
I know Trump is a racist with a long history of racism, this was a big selling point and what got him many early votes. I mean seriously what policies did he ever articulate other than racism? Well releasing his tax returns if elected.
Hey ponderingturtle,

The thing is many people do hear something else in Trump’s rhetoric and policies. To many Trump supporter’s “Make America Great Again” sounds like opening steel mills and bringing back good paying manufacturing jobs.
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Old 8th April 2019, 10:23 AM   #158
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Why should they be upset about a popular policy punishing those who haven't committed any crime? They like the policy why should their support for it suddenly be wrong?
I do not understand what this has to do with the post from Joemourge that you had originally quoted. Could you elaborate on this?
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Old 8th April 2019, 10:33 AM   #159
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
[An NPR opinion piece. Not particularly influential. It seems to me if Trump helps Israel, he's considered a white nationalist and if he doesn't help Israel he's anti-Semitic, I see how that works. What in your opinion should Trump do for Israel if anything at all?
I long ago gave up on "should" as far as Mango Mussolini goes, aside from immediately resigning from office. As for NPR, if you don't accept reporting as reporting, I can't help you. This is why I simply do not discuss anything about him doing anything internationally, except that I expect him to pick the worst possible choice.

Quote:
Christians don't spread hate, they're about love and forgiveness. I don't think you'll find many hoping for the destruction of Jews or Israel. WWJD?
In the opinion of many evangelicals, Jesus will...destroy Israel during the Second Coming.

Quote:
I think everyone on the Supreme Court is well aware of the concept of racism. Speaking of SC Justices, Ruth Bader Ginsburg isn't getting any younger.
Justice Roberts' opinion clearly showed that he had no clue how racism operates - and this was proven when, immediately after his gutting of the VRA, states covered by preclearance rushed to disenfranchise black voters. For those who did understand, this was predictable - and we know this, because the minority opinion on the Supreme Court predicted it.

Quote:
From your article:

"The girl’s rape case was among more than 400 sex-crime cases that were inadequately investigated or not looked into at all by Maricopa County sheriff Joe Arpaio’s office during a three-year period ending in 2007.

Sheriff’s spokeswoman Lisa Allen says Arpaio’s office agrees with the decision to resolve the lawsuit.

The botched investigations served as an embarrassment for Arpaio, who promotes himself as “America’s toughest sheriff”.
Exactly. Very concerned with harassing Hispanic people - and making people live in tents in the desert, making sure that they wear pink underwear, etc.

Child rape? Ehhh...that fell through the cracks.

Quote:
I'm for equal treatment for all. I think we're on the same page there. If my kid or your kid is sharper and scores higher than a billionaire's kid, I expect him/her to be accepted before the rich kid regardless of skin color. (Big stink about this kind of thing going on now of course, I'm watching it unfold too) I only hope the parents and the bribe takers in those cases are all placed in jail for a time to ponder their mistakes.
See, I expect them to take the wealthier kid, or the kid who has "legacy", and I see no major campaign to change any of that. Even the recent controversy strikes me as parents giving the wrong kind of bribe to schools - ie. they bribed individual coaches, admissions officers, and the like, rather than creating a scholarship fund or some such.
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Old 8th April 2019, 10:49 AM   #160
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Originally Posted by Tormac View Post
Hi ponderingturtle,

I am sorry, but I just don’t know what you are talking about here. What is “@whitegenocide(tm)”? I think this is part of the problem from both sides. Both sides seem to assume that everyone knows the details of particular events that they are talking about, and make statements that seem shrill and nonsensical.

I find it difficult to understand most of your points. I am not sure if “@whitegenocide(tm)” is a sarcastic thing that you invented, or if this is a serious email address or what it is you are referring to.
The source on Twitter that Trump got his claim that 80% of white murder victims are killed by blacks. Also a major white supremacist/nazi follower.

https://www.factcheck.org/2015/11/tr...crime-graphic/
"Trump: Hey, Bill, Bill, am I gonna check every statistic? I get millions and millions of people, @RealDonaldTrump, by the way.

O’Reilly: You gotta, you’re a presidential contender, you gotta check ‘em.

Trump: I have millions of people … You know what? Fine. But this came out of radio shows and everything else.

O’Reilly: Oh, come on, radio shows?!

Trump: All it was is a retweet. And it wasn’t from me. It came out of a radio show, and other places.

O’Reilly: Look, you know I’m looking out for you, right? … Don’t do this. Don’t put your name on stuff like this, because it makes the other side, it gives them stuff to tell the ill-informed voter that you’re a racist. I mean, you just handed them a platter.

Trump: Well, this was a retweet. Bill, I’m sure you’re looking out for me, everybody is. This was a retweet. And it comes from sources that are very credible, what can I tell you."

Quote:
This lack of communication seems to be in a self-reinforcing feedback loop inside each of the right and left’s own social media spheres. Each side is sure the other side is dangerous and growing violent. The thing that scares me is it does seem like there is growing intolerance and violence.
I get it pointing out how often Trump cites nazi sources as his sources for information are just off-putting and will be ignored by your friend and truly doesn't matter.
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