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View Poll Results: American Civil War II: Is It Coming
American Civil War II is coming soon, perhaps even soon after this election. 12 20.69%
American Civil War II is coming sometime in the next few years. 9 15.52%
American Civil War II is coming in the foreseeable future, but not for at least a decade or so.. 4 6.90%
American Civil War II is not coming anytime in the foreseeable future. 21 36.21%
American Civil War II is never going to happen. 7 12.07%
American Civil War II is coming soon to Netflix, starring Dwayne Johnson! 9 15.52%
Planet X Civil War XXXVII is coming soon! 6 10.34%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 58. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 6th September 2020, 11:40 PM   #121
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
In one scenario, John Podesta — the former chair of Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign.....

https://www.pacificpundit.com/2020/0...g-to-ny-times/
You are copying propaganda from the extremist right wing blogger and conspiracy theorist "The Pacific Pundit"

Media Fact Check
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/pacific-pundit/
"Extreme Right, Propaganda, Conspiracy, Lack of Transparency, Poor Sourcing, Failed Fact Checks"

This page offers direct examples of the Pacific Pundit webpage forging evidence and quotes
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Old 7th September 2020, 12:15 AM   #122
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For the US, I alternate between hope and despair, depending on the tone of the news of the day.

At the moment I'm leaning toward a fear of awful ruction. Not necessarily on a national scale. My pessimism is aroused by the widespread societal devolution into a broad acceptance of bat-**** crazy CTs. The mythical, stoic, self-reliant 'Marlboro man' is far more often a provincially-minded, corn-fed lardass cradling his AR-15, venting his fear-induced hate and rage against an illusion fed by an all-encompassing propaganda willingly swallowed.

I see this horrible feedback loop, becomingly increasingly amplified like the synchronized, harmonic oscillation that ends in catastrophic failure of a structure. On the one end, a sociopath desperate to remain out of prison. On the other end, a cult of unthinking zombies in thrall to their 'god.' And between, a cynical propaganda machine propping the one and goading the rest.

A downhill track that a crucial number must perceive and leap off of in order that the worst destination be avoided.
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Old 7th September 2020, 05:07 AM   #123
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I'm expecting lots of Portlands, with convoys of the Gravy SEALS driving through cities, turning Trump's predictions into self-fulfilling prophesy. There will probably be some anti immigrant violence like the Walmart shooting in El Paso by lone wolf actors. Sadly, the counter protestors won't have the good sense to stay home.
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Old 7th September 2020, 11:48 AM   #124
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
I'm expecting lots of Portlands, with convoys of the Gravy SEALS driving through cities, turning Trump's predictions into self-fulfilling prophesy. There will probably be some anti immigrant violence like the Walmart shooting in El Paso by lone wolf actors. Sadly, the counter protestors won't have the good sense to stay home.
I think it's going to get worse, too.

I live in Portland (actually Portland address, but not downtown), and I think the violent protesters are doing far more damage to their message than good and need to just stop this nonsense. They're defeating their own purpose at this point.
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Old 7th September 2020, 02:47 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I think it's going to get worse, too.

I live in Portland (actually Portland address, but not downtown), and I think the violent protesters are doing far more damage to their message than good and need to just stop this nonsense. They're defeating their own purpose at this point.
Which is?

You may think violence detracts from what you are protesting about, and you would be right. But the real message is how angry they are about it. When peaceful protest doesn't get the message through, violent protest is the logical next step. And when that fails... welcome to Civil War II!
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Old 7th September 2020, 05:33 PM   #126
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Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets View Post
Which is?

You may think violence detracts from what you are protesting about, and you would be right. But the real message is how angry they are about it. When peaceful protest doesn't get the message through, violent protest is the logical next step. And when that fails... welcome to Civil War II!
Their purpose is to bring attention to the systemic racism in policing. But the violence in some place, specifically Portland, is having an overall negative effect. Support for the BLM is falling and it is largely due to the violence.
Quote:
Yet, despite data indicating that demonstrations associated with the BLM movement are overwhelmingly peaceful, one recent poll suggested that 42% of respondents believe “most protesters [associated with the BLM movement] are trying to incite violence or destroy property” (FiveThirtyEight, 5 June 2020). This is in line with the Civiqs tracking poll which finds that “net approval for the Black Lives Matter movement peaked back on June 3 [the week following the killing of George Floyd when riots first began to be reported] and has fallen sharply since” (USA Today, 31 August 2020; Civiqs, 29 August 2020).

Research from the University of Washington indicates that this disparity stems from political orientation and biased media framing (Washington Post, 24 August 2020), such as disproportionate coverage of violent demonstrations (Business Insider, 11 June 2020; Poynter, 25 June 2020). Groups like the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) have documented organized disinformation campaigns aimed at spreading a “deliberate mischaracterization of groups or movements [involved in the protests], such as portraying activists who support Black Lives Matter as violent extremists or claiming that antifa is a terrorist organization coordinated or manipulated by nebulous external forces” (ADL, 2020). These disinformation campaigns may be contributing to the decline in public support for the BLM movement after the initial increase following Floyd’s killing, especially amongst the white population (USA Today, 31 August 2020; Civiqs, 30 August 2020a, 30 August 2020b). This waning support also comes as the Trump administration recently shifted its “law and order” messaging to target local Democratic Party politicians from urban areas, particularly on the campaign trail (NPR, 27 August 2020).
https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/dem...r-summer-2020/

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Old 7th September 2020, 05:46 PM   #127
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0x76cmGMfCQ

Maybe not music for all, but something to think about. And I think all sides would hear their anger in this.
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Old 8th September 2020, 02:50 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Their purpose is to bring attention to the systemic racism in policing. But the violence in some place, specifically Portland, is having an overall negative effect. Support for the BLM is falling and it is largely due to the violence.
That's what you say, but is it true?

I think the violent protesters are sick of having to passively put up with police brutality etc., and need something to lash out at. Obviously they can't do that to the object of their ire, so they attack what they can.

And the public is aghast. Not understanding the real motivation and spurious association to BLM, they feel embarrassed about their support for it. And of course latent racist thoughts get stirred up as well. As your link pointed out:-

Quote:
“deliberate mischaracterization of groups or movements [involved in the protests], such as portraying activists who support Black Lives Matter as violent extremists or claiming that antifa is a terrorist organization coordinated or manipulated by nebulous external forces” (ADL, 2020). These disinformation campaigns may be contributing to the decline in public support for the BLM movement after the initial increase following Floyd’s killing, especially amongst the white population
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Old 11th September 2020, 12:38 AM   #129
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When considering the idea of a post election civil war, people need to open their minds to the whole parade of horribles for what is doctrinally known as "Conflict short of war". There are a slew of options in between a peaceful transition of power and civil war. All of them involve, to go a bit Shakespearean, bloody constraint, heads bashed into walls by their venerable beards, and mad mothers with their howls confused that do break the clouds.

From what I said in previous posts, I expect our cities to burn in meaningless conflicts, the outcome of which will do nothing to change the outcome of the Electoral College vote in December.
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Old 13th September 2020, 07:55 PM   #130
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Nope BOTH sides are guilty, and thus suck. Orange Man Bad doesnt exist in a vaccuum
The are all manner of orbital launches these days.
Wouldn't it be interesting if he tried?
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Old 13th September 2020, 08:32 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by fishbob View Post
The are all manner of orbital launches these days.
Wouldn't it be interesting if he tried?
Yes, like Clin Ton and Dole!

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tl;dr

https://youtu.be/sGvTzIOSFyc?t=275
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Old 13th September 2020, 09:22 PM   #132
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Two items of interest. One suggests things are becoming ripe for civil conflict. The other suggests that America's current demographics disfavor such strife on the scale of a civil war:

1) Movements thrive on martyrs, they provide a focus for anger and grief, and nurse the idea that things have moved beyond the point of no return. Salon describes the issue here, suggesting that both sides now have such martyrs to focus on:

American bloodlands: In a deeply polarized nation, mass violence is not far away

Quote:
The spark that usually sets such tinder ablaze is martyrdom. Aaron "Jay" Danielson, a supporter of the right-wing group Patriot Prayer, was wearing a loaded Glock pistol in a holster and had bear spray and an expandable metal baton when he was shot dead on Aug. 29, allegedly by Michael Forest Reinoehl, a supporter of antifa, in the streets of Portland, Oregon. A woman in the crowd can be heard shouting after the shooting: "I am not sad that a ******* fascist died tonight." On Thursday, Reinoehl, allegedly armed with a handgun, was shot and killed by federal agents in Washington state.

Once people start being sacrificed for the cause, it takes little for demagogues of the radical left and the radical right to insist that self-preservation necessitates violence and is a prerequisite for victory.

2) The counter to that idea is that the population of America may just be too old to have itself a civil war. Old men may decide to send the young off to fight far away, but a civil war requires conflict and sacrifice and practical support from a much wider proportion of the population compared to say, deciding to send some hundreds of thousands of young men off to Vietnam. Too many Americans are too old to be willing to fight themselves, and there are not enough young people full of fire to really kick things off.

Population Age Structure and Its Relation to Civil Conflict: A Graphic Metric

Quote:
• Of countries without recent civil conflict, 24 percent of all states with more than 60 percent of their population under 30 years of age (i.e., a young age structure) experienced at least one incident of civil conflict during
the following decade. Among countries with less than 60 percent under 30 years of age, just 7 percent experienced civil conflict.

Conclusion: One-fourth of all non-conflict countries with young age structures will likely experience a new civil conflict during the next decade.


• About 86 percent of all countries that experienced a new outbreak of civil conflict had age structures with 60 percent or more of the population younger than 30 years of age. Although country age structures in many
regions matured between 1970 and 1999, this “outbreak benchmark” remained virtually constant.

Conclusion: This “60-percent-under30” benchmark could serve as a means to identify and track a state’s demographic risks of civil conflict (see figures below).
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Old 14th September 2020, 12:31 AM   #133
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Quote:
Yet, despite data indicating that demonstrations associated with the BLM movement are overwhelmingly peaceful, one recent poll suggested that 42% of respondents believe “most protesters [associated with the BLM movement] are trying to incite violence or destroy property”
And 43% of respondents nationwide approve of Trump. Coincidence? I think not.

The (lack of) violence isn't changing people's minds. The Deplorables hate civil rights and brown people, so of course they say that BLM is inciting violence. They would say that anyway. Because they are deplorable.
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Old 14th September 2020, 01:25 AM   #134
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Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets View Post
And 43% of respondents nationwide approve of Trump. Coincidence? I think not.

The (lack of) violence isn't changing people's minds. The Deplorables hate civil rights and brown people, so of course they say that BLM is inciting violence. They would say that anyway. Because they are deplorable.
I wouldn't be surprised one bit if there isn't a connection. After all, they seem to swallow whatever other nonsense Dear Leader spews forth from his mouth.
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Old 16th September 2020, 11:27 AM   #135
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If Civil War is coming, at least the participants will be well-armed.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN26622A
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Old 16th September 2020, 12:16 PM   #136
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
If Civil War is coming, at least the participants will be well-armed.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN26622A
The thing about US sales of guns is that the numbers are very misleading: the people who rush to buy guns usually already have guns in their home.
Unless I see some data to the contrary, I think that the number of people owning guns isn't rising significantly.
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Old 16th September 2020, 12:26 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The thing about US sales of guns is that the numbers are very misleading: the people who rush to buy guns usually already have guns in their home.
Unless I see some data to the contrary, I think that the number of people owning guns isn't rising significantly.
The number of guns sales may be steady or going up but the number of gun owners has gone down. It varies regionally, but over all, only about a third of households have guns in them. It's more guns in the hands of fewer people.
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Old 16th September 2020, 12:52 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
The number of guns sales may be steady or going up but the number of gun owners has gone down. It varies regionally, but over all, only about a third of households have guns in them. It's more guns in the hands of fewer people.
And, let's be honest, most of those gun-owning people are fat, old, and riddled with diabetes and COPD and heart conditions. They may imagine themselves as mighty warriors but if it came down to actual combat they'll be wiped out by a set of stairs or a gentle slope. The recoil of their own guns will do more damage to themselves than they could realistically hope to deal out to others.
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Old 16th September 2020, 01:52 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
They may imagine themselves as mighty warriors but if it came down to actual combat they'll be wiped out by a set of stairs or a gentle slope.
*Makes note*

Ensure defence positions are on hills too steep for motorised mobility machines.
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Old 16th September 2020, 03:53 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
And, let's be honest, most of those gun-owning people are fat, old, and riddled with diabetes and COPD and heart conditions. They may imagine themselves as mighty warriors but if it came down to actual combat they'll be wiped out by a set of stairs or a gentle slope. The recoil of their own guns will do more damage to themselves than they could realistically hope to deal out to others.
There's a reason I like to call the right-wing militias the Gravy SEALS.
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Old 16th September 2020, 04:05 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
*Makes note*

Ensure defence positions are on hills too steep for motorised mobility machines.
This is where I don't take most of the militias all that seriously. Having a firearm is not the same as having combat power. Combat power is the ability to apply lethal force at a decisive place in the battle space. Applying force at decisive point requires having a force over which someone exercises a great deal of command and control so they can direct that force to the decisive place in the battle space.

Mostly what I see in the Gravy SEALS are people who treat a firearm as if it were a fetish item to ward away evil. The weapon itself requires a great deal of training and discipline to master. The ability to shoot, move and communicate as part of a unit with a common mission, requires even more training and discipline to master.

So far, what I see is an armed mob. What I saw in Portland two weekends ago showed a level of organization to spread the violence that I didn't expect. However, that was an effort to sow chaos. I didn't see anything that makes me think these militias can achieve and hold military objectives. So I don't expect civil war but I do expect a great deal of chaos.
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Old 16th September 2020, 04:09 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
There's a reason I like to call the right-wing militias the Gravy SEALS.
I prefer Meal Team Six.

Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Mostly what I see in the Gravy SEALS are people who treat a firearm as if it were a fetish item to ward away evil. The weapon itself requires a great deal of training and discipline to master. The ability to shoot, move and communicate as part of a unit with a common mission, requires even more training and discipline to master.
Ironically the justification behind founding the NRA, when the Union discovered that their city boy conscripts couldn't shoot for crap.

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Old 16th September 2020, 04:47 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
The thing about US sales of guns is that the numbers are very misleading: the people who rush to buy guns usually already have guns in their home.
Unless I see some data to the contrary, I think that the number of people owning guns isn't rising significantly.
I think that's true. I don't own a gun and I'm certainly not going to go out and buy one. Nor is anyone I know. I think it's the gun nuts and their paranoia running rampant who are fueling this.
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Old 16th September 2020, 05:42 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Mostly what I see in the Gravy SEALS are people who treat a firearm as if it were a fetish item to ward away evil.
Cowards' guns.

Trouble is, with the kind of firepower available to people in USA, you can do an immense amount of damage with very little skill.
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Old 16th September 2020, 05:58 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by Beelzebuddy View Post
I prefer Meal Team Six.
Also acceptable as is Ya'll Qaida.
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Old 17th September 2020, 05:14 AM   #146
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Well Glenn Beck is now saying a civil war is coming, so it isn't, and this thread can be closed.
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Old 18th September 2020, 05:54 PM   #147
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RBG dying makes the Boogaloo somewhat more likely.
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Old 18th September 2020, 05:57 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Also acceptable as is Ya'll Qaida.
As a side note about all these Gravy Seals and wannabe freedom fighters, the new film by the guys and gals who made Four Lions is phenomenally good. It's called The Day Shall Come, and it also explores (and satirizes) the FBI's entrapment of possible terrorists. If you liked Four Lions, I highly recommend it. Also, we all need a laugh in times like these.
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Old 18th September 2020, 09:31 PM   #149
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
RBG dying makes the Boogaloo somewhat more likely.
Yeah, I trimmed the odds a couple of points after seeing she'd died. Maybe 10% more likely than it was yesterday.
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Old 18th September 2020, 10:34 PM   #150
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When the Civil War comes, we non-gun owners will be glad that all the gun nuts paid for and maintained such nice arsenals for us to come and get.
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