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Old 12th August 2020, 08:04 AM   #1
Puppycow
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Trump calls out "Cancel Culture"

While I'm not here to defend "cancel culture" per se, now that Trump has officially taken a stand against it, I think it's worth questioning his own use of this very same tactic.

Quote:
"One of their political weapons is 'cancel culture' -- driving people from their jobs, shaming dissenters and demanding total submission from anyone who disagrees. This is the very definition of totalitarianism, and it is completely alien to our culture and our values, and it has absolutely no place in the United States of America," Trump said in a July 3 speech at Mount Rushmore.
The article presents a whole laundry list of "dissenters" who Trump tried to get fired and shamed.

Such as:
Quote:
September 2017: Trump tweets that NFL players and other athletes who don't stand for the National Anthem should be told, "YOU'RE FIRED." He says in another tweet, "Fire or suspend!" And at a rally, he says, "Wouldn't you love to see one of these NFL owners when somebody disrespects our flag to say, 'Get that son of a bitch off the field right now, out, he's fired, he's fired.' "
Isn't that the very definition of what he is now decrying?
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:06 AM   #2
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How about litigation culture, Donnie?

How about threatening violence on protesters, threatening to sue or legislate against news media, etc.?
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:11 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
While I'm not here to defend "cancel culture" per se, now that Trump has officially taken a stand against it, I think it's worth questioning his own use of this very same tactic.



The article presents a whole laundry list of "dissenters" who Trump tried to get fired and shamed.

Such as:


Isn't that the very definition of what he is now decrying?
That doesn't count.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:19 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Isn't that the very definition of what he is now decrying?
Yes.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:22 AM   #5
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"Person who is factually/morally/logically/ethically wrong decrees 'Being held to standards that show that I am wrong.'"

There I just summed up a whole lot of whining.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:23 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
That doesn't count.
Probably in his own mind it doesn't. Because he's a narcissist. Objectively, however, it's the same thing.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:26 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
While I'm not here to defend "cancel culture" per se, now that Trump has officially taken a stand against it, I think it's worth questioning his own use of this very same tactic.

The article presents a whole laundry list of "dissenters" who Trump tried to get fired and shamed.

Such as:
Quote:
September 2017: Trump tweets that NFL players and other athletes who don't stand for the National Anthem should be told, "YOU'RE FIRED." He says in another tweet, "Fire or suspend!" And at a rally, he says, "Wouldn't you love to see one of these NFL owners when somebody disrespects our flag to say, 'Get that son of a bitch off the field right now, out, he's fired, he's fired
.' "

Isn't that the very definition of what he is now decrying?
EXACTLY!!!

Talk to Kaepernick about your aversion to cancel culture why don't you Donald?
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:31 AM   #8
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Stating that Republican is hypocrite is like stating water is wet.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:40 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
Stating that Republican is hypocrite is like stating water is wet.
Along the line of Republican hypocrisy. They called for a boycott against Nike, but then got mad when liberals called for one against GOYA.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:48 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Probably in his own mind it doesn't. Because he's a narcissist. Objectively, however, it's the same thing.
Nonsense that kind of thing never bothers people who are all upset about cancel culture. See it is not actually a behavior but a political activity they object to such as having a racist meltdown having some effect on your life or brandishing firearms at protesters being treated as a crime.
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Old 12th August 2020, 08:58 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
Stating that Republican is hypocrite is like stating water is wet.
Yeah, but someone has to say it. When the Emperor has no clothes, I feel like someone should mention it.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:00 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
While I'm not here to defend "cancel culture" per se, now that Trump has officially taken a stand against it, I think it's worth questioning his own use of this very same tactic.



The article presents a whole laundry list of "dissenters" who Trump tried to get fired and shamed.

Such as:


Isn't that the very definition of what he is now decrying?
So now if you're anti Trump you're pro Cancel Culture. Both sides continue to suck.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:01 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
How about litigation culture, Donnie?

How about threatening violence on protesters, threatening to sue or legislate against news media, etc.?
So you want to cancel those news media folk instead?
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:02 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
Stating that Republican is hypocrite is like stating water is wet.
You mean any politician.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:02 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
So you want to cancel those news media folk instead?
That was Trump, not me.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:03 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Along the line of Republican hypocrisy. They called for a boycott against Nike, but then got mad when liberals called for one against GOYA.
At least you admit the term is Liberal.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:03 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
So now if you're anti Trump you're pro Cancel Culture. Both sides continue to suck.
No, you can be against Cancel Culture and against Trump. In fact, given how Trump himself uses it, it's a perfectly consistent position.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:16 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Along the line of Republican hypocrisy. They called for a boycott against Nike, but then got mad when liberals called for one against GOYA.
According to Altemeyer in "The Authoritarians", a great read if you haven't read it, "On the other hand, in context to authoritarian personality, authoritarians harbor many double standards and hypocrisies, without realizing it." To the authoritarian, an action is not necessarily right or wrong in itself, but the right or wrongness of it is also determined by who performs the action. So, yes, it really is only a crime if Democrats do it.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:16 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
At least you admit the term is Liberal.
So? The point is the GOP will employ the same kind of warfare and whine when it is employed against them. Which is what Trump's complaint about the "cancel culture" is. A whine. Bwaaaaa. Baby Trump having a hissy fit.

Trump has no moral ground to complain. Even you have to admit this.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:21 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Masque View Post
According to Altemeyer in "The Authoritarians", a great read if you haven't read it, "On the other hand, in context to authoritarian personality, authoritarians harbor many double standards and hypocrisies, without realizing it." To the authoritarian, an action is not necessarily right or wrong in itself, but the right or wrongness of it is also determined by who performs the action. So, yes, it really is only a crime if Democrats do it.
I haven't read it. But of course all that is true. I remember the woman on a bicycle that gave the finger to Trump's passing motorcade being fired from her job. That's ok to them.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:22 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
No, you can be against Cancel Culture and against Trump. In fact, given how Trump himself uses it, it's a perfectly consistent position.
Nope, the way this was present, it's either or. Pick a side, a Trumpkin or Cancel Culture Antifa thug, there is no gray area.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:23 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
So? The point is the GOP will employ the same kind of warfare and whine when it is employed against them. Which is what Trump's complaint about the "cancel culture" is. A whine. Bwaaaaa. Baby Trump having a hissy fit.

Trump has no moral ground to complain. Even you have to admit this.
Yet those in this thread either stand with him or support Cancel Culture, what side works for you?
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:24 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Nope, the way this was present, it's either or. Pick a side, a Trumpkin or Cancel Culture Antifa thug, there is no gray area.
Again, Trump has used cancel culture himself. Your dichotomy is false.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:25 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Again, Trump has used cancel culture himself. Your dichotomy is false.
Oh no, there is no middle ground, if Orange Man Bad then those in this thread approve cancel culture. One cultural evil doesnt justify another. Surely this is obvious to you.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:27 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Oh no, there is no middle ground, if Orange Man Bad then those in this thread approve cancel culture. One cultural evil doesnt justify another. Surely this is obvious to you.
You can't gaslight anyone in this thread, rocky. We're all aware that Trump has used the exact same "culture", Trump is therefore FOR cancel culture when it suits him and AGAIN it when it's not, and it's also therefore possible to be in favour or both or against both.

You can deny that all you want but no one but you will buy it.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:31 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
You can't gaslight anyone in this thread, rocky. We're all aware that Trump has used the exact same "culture", Trump is therefore FOR cancel culture when it suits him and AGAIN it when it's not, and it's also therefore possible to be in favour or both or against both.

You can deny that all you want but no one but you will buy it.
I'm not the gas light here, those in this thread present an all or nothing and then try to walk it back, it will not work for you. The cancel culture is repugnant.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:33 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
I'm not the gas light here, those in this thread present an all or nothing and then try to walk it back, it will not work for you. The cancel culture is repugnant.
You're all over the place. What do I care about what other posters think? The FACT is that Trump is inconsistent about cancul culture and has tried to use it himself. Therefore he is at least sometimes in favour of it, and it is therefore possible to be for Trump and for cancel culture. Moreover several left-leaning posters, including myself if we're using an American standard, have spoken out against both Trump and cancel culture.

You are WRONG. As usual.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:34 AM   #28
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It's the right that is having the tizzy about "cancel culture." Those on the left 1) note that half of the time, they can't even talk about what it even means in the first place, and 2) I don't care what you call it, but I absolutely agree that getting a person fired from their job because they are opposed to racist cops killing black people is wrong, whereas I don't have a problem with an employer that fires a person who is vocally racist.

It's not "cancel culture" that I agree with or am opposed to, it is the difference between people getting fired for doing good things and people fired for doing bad things.

And don't bother with the slippery slope nonsense. Colin Kaepernick is not a slippery slope. He was blackballed because he protested police abuse of black people. If you approve of that, there is no middle ground we can have that is debatable.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:35 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
Colin Kaepernick is not a slippery slope. He was blackballed (sni)
TMI.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:42 AM   #30
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They're hoping to use it as a wedge-issue. Same goes for certain transgender issues (children transitioning, biological males participating in female sports). They're hoping to peel off voters in swing-states. It could work.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:45 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Cain View Post
They're hoping to use it as a wedge-issue. Same goes for certain transgender issues (children transitioning, biological males participating in female sports). They're hoping to peel off voters in swing-states. It could work.
Well, having lost the issue of political correctness, they have to move onto something new.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:48 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
Well, having lost the issue of political correctness, they have to move onto something new.
Maybe they should just come out and say it:

"TRUMP 2020.
----------------
We just want to be unpleasant pricks."
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:50 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Maybe they should just come out and say it:

"TRUMP 2020.
----------------
We just want to be unpleasant pricks."
TRUMP 2020
__________
Embrace the deplorables!
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:51 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
You're all over the place. What do I care about what other posters think? The FACT is that Trump is inconsistent about cancul culture and has tried to use it himself. Therefore he is at least sometimes in favour of it, and it is therefore possible to be for Trump and for cancel culture. Moreover several left-leaning posters, including myself if we're using an American standard, have spoken out against both Trump and cancel culture.

You are WRONG. As usual.
This guys' take on it may help muddy the waters.

https://taibbi.substack.com/p/the-left-is-now-the-right

A bit:
Conservatives once tried to legislate what went on in your bedroom; now it’s the left that obsesses over sexual codicils, not just for the bedroom but everywhere. Right-wingers from time to time made headlines campaigning against everything from The Last Temptation of Christ to “**** the Police,” though we laughed at the idea that Ice Cube made cops literally unsafe, and it was understood an artist had to do something fairly ambitious, like piss on a crucifix in public, to get conservative protesters off their couches.

Today Matt Yglesias signing a group letter with Noam Chomsky is considered threatening. Moreover a lot less than booking a Robert Mapplethorpe exhibit can get you in the soup – a headline, a retweet, even likes are costing people jobs. Imagine how many movies Milos Forman would have had to make if Jerry Falwell had been able to get people fired this easily.

This is separate from the Democratic Party “moving right,” or in the case of issues like war, financial deregulation, and surveillance, having always been in lockstep with the right. This is about a change in the personality profile of the party’s most animated, engaged followers.

Many who marched against Dick Cheney’s spy state in the early 2000s lost interest once Donald Trump became a target, then became full converts to the possibilities of centralized speech control after Russiagate, Charlottesville, and the de-platforming of Alex Jones, with even the ACLU wobbling. (Some of the only left media figures to be consistent on this issue work at the World Socialist Web Site, which has gone after woke icons like Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez over Internet censorship). Support for the “radical transparency” concept that made Wikileaks famous receded in favor of a referendum on the political and sexual iniquity of Julian Assange: many activists today are more concerned with who than what and find nuance, contradiction, and double-meaning repulsive. Bad person = bad idea!
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:55 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Maybe they should just come out and say it:

"TRUMP 2020.
----------------
We just want to be unpleasant pricks."
I'm reminded of the old 'you will be eaten first' tract parody about Cthulu.

Only this time it's leopards.
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Old 12th August 2020, 09:57 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
I'm not the gas light here, those in this thread present an all or nothing and then try to walk it back, it will not work for you. The cancel culture is repugnant.
I stated clearly in the OP that I'm not defending cancel culture but pointing out that Trump himself uses it. Therefore you are wrong.
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Old 12th August 2020, 10:00 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
I'm not the gas light here, those in this thread present an all or nothing and then try to walk it back, it will not work for you. The cancel culture is repugnant.
Sure it is. Rocky, we all have seen enough of your posts to find your remarks in this thread to be laughable.
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Old 12th August 2020, 10:04 AM   #38
rockysmith76
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
You're all over the place. What do I care about what other posters think? The FACT is that Trump is inconsistent about cancul culture and has tried to use it himself. Therefore he is at least sometimes in favour of it, and it is therefore possible to be for Trump and for cancel culture. Moreover several left-leaning posters, including myself if we're using an American standard, have spoken out against both Trump and cancel culture.

You are WRONG. As usual.
Nope, I see clearly, this flipping the script thing won't work here. Cancel culture is a repugnance, surely even you can see this.
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Old 12th August 2020, 10:04 AM   #39
Regnad Kcin
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Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Nope, the way this was present, it's either or. Pick a side, a Trumpkin or Cancel Culture Antifa thug, there is no gray area.
LOLlipop.
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Old 12th August 2020, 10:05 AM   #40
rockysmith76
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
It's the right that is having the tizzy about "cancel culture." Those on the left 1) note that half of the time, they can't even talk about what it even means in the first place, and 2) I don't care what you call it, but I absolutely agree that getting a person fired from their job because they are opposed to racist cops killing black people is wrong, whereas I don't have a problem with an employer that fires a person who is vocally racist.

It's not "cancel culture" that I agree with or am opposed to, it is the difference between people getting fired for doing good things and people fired for doing bad things.

And don't bother with the slippery slope nonsense. Colin Kaepernick is not a slippery slope. He was blackballed because he protested police abuse of black people. If you approve of that, there is no middle ground we can have that is debatable.
No thats a dodge, the bad thing here is Cancel Culture, move away from your Orange Man dogma for one instant.
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