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Tags aliens , UFO incidents , ufos

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Old 16th December 2017, 04:17 PM   #1
Steve001
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Advanced Aviation Threat Identification Program UFO'S

Just released report.

Quote:
For five years, from 2007 to 2012, the Pentagon ran a $22 million program that investigated reports of UFOs. The program investigated accounts by military personnel and commercial pilots who witnessed unidentified aircraft that appeared to move or hover without visible signs of propulsion or lift, the reports said.

One of the sightings investigated had been captured on videotape, released in August, showing a white oval object the size of a commercial plane as it was chased by a pair of Navy fighter jets off of San Diego in 2004, the Times said.

https://nypost.com/2017/12/16/pentagons-search-for-ufos-revealed/<br>

Last edited by TubbaBlubba; 21st December 2017 at 10:24 AM.
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Old 16th December 2017, 04:19 PM   #2
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In this day and age?
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Old 16th December 2017, 06:09 PM   #3
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Quote:
“I think it’s one of the good things I did in my congressional service. I’ve done something that no one has done before.”

Most of the $22 million spent on the program went to an aerospace research company run by Reid’s friend and fellow Nevadan, Robert Bigelow, the Times said. Bigelow, a devout believer that aliens have visited Earth, is currently working with NASA on producing space modules for human use.
Uh huh, you did a good thing for some lunatic friend of yours anyways.
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Old 16th December 2017, 11:11 PM   #4
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New York Times piece with interview and video from the Dept of Defense.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/u...navy.html?_r=0

Incredible story and the video from the F18 is fascinating.
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Old 17th December 2017, 01:15 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by marting View Post
New York Times piece with interview and video from the Dept of Defense.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/u...navy.html?_r=0

Incredible story and the video from the F18 is fascinating.
To quote Arthur C Clarke: "I'm no longer interested in looking at photos of UFOs. There are just too many of them, and they're too easily faked."
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Old 17th December 2017, 04:09 AM   #6
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I almost think this would be better in the General Skepticism forum.

Anything new here, other than the government wasting more money chasing shadows?
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Old 17th December 2017, 07:21 AM   #7
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Carl Sagan often said that if there were any believable evidence of “alien visitors”, the military would be clamoring for funds to address this potential threat, starting with Roswell.

Yet, all we (and the Soviets) did was to spend bucketloads on preparing to blow each other up.
Maybe the aliens would get caught in the “nuclear winter”....
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Old 17th December 2017, 07:56 AM   #8
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US UFO Secrets Revealed

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-42379749

That video footage is quite impressive, I have to admit.
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Old 17th December 2017, 08:26 AM   #9
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There's another thread on this. I'll report this post and request a merge.

Meanwhile, what I noticed from the clip I just saw on TV is that the "object" remains in the exact same spot on the HUD screen while the plane is manueuvering. Looks like an artifact, to me.
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Old 17th December 2017, 09:49 AM   #10
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As some other poster here pointed out: anyone with a decent telescope anytime in the last 500 million years would have figured out there was life here.

I wouldn't be surprised if some alien civ became interested in this system enough to send some probes to keep an eye on things. The tech's not even that hard. Another 100 years and we'll be doing it.
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Old 17th December 2017, 02:14 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Bikewer View Post
Carl Sagan often said that if there were any believable evidence of “alien visitors”, the military would be clamoring for funds to address this potential threat, starting with Roswell.

Yet, all we (and the Soviets) did was to spend bucketloads on preparing to blow each other up.
Maybe the aliens would get caught in the “nuclear winter”....
Why assume it's aliens?
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Old 17th December 2017, 02:17 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
There's another thread on this. I'll report this post and request a merge.

Meanwhile, what I noticed from the clip I just saw on TV is that the "object" remains in the exact same spot on the HUD screen while the plane is manueuvering. Looks like an artifact, to me.
If the jets radar is locked on the object wouldn't the object say centered?
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Old 18th December 2017, 01:28 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
If the jets radar is locked on the object wouldn't the object say centered?
Not usually, there would nornally be a certain amount of "hunting" depending on the severity of any evasive action taken by the target. If the radar locked target changes direction, the tracking radar responds but its not able to anticipate what the target is going to do, so there will be some "trailing" of the target by the TD Box


That dark mark does no look or act like a radar locked target. It looks like a video artifact on the HUD itself.
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Last edited by smartcooky; 18th December 2017 at 01:30 AM.
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Old 18th December 2017, 06:34 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Not usually, there would nornally be a certain amount of "hunting" depending on the severity of any evasive action taken by the target. If the radar locked target changes direction, the tracking radar responds but its not able to anticipate what the target is going to do, so there will be some "trailing" of the target by the TD Box


That dark mark does no look or act like a radar locked target. It looks like a video artifact on the HUD itself.
I'm not sure you are correct. There is tracking radar. Looking at this video I believe is IR nightvision not radar possibly using this type of helmet. It appears the video in question is video of the pilot tracking the object visually.
https://youtu.be/Dj4cP4PMPPM

Last edited by Steve001; 18th December 2017 at 06:36 AM.
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Old 18th December 2017, 06:45 AM   #15
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IMHO it's video from FLIR using optical lock. Just my 2 cents based on playing a game 10 years ago.
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Old 18th December 2017, 05:43 PM   #16
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While looking at flir video I saw this video. The object looks very similar to the Pentagon video.
The object is in the country of Chile.
https://youtu.be/cCq2VPmtCwg

Last edited by Steve001; 18th December 2017 at 05:44 PM.
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Old 19th December 2017, 06:18 AM   #17
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Wow, UFO's with no sonic boom, and look like a reflection. And the reflection has no Radar return.

22 million to investigate UFOs, why so little? Is that all the money Harry could get for his UFO nut buddy.
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Old 19th December 2017, 07:59 AM   #18
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Apparently, that case was solved. The object was an airliner:
Explained: Chilean Navy "UFO" video ... Flight IB6830
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Old 19th December 2017, 12:04 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
Apparently, that case was solved. The object was an airliner:
Explained: Chilean Navy "UFO" video ... Flight IB6830
Your link doesn't work... it isn't even a link
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Old 19th December 2017, 12:22 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
I'm not sure you are correct. There is tracking radar. Looking at this video I believe is IR nightvision not radar possibly using this type of helmet. It appears the video in question is video of the pilot tracking the object visually.
https://youtu.be/Dj4cP4PMPPM
The suggestion was it was a radar locked target. This does not look like any kind of a radar locked target in my experience (which is two years working in the maintenance and testing of a number of fighter aircraft Avionics systems including the AN-APG66 radar - same system as that installed in the F16 at that time - and the Ferranti 4510 HUD on which its information is displayed.)

Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
IMHO it's video from FLIR using optical lock. Just my 2 cents based on playing a game 10 years ago.
Even if it is a FLIR display, the target object would still not stay fixed in exactly the same place on the HUD. It will move with subtle changes in attitude of the aircraft and the TD Box would track it.
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Old 19th December 2017, 01:36 PM   #21
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Quote:
Even if it is a FLIR display, the target object would still not stay fixed in exactly the same place on the HUD. It will move with subtle changes in attitude of the aircraft and the TD Box would track it.
Speaking as someone who has ~no~ experience with this kind of equipment, I had the same thoughts. Other videos I could find of similar systems tracking things like rockets show the tracked object staying centered, but not nearly as steady and non-shaky. Is that what you mean?

There are things about this story that are interesting, but it sounds like there could be a series of odd but down-to-earth events that could explain it, as is so often the case.

It's been fun reading about it, though.
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Old 19th December 2017, 01:37 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Bluegill View Post

There are things about this story that are interesting, but it sounds like there could be a series of odd but down-to-earth events that could explain it, as is so often always the case.

.
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Old 19th December 2017, 01:38 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Your link doesn't work... it isn't even a link
This will.https://www.metabunk.org/explained-c...-ib6830.t8306/

Last edited by Steve001; 19th December 2017 at 01:40 PM.
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Old 19th December 2017, 01:45 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
The suggestion was it was a radar locked target. This does not look like any kind of a radar locked target in my experience (which is two years working in the maintenance and testing of a number of fighter aircraft Avionics systems including the AN-APG66 radar - same system as that installed in the F16 at that time - and the Ferranti 4510 HUD on which its information is displayed.)



Even if it is a FLIR display, the target object would still not stay fixed in exactly the same place on the HUD. It will move with subtle changes in attitude of the aircraft and the TD Box would track it.
I believe the longer version of this vid does show that. The point isn't what type of imaging system is used but what military pilots are seeing. I don't think this portion is shown in the first linked vid. Start at 5 minutes in.
https://youtu.be/gpBQFuLl2So

Last edited by Steve001; 19th December 2017 at 02:04 PM.
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Old 19th December 2017, 01:46 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
The suggestion was it was a radar locked target. This does not look like any kind of a radar locked target in my experience (which is two years working in the maintenance and testing of a number of fighter aircraft Avionics systems including the AN-APG66 radar - same system as that installed in the F16 at that time - and the Ferranti 4510 HUD on which its information is displayed.)



Even if it is a FLIR display, the target object would still not stay fixed in exactly the same place on the HUD. It will move with subtle changes in attitude of the aircraft and the TD Box would track it.
I'm thinking it's a FLIR display on an HUD, but am no expert. Staying locked in the same place suggests, at least to me, an artifact.
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Old 19th December 2017, 02:11 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
The point isn't what type of imaging system is used but what military pilots are seeing.
https://youtu.be/gpBQFuLl2So
Do we have any solid indication that the pilots in this encounter were seeing the objects with their own eyes, as opposed to reacting to what they were seeing on their screens?
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Old 19th December 2017, 03:09 PM   #27
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I would like to make the following points that are set out on a Popular Mechanics article.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/mili...er-with-a-ufo/


The Navy F18 fighter story is from before the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program. The original story was published in Aviation Week in 2007.

Here is an extract of what the first pilot, in the first group, saw in the water off California.
"(Pilot)FAST EAGLES (110/100) COULD NOT FIND UNID AIRBORNE CONTACT AT LOCATION GIVEN BY PRINCETON. WHILE SEARCHING FOR UNID AIR CONTACT, FAST EAGLES SPOTTED LARGE UNID OBJECT IN WATER AT 1430L. PILOTS SAW STEAM/ SMOKE/CHURNING AROUND OBJECT. PILOT DESCRIBES OBJECT INITIALLY AS RESEMBLING A DOWNED AIRLINER, ALSO STATED THAT IT WAS MUCH LARGER THAN A SUBMARINE."

The Princeton had Radar false readings
"For two weeks, the operator said, the Princeton had been tracking mysterious aircraft. The objects appeared suddenly at 80,000 feet, and then hurtled toward the sea, eventually stopping at 20,000 feet and hovering. Then they either dropped out of radar range or shot straight back up."

.....but the fighters were not able to get a radar lock on the object. The “capsule” was not only more maneuverable than the Hornets but also much faster —for it to have reached the CAP point ahead of the Navy fighters it would have had to have flown in excess of 2,400 miles an hour.......The two Super Hornets returned to the USS Nimitz and were replaced by a second flight of four more Super Hornets, this time bearing Forward Looking Infrared (FLIR) sensor pods. The second flight of Super Hornets also encountered the “capsule”, but this time they got infrared video, which somehow made it to YouTube.

It is only the infra red video that we can see from the second group of F-18s and it is possibly fake whereas the pilot from the first F18 group did see whales.
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Old 19th December 2017, 03:18 PM   #28
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What I think is interesting is the similar scenario to the Washington UFO Flap of 1952.

The radar was having more and more false reading over a couple of months and assuming they were inversion layer false readings. The movements are extremely fast and sometimes just disappear up and down simultaneously.

Eventually the radar operator calls jets in, to have a look. The jets cant lock on to the where the radar operator says to look. The 1952 jet pilot sees steam boats and cars sending back false readings. The case is described and closed in the released Blue Book files.

The only new thing is the HUD video, from a second group of unnamed pilots, that purports to be infra red, yet this comes out ten years after the pilots told their first story in Aviation Week.
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Old 19th December 2017, 04:05 PM   #29
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Here's San Diego Tribune's take:

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/...htmlstory.html

Quote:
This is what Fravor says happened. He and another pilot were with the USS Nimitz training in F/A-18F Super Hornets about 100 miles out in the Pacific Ocean when someone on the Navy cruiser USS Princeton contacted them by radio about mysterious aircraft.

The ship had been tracking objects that were described as being whitish, 40 feet long and shaped like Tic Tacs that would appear suddenly 80,000 feet up, then descend toward the ocean and hover at 20,000 feet before dropping out of radar range or blasting back up.

The ship and the pilots worked together to track one of the aircraft and when Fravor got close enough to examine one, it peeled away.


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Old 19th December 2017, 04:09 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
I'm thinking it's a FLIR display on an HUD, but am no expert. Staying locked in the same place suggests, at least to me, an artifact.
Same here.
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Old 19th December 2017, 06:21 PM   #31
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Bug in the lens.
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Old 19th December 2017, 06:30 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Bluegill View Post
Do we have any solid indication that the pilots in this encounter were seeing the objects with their own eyes, as opposed to reacting to what they were seeing on their screens?

Guy was just on CNN, said he saw it with his own eyes. When asked what the official report was, he started hemming and hawing and skipped answering it, much like a politician does.
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Old 19th December 2017, 06:54 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Bluegill View Post
Do we have any solid indication that the pilots in this encounter were seeing the objects with their own eyes, as opposed to reacting to what they were seeing on their screens?
There's no solid evidence. The point is to take a wait and see because neither of us has any solid evidence to take a position.
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Old 19th December 2017, 07:03 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Beerina View Post
Guy was just on CNN, said he saw it with his own eyes. When asked what the official report was, he started hemming and hawing and skipped answering it, much like a politician does.
There are two different groups of F18s.

The first group of two F-18's, see the whales in the water and chase the Princetons radar reading, but can't lock on with their radar. These pilots are named. The story first appeared in 2007 in Aviation Week.

The video is supposedly from the second group of four F-18s but these people are not named and the video is new.

I'm suspicious there is a bit of fake story piggybacking going on and I can't find the pilot names of the second lot of F-18's or a USA Navy press release saying they released the video.
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Old 19th December 2017, 09:53 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Bikewer View Post
Carl Sagan often said that if there were any believable evidence of “alien visitors”, the military would be clamoring for funds to address this potential threat, starting with Roswell.
First of all, the recent UFO report is nothing new and that the report is just a tip of the iceberg of what I have uncovered in the form of declassified UFO documents over the years. I also found that the Air Force had already concluded in its 1948 EOTS report that the objects were, it the Air Force's own words, "Interplanetary Spaceships." The Air Force reconfirmed that conclusion in its 1952 intelligence report, so it is no surprise to me why the Air Force ordered its pilots to shoot down flying saucers during the 1950's.

http://roswellproof.homestead.com/fi..._ins_83052.gif

http://roswellproof.homestead.com/Al..._shootdown.jpg

http://greyfalcon.us/pictures/washingtonpost.jpg

In regard to Roswell, General Arthur Exon, former commanding officer of Wright-Patterson AFB, confirmed that the Roswell incident involved extraterrestrials. After all, he was the Air Force officer who overflew both crash sites, which many people today are unaware of and not many people are aware that during the same time frame of the Roswell incident, saucers were also overflying Muroc AFB, CA. now known as Edwards AFB. Pilot flying saucer reports over Muroc AFB and Rogers Dry Lake Bed areas are now available to the public


Quote:
Yet, all we (and the Soviets) did was to spend bucketloads on preparing to blow each other up.
Maybe the aliens would get caught in the “nuclear winter”....

I might also add that even the Soviets have provided information where a saucer hovered over one of its missile bases where they lost control of their missiles, which isn't surprising to me because my own base was involved in investigations that involved UFOs dismantling our Minuteman missiles in 1967. Hill AFB was the depot for the Minuteman missile and even the Boeing tech rep based at my base had said that one particular incident was being reported as an UFO incident because security personnel reported a saucer hovering over the missile field during the time the missiles shutdown. I personally spoke to one of the missile commanders on the phone and he too, confirmed the incident as reported and he thought the security guard top side was joking when he reported a saucer hovering overhead, that is, until his missiles began to shut down, which occurred a week after another missile flight was affected at Malmstrom AFB. In 1975, UFOs were back at Malmstrom AFB and this time two F-106 interceptors were scrambled but radar contact was lost when one of the objects climbed above 200,000 feet.

I would like to add that the Air Force officer who wrote a report on that 1975 UFO incident at Malmstrom AFB was Lt. Col. Lewis Chase, the RB-47 pilot whose aircraft was chased by a UFO over multiple states in another incident, which was also tracked by a ground-based radar and the aircraft's ELINT system.

To further add, when I see reports such as the Navy pilot report, I know that it is just a tip of the iceberg.

Last edited by skyeagle409; 19th December 2017 at 10:09 PM.
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Old 19th December 2017, 10:03 PM   #36
Skeptic Ginger
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
There's another thread on this. I'll report this post and request a merge.

Meanwhile, what I noticed from the clip I just saw on TV is that the "object" remains in the exact same spot on the HUD screen while the plane is manueuvering. Looks like an artifact, to me.
I thought so at first, not a camera artifact but something like a reflection from the plane recording the video. But there are two jets following it, and at the end it really does zoom off kind of ruling out something reflecting off one of the jets.

I maintain an open mind here but expect an explanation that doesn't involve challenging my POV that the distance between stars and the fact we've yet to detect a technological civilization within radio signal range argues against an ET explanation.

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Old 19th December 2017, 10:47 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
To quote Arthur C Clarke: "I'm no longer interested in looking at photos of UFOs. There are just too many of them, and they're too easily faked."

It is true that many UFO photos have been faked and I have even pointed out over the years such tricksters as Billy Meire who is well-known for faking UFO photos. I am more interested in technical data, ATC communication tapes (military and civilian), pilot reports and declassified military and intelligence documentation regarding UFOs.

Personally speaking, I think the government is slowly preparing the public for UFO disclosure, which is what would have already occurred on January 22, 1958 on Live CBS-TV had the audio folks not shut down the station's audio system as Major Keyhoe was about to reveal what the government knew about UFOs. When CBS was asked why they did so, the reply was it was done "in the interest of national security."

In the case of the Navy pilots, one of them remarks that the object is rotating. I guess we can rule out a weather balloon.

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Old 19th December 2017, 11:08 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
Just released report.

I find that interesting, but it is just one report of thousands upon thousands of such reports.

Such UFO activity is nothing new off the southern coast of California and in fact, Clarence Kelly, the father of the U-2 and the SR-71, also reported observing a UFO not far from Pt Mugu Naval Air Station, along with his wife. His UFO sighting was confirmed by a Lockheed flight test crew of a Lockheed EC-121 that was flying in the general area.

The speed for which the object sped away had underlined the fact the object was not ours.
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Old 19th December 2017, 11:58 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I maintain an open mind here but expect an explanation that doesn't involve challenging my POV that the distance between stars and the fact we've yet to detect a technological civilization within radio signal range argues against an ET explanation.

I have to disagree because of what I know from my own past experience at two air bases, which got me started on determining on what the government knows about UFOs and what I have uncovered is eye-opening to say the least.

For an example, I was wondering why, in 1968, Carl Sagan sought to acquire Air Force space surveillance data on objects in space that were determined not to be missiles or spacecraft and decades later, I found that UFOs have been tracked as they arrive from deep space, an account confirmed to me personally by one of the engineers at Aerojet who was instrumental in the development of the DSP surveillance satellite. Dr. Sagan's request for Air Force space surveillance radar data was made during the 1968 Congressional UFO Symposium.

In one case in 1984, a DSP's star-tracker sensor detected a UFO as it headed toward the earth at well over 22,000 mph before it maneuvered and passed between the earth and the DSP satellite where the satellite's main sensor which points toward the earth, detected the object. The encounter occurred as the satellite sat in geosynchronous orbit. I might also add that other ground-based space surveillance assets were involved in the tracking of that UFO near the satellite.

Given the fact our solar system is not that old astronomically speaking, there could very well be civilizations that are thousands or even millions of year more advance than mankind of today and looking for new places to call home because we should remember that even our own sun will expand and engulf the earth in a few billion years.

Look how far mankind has come technologically speaking from 1903 to where we are today. Where will we be technologically speaking in a few thousand years from today?

Never say we have not been visited based on our own current technology and knowledge of physics as examples because our current level of technology regarding space travel would not hold up against technology of alien beings whose technology is thousands or even millions of years more advanced than mankind and given the numbers in the cosmos, the number of such advanced civilizations could number in the thousands if not millions within our own galaxy.
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Old 20th December 2017, 01:00 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
Why assume it's aliens?

It is just a matter of using the process of elimination. For an example, do we have flying vehicles capable of flying at hypersonic speeds within the atmosphere and not create a sonic boom? Some UFOs have been tracked at over thousands of miles per hour and in 1952, one UFO was tracked in the Washington D.C. area at 7200 mph and no sonic boom was heard. In another case, multiple UFOs flew near a B-29 in 1952 near Galveston, Texas at over 5000 mph.

Based on my own experience and what I know from declassified government intelligence and military documents --among other many other things--ET is here and has been for centuries. Here is one small example of thousands of references where flying saucers were tracked by Project Mogul and other balloon teams.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-aqOswt1XY-...0/MCLAUGH1.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-CHXR2lYnJZ...0/MCLAUGH2.jpg


UFO encounters by military and civilian pilots are nothing knew and the advanced technology nature of UFOs encountered underlines the fact the objects are not ours. In the America West encounter, the object was hundreds of feet long, and I might add the UFO was confirmed by a F-117 stealth fighter pilot flying in the general area.

Audio tape recordings between civilian and military radar personnel made during the UFO encounter have been available to the public where the military confirms on tape the tracking of that huge UFO, but I find the Japan Airlines 1628 UFO encounter over Alaska even more interesting because of the huge size of the UFO that was described as larger than two aircraft carriers, which was also confirmed by FAA and Air Force ground-based radars. FAA documents on the Japan Airlines UFO encounter are now available to the public. The radar data was flown to the East Coast and examined by hardware and software specialist who later confirmed the huge size of the UFO that maneuvered around the B-747, which was accompanied by two smaller objects.

A bit more than two months later, an Air Force KC-135 encountered a similar object of size and shape in the general region and communication tapes of that UFO encounter with the KC-135 are now available to the public along with letters from the FAA controllers who were involved in the JAL 1628 incident. Not long after the KC-135 encounter, an Alaska Airlines jet encountered a UFO in that general region.

I have also been aware that a detachment from Wright-Patterson AFB was sent to Alaska and they also encountered a UFO. Photos taken of the UFO during that encounter were then classified and sent via courier back to Wright-Patterson AFB, and I might add the photos are still classified to this very day, but I can also add that gun video footage taken by a climbing Air Force jet of a UFO that was hovering above 30,000 feet over Wright-Patterson AFB has been released to the public.

I find the Navy pilot UFO encounters interesting but expect more such revelations to be revealed by the government in the future.

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