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Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , border issues , donald trump , immigration issues , Trump controversies

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Old 27th November 2018, 05:18 PM   #1561
Craig4
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
One like Kavanaugh.
Give Kavanaugh a beer and tell the little girl to show some leg. He'll let her in.
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Old 27th November 2018, 05:40 PM   #1562
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Just more of the usual concentrated idiocy:

Quote:
President Trump placed responsibility for recent stock market declines and this week’s General Motors plant closures and layoffs on the Federal Reserve during an interview Tuesday, shirking any personal blame for cracks in the economy and declaring that he is “not even a little bit happy” with his hand-selected central bank chairman.

In a wide-ranging and sometimes discordant 20-minute interview with The Washington Post, Trump complained at length about Federal Reserve Chairman Jerome H. “Jay” Powell, whom he nominated earlier this year. When asked about declines on Wall Street and GM’s announcement that it was laying off 15 percent of its workforce, Trump responded by criticizing higher interest rates and other Fed policies, though he insisted that he is not worried about a recession.

“I’m doing deals, and I’m not being accommodated by the Fed,” Trump said. “They’re making a mistake because I have a gut, and my gut tells me more sometimes than anybody else’s brain can ever tell me.”

He added: “So far, I’m not even a little bit happy with my selection of Jay. Not even a little bit. And I’m not blaming anybody, but I’m just telling you I think that the Fed is way off-base with what they’re doing.”

Trump also dismissed the federal government’s landmark report released last week finding that damages from global warming are intensifying around the country. The president said that “I don’t see” climate change as man-made and that he does not believe the scientific consensus.

“One of the problems that a lot of people like myself, we have very high levels of intelligence but we’re not necessarily such believers,” Trump said. “You look at our air and our water, and it’s right now at a record clean.”

The president added of climate change, “As to whether or not it’s man-made and whether or not the effects that you’re talking about are there, I don’t see it.”

...

Trump again questioned the CIA’s assessment that Saudi Arabia’s crown prince ordered the assassination of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, a contributor to The Post, and said he has considered Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman’s repeated denials in his decision to maintain a close alliance with the oil-rich desert kingdom.

“Maybe he did and maybe he didn’t,” Trump said. “But he denies it. And people around him deny it. And the CIA did not say affirmatively he did it, either, by the way. I’m not saying that they’re saying he didn’t do it, but they didn’t say it affirmatively.”
Linky.
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Old 28th November 2018, 12:45 PM   #1563
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From Badscience:

Originally Posted by Bird on a Fire
Originally Posted by MONK
Trump loses insane cult leader Ammon Bundy

https://www.thedailybeast.com/anti-g...grant-rhetoric
Every time I think the whole Trump thing can't get crazier, it does.

That's some of the most sensible commentary I've seen on the migrant caravan and it comes from Y'All Qaeda.
And here is the first paragraph:
Quote:
Ammon Bundy, an anti-government militia leader, issued a surprise critique of President Trump’s rhetoric regarding immigrants. In a video posted on Facebook, Bundy pushed back on the president for his comments portraying members of the migrant caravan as “criminals” and “gang members.” “It seems that there’s been this group stereotype,” Bundy says in the 17-minute video. “But what about those who have come here for reasons of need? . . . What about the fathers, the mothers, the children, who have come here and are willing to go through the process to apply for asylum so they can come into this country?” The video now has over 5,000 views.
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Old 15th December 2018, 04:50 PM   #1564
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I'm sure trumpf is only separating them so he can eat the kids before sending the parents to the incinerators...….

It just has to get something out of the Deal...…………..
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Old 20th December 2018, 01:58 PM   #1565
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The problem with immigration politics is that many Democrats have an INCREDIBLY idealised view of Europe and think "If Germany and France can have open borders* why can't America and Mexico?"

*ignoring the caveats that go along with how the Schengen Zone actually works
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Old 20th December 2018, 02:10 PM   #1566
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Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
The problem with immigration politics is that many Democrats have an INCREDIBLY idealised view of Europe and think "If Germany and France can have open borders* why can't America and Mexico?"

*ignoring the caveats that go along with how the Schengen Zone actually works
My friends wife last week discussing border security with me, and she's no dummy either:

"I dunno, it just feeeels like, I dunno we're just a small little planet in a huge galaxy in a gigantic universe...it seems like we shouldn't need walls and borders"

The problem is the word "feels". Just because these head-in-the-cloud types think everyone should love each other doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees. It isn't reality.

That was the answer I got when I asked for a rational reason to not work on securing our borders better. There is no rational answer.
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Old 20th December 2018, 02:26 PM   #1567
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
My friends wife last week discussing border security with me, and she's no dummy either:

"I dunno, it just feeeels like, I dunno we're just a small little planet in a huge galaxy in a gigantic universe...it seems like we shouldn't need walls and borders"

The problem is the word "feels". Just because these head-in-the-cloud types think everyone should love each other doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees. It isn't reality.

That was the answer I got when I asked for a rational reason to not work on securing our borders better. There is no rational answer.
There is a rational answer. No one has shown that increased border security pays back significantly, from what I have seen.
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Old 20th December 2018, 02:35 PM   #1568
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
There is a rational answer. No one has shown that increased border security pays back significantly, from what I have seen.
Again, that is presuming that Schengen can be CTRL+c/v'd to anywhere and everywhere on the planet without going down in flames. Or as I like to call it, the "Appeal to Europe/Scandinavia fallacy"
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Old 20th December 2018, 08:33 PM   #1569
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
There is a rational answer. No one has shown that increased border security pays back significantly, from what I have seen.
Depending on the situation, it may even have a net negative effect. Especially if the money would have more of an effect even if it were diverted towards increasing living conditions in countries that the US made a mess of. Even so, I'm entirely fine with efficient uses of taxpayer dollars to secure borders. That can even include walls, potentially. As has been nigh unanimously attested to, though, a full border wall like Trump's pushing would be wildly inefficient in comparison to other options like increased drone surveillance, with agents available to deal with any illegals found. I quite suspect that the same money could be far more effectively used for numerous other and more beneficial projects to the US, though.
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Old 4th February 2019, 09:48 PM   #1570
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Trump officials now claim it would be too 'traumatic' to reunite kids stolen from parents at border.

WTF.
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Old 5th February 2019, 08:28 AM   #1571
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
At least separating these kids plays well with republicans. This makes them all happy.
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Old 5th February 2019, 09:57 AM   #1572
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
"Sorry, it really isn't convenient for us to stop committing Crimes Against Humanity at this time. We started doing it, and we really believe that we should see it through to the end."
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Old 6th February 2019, 07:17 AM   #1573
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Originally Posted by Border Reiver View Post
"Sorry, it really isn't convenient for us to stop committing Crimes Against Humanity at this time. We started doing it, and we really believe that we should see it through to the end."
Like anyone in the US government would ever be held accountable for mere crimes against humanity or war crimes.

It is really kind of cute how the armed forces seem to believe despite all evidence that they would refuse an illegal order and be found in the right.
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Old 6th February 2019, 08:29 AM   #1574
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
I'm trying to find the right word to describe this policy, its implementation and the response of officials to it, but I'm struggling to find one that really expresses how disgusting it is.

I guess "inhuman" will do.
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Old 6th February 2019, 09:25 AM   #1575
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
I'm trying to find the right word to describe this policy, its implementation and the response of officials to it, but I'm struggling to find one that really expresses how disgusting it is.

I guess "inhuman" will do.
I go with popular with their base.

It really does seem that crimes against humanity goes well with republican presidencies. At least since 92 anyway.
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Old 6th February 2019, 09:42 AM   #1576
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
The problem is the word "feels". Just because these head-in-the-cloud types think everyone should love each other doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees. It isn't reality.

That was the answer I got when I asked for a rational reason to not work on securing our borders better. There is no rational answer.
See, I ask why we need a wall to secure our borders and the answer I get is "duh". There is no rational answer for that, either.
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Old 13th February 2019, 02:43 AM   #1577
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Just as a heads up, just in case anyone doubted it... The Trump Administration is still separating families.
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Old 16th February 2019, 12:49 PM   #1578
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
My friends wife last week discussing border security with me, and she's no dummy either:



"I dunno, it just feeeels like, I dunno we're just a small little planet in a huge galaxy in a gigantic universe...it seems like we shouldn't need walls and borders"



The problem is the word "feels". Just because these head-in-the-cloud types think everyone should love each other doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees. It isn't reality.



That was the answer I got when I asked for a rational reason to not work on securing our borders better. There is no rational answer.
Asking loaded questions that contain embedded falsehoods isn't the behavior I'd expect if someone wanted a serious discussion.
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Old 18th February 2019, 01:52 PM   #1579
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
See, I ask why we need a wall to secure our borders and the answer I get is "duh". There is no rational answer for that, either.
I don't care if it's a wall or not, but it seems like doing nothing at all is the way my state wants to go.

I live in Cali where our government seems to want illegals here. We have a sanctuary state, we give them drivers licenses, health care, SF city gives them the right to vote in certain elections - ya I'm asking that question because the actions of our government lead me to believe that illegals are wanted here.

So I ask citizens, not big business or politicians, do you want these policies? Do you want illegals to come in this country freely? Most people do not.

Wall - people are not arrested or held in facilities like the ones everybody is complaining about here, no more family separation because we don't apprehend them.

No wall choice #1 - we are stuck apprehending all these people. We simply let them go into our society hoping they will come to their court date. We are forced to deal with families. Nobody likes this solution but it is the default one. Huh.

No wall choice #2 - we apprehend them and drop them off on the other side of the border. Preferable solution, but we cannot or will not do it.

Too many people want these people here. All you need to do is look at how California is handling this. Open arms.

How about some solutions? Anyone else here have one?
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Old 18th February 2019, 02:31 PM   #1580
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
I don't care if it's a wall or not, but it seems like doing nothing at all is the way my state wants to go.

I live in Cali where our government seems to want illegals here. We have a sanctuary state, we give them drivers licenses, health care, SF city gives them the right to vote in certain elections - ya I'm asking that question because the actions of our government lead me to believe that illegals are wanted here.

So I ask citizens, not big business or politicians, do you want these policies? Do you want illegals to come in this country freely? Most people do not.

Wall - people are not arrested or held in facilities like the ones everybody is complaining about here, no more family separation because we don't apprehend them.

No wall choice #1 - we are stuck apprehending all these people. We simply let them go into our society hoping they will come to their court date. We are forced to deal with families. Nobody likes this solution but it is the default one. Huh.

No wall choice #2 - we apprehend them and drop them off on the other side of the border. Preferable solution, but we cannot or will not do it.

Too many people want these people here. All you need to do is look at how California is handling this. Open arms.

How about some solutions? Anyone else here have one?
Wouldn't the Californian agricultural industry suffer massively if illegal immigrants weren't employed?

Still sounds like a really bad idea from a consideration of the good of the people of the state.

Meanwhile, a Danish study found that as long as immigrants were allowed to work, even the lowest paid boosted the economy

https://nordic.businessinsider.com/t...es-why-2017-4/
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Old 18th February 2019, 02:42 PM   #1581
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
I don't care if it's a wall or not, but it seems like doing nothing at all is the way my state wants to go.
What, you can drive right over the border with no passport, no stops, no checks, no nothing? Nothing at all? Is that what you're saying?


Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
So I ask citizens, not big business or politicians, do you want these policies? Do you want illegals to come in this country freely? Most people do not.
I don't mind if immigrants come to the country. I would prefer it be legally, but if they aren't, it isn't the end of the world. I would also prefer that people obey traffic laws and be polite to each other on the street.

It's a matter of keeping perspective. This xenophobic anti-immigrant thing Trump is pushing so hard does not have it.


Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Wall - people are not arrested or held in facilities like the ones everybody is complaining about here, no more family separation because we don't apprehend them.
Interesting. You realize we're apprehending families turning themselves in to authorities, seeking refugee status and then separating them from their children? Do you not find this a bit ...extreme?

Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
[How about some solutions? Anyone else here have one?
I have a solution. Fund the immigration courts the way they really need to be funded so that these people can be processed the way they ought to be processed: quickly, humanely, and with justice.

The solutions Trump looking for are for problems that don't really exist.
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Old 18th February 2019, 10:16 PM   #1582
Aridas
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
Wouldn't the Californian agricultural industry suffer massively if illegal immigrants weren't employed?
Just about all agriculture would suffer lots. That's one of the main reasons that they've pointedly resisted, for example, E-Verify, and one of the main reasons why there was lots of sound and fury from the Republican Party (which is overwhelmingly favored by those in agriculture), but little action, let alone effective action.

Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
Still sounds like a really bad idea from a consideration of the good of the people of the state.
There's always doing things the legal way, but legal workers are notably harder to exploit.

All this is a bit of a tangent, though, when it comes to this thread. This thread is more specifically about the Family Separation Policy of the Trump Administration, rather than immigration policies in general.
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Old 7th March 2019, 03:07 AM   #1583
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https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/statu...42964431421440

Quote:
Breaking: Trump admin has identified 471 parents who were removed from the US without their children and “without being given the opportunity to elect or waive reunification in accordance with the preliminary injunction”. This follows ACLU request. @priscialva reporting
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Old 7th March 2019, 04:49 AM   #1584
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Yea and that was when they even bothered to keep records.
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Old 7th March 2019, 05:14 AM   #1585
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Neilson will be questioned today by Congress on, amongst other things, whether she previously committed perjury when she claimed there was no family separation policy
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Old 7th March 2019, 09:08 AM   #1586
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Looks like she did what she could to evade those questions.

To mostly repeat what I wrote elsewhere... As might be expected by pretty much everyone paying attention at all, it was not a good time for her as she tried to evade or mislead in response to a bunch of questions and outright lied to Congress yet again. It reminded me yet again that the Far Right do have slightly legitimate concerns about violence from the left. After all, listening to her definitely made me want to slap her at times because of how shameless her lies and BS was.

May she be punished properly by the law for her crimes.
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Old 25th March 2019, 05:58 AM   #1587
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Officials detained a 9 year old US citizen for more than 30 hours
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Old 25th March 2019, 04:51 PM   #1588
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post

Just doing their job.

Just following orders.

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Old 25th March 2019, 07:07 PM   #1589
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Quote:
after she tried to cross the U.S-Mexico border on her walk to school.
The incompetence is astounding.
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Old 25th March 2019, 11:05 PM   #1590
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
C.B.P. prioritizes the safety of the minors we encounter, he said. Its important that C.B.P. officials positively confirm the identity of a child traveling without a parent or legal guardian.

It's obvious you didn't even read the article.
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Old 25th March 2019, 11:06 PM   #1591
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
“C.B.P. prioritizes the safety of the minors we encounter,” he said. “It’s important that C.B.P. officials positively confirm the identity of a child traveling without a parent or legal guardian.”

It's obvious you didn't even read the article.
Because a 9 yr old can't walk to school? WTF?

Quote:
The representative said both children had United States passport cards at the time.

“The younger child provided inconsistent information during her inspection, and C.B.P. officers took the 9-year-old into custody to perform due diligence in confirming her identity and citizenship,” the spokesperson said.
What do you want to bet they intimidated the 9 yr old telling her she was going to jail?
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Old 25th March 2019, 11:19 PM   #1592
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Because a 9 yr old can't walk to school? WTF?

What do you want to bet they intimidated the 9 yr old telling her she was going to jail?


Ok, cmon...do you really think a 9 year old crossing an international border is a commonplace occurrence? Its not. Especially in this climate.
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Old 26th March 2019, 01:33 AM   #1593
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
C.B.P. prioritizes the safety of the minors we encounter, he said. Its important that C.B.P. officials positively confirm the identity of a child traveling without a parent or legal guardian.

It's obvious you didn't even read the article.
Sure I did. Including past the part that you quoted.

Quote:
But Thelma Galaxia, Julias mother, told the station that while her daughter was detained, officials accused her of lying about her identity.

My daughter told her brother that the officer told her that if she admitted that she was her cousin, she would be released soon so she could see her mom, Galaxia said.

Julias older brother also told the station that official accusing him of smuggling and committing other crimes he said he did not understand.

He was told that he would be taken to jail and they were going to charge him for human trafficking and sex trafficking, Galaxia said.

I was scared. I was sad because I didn't have my mom or my brother. I was completely by myself, Julia said of the ordeal.
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Old 26th March 2019, 09:31 AM   #1594
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
Ok, cmon...do you really think a 9 year old crossing an international border is a commonplace occurrence? Its not. Especially in this climate.
Well, if you read the article you might notice it was a commonplace occurrence for this kid, who is said to do it every day, though usually in a different way. And she was not doing it alone. She was with her 14 year old brother. They both had correct documentation. The authorities determined quickly enough that the brother was a citizen (after initially accusing him of smuggling), but apparently decided he and his sister were lying about her? And it took over a day to get it right? Is it so hard just to acknowledge that, whatever you think of policies, this time the authorities just plain screwed up?
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Old 26th March 2019, 10:45 AM   #1595
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
What do you want to bet they intimidated the 9 yr old telling her she was going to jail?
It sounds like that's precisely what happened. And the brother too; they allegedly threatened him with jail unless he signed a statement declaring that his sister was really his cousin, which statement they then used as probable cause to (continue to) detain the girl.
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Old 26th March 2019, 10:54 AM   #1596
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
It sounds like that's precisely what happened. And the brother too; they allegedly threatened him with jail unless he signed a statement declaring that his sister was really his cousin, which statement they then used as probable cause to (continue to) detain the girl.
Ah so really SOP and everything was working as it is supposed to.
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Old 26th March 2019, 11:07 AM   #1597
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It remains, of course, a bit speculative exactly who said what, and how the whole mistake was made.

I think a good exercise would be for some regular, all-American white kids to be subjected to the same kind of treatment, intimidation and assumption of wrongdoing that seems to be the norm here, to provide a baseline for "inconsistent information" and bad behavior. Maybe if you work at the border, you should be willing to volunteer your own little kids to do it, and have them videotaped for general education.

Of course put that way it sounds like a crazy, cruel, and inappropriate thing to do, which by itself says something about the whole procedure.
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Old 26th March 2019, 11:21 AM   #1598
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
It remains, of course, a bit speculative exactly who said what, and how the whole mistake was made.
Why assume it was a mistake? Harassing the darkies even if they are citizens is one of the main goals of border patrol. I mean this isn't really any different than arresting US citizens for speaking spanish in a gas station in Minnesota now is it?
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Old 26th March 2019, 01:06 PM   #1599
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Because a 9 yr old can't walk to school? WTF?

What do you want to bet they intimidated the 9 yr old telling her she was going to jail?
Have you ever heard of the phenomenon of a person using documents that do not belong to them with the hope that the inspecting officer will believe they are the true bearer and admit them as a US citizen?

Would you believe that it is commonplace to ask questions of the person presenting the document in order to verify that they are who the document says they are, and if answers are inconsistent then it becomes reasonable to suspect the presenter may fall into the category described in the above paragraph? I believe such a person can be called an "impostor."
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Old 26th March 2019, 03:50 PM   #1600
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
C.B.P. prioritizes the safety of the minors we encounter, he said. Its important that C.B.P. officials positively confirm the identity of a child traveling without a parent or legal guardian.

It's obvious you didn't even read the article.
Because a 9 yr old can't walk to school? WTF?

Quote:
The representative said both children had United States passport cards at the time.

The younger child provided inconsistent information during her inspection, and C.B.P. officers took the 9-year-old into custody to perform due diligence in confirming her identity and citizenship, the spokesperson said.
What do you want to bet they intimidated the 9 yr old telling her she was going to jail?

Just following orders.
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