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Old 7th January 2019, 03:19 PM   #321
Squeegee Beckenheim
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
Who's loling at who?
Who is outraged at all?
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Old 7th January 2019, 03:22 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
"Republicans have launched political attacks on her and this one random, anonymous Twitter user that we have zero idea about his social or political ideology posts an old video of her dancing with a snarky comment about it! IT'S ALL LINKED!"
Before he deleted his twitter account, some people looked at its history to see if it was some kind of parody. Apparently it was very typically what you'd expect from a hardcore Trump supporter.

Of course, there's always Poe's law, but it's been reported as likely the real deal, and you'd imagine a parody account to double-down rather than vanish.
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Old 7th January 2019, 03:45 PM   #323
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
Her cool nickname is AOC not ACO. Maybe she's not crazy, but Waldman is if he thinks Republicans believe wealth is synonymous with virtue.

Personally, I would be happy to go along with higher taxes on the wealthy. Republicans have boxed themselves in on this issue. Because they believe that tax increases are wrong (not morally, but economically), they have protected lots of wealthy people who turn around and vote their socially liberal consciences. If the liberal rich started having to actually pay higher taxes as a result of voting Democratic, they might think twice about it.

As for AOC, she's a twit who clearly doesn't understand how to get things done (or basic economics). That said, I certainly didn't see anything shocking in the video.
Here's the thing about those higher tax brackets. There is more than a reasonable argument that they stimulate growth not deter it. What it does is incentivise stockholders to stay vested as opposed to to pulling income out for personal use.
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Old 7th January 2019, 04:00 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
So please explain to me what part of this "narrative" one random anonymous Twitter user is?

"Republicans have launched political attacks on her and this one random, anonymous Twitter user that we have zero idea about his social or political ideology posts an old video of her dancing with a snarky comment about it! IT'S ALL LINKED!"

This "Republicans are out to get her, so everything said negative about her in any context is about that" is a stretch.
...the reality is that what is happening at the moment in America is a propaganda war. Its a war that is being lead by the Trump administration, aided and abetted by elements in the Federal government, a complicit Republican party, a clueless and easily lead media, and an army of bots and disinformation agents on social media.

And its a battle that, by and large, they are winning. Its why Rashida Tlaib saying a bad-word has dominated news cycles. When we talk about "narrative": this is what we are talking about. Rashida Tlaib said the word ************. The RW narrative machine turned it into a talking point, then "left-leaning institutions" like the Washington Post and NBC published their "hot takes" on why what Tliab did is everything wrong with politics today. Its a story that is lingering like a bad smell. And thats exactly what they want. Its tactical on their part.

What happened here was a necessary pre-emptive strike. Attack the talking point before it gains traction. Turned what could have been a hurtful talking point into something that did the complete opposite. It could very easily have ended up differently.

Its all about "winning the news cycle." The "resistance" effectively "won" this round. I'll be honest: I don't much like what happened either, and in a normal world I'd probably be "on your side" on this issue. But things aren't normal, and this is how the battlefield works now, so the best I can do is sit back and let it all play out. Because the consequences of letting these "little" things go unchallenged could well be another four more years of Trump.
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Old 7th January 2019, 05:02 PM   #325
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Before he deleted his twitter account, some people looked at its history to see if it was some kind of parody. Apparently it was very typically what you'd expect from a hardcore Trump supporter.



Of course, there's always Poe's law, but it's been reported as likely the real deal, and you'd imagine a parody account to double-down rather than vanish.
Why would I expect that?
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Old 7th January 2019, 08:46 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by banquetbear View Post
...the reality is that what is happening at the moment in America is a propaganda war. Its a war that is being lead by the Trump administration, aided and abetted by elements in the Federal government, a complicit Republican party, a clueless and easily lead media, and an army of bots and disinformation agents on social media.

And its a battle that, by and large, they are winning. Its why Rashida Tlaib saying a bad-word has dominated news cycles.
I guess you forgot what happened when Dick Cheney said a bad word.

Quote:
What happened here was a necessary pre-emptive strike.
Republicans don't need to attack AOC. The Democrats will do it all for them, free of charge. AOC has no record of accomplishment, her ideas are unworkable fantasies, she has no network of power and support withing the party establishment, but she's getting tons of favorable press. This is actually bad news for the Democrats. More specifically, it's bad news for all the other elected Democrats who are struggling for press attention to raise their own profiles. Jealousy and infighting are what will sink AOC. Republicans won't have to do a thing.
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Old 7th January 2019, 08:59 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I guess you forgot what happened when Dick Cheney said a bad word.

Republicans don't need to attack AOC. The Democrats will do it all for them, free of charge. AOC has no record of accomplishment, her ideas are unworkable fantasies, she has no network of power and support withing the party establishment, but she's getting tons of favorable press. This is actually bad news for the Democrats. More specifically, it's bad news for all the other elected Democrats who are struggling for press attention to raise their own profiles. Jealousy and infighting are what will sink AOC. Republicans won't have to do a thing.
Can I have some of whatever you're smoking? That's some crazy analysis. AOC has been all over country helping other Democrats raise money. She's a star. Not perfect, but smart , articulate and telegenic.
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:09 PM   #328
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Can I have some of whatever you're smoking? That's some crazy analysis. AOC has been all over country helping other Democrats raise money. She's a star. Not perfect, but smart , articulate and telegenic.
How do you think that makes Nancy Pelosi feel?
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:27 PM   #329
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
How do you think that makes Nancy Pelosi feel?
Nancy's got hers. In the "caring conservative" newthink, why should she care about AOC? Pelosi is the Speaker of the House. She has no further aspirations and she was never the crazed leftwinger the troglodyte conservatives pictured her as.

More important, though, and you still have 55 minutes on our session before my next patient.....

"And how does that make you feel?"
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:31 PM   #330
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I guess you forgot what happened when Dick Cheney said a bad word.
...way back in 2004 a "news cycle" was an objectively different thing. A single cite from a single news source doesn't show that "Dick Cheney said a bad word" even lasted a cycle, let alone dominated several cycles. The President at the time didn't criticize Cheney. There is no comparison between what happened then and what happened now.

Quote:
Republicans don't need to attack AOC. The Democrats will do it all for them, free of charge. AOC has no record of accomplishment, her ideas are unworkable fantasies, she has no network of power and support withing the party establishment, but she's getting tons of favorable press. This is actually bad news for the Democrats. More specifically, it's bad news for all the other elected Democrats who are struggling for press attention to raise their own profiles. Jealousy and infighting are what will sink AOC. Republicans won't have to do a thing.
Propaganda in action. Thanks for showing for the rest of us how these "fact-free talking points" work. You don't need facts on your side. Just make stuff up, repeat it often enough, and people like you believe.
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:32 PM   #331
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Nancy's got hers. In the "caring conservative" newthink, why should she care about AOC?
You lost me. Are you accusing Pelosi of caring conservative newthink?
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:38 PM   #332
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
How do you think that makes Nancy Pelosi feel?
Why the hell would Pelosi care?

Pelosi being speaker manages the office space for the House. Guess who is two doors down from Pelosi? AOC. Sounds to me, Pelosi is taking AOC under her wing so to speak. BTW, Pelosi is 78 years old and has said, she will pass the torch next session.
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:45 PM   #333
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
You lost me. Are you accusing Pelosi of caring conservative newthink?
No. I'm ridiculing your ridiculous query.
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Old 7th January 2019, 09:45 PM   #334
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
How do you think that makes Nancy Pelosi feel?
Unlike Conservatives, the rest of us don't think in terms of zero sum play. We believe that when a colleague gets raised up it helps raise up the collective, and thus is a good thing, not a threat to be taken out because they might take some of what is ours.
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Old 7th January 2019, 10:26 PM   #335
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
And of course if is always the other guy who is guilty of tribalism......

That's some good false equivalency there.

All people don't consider themselves members of the same sort of tribe. Trumpists consider themselves the tribe of white Americans of western European descent. And for some bizarre reason, Hispanic isn't part of that tribe. Or Jews. Or probably Catholics. I've probably missed a few exceptions.

There's also the tribe of all Americans, which is closer to the average Democrat's tribe.

And then there's the tribe of all humanity. A few more steps up.

Who do you think of as your tribe? Do you believe it's the same as the average Trump supporter?
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Old 7th January 2019, 11:31 PM   #336
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
That's some good false equivalency there.

All people don't consider themselves members of the same sort of tribe. Trumpists consider themselves the tribe of white Americans of western European descent. And for some bizarre reason, Hispanic isn't part of that tribe. Or Jews. Or probably Catholics. I've probably missed a few exceptions.

There's also the tribe of all Americans, which is closer to the average Democrat's tribe.

And then there's the tribe of all humanity. A few more steps up.

Who do you think of as your tribe? Do you believe it's the same as the average Trump supporter?
Perhaps, it's just me, but I read his comment more as a critique of Joe's oft uttered decrylation of tribalism - sort of a tribe that hates tribalism if you will.
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Old 7th January 2019, 11:51 PM   #337
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I guess you forgot what happened when Dick Cheney said a bad word.
No, but I remember when he shot someone in the face.
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Old 8th January 2019, 01:23 AM   #338
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
I still don't get why people are confusing lols with outrage. Are we to believe that there is outrage over Fiji Water Girl?

For the record I love what the Fiji Water Girl did. Talk about a ballsy stunt that worked spectacularly.







As for AOC, I love her. I love her platform of ideas though I might go a bit more extreme. I think we have too many useless super rich that get rich just moving money around and not creating anything. As such I've flirted with the radical idea that we implement Roman style decimation with the super rich. The chosen 10% would have their assets seized and redistributed into social programs.
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Old 8th January 2019, 01:44 AM   #339
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Can I have some of whatever you're smoking? That's some crazy analysis. AOC has been all over country helping other Democrats raise money. She's a star. Not perfect, but smart , articulate and telegenic.
Iíll give you telegenic, and the bar is evidently low for articulate, but smart? Yeah, Iím not the one smoking strange stuff.
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Old 8th January 2019, 03:15 AM   #340
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Iíll give you telegenic, and the bar is evidently low for articulate, but smart? Yeah, Iím not the one smoking strange stuff.
So she just graduated from one of the top 50 universities in the world by fluke, did she?
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Old 8th January 2019, 04:03 AM   #341
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Why would I expect that?
Why would you expect what?
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Old 8th January 2019, 04:48 AM   #342
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Iíll give you telegenic, and the bar is evidently low for articulate, but smart? Yeah, Iím not the one smoking strange stuff.
Compared to the last two Republican Presidents, she's a ******* genius.
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Old 8th January 2019, 05:05 AM   #343
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Originally Posted by Damien Evans View Post
So she just graduated from one of the top 50 universities in the world by fluke, did she?
To expand on your point:

"Ocasio-Cortez attended Yorktown High School, graduating in 2007,[16] where she won second prize in the Intel International Science and Engineering Fair with a microbiology research project on the effect of antioxidants on C. elegans' lifespan.[17] As a result, the International Astronomical Union named a small asteroid after her: 23238 Ocasio-Cortez.[18][19] In high school, she took part in the National Hispanic Institute's Lorenzo de Zavala (LDZ) Youth Legislative Session. She later became the LDZ Secretary of State while she attended Boston University. Ocasio-Cortez had a John F. Lopez Fellowship.[20] In 2008, while Ocasio-Cortez was a sophomore at Boston University, her father died of lung cancer.[21][22] During college, she was an intern in the immigration office of U.S. Senator Ted Kennedy.[23] She graduated cum laude from Boston University's College of Arts and Sciences in 2011 with a bachelor's degree in international relations and a minor in economics."

Alexandria Ocasio-CortezWP
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Old 8th January 2019, 05:17 AM   #344
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Compared to the last two Republican Presidents, she's a ******* genius.
Indeed so!

In fact, even if one goes back to the last five Republican presidents (Ford, Reagan, H.W. Bush, G.W. Bush and Trump) the she is quite the genius indeed.
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Old 8th January 2019, 05:31 AM   #345
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post
To expand on your point:

"Ocasio-Cortez attended Yorktown High School, graduating in 2007,[16] where she won second prize in the Intel International Science and Engineering Fair with a microbiology research project on the effect of antioxidants on C. elegans' lifespan.[17] As a result, the International Astronomical Union named a small asteroid after her: 23238 Ocasio-Cortez.[18][19] In high school, she took part in the National Hispanic Institute's Lorenzo de Zavala (LDZ) Youth Legislative Session. She later became the LDZ Secretary of State while she attended Boston University. Ocasio-Cortez had a John F. Lopez Fellowship.[20] In 2008, while Ocasio-Cortez was a sophomore at Boston University, her father died of lung cancer.[21][22] During college, she was an intern in the immigration office of U.S. Senator Ted Kennedy.[23] She graduated cum laude from Boston University's College of Arts and Sciences in 2011 with a bachelor's degree in international relations and a minor in economics."

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She sounds way too smart. She's the elite, so we should all dismiss her because of that.
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Old 8th January 2019, 06:12 AM   #346
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By the way, a more subtle way of dismissing her is to call her "adorable."
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Old 8th January 2019, 06:23 AM   #347
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Iíll give you telegenic, and the bar is evidently low for articulate, but smart? Yeah, Iím not the one smoking strange stuff.
You support Trump and you comment on another politician's smarts? Think you may have a bad case of AOCDS.
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Old 8th January 2019, 06:33 AM   #348
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
By the way, a more subtle way of dismissing her is to call her "adorable."
I admit that I did so, because I found the video adorable. That said, AOC is obviously a much more competent person than me, and I don't mean to be dismissive.
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Old 8th January 2019, 06:40 AM   #349
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Originally Posted by Parsman View Post
You support Trump and you comment on another politician's smarts? Think you may have a bad case of AOCDS.
Itís just the standard conservative MO. Remember when the guy who graduated magma cum laude from Haravard Law wasnít that smart either?

Meanwhile, Trump will say more dumb **** by the time I finish typing this sentence than Obama and Ocasio-Cortez will say for the rest of their lives combined. But nary a word of criticism from our resident conservatives who suddenly care about the intelligence of politicians again.
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Old 8th January 2019, 06:43 AM   #350
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Itís just the standard conservative MO. Remember when the guy who graduated magma cum laude from Haravard Law wasnít that smart either?

Meanwhile, Trump will say more dumb **** by the time I finish typing this sentence than Obama and Ocasio-Cortez will say for the rest of their lives combined. But nary a word of criticism from our resident conservatives who suddenly care about the intelligence of politicians again.
That's a bit of hyperbole. But it isn't far off.
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Old 8th January 2019, 07:50 AM   #351
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Originally Posted by Damien Evans View Post
So she just graduated from one of the top 50 universities in the world by fluke, did she?
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Compared to the last two Republican Presidents, she's a ******* genius.
I love the internal inconsistencies of the left. AOC's must be smart because she graduated from a top school, but Trump and Bush are idiots even though they did too.

If it weren't for double standards, you wouldn't have any standards at all.
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Old 8th January 2019, 07:52 AM   #352
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Itís just the standard conservative MO. Remember when the guy who graduated magma cum laude from Haravard Law wasnít that smart either?

Meanwhile, Trump will say more dumb **** by the time I finish typing this sentence than Obama and Ocasio-Cortez will say for the rest of their lives combined. But nary a word of criticism from our resident conservatives who suddenly care about the intelligence of politicians again.
I'm not the one who brought up intelligence. Nor was any lack of it my problem with Obama. And you hardly need me to tell you Trump says stupid ****.
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:05 AM   #353
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I love the internal inconsistencies of the left. AOC's must be smart because she graduated from a top school, but Trump and Bush are idiots even though they did too.

If it weren't for double standards, you wouldn't have any standards at all.
For this to mean something, you need to demonstrate inconsistencies from the same entity, preferably a significant entity. Obviously there will be diverging and inconsistent opinions in any group as large as "the left".
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:06 AM   #354
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
For this to mean something, you need to demonstrate inconsistencies from the same entity, preferably a significant entity. Obviously there will be diverging and inconsistent opinions in any group as large as "the left".
Just watch: neither of them will take exception with the other's argument.
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:09 AM   #355
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Damn.... the Republicans are really desperate to find something.... anything!... aren't they?
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:31 AM   #356
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
For this to mean something, you need to demonstrate inconsistencies from the same entity, preferably a significant entity. Obviously there will be diverging and inconsistent opinions in any group as large as "the left".
*Head desk*

This entire thread is based on the idea that this one random tweet from one random anonymous idiot represents some coordinated attack on AOC from the Right that the Left has to launch some sort of preemptive strike on.
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:34 AM   #357
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I love the internal inconsistencies of the left. AOC's must be smart because she graduated from a top school, but Trump and Bush are idiots even though they did too.

If it weren't for double standards, you wouldn't have any standards at all.
Nice projection. Pity it's completely offtopic and I've made no comment anything like that in this thread.

Oh and for the record, I don't think Bush was an idiot, though he was one of the worst public speakers I've ever seen, and whatever intelligence Trump may or may not have once possessed it's long since disappeared under the weight of his ego.
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:37 AM   #358
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
*Head desk*

This entire thread is based on the idea that this one random tweet from one random anonymous idiot represents some coordinated attack on AOC from the Right that the Left has to launch some sort of preemptive strike on.
Yeah, but it reminded us how awesome Jim Hoft is, so that's a blessing.

Also, every time I see AOC, I say to myself - appellation d'origine controlťe.
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:46 AM   #359
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
*Head desk*

This entire thread is based on the idea that this one random tweet from one random anonymous idiot represents some coordinated attack on AOC from the Right that the Left has to launch some sort of preemptive strike on.
Yes and? I've more or less expressed the same sentiment upthread as you express here. You need not subject your head to further abuse, as tempting as it may be to posture vacuously.
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Old 8th January 2019, 08:49 AM   #360
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
Yeah, but it reminded us how awesome Jim Hoft is, so that's a blessing.

Also, every time I see AOC, I say to myself - appellation d'origine controlťe.
Champagne!!!
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