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Tags racism charges , racism incidents , Ralph Northam , Virginia politics

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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:22 AM   #121
varwoche
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I don't believe that people should be chucked onto the trash heap for "youthful indiscretion", as long as it's crystal clear they own their past "sin", grew past it, and made that growth clear.

I believe in (non religious) redemption. Even for Byrd. His conversion from racism impressed me as sincere.

I don't know if Notham has owned, grown, and made clear. I never heard of him until yesterday.

Since Kavanaugh is coming up, I got no sense at all that he owned his ugly past.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:38 AM   #122
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
I don't believe that people should be chucked onto the trash heap for "youthful indiscretion", as long as it's crystal clear they own their past "sin", grew past it, and made that growth clear.

I believe in (non religious) redemption. Even for Byrd. His conversion from racism impressed me as sincere.

I don't know if Notham has owned, grown, and made clear. I never heard of him until yesterday.

Since Kavanaugh is coming up, I got no sense at all that he owned his ugly past.
K did not own his “ugly” past?

Perhaps that is because the things he was accused of never happened.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:45 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
If he was a Republican, he'd be called a racist for even knowing someone from that yearbook pic.

"Racist" is such a "go to" word among Democrats it will be hilarious to see how this unfolds. What's more important? Values or power? Stay tuned.
Chris B.
Not all Republicans are racist. But many of the policies that their party advocates are. Such as the suppression of people of color voting. Such as Donald Trump and his real estate practices, birtherism and his immigration positions.

It is really surprising that this man was elected as a Democrat with that picture in a yearbook. But again,this is the South. I'm curious about his "body of work" since the picture was taken. Has there been the hint of racism since?
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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:49 AM   #124
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I didn't know he was a republican CNN always gets it ....right
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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:53 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Except that this actually happened and the Gov was proud enough of it to stick it in his yearbook, while the claims against K were laughably fale and totally unproven.
Well, yes. It is rather easy for things to remain "unproven" if they're not actually investigated properly.

Quote:
Thanks, tho, for going "on record" tho.
You, tho, are welcome tho.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:53 AM   #126
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so much for owning it:

NEWS: Northam is calling Va Dems and telling them that’s *not* him in the yearbook photo and he will make a statement this afternoon to say the same. In other words, he is NOT quitting as of right now.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 08:54 AM   #127
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Where was the governor when Smollett was attacked?
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:00 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Well, yes. It is rather easy for things to remain "unproven" if they're not actually investigated properly.

You, tho, are welcome tho.
It is even easier when they were false to begin with. By the way? false claims that are mentioned for the first time 35 years later make it hard to investigate, no?

It is groovy, I don't hold it against the lying Doctor with her 13th hour hail mary lies
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:04 AM   #129
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Did Kavanaugh admit to his actions as a teen? Did he explain how he no longer has a drinking problem.

Do you see the difference?
I'm not compelled to forgive one person's misdeeds because they say (after they've been caught) that they are very, sincerely sorry and have lots of black friends and just loved In Living Color. I'm certainly not compelled to forgive one person's misdeeds because another different person is not sorry for his own misdeeds.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:16 AM   #130
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
It is even easier when they were false to begin with. By the way? false claims that are mentioned for the first time 35 years later make it hard to investigate, no?

It is groovy, I don't hold it against the lying Doctor with her 13th hour hail mary lies
There is no evidence that Dr. Ford was lying. There's plenty of evidence that Kavanaugh was. Believe what you want.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:21 AM   #131
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I'm not compelled to forgive one person's misdeeds because they say (after they've been caught) that they are very, sincerely sorry and have lots of black friends and just loved In Living Color. I'm certainly not compelled to forgive one person's misdeeds because another different person is not sorry for his own misdeeds.
What do you mean "caught" You act as if the Governor did something criminal yesterday as opposed to something distasteful 35 years ago.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:35 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
It is even easier when they were false to begin with. By the way? false claims that are mentioned for the first time 35 years later make it hard to investigate, no?

It is groovy, I don't hold it against the lying Doctor with her 13th hour hail mary lies
I think if you really want to go over the Kavanaugh stuff again, then it should probably happen in the Kavanaugh thread. I think I've given evidence that my position is not a hypocritical one, and that I'm not applying different standards or requiring different levels of evidence depending on where on the political spectrum people fall. I'm not convinced you can say the same.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:41 AM   #133
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I'm not compelled to forgive one person's misdeeds because they say (after they've been caught) that they are very, sincerely sorry and have lots of black friends and just loved In Living Color. I'm certainly not compelled to forgive one person's misdeeds because another different person is not sorry for his own misdeeds.
If you can't see the difference you aren't looking very hard.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:45 AM   #134
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My take on this is that had it come out before the election and he was still elected, it would have been better. The people would have had their chance to decide on it.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:49 AM   #135
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
My take on this is that had it come out before the election and he was still elected, it would have been better. The people would have had their chance to decide on it.
Yes. But oh well. Maybe if we knew that Trump and his staff were conspiring to defraud the US Trumpturd wouldn't have been elected.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 09:56 AM   #136
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Yes. But oh well. Maybe if we knew that Trump and his staff were conspiring to defraud the US Trumpturd wouldn't have been elected.
But that was obvious to anyone paying attention.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:02 AM   #137
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
But that was obvious to anyone paying attention.
You would think.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:16 AM   #138
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https://twitter.com/ElieNYC/status/1091605726341095424

Quote:
So, my senior year of high school I moved to Indiana for my senior year. At the new school, seniors got their own parking spots and could paint it however they wished.

In my randomly assigned spot, the previous senior had painted it with the Confederate flag.

People didn't notice this would be a problem until I showed up and then *everybody* noticed it would be a problem.

It was quickly repainted. Not even by me. But by members of the football team which I had been practicing with a little bit over the summer.

I tell this story now because I notice how the #RalphNortham conversation isn't really focused on the harm he caused to his classmates in real time. There were black people in his school in 1984. And 1985, and 86 and so on. Imagine what they must have thought.

Imagine, coming into medical school, excited and terrified at the same time, flipping thought last year's yearbook that's lying around somewhere, and coming across blackface bro and Klansman friend. Imagine not knowing which one of your classmates will be "the one" your year.

Imagine literally never being able to show your OWN damn yearbook, from your successful time at MEDICAL SCHOOL, to your children because you don't EVER want them to see the racism you went through.

Northman never apologized to those classmates. He's had 35 freaking years to do so. He didn't go up to black people at the reunion and say "hey, maybe you saw our yearbook from that year? I'm sorry, deeply sorry, I ruined it for everybody."

It's not a victimless crime. It's not a politically incorrect foible. Northam hurt people, and didn't apologize for it until he got caught and wanted to keep his job.

He shouldn't be able to get away with it.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:19 AM   #139
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According to CNN, Northam now says it isn't him and he has no recollection of taking the photo. Because, of course.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:22 AM   #140
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
According to CNN, Northam now says it isn't him and he has no recollection of taking the photo. Because, of course.
If that's the case, he has to explain why it's on his yearbook page. Yet to be heard from are the yearbook editors who allowed it to be published. Numerous Democrats have called for his resignation. Nobody is defending this guy.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:24 AM   #141
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
If he was a Republican, he'd be called a racist for even knowing someone from that yearbook pic.

"Racist" is such a "go to" word among Democrats it will be hilarious to see how this unfolds. What's more important? Values or power? Stay tuned.
Chris B.
Let's dig into it.

Now that I've heard from enough black Virginians, I'll happily say that Northram should step down. He was elected post-Charlottesville, in the face of an openly racist opponent, and in part due to record black turnout. This photo just suddenly appearing is a slap in the face.

Republicans face a vastly worse problem than a photo in blackface. They're the party that stands up for violent police, and call nonviolent black protesters "rioters and looters", and decries BLM as "racist" even as they stand up for white victims of police violence, or as "terrorists" even though they're nonviolent. Their party is the one that gutted the Voting Rights Act. Their party is the one that guts enforcement of equal rights in housing, banking, education, and hiring. Your senators (sans Tim Scott) puts openly racist judges on the bench. For that Matter, they're the ones who installed Dolt 45 and his band of white supremacists (Gorka, Bannon, Miller, Sessions, among others) at the top of the executive branch.

In the states, it's republicans who protect the Confederate statues that serve as monuments to Jim Crow. They're the ones who celebrate the slaver and traitor Robert E. Lee. THey're the ones who fly the Confederate battle flag. They're the ones who purge black voters from voter rolls, and who do everything in their power to stop black people from voting. They also support unequal k-12 education, but that's really both parties, so that's a rare spot of parity. And they're the ones who constantly run open racists like Northram's opponent for office.

In short, the GOP has no space to speak on this issue because they defend and cause structural, systemic racism against black people, and do so with smiles on their faces. and I'm supposed to care whether they cover their faces in shoe polish first? All they are in this discussion is a distraction.

("Go to word", my entire ass...)
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:27 AM   #142
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Let's dig into it.

Now that I've heard from enough black Virginians, I'll happily say that Northram should step down. He was elected post-Charlottesville, in the face of an openly racist opponent, and in part due to record black turnout. This photo just suddenly appearing is a slap in the face.

Republicans ...
I deleted the fallacious whatabout Republican rant because this is still a site for critical thinking
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:28 AM   #143
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
According to CNN, Northam now says it isn't him and he has no recollection of taking the photo. Because, of course.
...after having apologised for being in the photo...
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:30 AM   #144
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
...after having apologised for being in the photo...
How Trumpy. Now he really has to go and it's been too long already.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:35 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
I deleted the fallacious whatabout Republican rant because this is still a site for critical thinking
Your very first post in this thread was whataboutism. That makes this accusation of hypocrisy rather ironic.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:37 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by Travis View Post
Personally I just want my side to WIN.





Northam? I've actually been reporting death threats against him for about 48 hours now on Twitter thanks to that abortion bill that has the conservative universe absolutely apoplectic.

Now, with this also in the fray? I might just abstain from Twitter for a day or so.
Well, a day or so would be a good start. Several posters here have expressed concern for your emotional well-being and how you appear to have an unhealthy relationship with online comments. What would it take for you to believe that these concerns are sincere, and for you to take them seriously? If you have spent any time at all "reporting death threats" on Twitter, please realize that the Governor, nation, Twitter and all concerned will go on just fine without your participation.

Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
According to CNN, Northam now says it isn't him and he has no recollection of taking the photo. Because, of course.
That is the least believable excuse ever. "I'm in this photo, but I'm not sure which one is me."

I'd like for him not to resign, just to put a stake in the ground against 30-year-old witch hunts. Even real witches should get to keep their jobs 30 years later. Let's see Virginians pursue a legal, constitutional remedy to recall the governor if he's no longer wanted.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:40 AM   #147
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
That is the least believable excuse ever. "I'm in this photo, but I'm not sure which one is me."
Or he did it so often, he honestly can't remember which time it was. It's a terrible 'excuse'.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 10:41 AM   #148
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Maybe he went with a friend to a Halloween party as a Klanster and a Black person portrayed as good friends? Like there was supposed to be a positive message about racial harmony in the New South?

If I were him, that’s the story I’d go with. Ok, that’s still a bit too edgy but if you can sell a positive intent, maybe it would mitigate the whole thing.

I do have to wonder though...if there had been no picture but instead a black classmate who shared a story about the costume, would anyone be asking him to step down on that basis only?


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Old 2nd February 2019, 11:10 AM   #149
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
According to CNN, Northam now says it isn't him and he has no recollection of taking the photo. Because, of course.
This only makes things worse. It's on his yearbook page, he had no problem stating that he was one of the people in the photo just yesterday - meaning that he didn't think "no way would I do that.", and he recalled *doing* it.

Just go away, Northram.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 11:50 AM   #150
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I hear he is having second thoughts about resigning, he does not want a black man to take over as governor. Guess he didn't leave that racism behind in Medical school!

/shamelessly stolen from somewhere on twitter
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Old 2nd February 2019, 12:00 PM   #151
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
This only makes things worse. It's on his yearbook page, he had no problem stating that he was one of the people in the photo just yesterday - meaning that he didn't think "no way would I do that.", and he recalled *doing* it.

Just go away, Northram.
For sure. What an idiot. I second that opinion, Mumbles. "Just go away, Northam"!
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Old 2nd February 2019, 12:20 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
I hear he is having second thoughts about resigning, he does not want a black man to take over as governor. Guess he didn't leave that racism behind in Medical school!

/shamelessly stolen from somewhere on twitter

I hear he is going to regale us with a story about fighting Nazi astronauts on the moons around Jupiter.


/shamelessly made up like so much nonsense in this thread
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Old 2nd February 2019, 12:59 PM   #153
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The governor is holding a press conference now claiming that he never bought the yearbook, never saw the page until it was shown to him this week, that he never submitted that picture, that he doesn't appear in it, and that others have reported pictures had been placed on their pages erroneously in the same yearbook. I'd like to hear from the people who actually edited and produced the yearbook.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:05 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Let's dig into it.

Now that I've heard from enough black Virginians, I'll happily say that Northram should step down. He was elected post-Charlottesville, in the face of an openly racist opponent, and in part due to record black turnout. This photo just suddenly appearing is a slap in the face.

Republicans face a vastly worse problem than a photo in blackface. They're the party that stands up for violent police, and call nonviolent black protesters "rioters and looters", and decries BLM as "racist" even as they stand up for white victims of police violence, or as "terrorists" even though they're nonviolent. Their party is the one that gutted the Voting Rights Act. Their party is the one that guts enforcement of equal rights in housing, banking, education, and hiring. Your senators (sans Tim Scott) puts openly racist judges on the bench. For that Matter, they're the ones who installed Dolt 45 and his band of white supremacists (Gorka, Bannon, Miller, Sessions, among others) at the top of the executive branch.

In the states, it's republicans who protect the Confederate statues that serve as monuments to Jim Crow. They're the ones who celebrate the slaver and traitor Robert E. Lee. THey're the ones who fly the Confederate battle flag. They're the ones who purge black voters from voter rolls, and who do everything in their power to stop black people from voting. They also support unequal k-12 education, but that's really both parties, so that's a rare spot of parity. And they're the ones who constantly run open racists like Northram's opponent for office.

In short, the GOP has no space to speak on this issue because they defend and cause structural, systemic racism against black people, and do so with smiles on their faces. and I'm supposed to care whether they cover their faces in shoe polish first? All they are in this discussion is a distraction.

("Go to word", my entire ass...)
Regarding Confederate statues, you can't revise history to better suit your current views. It already happened so learn from it.

Regarding voters and voting, I'd suggest you focus on the areas where registered voters outnumber those eligible to vote to determine where voter fraud is most likely happening.

And yes, the term "Racist" is thrown around by those on the left daily. Name one day in the past 2 years the word "Racist" has not been used on CNN. You won't be able to.

An accusation which is not supported by evidence likely didn't happen. Perhaps people should require some evidence before they label someone "Racist". Something like a photo.

Chris B.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:16 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Regarding Confederate statues, you can't revise history to better suit your current views. It already happened so learn from it.
....

These statues were not erected in 1868 by tearful survivors as memorials to the Civil War dead. They were mostly put up during the massive 20th century resistance to desegregation and the civil rights movement. They had a specific political intent, like a swastika, and that's why they are offensive and should be demolished. The glorification of the Confederacy is pure fraud.

Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
.....
Regarding voters and voting, I'd suggest you focus on the areas where registered voters outnumber those eligible to vote to determine where voter fraud is most likely happening.
And where would those be? No one has ever proven any significant voter fraud. And just moving without updating your address is not fraud.

Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
....
And yes, the term "Racist" is thrown around by those on the left daily. Name one day in the past 2 years the word "Racist" has not been used on CNN. You won't be able to.
....
The term "racist" is thrown around a lot because racism is endemic to our society. When cops shoot unarmed black kids out of fear that they are "probably" dangerous, or when they arrest black people when they might have given a warning to whites, or when voter suppression efforts explicitly target black voters and black neighborhoods, when proud white nationalists march in Charlottesville, and when a President gets elected by claiming that migrants are rapists and murderers and voters swallow it whole, there's plenty of racism to go around.

Last edited by Bob001; 2nd February 2019 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:41 PM   #156
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
The governor is holding a press conference now claiming that he never bought the yearbook, never saw the page until it was shown to him this week, that he never submitted that picture, that he doesn't appear in it, and that others have reported pictures had been placed on their pages erroneously in the same yearbook. I'd like to hear from the people who actually edited and produced the yearbook.
If this had been Northam's first response, I would be willing to accept it tentatively, pending an investigation into the yearbook. It's plausible that a photo could be erroneously placed (accidentally or otherwise), and if it's true that other examples of erroneous photos have been found in the yearbook, that becomes even more plausible - although I would have to see the examples of these other erroneous photos.

But unfortunately we have this gigantic, brilliant-glowing-neon problem, that yesterday Northam confirmed the photo was genuine, acknowledged it was racist, and apologized for it. From his official statement:

Quote:
Earlier today, a website published a photograph of me from my 1984 medical school yearbook in a costume that is clearly racist and offensive.

I am deeply sorry for the decision I made to appear as I did in this photo and for the hurt that decision caused then and now.

This behavior is not in keeping with who I am today and the values I have fought for throughout my career in the military, in medicine, and in public service. But I want to be clear, I understand how this decision shakes Virginians’ faith in that commitment.
Now he's taking it all back? This reversal is causing me to lose even more respect for Northam than the original incident.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:49 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Now he's taking it all back? This reversal is causing me to lose even more respect for Northam than the original incident.

Well it sounds like he rushed to try and apologize because it was what his advisers thought wise even while he was thinking "I don't really remember this, is that even me?"
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:56 PM   #158
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Northam claims there's a difference between the actions pictured in the yearbook photo and dressing up in blackface for a Michael Jackson dance contest. "They're both wrong, but I would hope people would see the contrast."
It's breathtaking watching a man take a shotgun to both his legs in public.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:57 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by shuttlt View Post
It seems a bit unlikely that that is consciously how the average republican thinks. If you ignore the "mothers life is in danger/child has a life threatening illness/severely disabled" reasons, 75% of Americans are against abortion being legal. Disagreement with this goes way beyond the Republicans. This is a gift for them, pushing this law created a situation where 75% of the country agrees with Republicans against the Democrats. Presumably CNN won't focus on that, so it just reinforces the Republican base and drives the Democrats and the Republicans further apart over an issue they mostly agree on. If Trump wants, he can now truthfully claim Democrats wanted to make it legal to execute healthy babies.... it's beyond stupid.
I don't know where you get your figures. But I KNOW for a FACT that they are FALSE. This is like arguing with Trump as he pulls points straight out of his ass.

All I can say, is good luck with that.
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Old 2nd February 2019, 01:58 PM   #160
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Originally Posted by Travis View Post
Well it sounds like he rushed to try and apologize because it was what his advisers thought wise even while he was thinking "I don't really remember this, is that even me?"
I don't buy that either.

If somebody ever produces my yearbook page from any school I attended and it contains a photo of two people wearing blackface and a Klan robe, I would not hesitate even a moment to assert with complete confidence that the photo must be erroneously placed and could not possibly depict me, because I have never ever worn blackface or a Klan robe, so such a photo of me could not be physically possible - no question, end of story. There's really no room for waffling about this, unless Northam knows he has appeared in either costume at some point and is simply unsure whether this particular photograph is a depiction of himself at such a time.
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