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Old 22nd January 2017, 09:08 AM   #681
Oystein
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
Thanks for documenting that
a) funds were solicited and many sent in before Chris relayed Millette's intention to publish a paper
b) this is explictly not included in what Millette is being contracted and payed for out of the donations, but a goodie on top
c) Chris hoped that there will be a reviewed paper in the end

So I was right: Ziggi lied about Chris "promising" a reviewed paper. He never did such a thing, nor did I, and certainly neither of us did in connection with soliciting funds.

Thanks again for your effort, Criteria! You Truthers can always be dependet on to debunk yourselves
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Old 22nd January 2017, 09:09 AM   #682
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
Where is there an explicit promise made of when publishing would happen?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 09:11 AM   #683
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Where is there an explicit promise made of when that publishing would happen?
FTFY.
Can you answer the fixed question?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 09:21 AM   #684
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
The attempt to pin a "he did it too", even if true, on Millette, would not change the fact that Basile has not produced as promised. It does not address my questions above concerning ziggi's claim that no one knew it would take 3+ years.
Nor does it not address the title of this thread.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 03:15 PM   #685
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
On the 4th of January, 2012, Chris Mohr posted an email quote from his correspondence with Dr. Millette:



It certainly appears that Chris Mohr interpreted Dr. Millette’s words as a promise of more than a “lab report”.
The "lab report", the paper, debunks the liars in 9/11 truth. Jones made up thermite with no evidence, and he was fired for spreading lies. Gullible followers of 9/11 truth take it on faith, and ignore the fact Jones paper lied about thermite. Reading comprehension is required, and exposes the conclusion for thermite in the Jones vanity journal paper of woo is not supported by the evidence and statements found in the paper.

Have someone read the paper for you, so you can see the conclusion has no foundation except in the failed paranoid conspiracy mind of Jones, fired for going nuts on 9/11. Where is Jones now? Jones best work is about Christ walking in the New World; better work than his thermite fraud.
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Old 24th January 2017, 12:52 PM   #686
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Ziggi, two weeks ago:

http://911debunkers.blogspot.de/2017...continues.html
"On December 27, 2016, I had a short phone conversation with Mr. Mark Basile. He continues to work on his red/gray chip study in his spare time and he will contact us as soon as he is ready to write up some results - which he hopes to do in a few months time. We apologize for the delays and thank our supporters for their patience. The results will be worth the wait. Finally, we would like to remind readers that new WTC dust samples are welcome in case anyone knows about a possible supply."
This documents three facts:
  1. Mark Basile is not actually working on the samples at all. A competent analyst would not need more than a few weeks.
  2. Mark Basile no longer intends to send any samples to any independent lab. For why else would HE be working on them?
  3. The samples that he has contain red-gray chips (he has shown examples years ago), but he know or at least suspects already that not a single one is actually "thermitic".
Ziggi edited this blog post and added the following:
"Clarification: An independent lab will double-check results, and the donated money goes to independent tests as advertised. Mr. Basile will contact us when the independent testing has concluded."
Ok, I am glad they are still at least talking about labs.
Doesn't help their questionable legal position much. Mark promised, when donation were solicited, that he would let independent labs do all the tests, and that he would report whatever the labs found. That the lab test would be "blind tests", i.e. the labs would not get a hint of what results to get.

Now the deal is changed to that he will only report what he finds, and the labs will be told what to find.

This is akin to saying "I test and test and test until I happen on a set of data that can be construed as confirming my bias, and then hire a lab to confirm my bias".

Ziggi essentially announced Basile's intention to commit scientific fraud.
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Old 24th January 2017, 01:32 PM   #687
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Ziggi is making it up as he goes along. The chance of anything scientific coming out of this next to nil.
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Old 24th January 2017, 01:42 PM   #688
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Has Rich Shaddock had anything to say on the study lately? At one time he was trying to get the money back from Mark and do his own study (as per the original promise).
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Old 24th January 2017, 01:53 PM   #689
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Has Rich Shaddock had anything to say on the study lately? At one time he was trying to get the money back from Mark and do his own study (as per the original promise).
I haven't seen or heard anything from Rick since ... well, at least since his hero Trump won the election
I didn't look or ask specifically, though
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Old 27th February 2017, 02:18 PM   #690
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I just looked over the "Proposal for Labs to Study the Building Fire Dust" located on the http://www.markbasile.org/ site and saw this, which I found interesting...

Quote:
Analytical Costs:

The following work is in need of funding to be run at independent facilities.

- DSC costs are $190 per scan and an estimated 5 to20 scans are desired, to look at the following materials in both air and inert atmospheres;

2 samples each of known building primer paint

2 samples each of red chips of suspected primer from building dust

5 sample each of red/gray chips or red layer only from red/gray chips

-ESCA costs are $330 per hour and a total of 4 to 8 hours is desired. This should allow for evaluation of at least two known thermitic red/gray chips with some sputtering for depth profile information as well.
The hilited portion is the part Mark is having an issue with and why it's taking him so long. He's identifying the two kinds of primer paint used in the buildings contained within the dust and cannot find any of the suspected thermite red/gray chips as there are none. They're all turning out to be primer paint.
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Old 25th April 2017, 03:47 PM   #691
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The months click by and still no progress..........
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Old 27th April 2017, 05:49 AM   #692
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
The months click by and still no progress..........
I wouldn't be surprised if he actually does find a paint at world trade center that can be ignited in an inert atmosphere, because I found a paint that was there that contained aluminum.
Red Aluminum metal flake paint, Some of it has a base similar to Laclade.

It was commonly used on motor cycles, cars and fire engines.

So potential for it's existence in the buildings is there though it would be very rare.
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Old 27th April 2017, 05:52 AM   #693
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Originally Posted by Crazy Chainsaw View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if he actually does find a paint at world trade center that can be ignited in an inert atmosphere, because I found a paint that was there that contained aluminum.
Red Aluminum metal flake paint, Some of it has a base similar to Laclade.

It was commonly used on motor cycles, cars and fire engines.

So potential for it's existence in the buildings is there though it would be very rare.
Fire trucks were damaged and destroyed during the collapse, as of course were cars.
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Old 27th April 2017, 04:08 PM   #694
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Originally Posted by Mark F View Post
Fire trucks were damaged and destroyed during the collapse, as of course were cars.
And motorcycles, people love metal flake paint, and a lot of metal flake paint, contains Aluminum.
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Old 27th April 2017, 09:50 PM   #695
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Exclamation

.
The sun will burn out in a few billion years and I hope that he will have completed his study by then.
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Old 28th April 2017, 04:27 AM   #696
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
.
The sun will burn out in a few billion years and I hope that he will have completed his study by then.
Have hope he may infact complete his studies before, the milky way becomes a quazar in a few trillion years.
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Old 23rd May 2017, 04:08 PM   #697
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Wow how time flies. Another month goes by and still no progress reported.

Seven and a half years ago when Mark requested quotes on costs for tests seems like yesterday.............
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Old 23rd May 2017, 04:57 PM   #698
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
4. Mark Basile "continues to work on his red/gray chip study in his spare time and he will contact us as soon as he is ready to write up some results - which he hopes to do in a few months time".
Originally Posted by jaydeehess View Post
Really?

24th November 2015, 05:42 PM


That "update" from Ziggi, was over a year ago.

Shall we check back again in another year, or just check in every second year?
Originally Posted by pgimeno View Post
Well, "a few months" is a subjective concept. For some people, "more than 60 months" may still be "a few".
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Wow how time flies. Another month goes by and still no progress reported.

Seven and a half years ago when Mark requested quotes on costs for tests seems like yesterday.............

Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time.

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Old 24th May 2017, 10:27 AM   #699
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Originally Posted by BasqueArch View Post
Everywhere is within walking distance if you have the time.

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By the time Basile actually starts it will be debunked so what is the point?
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Old 10th June 2017, 11:38 AM   #700
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Ziggi, two weeks ago:

http://911debunkers.blogspot.de/2017...continues.html
"On December 27, 2016, I had a short phone conversation with Mr. Mark Basile. He continues to work on his red/gray chip study in his spare time and he will contact us as soon as he is ready to write up some results - which he hopes to do in a few months time. We apologize for the delays and thank our supporters for their patience. The results will be worth the wait. Finally, we would like to remind readers that new WTC dust samples are welcome in case anyone knows about a possible supply."
This documents three facts:
  1. Mark Basile is not actually working on the samples at all. A competent analyst would not need more than a few weeks.
  2. Mark Basile no longer intends to send any samples to any independent lab. For why else would HE be working on them?
  3. The samples that he has contain red-gray chips (he has shown examples years ago), but he know or at least suspects already that not a single one is actually "thermitic".
Ziggi edited this blog post and added the following:
"Clarification: An independent lab will double-check results, and the donated money goes to independent tests as advertised. Mr. Basile will contact us when the independent testing has concluded."
...
Correction:
Ziggi made that clarification in a separate blog post on January 22, 2017 - two days after I made the first of the quoted posts above:
http://911debunkers.blogspot.de/2017...gray-chip.html
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Old 12th June 2017, 12:10 PM   #701
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So how long has it been exactly since the $5000 was provided to Mark Basile?
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Old 12th June 2017, 12:30 PM   #702
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I don't think anyone knows for sure. There has not really been anything that comes close to transparency in this matter (or this study).

If we assume the money was transferred immediately after the goal ($5000) was raised it would be Jan, 2014.
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Old 12th June 2017, 02:29 PM   #703
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Yes, by Jan 2014.
Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
I am dumping an old link (February 6, 2014) here of a radio talk between JM Talboo and Ziggi Zugam about the Basile study:
http://noliesradio.org/archives/76313
...
JM says the goal of $5000 has been reached - although at the time it was already known that Mark really wants $10,000.
On 07/31/2013, Basile had told the 9/11 Truth Teleconference that he was at $1500.

Some of the money was raised directly to a PayPal account in Mark's name.
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Old 12th June 2017, 02:40 PM   #704
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This is too funny...
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Old 26th July 2017, 09:24 AM   #705
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The occasion for this bump is a comment written today on 911Blogger by dtg86 (whose real name I think I knew at some time, but forgot; dtg are almost certainly initials). He is a bona fide truther, from what I have read in the past: Happily convinced of the "explosive demolitions after 4 plane crashes" teaching of the Truth Denomination that's most in line with 911Blogger, but not without some critical capacity.

Originally Posted by dtg86
Time marches on

and still, the only update we have is "I'm working on it". Well another year and more has passed. No updates, no lab chosen. What exactly is he working on and what exactly is the hold up? The shelf life of the red chips has to be waning fast if there is one. I'm unsure of that aspect, but I believe I've read the potency of the chips deteriorates over time.

If there are other mitigating factors outside of the technical aspect such as the quality of the chips, amount of chips needed to be tested (waiting on more samples), threats or coercion (no one is asking him to risk his or his family's safety), then update us and drop the project. Donate the funds to Architects and Engineers and move on. At least post a bank statement that the funds are still available. Frankly and sadly, we are left to conclude that the funds were never used for purpose intended. This makes donating for other projects for research, such as http://www.wtc7evaluation.org/, even more difficult since no one will trust that their donation will be used for the purposes stated.
Any apologists willing to declare dtg86 a foul apple, a traitor, a plant?
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Old 2nd August 2017, 06:18 AM   #706
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Wow how time flies. Another month goes by and still no progress reported.

Seven and a half years ago when Mark requested quotes on costs for tests seems like yesterday.............

Mark Basile has chosen September to release his update.

http://911debunkers.blogspot.ca/2017...ming-soon.html
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Old 2nd August 2017, 06:38 AM   #707
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
Mark Basile has chosen September to release his update.

http://911debunkers.blogspot.ca/2017...ming-soon.html
An update, but not the results?
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Old 2nd August 2017, 09:15 AM   #708
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16 years of lies

Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
Mark Basile has chosen September to release his update.

http://911debunkers.blogspot.ca/2017...ming-soon.html
Will it be released to Alex Jones, the hero of 9/11 truth cult members.

When will 9/11 truth give up the 9/11 was an inside job failed tagline...

Another fake study by 9/11 truth nuts, just in time to celebrate 16 years spreading lies and dumbed down claims. How long does a fake study take?

The web site you posted is super woo. 9/11 debunkers web site is extra credit paranoid nonsense, dumbed down with anti-science rhetoric. Why are all 9/11 truth web sites spreading lies tailored to match the overwhelming ignorance of the 9/11 truth believers and failed followers. Like Alex Jones but with better click bait and ads.

16 years of BS from 9/11 truth - a fake movement that claims to have "overwhelming evidence", which is never posted. Where is 9/11 truth hiding this "evidence".
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Old 2nd August 2017, 09:40 AM   #709
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Originally Posted by Criteria View Post
Mark Basile has chosen September to release his update.

http://911debunkers.blogspot.ca/2017...ming-soon.html
We should quote that blog post fully:
Originally Posted by Ziggi
Mark Basile is still working on his red/gray chip study, and we are expecting an update about 6 weeks from now, in September 2017.

We wish to thank our donors for their patience. If anyone wants the money returned on account of this taking too long, please contact me: ziggizugam@gmail.com
In other words: Ziggi and Basile, partners in crime, have determined they no longer plan to use the money as intended on competent and sufficient tests done by independent labs.

Remember that 4 (four!) years ago, Basile had informed participants of the "9/11 Truth Teleconference" that collecting $5000 was only a first step, that ideally he'd need closer to $10,000 to have the independent lab tests done that are necessary to move the science forward
http://houston911truth.net/audio/073113.wav

I'll quote from 04:43 minutes:
Originally Posted by Mark Basile July 2013
What I basically ask for at this point is about 5,000 dollars. Well, not exactly 5,000 dollars, and I think that's an appropriate amount to basically get us some answers that can confirm what's already been put out there [by Harrit et al]. If that happens, and I see the people are really willing to contribute, I'd like to actually get about 10,000 dollars, is more where my original proposal started, and I think I can basically confirm and then I actually move the science a bit more forward, if you will.
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Old 2nd August 2017, 11:16 AM   #710
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Thanks, Oystein. When i read Criteria's pist my first question was "September this year?"
Your quote confirms that at least it will be this year.
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Old 2nd August 2017, 03:57 PM   #711
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Just LOL. If Ziggi were serious about doing the right thing, he would just contact all of the donors directly and offer the money back. Making a blog post that all of 10 people will ever see doesn't help the people he and Mark stole from.
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Old 2nd August 2017, 04:21 PM   #712
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Can I assume Ziggi is now in control/possession of the money?

Last I heard on the money was, Rick Shaddock trying to get it back so he could start a real independent study.

Where is the money Ziggi? I'm sure a person of Ziggi's stature wouldn't mind posting a deposit statement.
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Last edited by DGM; 2nd August 2017 at 04:27 PM.
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Old 11th August 2017, 07:27 PM   #713
Oystein
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Now that Ziggi has delurked, perhaps he can quickly attend this question:
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Can I assume Ziggi is now in control/possession of the money?

Where is the money Ziggi? I'm sure a person of Ziggi's stature wouldn't mind posting a deposit statement.
Also, I said upthread that offering to return the money means that there are no longer plans to spend the money on necessary and competent independent lab tests. That, in other words, Basile and Ziggi have given up on the study. Ziggi could comment on that as well. I will of course take silence as an (affirmative) answer.
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