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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:31 PM   #321
Old coarse guy
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Please explain?
Explain what ?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:32 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
Explain what ?
Why this is important.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:32 PM   #323
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
I think you are double counting the bottom floor.
You mean the one floor beneath the horizontal concrete beam?

Looks like a 1 to me.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:34 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Why this is important.
It is important because the height that I see given for the building is 42m. The amount of storeys that you and many others are claiming is 17. That makes no sense in terms of anyone's thinking, including NIST's and the CTBUH.

Does it make sense to you ?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:34 PM   #325
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Have you ever dropped a sheet of plywood, Tony? Moves quite a lot air around.

Try it sometime.
Maybe you can do an experiment and drop a piece of plywood into a wooden cage filled with flour and see if it comes out in a focused way at just certain places through the exterior of the cage.

I don't need to do an experiment to know it won't but maybe you do.

Last edited by Tony Szamboti; 22nd January 2017 at 07:38 PM.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:35 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by pgimeno View Post
And here:

It's likely that whoever counted 17, counted the penthouse as one.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:37 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by pgimeno View Post
And here:
http://www.formauri.es/personal/pgim..._storeys_2.jpg
It's likely that whoever counted 17, counted the penthouse as one.
16 isn't right either. The building was 15 stories above ground. That is what the Iranian sites mostly say and that is what I count.

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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:37 PM   #328
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
It is important because the height that I see given for the building is 42m. The amount of storeys that you and many others are claiming is 17. That makes no sense in terms of anyone's thinking, including NIST's and the CTBUH.

Does it make sense to you ?
I've given no value for height. What difference does the height matter?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:39 PM   #329
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
I've given no value for height. What difference does the height matter?
It doesn't matter to you that they got it wrong? Doesn't it make you less confident that what they are telling you is right?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:40 PM   #330
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
Maybe you can do an experiment and drop a piece of plywood into a cage filled with flour and see if it comes out in a focused way at just certain places through the exterior of the cage.

I don't think it will.
Will do....

It did.

Think how I managed to do that.... It involved walls.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:41 PM   #331
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
I've given no value for height. What difference does the height matter?
Okay, so let's say that a building had 17 storeys that were 1m high each, and another had 17 storeys that were 3m high each. Would that matter in respect to those 2 buildings if you were researching/discussing them ?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:41 PM   #332
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Will do....

It did.

Think how I managed to do that.... It involved walls.
I am having a hard time believing you. Do you have a video?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:42 PM   #333
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
It doesn't matter to you that they got it wrong? Doesn't it make you less confident that what they are telling you is right?
It would if there was a alternative theory that I could examine.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:44 PM   #334
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
It would if there was a alternative theory that I could examine.
When you find out that the news got something wrong doesn't that lessen your confidence in and make you more skeptical of what they say?

You don't need a ready and waiting alternative to lose confidence in and be skeptical when you find what was told to you was wrong.

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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:45 PM   #335
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
Okay, so let's say that a building had 17 storeys that were 1m high each, and another had 17 storeys that were 3m high each. Would that matter in respect to those 2 buildings if you were researching/discussing them ?
You really need to make a coherent argument.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:47 PM   #336
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
You really need to make a coherent argument.
Do you agree that the building was 42m high ?

FYI that is a coherent question. Try a straight answer.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:48 PM   #337
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
When you find out that the news got something wrong doesn't that lessen your confidence in and make you more skeptical of what they say?

You don't need a ready and waiting alternative to lose confidence in and be skeptical when you find what was told to you was wrong.
Present the argument that show accepted reality is false.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:49 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
Do you agree that the building was 42m high ?

FYI that is a coherent question. Try a straight answer.
I ask, Why should I care?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:49 PM   #339
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
I am having a hard time believing you. Do you have a video?
No, did you want me to take one?

I did not even bother with cage! I dropped it in my garage, and used dead leaves instead of flour. The leaves went billowing out the door. Fun.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:50 PM   #340
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Present the argument that show accepted reality is false.
The articles, as well as the CTBUH listing for it, that claimed the Plasco building was 17 stories above ground when it clearly was 15 stories above ground.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:51 PM   #341
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
The articles, as well as the CTBUH listing for it, that claimed the Plasco building was 17 stories above ground when it clearly was 15 stories above ground.
It matters how?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:51 PM   #342
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
No, did you want me to take one?

I did not even bother with cage! I dropped it in my garage, and used dead leaves instead of flour. The leaves went billowing out the door. Fun.
The leaves would not mimic air. I don't think your experiment was relevant and don't see how it told you anything.

If you aren't serious please stop responding.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:52 PM   #343
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
I ask, Why should I care?
You are asking me why you should care what height and how many storeys the building in the title of this thread had ? Seriously ???
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:52 PM   #344
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
I don't think the syringe analogy works, as it has a structural funnel, which the building doesn't have.

The syringe analogy works because the interior of a building consist mostly of air, so as each floor collapses upon one another, where is all of that interior air going to go?

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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:52 PM   #345
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
It matters how?
Accuracy matters in analysis.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:53 PM   #346
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
The syringe analogy works because the interior of a building consist mostly of air, so as each floor collapses upon another, where is all of that interior air going to go?
There is no funnel in the building to a particular location like there is with the syringe. The air in the building should blow out all four sides fairly evenly if a floor collapsed upon another. Why don't we see that?

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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:54 PM   #347
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
The leaves would not mimic air. I don't think your experiment was relevant and don't see how it told you anything.

If you aren't serious please stop responding.
The leaves are not mimicking "air" for Christ sake.

If you are not serious, please stop responding.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:54 PM   #348
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
You are asking me why you should care what height and how many storeys the building in the title of this thread had ? Seriously ???
Yes I am. Please explain the point you are making questioning the actual height?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:56 PM   #349
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
Accuracy matters in analysis.
Yes it does. A valid starting hypothesis is also important.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:57 PM   #350
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Yes I am. Please explain the point you are making questioning the actual height?
I am questioning if this joins Shyam's "building 7 club" of failures of buildings over 15 storeys, due predominantly to fire.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:59 PM   #351
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
I am questioning if this joins Shyam's "building 7 club" of failures of buildings over 15 storeys, due predominantly to fire.
Does it really matter?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:01 PM   #352
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Does it really matter?
Yes, of course it does. Because if the building IS over 15 storeys then that doubles the membership of Shyam's "building 7 club".

So do you agree that the building was 42m high ?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:01 PM   #353
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Yes it does. A valid starting hypothesis is also important.
Well when I see free fall or near free fall acceleration and focused expulsions from a collapsing building, that was also on fire, both fire and explosives are going to be involved in my initial hypotheses.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:02 PM   #354
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
Yes, of course it does. Because if the building IS over 15 storeys then that doubles the membership of Shyam's "building 7 club".

So do you agree that the building was 42m high ?
Why does it matter? Is someone somewhere keeping a score?

Who belongs to this "club"?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:04 PM   #355
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
A valid starting hypothesis is also important.Except for ascertaining the amount of storeys and the height of the building that we are discussing

Fixed that for ya.

Welcome.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:04 PM   #356
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
There is no funnel in the building to a particular location like there is with the syringe.

You are giving me an excuse to question your claim as a 31-year expert because an expert would have known exactly what I am talking about.

Quote:
The air in the building should blow out all four sides fairly evenly if a floor collapsed upon another. Why don't we see that?

What does the 'path of least resistance' mean? As a 31-year expert, you are supposed to know how that applies when a building collapses.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:05 PM   #357
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Originally Posted by Tony Szamboti View Post
Well when I see free fall or near free fall acceleration and focused expulsions from a collapsing building, that was also on fire, both fire and explosives are going to be involved in my initial hypotheses.
Someone should care what you "see" why?
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:05 PM   #358
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Why does it matter? Is someone somewhere keeping a score?

Who belongs to this "club"?
Apparently NIST are yes. As you can see in the much posted video around 32s. Would you like me to post it for you again ?

WTC7 is so far the only member, as per Shyam Sunder in said video.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:08 PM   #359
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Originally Posted by Old coarse guy View Post
Fixed that for ya.

Welcome.
I'm done with you. dodging my post by altering them is seen by members here as the ultimate deception.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 08:10 PM   #360
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
I'm done with you. dodging my post by altering them is seen by members hear as the ultimate deception.
I posted the addition in red and stated that i fixed it for you. I understand why you would rather not have this exchange with me though.
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