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Old 26th March 2020, 02:25 PM   #41
dudalb
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This Trump supporter is not saying much

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/03/chr...lemHY0.twitter

Man, evolution on the fast track is a beautiful thing to see...
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:33 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
Instapundit links to a bunch of stuff, including the article the prestige posted earlier. And they have comments on everything.

The Theology Online Forums are not for the weak hearted. It is similar to this place in a lot of ways, but kind of in a mirror image sort of way. Many of these people have the opposite of TDS.

This forum is great. They have a mix, including those who support Trump's recent actions. They also have a "corona virus science" thread that is intended to be used strictly for discussion of the scientific aspects of the pandemic.

Maybe check Victor Davis Hanson and/or Scott Adams, but I'm not sure what they're up to these days.

I see Hanson on Fox News frequently. I enjoyed when he demonstrated he has no idea what inductive and deductive reasoning are. I laughed.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:39 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
I enjoyed when he demonstrated he has no idea what inductive and deductive reasoning are. I laughed.
???
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:43 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
???

It was several months if not a year or more ago, on Laura Ingraham, I believe. I'm not gonna hunt down a clip, but he was claiming something along the lines that liberals are flawed because they use deductive reasoning. He claimed (paraphrasing) that inductive reasoning was when you base your position on the facts while in deductive reasoning you twist the facts to fit your position. Something like that, anyway.

Yeah, total nonsense, and anyone who listens to that garbage should be embarrassed.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:52 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Retired law professor and regular socio-political blogger Ann Althouse examines the same question with her readers, here:

https://althouse.blogspot.com/2020/0...astically.html

You might like her more "neutral" approach to all things Trump.

Anyway, that's the closest thing I can offer, to what you're asking for. I don't follow any right wing media anyway (never had any use for Fox, dropped NRO years ago, Breitbart leaves me cold, I only read about two "conservative" blogs these days).
At first I thought this was non-responsive, but I get the connection to what I was asking. It goes to "why" people are praising Trump.

I had been looking more for "how", I suppose. What were they saying that justified giving Trump credit for a great performance. However, what the link is saying is basically that the people praising him aren't basing it on what he is actually doing.

Maybe "performance" is indeed the right word.
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Old 26th March 2020, 02:56 PM   #46
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The federalist link was exactly the sort of thing I was looking for.


I also actually caught a few minutes of Dennis Praeger today. First time I've been in a car on a weekday since last Monday. He was talking about the "idiocy" of shutting down Chicago beaches.


From what I can tell, the central theme of Trump's supporters is denialism. They don't blame him for inaction, because they don't think action was all that important. Indeed, most of them would have preferred more inaction.

And, right now, that's a tenable position. Things are actually tolerable, for the most part. Yes, there are sad stories, but they are mostly happening to other people. The disease is not so pervasive that it has touched everyone's lives, whereas the cure, i.e. the economic fallout, has. For people who respond mostly to "how does this affect me?", Trump's inaction didn't harm them...….yet.

I predict it. will, but that remains to be seen.
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Old 26th March 2020, 03:30 PM   #47
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Wow. Looks like Trump did make USA first....in confirmed cases of Covid-19. And right now, the regime is in a presser talking about getting people back to work....
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Old 26th March 2020, 06:53 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
The federalist link was exactly the sort of thing I was looking for.


I also actually caught a few minutes of Dennis Praeger today. First time I've been in a car on a weekday since last Monday. He was talking about the "idiocy" of shutting down Chicago beaches.


From what I can tell, the central theme of Trump's supporters is denialism. They don't blame him for inaction, because they don't think action was all that important. Indeed, most of them would have preferred more inaction.

And, right now, that's a tenable position. Things are actually tolerable, for the most part. Yes, there are sad stories, but they are mostly happening to other people. The disease is not so pervasive that it has touched everyone's lives, whereas the cure, i.e. the economic fallout, has. For people who respond mostly to "how does this affect me?", Trump's inaction didn't harm them...….yet.
My wife is in isolation. She has not been tested, but it is presumptive.

I don't blame Trump, I blame the idiots who work at her place of business and came in even though they were sick. Then again, I realize they need to go to work because they need money.

To the extent you know me (I've only been here for 15 years or whatever it is), you know someone affected.
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Old 26th March 2020, 07:25 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I wonder how much of the high approval rating is just backlash against the absurd "iT'S RaCiSt tO SaY It cAmE FrOm cHiNa!" meme.
Let's not pretend here. We know it's all about dog whistle messaging about foreigners being to blame, like much of his other dog whistles.
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Old 26th March 2020, 07:28 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
One data point.

I get emails from a Curio and Relic firearm vendor periodically as new items become available.

on Mar 17, the email included a line complaining that the usual gun shows were closed because of "Coronavirus hysteria" that he dismissed as "mass influenza infection that 99.999% of the world will survive" and things will return to normal soon.

Received another email for new items
Mar 24th, describes it as a "current health crisis" and no snarky comments.

What a difference a week makes.

There's also been a run on ammo because that's all that the gun community knows how to do apparently. Can't get any of the usual offerings unless you're willing to pay way too much for it. So a few right wingers seem to be nervous about it, in their own way.
Lol. Run on ammo, suddenly it's a crises.
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Old 26th March 2020, 09:01 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
My wife is in isolation. She has not been tested, but it is presumptive.

I don't blame Trump, I blame the idiots who work at her place of business and came in even though they were sick. Then again, I realize they need to go to work because they need money.

To the extent you know me (I've only been here for 15 years or whatever it is), you know someone affected.
Sorry to hear that.

As time goes on, there will be more and more people whose lives this is going to touch, and I wonder how strong the denialism can be. How long will they be able to pretend it's just the flu?

Good luck.
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Old 26th March 2020, 09:14 PM   #52
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There was an evangelist pastor that denied the seriousness of covid-19 that just died. Served him right. I wonder how many others will die because of that pastor's preaching.
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Old 26th March 2020, 11:49 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
"Hujan"? Is that near "Wuhan"?
It's what the Trump supporters are calling the virus - The Hujan Tragedy!
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Old 27th March 2020, 12:22 AM   #54
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I support you all fighting this horrible American virus
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Old 27th March 2020, 01:12 AM   #55
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The couple people I see on FB that I know are Trump supporters are talking about, without a trace of irony, how it's so bad that China screwed up the preparations, lied about it, and allowed it to spread across the country.
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:04 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
There was an evangelist pastor that denied the seriousness of covid-19 that just died. Served him right. I wonder how many others will die because of that pastor's preaching.
But you don't understand. It was his time, and this was God's way of taking him to Heaven. Just as it is their time for all others who die of this. God works in mysterious ways. The believers rationalize it this way.
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:14 AM   #57
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AP Archive, March 26, 2020: Trump supporters back his stance on virus outbreak
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I AGREE
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:16 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I'm legit afraid they've already set the groundwork for being okay with that. They've already written off 1-3% of the population as acceptable losses.
Thanks Obama.
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:19 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by shemp View Post
But you don't understand. It was his time, and this was God's way of taking him to Heaven. Just as it is their time for all others who die of this. God works in mysterious ways. The believers rationalize it this way.

There's a whole thread about that in Religion and Philosphy: Coronavirus and faith.
However, I think you should distinguish between believers and fundamentalists. The majority of believers seem to be pretty sensible about this.
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"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:21 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I'm legit afraid they've already set the groundwork for being okay with that. They've already written off 1-3% of the population as acceptable losses.

It will come as a surprise to some of them that they belong to the 1-3%.
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"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:23 AM   #61
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Sadly, I think the death rate in the USA will be higher than of other nations because we don't have enough respirators to treat the many that will become infected. I believe we are already there even though the official numbers don't say so because I don't trust those numbers as I believe the Trump regime will do whatever it can to suppress the data.
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Last edited by thaiboxerken; 27th March 2020 at 07:24 AM.
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:31 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by Lothian View Post
I support you all fighting this horrible American virus

I was about to post a similar link. The USA hasn't quite earned the right to have it named after the country yet. It will probably take a couple of weeks before America overtakes contestants like Italy or Spain, but with Trump's Easter celebrations coming up, it's bound to happen sooner or later.
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"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

Last edited by dann; 27th March 2020 at 07:32 AM.
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:40 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Sadly, I think the death rate in the USA will be higher than of other nations because we don't have enough respirators to treat the many that will become infected. I believe we are already there even though the official numbers don't say so because I don't trust those numbers as I believe the Trump regime will do whatever it can to suppress the data.
There's certainly plenty of scope to under-count Covid-19 victims given that most of the victims will be older people with underlying health conditions. If Covid-19 is chronically under-diagnosed then it's likely that there are a lot of older people dying without a diagnosis.

Whether this is deliberate, an unfortunate accident or a combination of the two is open for debate.

One thing which is causing me to scratch my head for all nations is the number of cases. The expectation is that infection rates will be well over 50% and yet the number of reported cases globally is in the hundreds of thousands and increasing by tens of thousands.

Are these numbers woefully inaccurate by orders of magnitude ? Have the epidemiologists got the models wrong by orders of magnitude ? Are we just at the beginning of a long and grisly haul ?
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Old 27th March 2020, 07:44 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
Let's not pretend here.
Agreed!
Quote:
We know it's all about dog whistle messaging about foreigners being to blame, like much of his other dog whistles.
You lost me.
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Old 27th March 2020, 08:12 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post

Are these numbers woefully inaccurate by orders of magnitude ? Have the epidemiologists got the models wrong by orders of magnitude ? Are we just at the beginning of a long and grisly haul ?
I think it's the last. This will cycle up and down for the next couple years, I believe.
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Old 27th March 2020, 08:17 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
There's certainly plenty of scope to under-count Covid-19 victims given that most of the victims will be older people with underlying health conditions. If Covid-19 is chronically under-diagnosed then it's likely that there are a lot of older people dying without a diagnosis.

Whether this is deliberate, an unfortunate accident or a combination of the two is open for debate.

One thing which is causing me to scratch my head for all nations is the number of cases. The expectation is that infection rates will be well over 50% and yet the number of reported cases globally is in the hundreds of thousands and increasing by tens of thousands.

Are these numbers woefully inaccurate by orders of magnitude ? Have the epidemiologists got the models wrong by orders of magnitude ? Are we just at the beginning of a long and grisly haul ?
Long and grisly haul I'm afraid. The long times between infection and symptoms, plus the significant portion of the infected population who never show symptoms make precise numbers impossible to track, and the total number of confirmed cases is much lower than it should be.

But the confirmed cases have been going up in an exponential arc for a while now. With virtually no one being immune to this thing and the lack of a vaccine, the only way to bring down the curve is lockdowns and social distancing, and we have to do it long before the number of infected gets too high to deal with.

It's kind of the same problem we have with Global Warming. In order to stop a catastrophe, we have to take real, significant, and expensive steps before the catastrophe effects or is obvious to everyone. Doing the right thing is going to seem like unnecessary overkill to much of the population.
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Old 27th March 2020, 08:44 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by Random View Post
In order to stop a catastrophe, we have to take real, significant, and expensive steps before the catastrophe effects or is obvious to everyone. Doing the right thing is going to seem like unnecessary overkill to much of the population.
...and if those measures work such that the catastrophe is less than fully catastrophic, that success will be used as evidence that such measures were really not necessary after all.

And should not be used the next time something like this happens.
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Old 27th March 2020, 09:56 AM   #68
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I’ve been seeing Trumpettes pushing the 2019 John Hopkins, as reporte by Fox News report about outbreaks as proof our response was just fine. Trump himself waved this report around in late February to prove everything would be fine.

The JH report is not as winning as Fox makes it out to be, although the US did excel in certain areas it ranks weak in others. And the report is little more than a war game, not an actual battle.
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Old 27th March 2020, 09:56 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
Let's not pretend here. We know it's all about dog whistle messaging about foreigners being to blame, like much of his other dog whistles.
That's only part of it. The real goal is to rally political tribalism by giving the right something to attack Americans for when they object to the stupid, counter-productive insistence on calling this novel coronavirus by wrong names. It gives them something to feel 'persecuted' over jointly, building that tribal political connection more, when they were at risk of losing some power by people unifying to combat a larger shared threat. Hell, tribals will even think that the blowback against Trump's actions is what generates a blowback itself.

Thus they have to downplay the threat, feed political tribalism even at damage to themselves, and attack, attack, attack.
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Old 27th March 2020, 09:58 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by kookbreaker View Post
I’ve been seeing Trumpettes pushing the 2019 John Hopkins, as reporte by Fox News report about outbreaks as proof our response was just fine. Trump himself waved this report around in late February to prove everything would be fine.

The JH report is not as winning as Fox makes it out to be, although the US did excel in certain areas it ranks weak in others. And the report is little more than a war game, not an actual battle.
Yeah, the French did pretty well in their 1939 report.
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Old 27th March 2020, 09:58 AM   #71
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1. Do/say something you know is going to get a reaction.
2. Accuse the other side of being "dramatic" or "overreacting" no matter how reasonable their reaction is.
3. Declare victory.

It's just base trolling. "I win because I got a reaction out of you."
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Last edited by JoeMorgue; 27th March 2020 at 10:02 AM.
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Old 27th March 2020, 09:59 AM   #72
johnny karate
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
You lost me.
And yet you repeatedly deny offers of a map and compass.
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Old 27th March 2020, 10:12 AM   #73
Meadmaker
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I got a list of conservative blogs from over at conservapedia, and started clicking.

Definitely the overriding theme is to deny the severity of the problem.

I hope they're right.
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Old 27th March 2020, 10:17 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I got a list of conservative blogs from over at conservapedia, and started clicking.

Definitely the overriding theme is to deny the severity of the problem.

I hope they're right.
I really do as well.

I hope that everyone limits contact, stays home when possible, so that the conservatives can point and yell 'Told you it wouldn't be bad!'
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Old 27th March 2020, 11:18 AM   #75
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
AP Archive, March 26, 2020: Trump supporters back his stance on virus outbreak
YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
That video supports the ideas of the Trump 'cult' and that many Trump fans are fixated on triggering 'librals'. The campaign sticker that says "Trump 2020 Make Liberals Cry Again" particularly demonstrates that.

Obama was very popular among Democrats but I never saw the 'cult' mentality that I see in so many Trump supporters. I find such adoration very weird.
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Old 27th March 2020, 11:39 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Agreed!

Quote:
We know it's all about dog whistle messaging about foreigners being to blame, like much of his other dog whistles.
You lost me.
Oh, come on. Don't be so obviously disingenuous. Instead of calling it by its name Covid 19 (the disease) or Coronavirus (the virus that causes Covid 19), Trump is determined to connect it to China by calling it the Wuhan virus. He went so far as to insist the G7 statement specifically refer to it as the Wuhan virus against the objections of the other members. What is the purpose of this other than to dog whistle? And please, don't give me the nonsense that it's because it began in Wuhan.
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Old 27th March 2020, 12:44 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
There are blue states that Trump has no chance of winning, so there's no love lost. Letting Boston howl while sending aid to Ohio is something I could easily see Trump doing.
Right now he seems targeted on New York City.

As to the OP, im my local neck of the Outer Darkness that is a red state, I'm seeing a mix of older misinformation/CT ("it's a Chinese bioweapon"), snake oil remedy peddling, and general invecttive against local governments for imposing "stay at home" orders ("You can't tell me what to do, fascist/communist b******s") and worry about their jobs and supporrting their families. There's also a lot of knee-jerk paranoia about people catching the virus from packaging (despite the science saying that is not a significant risk) which has led to the rehab facility I'm confined to for a leg injury not allowing things to even be dropped off for me that I need that the facility does not supply.
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Old 27th March 2020, 12:49 PM   #78
ChristianProgressive
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
He claimed (paraphrasing) that inductive reasoning was when you base your position on the facts while in deductive reasoning you twist the facts to fit your position.
Which is exactly backward.
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Old 27th March 2020, 02:51 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by Lothian View Post
I support you all fighting this horrible American virus
Why Was It Called the 'Spanish Flu?'
Quote:
The 1918 influenza pandemic did not, as many people believed, originate in Spain.

As the pandemic reached epic proportions in the fall of 1918, it became commonly known as the “Spanish Flu” or the “Spanish Lady” in the United States and Europe. Many assumed this was because the sickness had originated on the Iberian Peninsula, but the nickname was actually the result of a widespread misunderstanding.
Full (short) article here:
https://www.history.com/news/why-was...he-spanish-flu

It's still possible that it might eventually be called the "American Virus".
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Old 27th March 2020, 08:21 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Why Was It Called the 'Spanish Flu?'


Full (short) article here:
https://www.history.com/news/why-was...he-spanish-flu

It's still possible that it might eventually be called the "American Virus".
Site was especially laggy for me.

At any rate, for those unable/unwilling to read the link, it's because Spain was neutral during WW1 so it could print news about the flu that belligerent nations were suppressing, therefore most of the news about it came from Spanish papers. (Spain called it the "French flu".)
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