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Old 2nd July 2020, 11:22 PM   #161
Skeptic Ginger
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Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets View Post
I think an even better sliver lining would be if he survived to admit he was wrong and raise public awareness.
Like Gary Busey and helmet laws for motorcycle riding. He was an activist against mandatory helmet laws until he got a serious brain injury from a motorcycle accident.

Cain is 74. He might not have a mild case.
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Old 2nd July 2020, 11:37 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
Not seen now, but one of the original photos in that Statesman article showed a protestor with a sign that said ďgoy kno,Ē which is an antisemitic in-joke among white nationalist types. Great crowd.
It's Alex Jones. A "great crowd" is a given.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 04:59 AM   #163
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
Does that ever happen? What's this about "weakening"?
It can happen, but not in way these morons think. There is strong evolutionary pressure to make virus less harmful. Not less infectious, mind you. So pretty much as you guessed.

There are few hundred different viruses causing something we call "common cold". I am quite sure significant part of them were in far, far away past worse.

Obviously, there is no guarantee it will actually happen and even if it happens, it will take long time.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 05:22 AM   #164
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I think President Dumb **** just lost Texas. One of the dogs usually first in line to hump Trump's leg (Gov. Abbot) just issued a mask order.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 06:19 AM   #165
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
...or, The PDJT.
or the IDJT (Impeached Donald J. Trump)
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Old 3rd July 2020, 06:36 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
I think President Dumb **** just lost Texas. One of the dogs usually first in line to hump Trump's leg (Gov. Abbot) just issued a mask order.
I applaud your optimism but IMO when Joe (or Josie) Tex steps into the voting booth in November, they'll still vote GOP regardless of the administration's mishandling of Coronavirus and of the economic mess because of guns and God.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 08:25 AM   #167
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
The Governor of Texas orders masks mandatory.
I suspect some fireworks since the Lt. Governor stated yesterday that Fauci does not know what he is talking about and has hinted that the virus is a medis plot to get Trump.
There was a sudden shift in talking points from Republicans all across the country towards mandatory mask use. Clearly this is part of an organized strategy. I don't expect it will be long before these people are all claiming Republicans were promoting mask use all along and it was the Democrats holding things up.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 08:35 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
I think President Dumb **** just lost Texas. One of the dogs usually first in line to hump Trump's leg (Gov. Abbot) just issued a mask order.
What on earth are you going on about, Trump was always telling people to wear masks, even before they'd even heard about the virus!!??
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Old 3rd July 2020, 08:36 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I wonder how people think viruses weaken.

They don't get old and tired. They are little bits of protein that reproduce, making copies of themselves. How would a virus "weaken"? I guess it would have to mutate to a form that was just as contagious, less dangerous, but similar enough to the original that antibodies against the less dangerous form also protected against the original.

Does that ever happen? What's this about "weakening"?
IIRC less dangerous strains usually have a small evolutionary advantage and eventually outcompete the more dangerous ones. There is no evidence of this happening yet with COVID-19 so far as I know.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 09:02 AM   #170
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
There was a sudden shift in talking points from Republicans all across the country towards mandatory mask use. Clearly this is part of an organized strategy. I don't expect it will be long before these people are all claiming Republicans were promoting mask use all along and it was the Democrats holding things up.
Agents of Goldstein were responsible for telling people not to wear masks.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 09:05 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
What on earth are you going on about, Trump was always telling people to wear masks, even before they'd even heard about the virus!!??
It was the Obama administration that prevented people from wearing masks.

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Old 3rd July 2020, 09:16 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I wonder how people think viruses weaken.

They don't get old and tired. They are little bits of protein that reproduce, making copies of themselves. How would a virus "weaken"? I guess it would have to mutate to a form that was just as contagious, less dangerous, but similar enough to the original that antibodies against the less dangerous form also protected against the original.

Does that ever happen? What's this about "weakening"?
Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
IIRC less dangerous strains usually have a small evolutionary advantage and eventually outcompete the more dangerous ones. There is no evidence of this happening yet with COVID-19 so far as I know.
This! That pretty well describes the process.

But you do know that Republicans don't believe in evolution.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 09:36 AM   #173
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
IIRC less dangerous strains usually have a small evolutionary advantage and eventually outcompete the more dangerous ones. There is no evidence of this happening yet with COVID-19 so far as I know.
It depends on the nature of the virus and itís modes of transmission. The selection is for what maximizes viral spread. For a particular type of virus that may be selection for a less rapidly lethal form of disease so that the infected host is up and about spreading the virus around. This was observed for a myxomatosis virus and rabbits in Australia. But for a different type of virus and/or a different environment a rapidly lethal disease that produces a large burst of viruses in a short time may spread the virus better.

I imagine a less rapidly lethal virus is selected among sparsely populated hosts for e.g.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 09:52 AM   #174
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
There was a sudden shift in talking points from Republicans all across the country towards mandatory mask use. Clearly this is part of an organized strategy. I don't expect it will be long before these people are all claiming Republicans were promoting mask use all along and it was the Democrats holding things up.
True, but that is what you can expect from politicans in general.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 12:20 PM   #175
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
It can happen, but not in way these morons think. There is strong evolutionary pressure to make virus less harmful. Not less infectious, mind you. So pretty much as you guessed. ....
Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
It depends on the nature of the virus and itís modes of transmission. The selection is for what maximizes viral spread. For a particular type of virus that may be selection for a less rapidly lethal form of disease so that the infected host is up and about spreading the virus around. This was observed for a myxomatosis virus and rabbits in Australia. But for a different type of virus and/or a different environment a rapidly lethal disease that produces a large burst of viruses in a short time may spread the virus better.

I imagine a less rapidly lethal virus is selected among sparsely populated hosts for e.g.
No sure how "sparsely populated" affects a pathogen's transmission. I would think absent a nearby host to infect would help the virus die out.

Giordano is right though, there are multiple selection factors. Take the MRSA 300 strain (bacteria but still a good example), it became the dominant strain and spread rapidly worldwide. It was the result of a mutation that allowed the PantonĖValentine leukocidin toxin to form. The bacteria became more virulent, not less yet that strain spread.



Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
It was the Obama administration that prevented people from wearing masks....
Trump is claiming the N95 masks were depleted under Obama for the 2009 flu and not replaced.

He's oblivious to the last 3.5 years when he could have replaced the stock.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 12:47 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Trump is claiming the N95 masks were depleted under Obama for the 2009 flu and not replaced.

He's oblivious to the last 3.5 years when he could have replaced the stock.
Also the Republican-controlled Congress that never allocated funds to replenish those supplies during Obama's terms.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 01:10 PM   #177
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This sign on an Arizona vintage store telling patrons they must wear masks is amusing.


"If you choose not to wear a mask, we respectfully ask that you postpone your visit,”

“We will be happy to debate the efficacy of masks with you when this is all over and you come in to sell your dead grandmother's clothes."
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Old 3rd July 2020, 02:51 PM   #178
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The Trump Administration's Coronavirus strategy has been complete, disastrous, cluster-****. It defies belief that a US Government effort can be so incompetent, but the graph doesn't lie.

Europe has closed its borders to people from the USA or transiting through the USA... and with good reason.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 06:07 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
IIRC less dangerous strains usually have a small evolutionary advantage and eventually outcompete the more dangerous ones. There is no evidence of this happening yet with COVID-19 so far as I know.
Regarding this, the COVID19 virus SARS-CoV-2 itself can be understood as a less virulent and acute cousin of the original SARS virus and MERS virus, so I think we're seeing what a moderate acute respiratory disease can do compared to its more dangerous relatives.
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Old 3rd July 2020, 08:26 PM   #180
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Kimberly Guilfoyle has tested positive. DJTJ is in isolation.

I'm all broken up over this.
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Old 4th July 2020, 05:46 AM   #181
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
Kimberly Guilfoyle has tested positive. DJTJ is in isolation.



I'm all broken up over this.
Sadly, Trump Jr tested negative but he is in isolation as a precaution.

And unfortunately she had not had contact with stubby Mcbonespurs for a while.

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Old 4th July 2020, 05:20 PM   #182
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The all-new "US Politics and coronavirus" thread pt. 2

I know that itís tone trolling or whatever, and I promise to only say it this one time. Can we please not wish that anyone, anywhere gets a potentially deadly virus? If nothing else, they aid on the spread that may get someone that you donít want to get sick.
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Old 4th July 2020, 05:32 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
I know that itís tone trolling or whatever, and I promise to only say it this one time. Can we please not wish that anyone, anywhere gets a potentially deadly virus? If nothing else, they aid on the spread that may get someone that you donít want to get sick.
I think that's a good idea.
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Old 4th July 2020, 05:51 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
I know that itís tone trolling or whatever, and I promise to only say it this one time. Can we please not wish that anyone, anywhere gets a potentially deadly virus? If nothing else, they aid on the spread that may get someone that you donít want to get sick.


Nope, sorry, can't do that. These people have made it clear they are either unable or unwilling to learn from the misfortune of others, and start acting as needed to fix this mess. At this point, a full-force bitch-slap from reality is the only thing that could possibly make them open their ******* eyes.

These people went out of their way to become the leaders of the United States, and when they were finally called on to actually lead, they ****** off and didn't even try. They need to have their folly rubbed in their faces, and getting sick with COVID is just about the only way to actually do that.
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Old 4th July 2020, 07:12 PM   #185
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NBC News and other sources are reporting the trump White House will be rolling out a new message for Americans next week about coronavirus. Basically it sounds like, don't worry so much.
Quote:
After several months of mixed messages on the coronavirus pandemic, the White House is settling on a new one: Learn to live with it...At the crux of the message, officials said, is a recognition by the White House that the virus is not going away any time soon ó and will be around through the November election.

As a result, President Donald Trump's top advisers plan to argue, the country must figure out how to press forward despite it. Therapeutic drugs will be showcased as a key component for doing that and the White House will increasingly emphasize the relatively low risk most Americans have of dying from the virus, officials said. NBC News report
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File Type: jpg US New cases 07032020.jpg (55.7 KB, 13 views)
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Old 4th July 2020, 07:16 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
NBC News and other sources are reporting the trump White House will be rolling out a new message for Americans next week about coronavirus. Basically it sounds like, don't worry so much.
Oh look, it's the "We ain't doin' jack ****" plan.

What a leader!
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Old 4th July 2020, 08:02 PM   #187
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Here is a Trump supporter explaining to the Grim Reaper how the Coronavirus made it to the US.

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
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Old 4th July 2020, 09:22 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Here is a Trump supporter explaining to the Grim Reaper how the Coronavirus made it to the US.

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I AGREE
I think it's kind of cool that someone wore a Grim Reaper outfit to a Florida beach.

It's hard to follow the stats on this darned virus. I have a page provided by Bing bookmarked as my go to "How many cases were there yesterday" page and today for July 4, they showed 133,000 new cases. I can only assume that's a data anomaly, and not an actual number of new cases.

In other news, i always follow the comparative number of cases between states to see how my neighborhood, Michigan, is doing. North Carolina has pulled to within 1,000 new cases, and should pass us if present trends continue in 1-3 days.

Meanwhile, a few days back I noted that we weren't seeing the horror stories about ventilator shortages and overworked health care workers that we saw in New York at the peek of the pandemic there. As people predicted, today, I saw a few such stories out of Texas.

Politically, all I can say about Trump's new campaign strategy is that I am glad to see him running on his record. People should very much judge him on his success or failure handling this crisis. It has been a real test of his leadership, and I hope people give an honest assessment of how he's doing.
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Old 4th July 2020, 11:10 PM   #189
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From an NYT article today:

Quote:
Like New York City in March, the Houston hospitals are experiencing a steep rise in caseloads that is filling their beds, stretching their staffing, creating a backlog in testing and limiting the availability of other medical services. Attempts to buy more supplies — including certain protective gear, vital-sign monitors and testing components — are frustrated by weeks of delays, according to hospital leaders.
How disgusting is this? No other nation has experience this kind of resurgence. Even more unforgivable, Donald Trump imposed his travel ban at the end of January, so, obviously, he knew this coronavirus thing was going to be a big deal. Five months later, hospitals are scrambling for PPE.

Are we great again yet?
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Old 4th July 2020, 11:27 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
From an NYT article today:

How disgusting is this? No other nation has experience this kind of resurgence. Even more unforgivable, Donald Trump imposed his travel ban at the end of January, so, obviously, he knew this coronavirus thing was going to be a big deal. Five months later, hospitals are scrambling for PPE.

Are we great again yet?
Trump and his followers think they can just ignore it. People only getting mild cases,

It was only a matter of time, a couple weeks, the case numbers rise, the hospitals begin to fill up, the increase in the death rate follows.

They're actually claiming since the death rate hasn't risen, all is well. Another week and they'll have to change the talking points memos.

Good luck with that.
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Old 4th July 2020, 11:53 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by Resume View Post
Oh look, it's the "We ain't doin' jack ****" plan.

What a leader!
A.K.A. the plan that Trump's been strongly favoring all along.

Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
From an NYT article today:



How disgusting is this? No other nation has experience this kind of resurgence. Even more unforgivable, Donald Trump imposed his travel ban at the end of January, so, obviously, he knew this coronavirus thing was going to be a big deal. Five months later, hospitals are scrambling for PPE.

Are we great again yet?
...If Trump was normal in the head, that "obviously" might follow. Trump isn't. Trump almost certainly did it as just another "Look at how tough I am on China" thing, even though it was weak as crap, given that the major airlines had already stopped flights.

Trump might have been trying to wish it away with the power of positive thinking, of course?
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Old 5th July 2020, 03:43 AM   #192
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Here is a Trump supporter explaining to the Grim Reaper how the Coronavirus made it to the US.

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There really, truly, IS NO CURE FOR STUPID!!
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Old 5th July 2020, 03:55 AM   #193
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Trump and his followers think they can just ignore it. People only getting mild cases,

It was only a matter of time, a couple weeks, the case numbers rise, the hospitals begin to fill up, the increase in the death rate follows.

They're actually claiming since the death rate hasn't risen, all is well. Another week and they'll have to change the talking points memos.

Good luck with that.
Our government didn't take us completely off restrictions until we had zero new cases for over two weeks (it was actually 18 days). Since then, we have had zero new cases in the general community. The few isolated new cases we have are all returning New Zealanders who presented with the disease during managed isolation or quarantine.

The result is for a population for 5 million, a total of just over 1500 cases, and 22 deaths. This is what it takes to beat this thing.

- The government listening to the scientists and following their instructions to the letter.
- Following your government's instructions.
- Working together with the other members of your community.
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Last edited by smartcooky; 5th July 2020 at 03:56 AM.
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Old 5th July 2020, 03:56 AM   #194
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
...If Trump was normal in the head, that "obviously" might follow. Trump isn't. Trump almost certainly did it as just another "Look at how tough I am on China" thing, even though it was weak as crap, given that the major airlines had already stopped flights.
Also he had to do something so that his little supporters could sit there and claim "he did more against the virus than anyone else in the world!".
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Old 5th July 2020, 06:08 AM   #195
newyorkguy
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
...I always follow the comparative number of cases between states to see how my neighborhood, Michigan, is doing. North Carolina has pulled to within 1,000 new cases, and should pass us if present trends continue in 1-3 days...
Assessing how your state is doing based on total cases can be misleading, can't it? I'm sure my state, New York, is still number one among total cases but we're way down on the list when it comes to new cases or trending. In my neighborhood, positive results from testing in Bronx County have fallen from over 1,000 a day in April to under one hundred by June. The positive rate for daily testing has gone from a high of over 20% to about 1%. That tells me we're doing an effective job in reducing the rate of infection. Looking at total case numbers doesn't tell me that.

Looking at Michigan and North Carolina daily new case charts shows the disease has trended way down in Michigan but remains on a steady rise in North Carolina. On Friday North Carolina reported roughly four times the number of new cases as did Michigan. I would say Michigan has done a pretty good job whereas North Carolina has a problem. Link to Google/Wiki tracker

The one trend that would bear watching in Michigan is the uptick in new cases the state has been seeing since late June. July 4th saw almost twice as many new cases reported as June 29th. It looks like Michigan bottomed out in mid-June but since then is seeing an upward trend. Since Michigan is one of the states where there has been organized resistance to safety measures that rise is a bit concerning.
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Old 5th July 2020, 06:26 AM   #196
Meadmaker
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
Assessing how your state is doing based on total cases can be misleading, can't it?
Agreed. I'm noting that North Carolina is growing faster than Michigan, but the rise in Michigan is of great concern.

Although there has been organized resistance here in Michigan, that's just some high profile yahoos. I think that in general we are doing pretty good, and our governor deserves a lot of the credit for that. Sure the measures were not universally acclaimed, but we locked down quick and stayed locked down, and we went from number 2 in the country down to, 11 or 12.

Like almost everywhere, we have an uptick, but not as bad as those states which ignored the threat and opened up pretty far. I find the uptick disturbing, and we don't have nearly enough mask use compliance for my tastes, but we aren't doing too bad. If you go into a store, most people are masked.

We'll see. There's plenty of idiocy here in Michigan, but the results will tell the tale.
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Old 5th July 2020, 07:09 AM   #197
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This story I'm quoting is from a week ago though I learned of it this morning, as apparently this is still going on. There was a story about this scam in this morning's edition of a local news bulletin I subscribe to. Some scam artists are selling boxes of cards that supposedly exempt the bearer from having to wear a face mask in public or in stores because doing so "poses a mental and/or physical risk to me." From an NPR story:
Quote:
A recently issued alert by the [U.S. Justice] department is urging the public not to heed information printed on the fraudulent cards, which purport to carry the authority of the "Freedom to Breathe Agency," which is neither a federal nor a state agency. NPR link
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Old 5th July 2020, 10:34 AM   #198
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Ah, murica. Where using mask is political issue, not medical advice.
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Old 5th July 2020, 11:52 AM   #199
The Great Zaganza
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
Ah, murica. Where using mask is political issue, not medical advice.
If the Democrats are for it, it must be bad for you.
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Old 5th July 2020, 12:50 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by Commander Inept
99% of coronavirius cases are totally harmless.
No, they're not.
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