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Tags 2020 elections , chris wallace , debates , donald trump , joe biden , presidential debates

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Old 29th September 2020, 09:06 PM   #201
ChristianProgressive
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
We could have had that nice young gay man who went to Harvard, but the voters chose Biden.
Democrat insiders chose Biden.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:07 PM   #202
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On the Green New Deal, I suspect one area of divergence is that apparently the Democrats as a party have decided to support nuclear energy, which AOC is against for whatever reason. Because it sounds bad environmentally, I guess. I think the Dems ought to own this, front and center, but apparently no one wants to have that particular argument at this time.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:09 PM   #203
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Originally Posted by SezMe View Post
You shouldn't be. Despite Trump's blather, Biden is no far left liberal. The Green New Deal is fine if viewed as some idealistic view but it's poison as public policy so Biden has been public about not supporting it.
GND is bold. UHC is bold. Biden, a well-known political coward, is allergic to bold.

Another go-along-and-get-along Dem who thinks it's still thinks it's pre-1980 America.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:10 PM   #204
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
They'll still vote for Biden though.
And the "we're concerned" GOPpers will vote for Trump.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:13 PM   #205
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Why would they? If the chosen Democratic candidate has the same views on the "Green New Deal" as the current President, what's in it for those that support it? "Don't tread on me" may realize a new meaning in this day and age instead of stepping on a rattlesnake, it may become the motto of those who seem to be thrown under the bus time and time again by the Democratic leadership.
If 2016 was a vote against Hillary election, this year is "vote against Trump".
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:14 PM   #206
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
I don't think so. Biden didn't bring the heat, even when he was making some cutting remarks, he came across as a milquetoast, he fumbled his words (beyond his stutter) and spoke in generalities. He also didn't cite enough sources on most issues.
He's never been a great orator but he came across as reasonable and responsible. It wasn't his job or his intention to respond individually to Trump's firehose of lies.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:14 PM   #207
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Likely he meant Portland Police Chief Chuck Lovell (Who supports President Trump). Since Portland does not have a Sheriff in charge of their local police force this should be easy to understand. But yes this small mixup will undoubtedly be seen as scandalous of course. Victory! Trump lied!
No, victory because Trump couldn't make a direct, factual response if you held a gun to his head. Which I think you realize. What does it mean, that he struggles so?
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:18 PM   #208
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Fell asleep on the couch. Seems like I didn't miss much.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:18 PM   #209
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
He's never been a great orator but he came across as reasonable and responsible. It wasn't his job or his intention to respond individually to Trump's firehose of lies.
I kept waiting for the verbal equivalent of Biden bloodying Trump's nose. I didn't get it. AOC, or any of the other liberal firebrands in Congress, would have been more confrontational and better prepared.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:19 PM   #210
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
Democrat insiders chose Biden.
He was an also-ran until he started winning primaries. Nobody handed it to him.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:22 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
He was an also-ran until he started winning primaries. Nobody handed it to him.
A lot of people I know said a long time ago it would be Biden. Anyone paying attention to the "inside baseball" aspects of the Democratic Party saw him coming a mile off.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:22 PM   #212
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Likely he meant Portland Police Chief Chuck Lovell (Who supports President Trump). Since Portland does not have a Sheriff in charge of their local police force this should be easy to understand. But yes this small mixup will undoubtedly be seen as scandalous of course. Victory! Trump lied!
Likely he was pulling that completely out of his anus. And considering that Chief Lovell is mostly known for being carefully nonpartisan (beyond frequent clashes with commissioner Hardesty) your statement is almost certainly pure fiction in its own right.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:24 PM   #213
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Originally Posted by Elagabalus View Post
Dude, this is the Trump v. Biden debate thread.
Yes and the topic of Hunter Biden getting 3.5 million dollars from the wife of the former Mayor of Moscow came up during the debate. Weren't you watching that part? I realize many probably turned off the tv soon after the debate began but you should really stay tuned for the discussion points/topics.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:27 PM   #214
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
GND is bold. UHC is bold. Biden, a well-known political coward, is allergic to bold.

Another go-along-and-get-along Dem who thinks it's still thinks it's pre-1980 America.
I quite like that Biden supports funding for nuclear power.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:27 PM   #215
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
A lot of people I know said a long time ago it would be Biden. Anyone paying attention to the "inside baseball" aspects of the Democratic Party saw him coming a mile off.
Really? That's why everyone was tipping Bernie back in February?
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:28 PM   #216
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Yes and the topic of Hunter Biden getting 3.5 million dollars from the wife of the former Mayor of Moscow came up during the debate. Weren't you watching that part? I realize many probably turned off the tv soon after the debate began but you should really stay tuned for the discussion points/topics.
And why is that interesting?
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:28 PM   #217
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Is anyone here prepared to say that Trump won the debate, or even picked up any extra voters at all? He's the one who needs to pick up votes, not Biden.

Biden was not brilliant by any means, but looks Churchillian against Trump.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:28 PM   #218
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
I kept waiting for the verbal equivalent of Biden bloodying Trump's nose. I didn't get it. AOC, or any of the other liberal firebrands in Congress, would have been more confrontational and better prepared.
This.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:29 PM   #219
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Yes and the topic of Hunter Biden getting 3.5 million dollars from the wife of the former Mayor of Moscow came up during the debate. Weren't you watching that part? I realize many probably turned off the tv soon after the debate began but you should really stay tuned for the discussion points/topics.
Not Biden, his company. What specifically is he accused of doing wrong?
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:34 PM   #220
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Is anyone here prepared to say that Trump won the debate, or even picked up any extra voters at all? He's the one who needs to pick up votes, not Biden.

Biden was not brilliant by any means, but looks Churchillian against Trump.
No.

But a lot of Biden supporters seemed a bit miffed that they got Biden.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:36 PM   #221
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Originally Posted by Elagabalus View Post
No.

But a lot of Biden supporters seemed a bit miffed that they got Biden.
A lot of Biden supporters are not hanging out on the internet.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:37 PM   #222
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Not Biden, his company. What specifically is he accused of doing wrong?
Founding a business. We all know the proper way is to inherit it.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:37 PM   #223
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Originally Posted by Elagabalus View Post
Really? That's why everyone was tipping Bernie back in February?
The same reason the Bernie Bros always do: Bernie gets a big start but always falls short by the finish. Anyone who isn't a Millenial or younger bought into the hype this time around. Older, more experienced political watchers knew that the Centrist circular firing squad still reigs supreme in the Donkey Party.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:39 PM   #224
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Why would they? If the chosen Democratic candidate has the same views on the "Green New Deal" as the current President, what's in it for those that support it? "Don't tread on me" may realize a new meaning in this day and age instead of stepping on a rattlesnake, it may become the motto of those who seem to be thrown under the bus time and time again by the Democratic leadership.
Biden has a plan for the Environment, he just doesn't call it "the Green New Deal". That's to avoid confusing it with other plans, like AOC's plan, called the "Green New Deal". He want to clarify that his plan is not the same thing as AOC's plan.

The Biden Plan for a Clean Energy Revolution and Environmental Justice
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:41 PM   #225
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
This.
I have this dream, it's likely never to come true, but I (for example) would have liked Biden to step up when Trump was issuing one of his veiled threats to sene his armed thugs to the polls and reply: "Mr. Trump, you should keep in mind that the 2nd Amendment protects OUR right to bear arms as well, and there are more of us..."

But Milquetoast Joe unilaterally disarmed by pledging to accept whatever the alleged outcome is and defending the electoral process as being uncorrupted.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:43 PM   #226
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
And why is that interesting?
It's interesting because Biden denied it. If it's no big deal why deny it? If the best the Dems can do is come back with a "we didn't see" does that mean it didn't happen or does it mean it happened but they didn't see it occur?

Perhaps it's not an unusual transaction for Hunter Biden's businesses (if he has any tomorrow) What if one of Trump's children received 3.5 million from the wife of a Moscow Mayor? Would that interest you? I wonder.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:47 PM   #227
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
I have this dream, it's likely never to come true, but I (for example) would have liked Biden to step up when Trump was issuing one of his veiled threats to sene his armed thugs to the polls and reply: "Mr. Trump, you should keep in mind that the 2nd Amendment protects OUR right to bear arms as well, and there are more of us..."

But Milquetoast Joe unilaterally disarmed by pledging to accept whatever the alleged outcome is and defending the electoral process as being uncorrupted.
I think part of it is Biden just isn't as energetic as he once was. Compare how he sparred with Ryan to today's debate. 2012 Biden definitely would have given Trump more of a fight.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:50 PM   #228
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Biden has a plan for the Environment, he just doesn't call it "the Green New Deal". That's to avoid confusing it with other plans, like AOC's plan, called the "Green New Deal". He want to clarify that his plan is not the same thing as AOC's plan.

The Biden Plan for a Clean Energy Revolution and Environmental Justice
That is a "plan" the same way Trump's EOs on health care are a "plan". Vague and ineffectual. AOC's resolution lists specific measures. goals and requirements.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:53 PM   #229
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
I think part of it is Biden just isn't as energetic as he once was. Compare how he sparred with Ryan to today's debate. 2012 Biden definitely would have given Trump more of a fight.
Which is one more reason we should have gone with a young, Progressive firebrand. I'd love to vote for AOC and/or any of The Squad that I've seen so far.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:54 PM   #230
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
I have this dream, it's likely never to come true, but I (for example) would have liked Biden to step up when Trump was issuing one of his veiled threats to sene his armed thugs to the polls and reply: "Mr. Trump, you should keep in mind that the 2nd Amendment protects OUR right to bear arms as well, and there are more of us..."

But Milquetoast Joe unilaterally disarmed by pledging to accept whatever the alleged outcome is and defending the electoral process as being uncorrupted.
That's possibly the worst idea I've ever heard.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:55 PM   #231
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
That is a "plan" the same way Trump's EOs on health care are a "plan". Vague and ineffectual. AOC's resolution lists specific measures. goals and requirements.
You are giving Trump too much credit.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:55 PM   #232
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Biden has a plan for the Environment, he just doesn't call it "the Green New Deal". That's to avoid confusing it with other plans, like AOC's plan, called the "Green New Deal". He want to clarify that his plan is not the same thing as AOC's plan.

The Biden Plan for a Clean Energy Revolution and Environmental Justice
That's a good read. My favorites are :

grid-scale storage at one-tenth the cost of lithium-ion batteries;

small modular nuclear reactors at half the construction cost of today’s reactors;

I think those items would be a great way to keep America green.
Why the **** couldn't they talk about stuff like that during the debate?
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:56 PM   #233
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
Which is one more reason we should have gone with a young, Progressive firebrand. I'd love to vote for AOC and/or any of The Squad that I've seen so far.
Can you be specific who is the "we" that didnt go with young progressive?

I love watching progressives try to avoid actually blaming black people.
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Old 29th September 2020, 09:59 PM   #234
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
And the "we're concerned" GOPpers will vote for Trump.
Oh, you're right. I didn't realize it was concern trolling, but looking at the poster's history, yeah.

Meanwhile, here's John Podhoretz of the New York Post:

Trump’s over-belligerence led him to stumble in first debate

Quote:
Joe Biden wants to be the Not-Trump, and boy was he ever at the first debate Tuesday night.

The former vice president spent the entire evening under withering assault from President Trump, who dominated the proceedings as he always has in these face-to-face confrontations — by interrupting, insulting, needling, ignoring the rules and feeding vampirically off the shocked finger-wagging of moderator Chris Wallace.

Without question, Biden seemed outmatched from beginning to end. But outmatched by what, exactly?

Yes, Trump roared, Biden was hoarse. Trump was full of beans, Biden sounded like his mouth was full of beans. Trump was a bludgeon, Biden was a dull peen hammer.

But the simple fact of the matter is that Trump was incredibly unpleasant to watch, and Biden wasn’t.

It was painful and sordid and cringe-inducing, and that was almost entirely Trump’s doing.
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Old 29th September 2020, 10:00 PM   #235
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
No, victory because Trump couldn't make a direct, factual response if you held a gun to his head. Which I think you realize. What does it mean, that he struggles so?
This was not a debate it was a disappointment for all Americans. Nothing new same rhetoric from all.
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Old 29th September 2020, 10:02 PM   #236
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Yes and the topic of Hunter Biden getting 3.5 million dollars from the wife of the former Mayor of Moscow came up during the debate. Weren't you watching that part? I realize many probably turned off the tv soon after the debate began but you should really stay tuned for the discussion points/topics.

All the American news sources have already debunked this one. The Trump news sources are the only ones still running with it and we all know their kind can't be trusted.
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Old 29th September 2020, 10:02 PM   #237
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
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Mike Reese
@SheriffReese
In tonight’s presidential debate the President said the “Portland Sheriff” supports him. As the Multnomah County Sheriff I have never supported Donald Trump and will never support him.
Likely he meant Portland Police Chief Chuck Lovell (Who supports President Trump). Since Portland does not have a Sheriff in charge of their local police force this should be easy to understand. But yes this small mixup will undoubtedly be seen as scandalous of course. Victory! Trump lied!
In any other election year, such mistakes would probably seen as irrelevant. Honest errors that don't really affect the way a particular candidate is viewed.

But Stubby McBonespurs and he right wing media have made a big issue of Joe Biden's mental health (often suggesting senility), and they support those type of accusations by pointing to small minor mistakes (just like the one Trump made). If Trump and his cult can make a big deal about Biden's mistakes, surely Trump deserves the same sort of attention when HE makes mistakes.
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Old 29th September 2020, 10:15 PM   #238
Craig4
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
In any other election year, such mistakes would probably seen as irrelevant. Honest errors that don't really affect the way a particular candidate is viewed.

But Stubby McBonespurs and he right wing media have made a big issue of Joe Biden's mental health (often suggesting senility), and they support those type of accusations by pointing to small minor mistakes (just like the one Trump made). If Trump and his cult can make a big deal about Biden's mistakes, surely Trump deserves the same sort of attention when HE makes mistakes.
Biden's camp needs to flood the airways and social media with an add featuring President Dumb **** telling the American people all about the heroic battles for the airports in the American Revolution.
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Old 29th September 2020, 10:22 PM   #239
ChrisBFRPKY
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Biden's camp needs to flood the airways and social media with an add featuring President Dumb **** telling the American people all about the heroic battles for the airports in the American Revolution.
Do you think the media refrains from reporting any mistakes President Trump has made?

Now that's funny.
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Old 29th September 2020, 10:30 PM   #240
Segnosaur
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Quote:
Biden's camp needs to flood the airways and social media with an add featuring President Dumb **** telling the American people all about the heroic battles for the airports in the American Revolution.
Do you think the media refrains from reporting any mistakes President Trump has made?
Now that's funny.
Trump's mistakes do get reported in the media. But typically, after the initial "ha ha look at Trump's mistake", the mistakes can get forgotten. And the mistakes certainly aren't central to Biden's campaign strategy.

Compare that to the way Trump and the right-wing media treat Biden's mistakes... not only are they reported on with much more intensity, but the mistake becomes central to attacks on Biden (by making up a false narrative about how its evidence of Biden's supposed mental decline).
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