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22nd March 2012, 04:40 AM | #1481 |
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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22nd March 2012, 05:12 AM | #1482 |
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Interesting question.
If I ever found the "Eureka" prophecy that convinced me that prophecy was real... ...and that led me to think that God must be real... ...I don't presently see how my day-to-day behavior would change one iota. I mean, yesterday I did not rob or lie or cheat or deceive or commit adultery or covet my neighbor's ass. Or the day before. Or the day before that. I live a pretty darn moral life for its own rewards, not for any other reason. Superficially, in guess if I found myself a member of the aforementioned Pantertown Church of Prophecy, my regular attendance going forward would be a "behavior change". Other than that, I'm already pretty darn righteous! |
22nd March 2012, 06:04 AM | #1483 |
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What's the best argument for UHC? This argument against UHC. "Perhaps one reason per capita GDP is lower in UHC countries is because they've tried to prevent this important function [bankrupting the sick] and thus carry forward considerable economic dead wood?"-BeAChooser |
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22nd March 2012, 06:59 AM | #1484 |
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It wouldn't. I already behave in a manner that I think is appropriate for the world I live in. (Except on Thursdays, of course, when my Viking ancestry grabs hold of me, and I go on the rampage, and pillage a village or two.)
And I would also like to know how you think people's behaviour would change, if you convinced them. |
22nd March 2012, 07:14 AM | #1485 |
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22nd March 2012, 07:33 AM | #1486 |
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22nd March 2012, 07:43 AM | #1487 |
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22nd March 2012, 07:43 AM | #1488 |
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What's the best argument for UHC? This argument against UHC. "Perhaps one reason per capita GDP is lower in UHC countries is because they've tried to prevent this important function [bankrupting the sick] and thus carry forward considerable economic dead wood?"-BeAChooser |
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22nd March 2012, 07:46 AM | #1489 |
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If the laws of nature were sporadically being violated by a capricious Supreme Being, I guess my behavior might be modified a bit by my enhanced sense of uncertainty and paranoia.
It would turn the simplest thing (an elevator ride, let's say) into a leap of faith rather than a reasoned risk. I'll go with the natural world for now and deal with the supernatural if and when it becomes an issue. |
22nd March 2012, 07:47 AM | #1490 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:00 AM | #1491 |
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Why should supernatural things change my behaviour? If the Haunted House really has a ghost in it, perhaps I wouldn't spend the night there, but not much else would change. What do you think ought to change?
Anyway, so many of the prophecies can be shown to be false (or absurd) that a supernatural origin seems improbable. If some supernatural being did something useful, like eliminate disease or war, then everybody's behaviour would change. But nothing of that kind has happened; and if there are in fact any supernatural forces or beings, they are extremely successful at concealing themselves. |
22nd March 2012, 08:00 AM | #1492 |
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Would you?
I ask this honestly because I do not see how you can believe the bible is prophetic, yet you pick and choose what to follow in it. You clearly don't support slavery, even though the old and new testament do. You don't support monarchies, even though the old and new testaments do. |
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What's the best argument for UHC? This argument against UHC. "Perhaps one reason per capita GDP is lower in UHC countries is because they've tried to prevent this important function [bankrupting the sick] and thus carry forward considerable economic dead wood?"-BeAChooser |
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22nd March 2012, 08:14 AM | #1493 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:20 AM | #1494 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:30 AM | #1495 |
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Don't tell me, you do it on Wednesdays, right? Let's sync our calendars, rampage is much more fun in company. And after a good day of pillaging, a friend or two to help carry the spoils is always good.
If you bring your own club you are more than welcome! We club indiscriminately, by the way. If they move, we club. If they don't move, we club. Makes it far easier to remember the rules. See, converting people is easy. I think I've out-converted you already, DOC! |
22nd March 2012, 08:32 AM | #1496 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:32 AM | #1497 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:35 AM | #1498 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:37 AM | #1499 |
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If it were ever demonstrated that biblical prophecies have been fulfilled and it could only be because of supernatural mean, I would be more inclined to believe in the supernatural.
My behavior wouldn't change in the slightest. I still would not kill people I suspected of being witches. I still would not murder children for mocking their elders. I still would not brutally rape and murder my enemies. I still would not hold other humans in slavery. How would your behavior change if you were to realize that biblical prophecies have not been fulfilled, that it is only intellectual dishonesty and cognitive dissonance that cause people to believe they have been? |
22nd March 2012, 08:42 AM | #1500 |
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22nd March 2012, 08:51 AM | #1501 |
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-Aberhaten did it - "Which gives us an answer to our question. What’s the worst thing that can happen in a pressure cooker?" Randall Munroe -Director of Independent Determining Inquisitor Of Crazy Yapping - Aberhaten's Apothegm™ - An Internet law that states that optimism is indistinguishable from sarcasm |
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22nd March 2012, 09:31 AM | #1502 |
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What's the best argument for UHC? This argument against UHC. "Perhaps one reason per capita GDP is lower in UHC countries is because they've tried to prevent this important function [bankrupting the sick] and thus carry forward considerable economic dead wood?"-BeAChooser |
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22nd March 2012, 09:32 AM | #1503 |
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22nd March 2012, 10:00 AM | #1504 |
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No, because reality would have to cease to exist due to all the violations of the fundamental laws of physics that the prophecies and miracles would be violating. Pro-tip: The laws of physics pretty much make any 'super natural event' impossible.
Even if it didn't I wouldn't change my behavior if those things could be proven beyond any reasonable doubt. I don't steal, cheat, murder, commit adultery or covet my neighbor's wife and I still wouldn't after. No, it would only serve to reinforce my opinions about the Bible. |
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22nd March 2012, 10:02 AM | #1505 |
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I feel this comparison is important, and should be brought to attention.
DOC, notice this conversation (here you make a claim that I am using argument ad populum. Clearly, you are aware of the fallacy and are trying to apply it here. (Instead of restating the fact that my use of the poll isn't a logical fallacy, I merely use your own posting style against you.) You respond once again with the claim that my post was a logical fallacy. So it is clear you are aware that use of argumentum ad populum IS a fallacy. That it isn't a defensible argument. But then yesterday you make the following post in another thread. This is clearly an argumentum_ad_populum. Yet you used it. You knowingly used it, even when you clearly know it is a fallacy to use it. How do you defend such dishonesty? |
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What's the best argument for UHC? This argument against UHC. "Perhaps one reason per capita GDP is lower in UHC countries is because they've tried to prevent this important function [bankrupting the sick] and thus carry forward considerable economic dead wood?"-BeAChooser |
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22nd March 2012, 10:39 AM | #1506 |
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"You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield "The poor mystic homeopaths feel like petted house-cats thrown at high flood on the breaking ice." - Leon Trotsky |
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22nd March 2012, 10:46 AM | #1507 |
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22nd March 2012, 11:00 AM | #1508 |
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22nd March 2012, 11:03 AM | #1509 |
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22nd March 2012, 11:31 AM | #1510 |
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The actual name of the monarch in question was Nabu-kidurri- user, which is an invocation to Nabu, patron deity of the Chaldeans. It means, "Nabu, protect the boundary-stone." This name was somewhat corrupted in Hebrew as Nebuchadrezzar. IIRC the Greeks called this king "Nabuchodonosser," which is the source of Nebuchadnezzar. Whenever you see this form, it means that either the text was written later or an earlier text was edited later, at a time of Greek influence, i.e. the Hellenistic period. If I' not mistaken, both forms of the name appear in Jeremiah. In 1 and 2 Kings it's always Nebuchadnezzar. However, the last entry in 2 Kings can be dated to about 560 BCE; so the later form of the name probably shows only later editing. The use of Nebuchadnezzar in the Book of Daniel is one of the many anachronisms that help s date the work to the Hellenistic period.
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22nd March 2012, 11:47 AM | #1511 |
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22nd March 2012, 11:51 AM | #1512 |
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If the biblical prophets had tapped into something supernatural they might have gotten some of their prophecies right. However:
1) Nahum only predicted the fall of Nineveh at the time the Medes and Chaldeans were closing in on the Assyrian capitol, and his prediction that the enemies of Assyria would enter the city by the river gates was wrong. 2) Isaiah and Jeremiah were wrong in predicting that the Medes (or Persians) would violently sack Babylon. 3) Ezekiel wrongly predicted Nebuchadrezzar would destroy Tyre. 4) Ezekiel wrongly predicted Nebuchadrezzar would invade and devastate Egypt, including the city of Thebes. |
22nd March 2012, 11:54 AM | #1513 |
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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22nd March 2012, 11:59 AM | #1514 |
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22nd March 2012, 12:12 PM | #1515 |
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How many zeros? Jabba |
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22nd March 2012, 12:30 PM | #1516 |
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22nd March 2012, 12:37 PM | #1517 |
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22nd March 2012, 12:51 PM | #1518 |
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-Aberhaten did it - "Which gives us an answer to our question. What’s the worst thing that can happen in a pressure cooker?" Randall Munroe -Director of Independent Determining Inquisitor Of Crazy Yapping - Aberhaten's Apothegm™ - An Internet law that states that optimism is indistinguishable from sarcasm |
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22nd March 2012, 12:54 PM | #1519 |
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22nd March 2012, 12:59 PM | #1520 |
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