Putin Personally Involved in Hack - Page 5

WilliamSeger · 22nd December 2016, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

Third, I'm still having a hard time getting excited about the release of accurate, non-classified information.

How do you feel about Trump exaggerating and flat-out lying about the emails? Do you think that had any effect on the election?

Ziggurat · 23rd December 2016, 07:05 AM

Originally Posted by Foolmewunz

Different discussion than the one we're having. Why don't you address the points I made instead of regressing?

Because I want to know how honest your objection actually is. And it looks like it's not, since you can't even give a simple "yes" before moving on.

Quote:

Is this the game plan? You folks are going to replay the 2016 election for the next four years

Wow. Talk about projecting. It's the left that keeps trying to come up with excuses for why it lost, and reasons to try to delegitimize the results.

Quote:

My question remains. You aver that you're a conservative?

No, actually, as a matter of fact I don't. There's some overlap between me and conservatives on many issues, but there's also some overlap between me and liberals on others, so I don't think I fit all that well into any one label. I doubt that matters to you, but you asked.

Quote:

You find that it's all okay that the Russians (or the Freedonians) made a professional and concerted effort to hack into private correspondence and selectively release material that was damaging to one side only.

No, it's not OK. It's not OK for anyone to hack into someone else's system without permission.

But on the scale of things to worry about, this is kind of low. Russia's invasion of Ukraine is a much bigger issue. Their selling air defense systems to Iran is a bigger issue. Their use of civilians in Syria for target practice is a bigger issue.

Hell, even if we want to restrict the conversation just to hacking, the State Dept. hack is a bigger issue. And the hack of the Office of Personnel Management is perhaps the biggest of all.

As for releasing the information publicly, well, that's about the most benign use they could put any of this to. Better to have it all made public then for them to possibly use it as leverage. As the Chinese will undoubtedly do with all that sensitive OPM data.

So while I think it's not a good thing that the Russians hacked the Democrats, I think the amount of attention it's getting compared to other stuff is not because of its actual seriousness, but because it serves the Democratic party agenda.

Ziggurat · 23rd December 2016, 07:08 AM

Originally Posted by WilliamSeger

How do you feel about Trump exaggerating and flat-out lying about the emails? Do you think that had any effect on the election?

I feel about the same as I felt about Hillary exaggerating and flat-out lying about emails. No idea what effect either had.

How do you feel about Harry Reid flat-out lying about Romney's taxes? Do you think that had any effect on the election?

WilliamSeger · 23rd December 2016, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

I feel about the same as I felt about Hillary exaggerating and flat-out lying about emails. No idea what effect either had.

I can show you Trump's lies about the emails -- actual things he said that are demonstrably false, not just my belief that they were false -- but you go first and we'll compare notes. Maybe you won't feel the same after that, but I doubt it.

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

How do you feel about Harry Reid flat-out lying about Romney's taxes? Do you think that had any effect on the election?

Maybe if it had been a close election, it would have had an effect, but it wasn't close. Reid repeated a rumor -- obviously a very bad idea and it can't be condoned -- but it was a believable rumor because Romney was so adamant about refusing to release his tax returns, which should cause justifiable suspicion. In fact, he never did release anything but a summary of two years, so I still have a suspicion that Reid wasn't that far off, and we still don't know what he was hiding.

That the best you got? Reid lied four years ago in a Senate speech, so Democrats are obliged to accept Trump's "unpresidented" lie-a-minute mendacity now? Anyway, you completely missed my point, so I'll reiterate it: My comment was to address the comments about how, if the emails were "damaging" then that "transparency" was for the better. What was actually in them was pretty tame until Trump used them to falsely claim criminal conduct. If Reid had repeatedly led rally crowds chanting "lock him up" you might be closer to a serviceable deflection, but we still have the problem that Trump is a sociopathic liar who won a very close election.

Ziggurat · 23rd December 2016, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by WilliamSeger

I can show you Trump's lies about the emails

I don't doubt that.

Quote:

but you go first and we'll compare notes.

No. Not worth my time, there are threads on it already.

Quote:

Reid repeated a rumor -- obviously a very bad idea and it can't be condoned -- but it was a believable rumor because Romney was so adamant about refusing to release his tax returns, which should cause justifiable suspicion.

Reid lied. He knew the accusation was baseless. And his explicit justification for doing so was that it worked.

Quote:

That the best you got? Reid lied four years ago in a Senate speech, so Democrats are obliged to accept Trump's "unpresidented" lie-a-minute mendacity now?

Nobody is obliged to "accept" anything. But your complaints are clearly self-interested, not principled. And I will take that into consideration when I decide how much I should be concerned about them.

WilliamSeger · 23rd December 2016, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

Nobody is obliged to "accept" anything. But your complaints are clearly self-interested, not principled. And I will take that into consideration when I decide how much I should be concerned about them.

And once again, you dodge my point by trying to deflect with false equivalence. Why is it that that's the best you can ever do to defend the Boy King? I have to assume it's because he's indefensible.

Ziggurat · 23rd December 2016, 09:58 AM

Originally Posted by WilliamSeger

And once again, you dodge my point by trying to deflect with false equivalence. Why is it that that's the best you can ever do to defend the Boy King? I have to assume it's because he's indefensible.

Again, I'm not trying to defend Trump. There are plenty of good reasons to criticize him, and I never liked him to begin with.

But you don't have a lot of credibility on this subject. The official narrative has turned to blaming Putin, so you dutifully follow right along. But there's no consistency, no principles behind it. So, I don't care. Nothing has changed. Trump will be lousy, but that's nothing new.

WilliamSeger · 23rd December 2016, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

But you don't have a lot of credibility on this subject. The official narrative has turned to blaming Putin, so you dutifully follow right along. But there's no consistency, no principles behind it. So, I don't care. Nothing has changed. Trump will be lousy, but that's nothing new.

No, I'm not interested in any "official narrative" that doesn't say the main reason Trump won is that he is a deplorable demagogue who pushed all sorts of bigot buttons, and bigots responded. I do believe that Trump's email lies had a small effect, and that Comey's irresponsible insinuation that some scandal was developing had a bigger effect. Have you figured out yet why Putin would prefer Trump, or is that another thing you don't care about?

But anyway, after this election, "principles" and "Republican" are two words that only belong together in punchlines, so back at ya.

logger · 23rd December 2016, 10:27 AM

Now Putin is calling the snowflakes sore losers. Are you leftist going to take that?

Ziggurat · 23rd December 2016, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by WilliamSeger

No, I'm not interested in any "official narrative" that doesn't say the main reason Trump won is that he is a deplorable demagogue who pushed all sorts of bigot buttons, and bigots responded.

Wow. I didn't expect you to prove my point about the narrowness of your thinking so explicitly.

Darth Rotor · 23rd December 2016, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by theprestige

Clinton was a poor candidate with a poor campaign, but if everything else had gone her way, she might have beaten Donald Trump anyway? I don't think a presidential candidate should have to depend on luck to win an election.

Why do you hate Harry Truman?

I am not sure luck entered into it ... but it might have. Luck is hard to measure.

RobLister · 23rd December 2016, 11:06 AM

We should blame Putin no more or less than we blame Snowden.

I can divest responsibility. I hate what Snowden did but the reveilded facts cannot be ignored.

Bob001 · 23rd December 2016, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by logger

Now Putin is calling the snowflakes sore losers. Are you leftist going to take that?

The "leftists" like Obama are the people who have imposed tough sanctions on Russia and opposed Putin's foreign policy, to a degree that KGB thug Putin regarded "leftist" Hillary Clinton as his personal enemy. It's your guy who's sucking up to Putin, even panting breathlessly about what great leader he is and how much closer he wants to be. Who's the snowflake?

varwoche · 23rd December 2016, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by RobLister

We should blame Putin no more or less than we blame Snowden.

I can divest responsibility. I hate what Snowden did but the reveilded facts cannot be ignored.

Either there are multiple Rob Listers's floating about the skeptical universe, or else welcome back! Good to see you and I hope life is treating you well.

Minoosh · 23rd December 2016, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

The official narrative has turned to blaming Putin, so you dutifully follow right along. But there's no consistency, no principles behind it. So, I don't care. Nothing has changed. Trump will be lousy, but that's nothing new.

Whose official narrative?

varwoche · 23rd December 2016, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by Foolmewunz

Hilited: Disclaimer! I hadn't seen your post before composing my above response to The Prestige.

Great minds etc.

Mader Levap · 23rd December 2016, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by Bob001

The "leftists" like Obama are the people who have imposed tough sanctions on Russia and opposed Putin's foreign policy, to a degree that KGB thug Putin regarded "leftist" Hillary Clinton as his personal enemy. It's your guy who's sucking up to Putin, even panting breathlessly about what great leader he is and how much closer he wants to be.

Putin is authoritanian leader and el presidento of biggest banana republic in the world that has Trump as pet. Of course republicans under those circumstances will admire someone that actually has one-party system in his country.

I mean, USA is 1/3 way there already - it has one-party system in House (you can guess which party is that lucky). Pseudo-democracy that will rot now faster than ever, potentially shaping into rightwing authoritanian degeneracy in far future.

logger · 23rd December 2016, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by Bob001

The "leftists" like Obama are the people who have imposed tough sanctions on Russia and opposed Putin's foreign policy, to a degree that KGB thug Putin regarded "leftist" Hillary Clinton as his personal enemy. It's your guy who's sucking up to Putin, even panting breathlessly about what great leader he is and how much closer he wants to be. Who's the snowflake?

Your side wanted a reset button, here's president who seems to know how to do it. Your side talks to NK, Iran, Cuba and other notorious bad actors. Trump starts with a decent relationship with Russia and the left has a complete meltdown. Its only because Putin sunk your old bag!

logger · 23rd December 2016, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by Mader Levap

Putin is authoritanian leader and el presidento of biggest banana republic in the world that has Trump as pet. Of course republicans under those circumstances will admire someone that actually has one-party system in his country.

I mean, USA is 1/3 way there already - it has one-party system in House (you can guess which party is that lucky). Pseudo-democracy that will rot now faster than ever, potentially shaping into rightwing authoritanian degeneracy in far future.

We aren't a democracy and yes my side is in complete power, it damn sure isnt just the House.

logger · 23rd December 2016, 05:57 PM

Look at Putin dems, making your pain even greater. Doesn't he know this 5 stage grief thing is serious!

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016...e-me-dems.html

Roger Ramjets · 23rd December 2016, 06:37 PM

Originally Posted by logger

Now Putin is calling the snowflakes sore losers. Are you leftist going to take that?

Winners and losers - that's what it's all about? Those stupid leftists getting all worried about what affect it might have on the country, don't they realize the only thing that matters is they lost?

Of course conservatives have always had a soft spot for Putin, because he and they are so alike. I welcome the day that the US becomes just like Russia, then we can truly say that we won!

Roger Ramjets · 23rd December 2016, 06:46 PM

Originally Posted by logger

Look at Putin dems, making your pain even greater. Doesn't he know this 5 stage grief thing is serious!

Dems might be pain, but those of us who hate America are in stitches! For the next 4 years we will watching the progress of Trump Nation - and laughing about it.

Skeptic Ginger · 23rd December 2016, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets

Dems might be pain, but those of us who hate America are in stitches! For the next 4 years we will watching the progress of Trump Nation - and laughing about it.

You don't think Trump's antics might put the rest of the world in turmoil as well?

I wouldn't be so quick to celebrate.

logger · 23rd December 2016, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets

Dems might be pain, but those of us who hate America are in stitches! For the next 4 years we will watching the progress of Trump Nation - and laughing about it.

I'm delighted!

logger · 23rd December 2016, 09:00 PM

Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets

Winners and losers - that's what it's all about? Those stupid leftists getting all worried about what affect it might have on the country, don't they realize the only thing that matters is they lost?

Yes thats what it's all about! If my side wins we get to put fourth the policies we like and cancel the policies you like. Understand now?

Quote:

Of course conservatives have always had a soft spot for Putin, because he and they are so alike. I welcome the day that the US becomes just like Russia, then we can truly say that we won!

Lol, whatever you say

thaiboxerken · 25th December 2016, 11:51 PM

Originally Posted by RobLister

We should blame Putin no more or less than we blame Snowden.

I can divest responsibility. I hate what Snowden did but the reveilded facts cannot be ignored.

What if those "facts" were doctored by the Russians to actually be misrepresentations of the truth?

23rd December 2016, 07:05 AM	#162
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 48,360	Originally Posted by Foolmewunz Different discussion than the one we're having. Why don't you address the points I made instead of regressing? Because I want to know how honest your objection actually is. And it looks like it's not, since you can't even give a simple "yes" before moving on. Quote: Is this the game plan? You folks are going to replay the 2016 election for the next four years Wow. Talk about projecting. It's the left that keeps trying to come up with excuses for why it lost, and reasons to try to delegitimize the results. Quote: My question remains. You aver that you're a conservative? No, actually, as a matter of fact I don't. There's some overlap between me and conservatives on many issues, but there's also some overlap between me and liberals on others, so I don't think I fit all that well into any one label. I doubt that matters to you, but you asked. Quote: You find that it's all okay that the Russians (or the Freedonians) made a professional and concerted effort to hack into private correspondence and selectively release material that was damaging to one side only. No, it's not OK. It's not OK for anyone to hack into someone else's system without permission. But on the scale of things to worry about, this is kind of low. Russia's invasion of Ukraine is a much bigger issue. Their selling air defense systems to Iran is a bigger issue. Their use of civilians in Syria for target practice is a bigger issue. Hell, even if we want to restrict the conversation just to hacking, the State Dept. hack is a bigger issue. And the hack of the Office of Personnel Management is perhaps the biggest of all. As for releasing the information publicly, well, that's about the most benign use they could put any of this to. Better to have it all made public then for them to possibly use it as leverage. As the Chinese will undoubtedly do with all that sensitive OPM data. So while I think it's not a good thing that the Russians hacked the Democrats, I think the amount of attention it's getting compared to other stuff is not because of its actual seriousness, but because it serves the Democratic party agenda.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

23rd December 2016, 07:08 AM	#163
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 48,360	Originally Posted by WilliamSeger How do you feel about Trump exaggerating and flat-out lying about the emails? Do you think that had any effect on the election? I feel about the same as I felt about Hillary exaggerating and flat-out lying about emails. No idea what effect either had. How do you feel about Harry Reid flat-out lying about Romney's taxes? Do you think that had any effect on the election?
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

23rd December 2016, 09:23 AM	#165
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 48,360	Originally Posted by WilliamSeger I can show you Trump's lies about the emails I don't doubt that. Quote: but you go first and we'll compare notes. No. Not worth my time, there are threads on it already. Quote: Reid repeated a rumor -- obviously a very bad idea and it can't be condoned -- but it was a believable rumor because Romney was so adamant about refusing to release his tax returns, which should cause justifiable suspicion. Reid lied. He knew the accusation was baseless. And his explicit justification for doing so was that it worked. Quote: That the best you got? Reid lied four years ago in a Senate speech, so Democrats are obliged to accept Trump's "unpresidented" lie-a-minute mendacity now? Nobody is obliged to "accept" anything. But your complaints are clearly self-interested, not principled. And I will take that into consideration when I decide how much I should be concerned about them.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

23rd December 2016, 09:58 AM	#167
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 48,360	Originally Posted by WilliamSeger And once again, you dodge my point by trying to deflect with false equivalence. Why is it that that's the best you can ever do to defend the Boy King? I have to assume it's because he's indefensible. Again, I'm not trying to defend Trump. There are plenty of good reasons to criticize him, and I never liked him to begin with. But you don't have a lot of credibility on this subject. The official narrative has turned to blaming Putin, so you dutifully follow right along. But there's no consistency, no principles behind it. So, I don't care. Nothing has changed. Trump will be lousy, but that's nothing new.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

23rd December 2016, 10:27 AM	#169
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145	Now Putin is calling the snowflakes sore losers. Are you leftist going to take that?
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145

22nd December 2016, 06:34 PM	#161
WilliamSeger Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 5,092	Originally Posted by Ziggurat Third, I'm still having a hard time getting excited about the release of accurate, non-classified information. How do you feel about Trump exaggerating and flat-out lying about the emails? Do you think that had any effect on the election?

23rd December 2016, 09:15 AM	#164
WilliamSeger Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 5,092	Originally Posted by Ziggurat I feel about the same as I felt about Hillary exaggerating and flat-out lying about emails. No idea what effect either had. I can show you Trump's lies about the emails -- actual things he said that are demonstrably false, not just my belief that they were false -- but you go first and we'll compare notes. Maybe you won't feel the same after that, but I doubt it. Originally Posted by Ziggurat How do you feel about Harry Reid flat-out lying about Romney's taxes? Do you think that had any effect on the election? Maybe if it had been a close election, it would have had an effect, but it wasn't close. Reid repeated a rumor -- obviously a very bad idea and it can't be condoned -- but it was a believable rumor because Romney was so adamant about refusing to release his tax returns, which should cause justifiable suspicion. In fact, he never did release anything but a summary of two years, so I still have a suspicion that Reid wasn't that far off, and we still don't know what he was hiding. That the best you got? Reid lied four years ago in a Senate speech, so Democrats are obliged to accept Trump's "unpresidented" lie-a-minute mendacity now? Anyway, you completely missed my point, so I'll reiterate it: My comment was to address the comments about how, if the emails were "damaging" then that "transparency" was for the better. What was actually in them was pretty tame until Trump used them to falsely claim criminal conduct. If Reid had repeatedly led rally crowds chanting "lock him up" you might be closer to a serviceable deflection, but we still have the problem that Trump is a sociopathic liar who won a very close election.

23rd December 2016, 09:50 AM	#166
WilliamSeger Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 5,092	Originally Posted by Ziggurat Nobody is obliged to "accept" anything. But your complaints are clearly self-interested, not principled. And I will take that into consideration when I decide how much I should be concerned about them. And once again, you dodge my point by trying to deflect with false equivalence. Why is it that that's the best you can ever do to defend the Boy King? I have to assume it's because he's indefensible.

23rd December 2016, 10:14 AM	#168
WilliamSeger Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 5,092	Originally Posted by Ziggurat But you don't have a lot of credibility on this subject. The official narrative has turned to blaming Putin, so you dutifully follow right along. But there's no consistency, no principles behind it. So, I don't care. Nothing has changed. Trump will be lousy, but that's nothing new. No, I'm not interested in any "official narrative" that doesn't say the main reason Trump won is that he is a deplorable demagogue who pushed all sorts of bigot buttons, and bigots responded. I do believe that Trump's email lies had a small effect, and that Comey's irresponsible insinuation that some scandal was developing had a bigger effect. Have you figured out yet why Putin would prefer Trump, or is that another thing you don't care about? But anyway, after this election, "principles" and "Republican" are two words that only belong together in punchlines, so back at ya.

23rd December 2016, 10:33 AM	#170
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 48,360	Originally Posted by WilliamSeger No, I'm not interested in any "official narrative" that doesn't say the main reason Trump won is that he is a deplorable demagogue who pushed all sorts of bigot buttons, and bigots responded. Wow. I didn't expect you to prove my point about the narrowness of your thinking so explicitly.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

23rd December 2016, 10:38 AM	#171
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 38,527	Originally Posted by theprestige Clinton was a poor candidate with a poor campaign, but if everything else had gone her way, she might have beaten Donald Trump anyway? I don't think a presidential candidate should have to depend on luck to win an election. Why do you hate Harry Truman? I am not sure luck entered into it ... but it might have. Luck is hard to measure.
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton__"If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok__ "I only use my gun whenever kindness fails."-- Robert Earl Keen__"Sturgeon spares none.". -- The Marquis

23rd December 2016, 11:06 AM	#172
RobLister New Blood Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 14	We should blame Putin no more or less than we blame Snowden. I can divest responsibility. I hate what Snowden did but the reveilded facts cannot be ignored.
RobLister New Blood Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 14

23rd December 2016, 11:19 AM	#173
Bob001 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: US of A Posts: 12,677	Originally Posted by logger Now Putin is calling the snowflakes sore losers. Are you leftist going to take that? The "leftists" like Obama are the people who have imposed tough sanctions on Russia and opposed Putin's foreign policy, to a degree that KGB thug Putin regarded "leftist" Hillary Clinton as his personal enemy. It's your guy who's sucking up to Putin, even panting breathlessly about what great leader he is and how much closer he wants to be. Who's the snowflake?

23rd December 2016, 11:55 AM	#174
varwoche Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Puget Sound Posts: 15,437	Originally Posted by RobLister We should blame Putin no more or less than we blame Snowden. I can divest responsibility. I hate what Snowden did but the reveilded facts cannot be ignored. Either there are multiple Rob Listers's floating about the skeptical universe, or else welcome back! Good to see you and I hope life is treating you well.
	__________________ To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot.

23rd December 2016, 11:58 AM	#175
Minoosh Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 12,242	Originally Posted by Ziggurat The official narrative has turned to blaming Putin, so you dutifully follow right along. But there's no consistency, no principles behind it. So, I don't care. Nothing has changed. Trump will be lousy, but that's nothing new. Whose official narrative?

23rd December 2016, 12:00 PM	#176
varwoche Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Puget Sound Posts: 15,437	Originally Posted by Foolmewunz Hilited: Disclaimer! I hadn't seen your post before composing my above response to The Prestige. Great minds etc.
	__________________ To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot.

23rd December 2016, 04:14 PM	#177
Mader Levap Graduate Poster Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 1,576	Originally Posted by Bob001 The "leftists" like Obama are the people who have imposed tough sanctions on Russia and opposed Putin's foreign policy, to a degree that KGB thug Putin regarded "leftist" Hillary Clinton as his personal enemy. It's your guy who's sucking up to Putin, even panting breathlessly about what great leader he is and how much closer he wants to be. Putin is authoritanian leader and el presidento of biggest banana republic in the world that has Trump as pet. Of course republicans under those circumstances will admire someone that actually has one-party system in his country. I mean, USA is 1/3 way there already - it has one-party system in House (you can guess which party is that lucky). Pseudo-democracy that will rot now faster than ever, potentially shaping into rightwing authoritanian degeneracy in far future.
	__________________ Sanity is overrated. / Voting for Republicans is morally equivalent to voting for Nazis in early 30's.

23rd December 2016, 05:39 PM	#178
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145	Originally Posted by Bob001 The "leftists" like Obama are the people who have imposed tough sanctions on Russia and opposed Putin's foreign policy, to a degree that KGB thug Putin regarded "leftist" Hillary Clinton as his personal enemy. It's your guy who's sucking up to Putin, even panting breathlessly about what great leader he is and how much closer he wants to be. Who's the snowflake? Your side wanted a reset button, here's president who seems to know how to do it. Your side talks to NK, Iran, Cuba and other notorious bad actors. Trump starts with a decent relationship with Russia and the left has a complete meltdown. Its only because Putin sunk your old bag!
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145

23rd December 2016, 05:41 PM	#179
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145	Originally Posted by Mader Levap Putin is authoritanian leader and el presidento of biggest banana republic in the world that has Trump as pet. Of course republicans under those circumstances will admire someone that actually has one-party system in his country. I mean, USA is 1/3 way there already - it has one-party system in House (you can guess which party is that lucky). Pseudo-democracy that will rot now faster than ever, potentially shaping into rightwing authoritanian degeneracy in far future. We aren't a democracy and yes my side is in complete power, it damn sure isnt just the House.
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145

23rd December 2016, 05:57 PM	#180
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145	Look at Putin dems, making your pain even greater. Doesn't he know this 5 stage grief thing is serious! http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016...e-me-dems.html
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145

23rd December 2016, 06:37 PM	#181
Roger Ramjets Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,344	Originally Posted by logger Now Putin is calling the snowflakes sore losers. Are you leftist going to take that? Winners and losers - that's what it's all about? Those stupid leftists getting all worried about what affect it might have on the country, don't they realize the only thing that matters is they lost? Of course conservatives have always had a soft spot for Putin, because he and they are so alike. I welcome the day that the US becomes just like Russia, then we can truly say that we won!
	__________________ We don't want good, sound arguments. We want arguments that sound good. Last edited by Roger Ramjets; 23rd December 2016 at 06:47 PM.

23rd December 2016, 06:46 PM	#182
Roger Ramjets Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,344	Originally Posted by logger Look at Putin dems, making your pain even greater. Doesn't he know this 5 stage grief thing is serious! Dems might be pain, but those of us who hate America are in stitches! For the next 4 years we will watching the progress of Trump Nation - and laughing about it.
	__________________ We don't want good, sound arguments. We want arguments that sound good.

23rd December 2016, 06:54 PM	#183
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 87,032	Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets Dems might be pain, but those of us who hate America are in stitches! For the next 4 years we will watching the progress of Trump Nation - and laughing about it. You don't think Trump's antics might put the rest of the world in turmoil as well? I wouldn't be so quick to celebrate.

23rd December 2016, 08:57 PM	#184
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145	Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets Dems might be pain, but those of us who hate America are in stitches! For the next 4 years we will watching the progress of Trump Nation - and laughing about it. I'm delighted!
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145

23rd December 2016, 09:00 PM	#185
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145	Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets Winners and losers - that's what it's all about? Those stupid leftists getting all worried about what affect it might have on the country, don't they realize the only thing that matters is they lost? Yes thats what it's all about! If my side wins we get to put fourth the policies we like and cancel the policies you like. Understand now? Quote: Of course conservatives have always had a soft spot for Putin, because he and they are so alike. I welcome the day that the US becomes just like Russia, then we can truly say that we won! Lol, whatever you say
logger Banned Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 11,145

25th December 2016, 11:51 PM	#186
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 31,712	Originally Posted by RobLister We should blame Putin no more or less than we blame Snowden. I can divest responsibility. I hate what Snowden did but the reveilded facts cannot be ignored. What if those "facts" were doctored by the Russians to actually be misrepresentations of the truth?
	__________________ 1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.