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Old 30th September 2019, 11:22 PM   #1961
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
The cause is the driving of the racists and bigots back under their rocks and out of the guise of "respectability" that the current regime has given them.
That may be your cause. I see no evidence that it was their cause.

Quote:
Oh, and I note that you make the same dumb mistake as another noted "conservative" poster. CNN and NBC and ABC(etc...) a.k.a. MSM are NOT left wing media.
It’s cute that you think this. Wrong, but cute.
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Old 30th September 2019, 11:31 PM   #1962
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Eh, it's a 12 year old kid with a story about being bullied. Important locally to the school, but not worth much outside of that. As I said waaay back, you'll never prove or disprove any "massive wave" of hate crimes via anecdote. As I recall, the stats show that hate crimes increased throughout Obama's presidency, rose somewhat faster during Dolt 45's presidency, and spike when and where he has one of his hate rallies.
Nope. That claim is wrong.
https://reason.com/2019/09/06/no-tru...y-226-percent/
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Old 1st October 2019, 08:24 AM   #1963
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
That article disputes one of those claims.

That hate crimes have increased during the Trump presidency is not in dispute.
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Old 1st October 2019, 08:35 AM   #1964
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
That article disputes one of those claims.

That hate crimes have increased during the Trump presidency is not in dispute.
That website is unreadable for me.
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Old 1st October 2019, 09:29 AM   #1965
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Your go-to argument is a sarcastic straw man. Make up a completely ridiculous position such as "racial attacks like that never happen" and attack that straw man. I never suggested that the Idaho case was a hoax. My skepticism was only about this particular incident and I read the whole article and also watched an interview with the girl before going out on a limb and making that prediction. It was all based on particular details of the reports and not the fact that the alleged victim was black. And guess what? My intuition turned out to be spot on.

Look such an attack is outrageous and is simply not believable. Clearly the kicking a coat hanger with the whole team involved is way too out there to be possible, there would never be that kind of group racist lawbreaking. It is as beyond belief as a gang rapes like at the frat house or the various football ones like these

https://www.athleticbusiness.com/rul...gang-rape.html

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...pe-allegations


All totally unbelievable and so clearly they never happened.
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Old 1st October 2019, 11:37 AM   #1966
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
That website is unreadable for me.
Basically, all they did is discover that counties with higher populations had more hate crimes, and politicians hold rallies in counties with higher populations. The original "study" didn't control for population size, nor did they apply their technique to Hillary Clinton rallies. Had they done so, they would have found that the correlation between rallies and hate crimes was even larger with Hillary, but that the effect disappeared when controlled for population.
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Old 1st October 2019, 11:42 AM   #1967
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Look such an attack is outrageous and is simply not believable. Clearly the kicking a coat hanger with the whole team involved is way too out there to be possible, there would never be that kind of group racist lawbreaking. It is as beyond belief as a gang rapes like at the frat house or the various football ones like these

https://www.athleticbusiness.com/rul...gang-rape.html

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...pe-allegations


All totally unbelievable and so clearly they never happened.
Some people were skeptical about a case which turned out to be a fraud, and those same people were not skeptical about a case which was not a fraud. A rational person would conclude that perhaps they understand something that allows them to correctly judge events. But you have decided that it's somehow offensive to correctly judge events. It's quite odd.
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Old 1st October 2019, 11:46 AM   #1968
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Basically, all they did is discover that counties with higher populations had more hate crimes, and politicians hold rallies in counties with higher populations. The original "study" didn't control for population size, nor did they apply their technique to Hillary Clinton rallies. Had they done so, they would have found that the correlation between rallies and hate crimes was even larger with Hillary, but that the effect disappeared when controlled for population.
No, that’s not what my link said.

My link cited FBI data that demonstrates hate crimes have increased during the Trump presidency.
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Old 1st October 2019, 11:53 AM   #1969
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
No, that’s not what my link said.



My link cited FBI data that demonstrates hate crimes have increased during the Trump presidency.
Again, that website is unreadable for me. Can you link to the FBI citation itself? Cut out the middleman?
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Old 1st October 2019, 04:53 PM   #1970
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https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/201...eleased-111318

This is what they link to. It's for 2017. Apparently it takes about 11 months for the data to come out given that this was published in November of 2018.

Quote:
Law enforcement reported 7,175 hate crimes to UCR in 2017, up from 6,121 in 2016. Although the numbers increased last year, so did the number of law enforcement agencies reporting hate crime data—with approximately 1,000 additional agencies contributing information.
Are the numbers up because hate crimes are up or because more agencies are reporting hate crimes to the FBI than the previous year?
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Old 1st October 2019, 05:34 PM   #1971
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/201...eleased-111318

This is what they link to. It's for 2017. Apparently it takes about 11 months for the data to come out given that this was published in November of 2018.



Are the numbers up because hate crimes are up or because more agencies are reporting hate crimes to the FBI than the previous year?
It's even possible that hate crimes are down, but the number of people inspired to report them is up.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 04:13 AM   #1972
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/201...eleased-111318

This is what they link to. It's for 2017. Apparently it takes about 11 months for the data to come out given that this was published in November of 2018.



Are the numbers up because hate crimes are up or because more agencies are reporting hate crimes to the FBI than the previous year?
Don't think that's clear from the statistics and we can only speculate and infer. What is clear is that the number of mass murderers who cite Donald Trump in their manifesto is up.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 05:25 AM   #1973
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
It's even possible that hate crimes are down, but the number of people inspired to report them is up.
Certainly the amount of up-to-the-second media reporting (and speculation) has increased.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 05:54 AM   #1974
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Don't think that's clear from the statistics and we can only speculate and infer. What is clear is that the number of mass murderers who cite Donald Trump in their manifesto is up.
Every watchdog organization has noted the same, as well. And this was predicted by the DoJ back in early 2009, but republicans lost their minds and screamed about it, which led to Obama shutting any effort to curb such growth down for a few years - a bad decision on his part, since the GOP continued to scream about how he was some sort of foreign negro militant long after he had done so anyway.

(And yes, mass murdering bigots, and white supremacists in general, have been more inspired by Dolt 45 - a predictable effect of electing the most openly bigoted president since Woodrow Wilson)
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Old 2nd October 2019, 05:59 AM   #1975
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/201...eleased-111318

This is what they link to. It's for 2017. Apparently it takes about 11 months for the data to come out given that this was published in November of 2018.



Are the numbers up because hate crimes are up or because more agencies are reporting hate crimes to the FBI than the previous year?
In part but of course individual agencies are also seeing a spike like the NYPD. This has been covered in this thread many times.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 06:37 AM   #1976
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Originally Posted by NoahFence View Post
Geeze... didn't see that coming.
Yeah... me too
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Old 2nd October 2019, 07:26 AM   #1977
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
It's even possible that hate crimes are down, but the number of people inspired to report them is up.
Sounds like that would be something for you to establish.

Good luck in your research and let us know how it turns out.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 07:28 AM   #1978
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Sounds like that would be something for you to establish.



Good luck in your research and let us know how it turns out.
Mainly I'm waiting for those claiming an increase in incidents to demonstrate that they've controlled for an increase in reporting.

Nice attempt to reverse the burden of proof, though. Let us know when someone does a proper study, rather than the half assed BS the SPLC tried to foist on us.

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Old 2nd October 2019, 07:53 AM   #1979
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Mainly I'm waiting for those claiming an increase in incidents to demonstrate that they've controlled for an increase in reporting.

Nice attempt to reverse the burden of proof, though. Let us know when someone does a proper study, rather than the half assed BS the SPLC tried to foist on us.
Well, actually I cited FBI data, but whatever. The data and source don't really matter. You're dedicated to believing what you believe.

I guess I should have linked to an article in the New York Post or a right wing blog, and you would have instantly accepted it at face-value.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 12:16 PM   #1980
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Edited by kmortis:  Removed to comply with Rule 11

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Old 3rd October 2019, 02:37 PM   #1981
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Dreadlocks MAGA attack...


Man, 18, riding CTA (Chicago) bus bashed in head with cane during a hate crime Wednesday afternoon, police say

Originally Posted by Chicago Tribune
Police were trying to find a person who hit an 18-year-old man in the head with a metal cane while yelling racially derogatory epithets on a CTA bus in the Marquette Park neighborhood Wednesday afternoon.

The man was on his way home from Daley College, 7500 S. Pulaski Road, about 1:50 p.m. and was on the bus in the 2600 block of West 71st Street when a man approached him “without provocation" and said: “F------ immigrant,” according to police.

The 18-year-old remained seated, but the attacker bashed him in the head with the cane he was holding before saying: “F------ Mexicans,” and “Look at those clothes, you probably stole them,” police said.

The attacker then got off the bus, and the 18-year-old made his way to Holy Cross Hospital, where he needed four staples to close the head wound, police said. He’s since been able to go home.

The assailant, who has not been arrested, was described as being an African American man in his early to mid-20s, between 5-foot-6 to 5-foot-10, about 155 pounds, with his hair worn in dreadlocks. He was wearing a white T-shirt and blue jeans, police said...
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...iq4-story.html
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Old 3rd October 2019, 02:57 PM   #1982
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Well, actually I cited FBI data, but whatever.
You linked to a Forbes web page that would not render legibly in my browser. Apparently they cited FBI data, but I wouldn't know it from your link.

From Puppycow's link (which I guess is the FBI data cited in your Forbes article), we get this page about the methodology:

https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2017/...es/methodology

It doesn't say anything about controlling for increases in rate of reporting, but it does say this:
Valid assessments about crime, including hate crime, are possible only with careful study and analysis of the various conditions affecting each local law enforcement jurisdiction. (See Uniform Crime Reporting Statistics: Their Proper Use.) In addition, some data in this publication may not be comparable to those in prior editions of Hate Crime Statistics because of differing levels of participation from year to year. Therefore, the reader is cautioned against making simplistic comparisons between the statistical data of this program and that of others with differing methodologies or even comparing individual reporting units solely on the basis of their agency type.
Which seems to suggest that they're not trying to control for increased reporting rates.

The "Proper Use" page linked in the above passage also does not describe any controls used when compiling the statistics.

So, in spite of the "fact" that you cited FBI data (which you did not actually do), you did not actually cite any source that describes data collection controls. Let alone controls for increased rates of reporting, which is what I'm asking about.

We're back where we started: An increase in reports, but no idea if that correlates to an increase in incidents, or an increase in reporting rate, or what ratio of the two. I'm still waiting for someone to address that.
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Old 1st November 2019, 02:20 PM   #1983
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One more data point for the massive wave files:

"Jamal Oscar Williams, 44, is accused by state prosecutors in Washington state of hate crimes and criminal harassment against Schmuel Levitin, a rabbi, and Ephriam Block. According to court documents, Williams “maliciously and intentionally” followed, threatened to kill and assaulted the men in multiple attacks in October because of their perceived religion."

https://www.thepostmillennial.com/an...es-hate-crime/

He's antifa.
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Old 4th November 2019, 01:44 AM   #1984
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Mahud Villalaz, an American citizen who lives in Milwaukee, was attacked with battery acid by a man who accused him of "invading" the country. The attack was captured on a nearby security camera.

Quote:
"He started arguing, saying, 'Why you came here and invade my country? Why you came here illegally?' [I said], 'Sir, you don't know my status. I'm a U.S. citizen too,'" Villalaz recalled. "He got mad when I told him 'everybody came here from somewhere else.'"

Villalaz, who was on his way to a restaurant, said he had begun to walk away when the man suddenly tossed the acid in his face.

He said he tried to defend himself, "but then it started burning really bad."

The Milwaukee Police Department told ABC News that they arrested a 61-year-old man in connection with the attack, but they did not release his identity. He will face a charge of aggravated battery, police said.

Milwaukee Alderman Jose Perez said he expects the suspect to be charged with a hate crime.
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Old 5th November 2019, 07:56 AM   #1985
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Mahud Villalaz, an American citizen who lives in Milwaukee, was attacked with battery acid by a man who accused him of "invading" the country. The attack was captured on a nearby security camera.
To be honest, attacking brown folks is the only response that makes sense if you actually believe the race-war rhetoric that Trump and others are peddling. The only difference between this guy and his peers is that he has the courage of his convictions and isn't too cowardly to act.

The American right is a cancer on our society.
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Old 7th November 2019, 09:36 AM   #1986
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
The American right is a cancer on our society.
This guy did something about it...

New video shows the moment Florida bar patron, 43, slapped a paper towel on top of a man's MAGA hat before spitting on the elderly Trump supporter and calling him a '******* communist'

Originally Posted by Daily Mail
The incident occurred at the Hurricane Grill & Wings restaurant in Vero Beach, Florida on October 25. In the video, Matthias Ajple, 43, is seen walking up to Robert Youngblood, 67, and slapping the paper towel on top of his MAGA hat. Youngblood, who was sitting at the bar with two other men, appeared to exchange words with the man before realizing the paper was on his hat...

Moments later, Youngblood is seen taking off the hat to remove the paper when Ajple jumps on a gate and appears to spit on the elderly man before walking away. Youngblood told police that Ajple also told him: 'You should go back to Russia you ******* communist.'...

When police eventually tracked Ajple down, he stated: 'I just was just trying to protect you guys because I support law enforcement, Trump supporters are communist and racist.'

Ajple was placed under arrest and transported to the Indian River County Jail without incident. He was charged with battery and his bond was set at $500. Ajple was later released after posting bond.

Ajple also told police as he was arrested: 'I don't even care that I'm going to jail, this is exciting, plus I have more time on this earth than he does anyway, he probably feels so good about himself.'...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-MAGA-hat.html
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Old 7th November 2019, 01:31 PM   #1987
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Silly liberal, bringing saliva to an acid fight.
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Old 7th November 2019, 01:36 PM   #1988
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
This guy did something about it...

New video shows the moment Florida bar patron, 43, slapped a paper towel on top of a man's MAGA hat before spitting on the elderly Trump supporter and calling him a '******* communist'



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-MAGA-hat.html
The horror, hope the old man makes a full recovery. Don't watch the video if you have a weak stomach.
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Old 7th November 2019, 03:10 PM   #1989
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This lunatic told the cops that he was trying to protect them from Trump supporters without realizing that the cops are Trump supporters.

Why wasn't he charged with a hate crime? He told the geezer to go back to Russia. That's a textbook hate crime.

The lunatic acid tosser should also be charged with a hate crime.
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Old 7th November 2019, 07:22 PM   #1990
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I guess it's white privilege that prevents the cops from charging the spitter with a hate crime.
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Old 7th November 2019, 09:37 PM   #1991
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Silly liberal, bringing saliva to an acid fight.
Act like a thug, get treated like a thug.

According to (the almost entirely white) conservatives here over the years, black people are thugs if they wear hoodies, take photos with the local mayor pointing at each other, listening to rap music, protesting nonviolently, and so forth - to the point where this alone justifies gun violence, and is not in any way connected to racism. MAGA hats have been associated with white supremacist violence, so by that standard, it's perfectly acceptable to shoot anyone wearing one.
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Old 7th November 2019, 09:57 PM   #1992
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Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
I support Trump and I didn't do that and I sure do not condone this. Trump was made aware that some morons were doing this and he admonished them to stop. Trump has tried to create jobs and has put many minority men and women to work. Perhaps some misguided morons did the things in the OP's post but the overwhelming majority of Trump supporters are against this behavior as is Trump himself.
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Old 8th November 2019, 11:53 AM   #1993
johnny karate
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Why wasn't he charged with a hate crime? He told the geezer to go back to Russia. That's a textbook hate crime.
It's not, actually.

Quote:
The lunatic acid tosser should also be charged with a hate crime.
He was.

Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
I guess it's white privilege that prevents the cops from charging the spitter with a hate crime.
It was more likely their understanding of hate crime laws that prevented it.
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Old 8th November 2019, 11:56 AM   #1994
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
I support Trump and I didn't do that and I sure do not condone this. Trump was made aware that some morons were doing this and he admonished them to stop. Trump has tried to create jobs and has put many minority men and women to work. Perhaps some misguided morons did the things in the OP's post but the overwhelming majority of Trump supporters are against this behavior as is Trump himself.

Here is Trump blatantly condoning criminal violence.
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Old 8th November 2019, 12:13 PM   #1995
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
Well he never implied gun violence in any way. Nor did he ever suggest specific targets that terrorists later targeted.

Had he, inconceivably, done either, he would have certainly stopped using violent language and encouraging such terrorism.

Oh, wait
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