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Tags Chadwick Brooks , William Lagasse

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Old 29th March 2007, 01:39 PM   #281
HyJinX
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Why?

You want to help?

Go ahead and make calls.

Doubling up isn't an issue. These guys need a lot of follow up.
C'mon Lyte...when you start saying things like this...you have to understand that you're being dishonest or that your previous statement was a lie. Don't lie. This thread, thus far, has been civil and interesting...don't ruin it with this kind of junk....seriously.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:40 PM   #282
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Why?
Sorry for being blunt, but I want to know because I don't trust you. You can ignore this request or you could provide a flip response, but the best thing you could do is provide a list of the media and authorities you contacted about your video.

I would like to contact them and find out how they plan on responding to you. We all want the truth right? So let's be truthful.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:40 PM   #283
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Originally Posted by HyJinX View Post
But what about the witnesses who saw the plane actually hit the light poles and then actually hit the pentagon? There's more of them then a few at the station...right?
Good question.

No there is not.

You have about 20 total that merely mention the poles in their accounts. (they saw them after the fact)

Only 2 specifically state that they "saw" the light poles get clipped.

Wanda Ramey and an anonymous military man.

They either deduced it and embellished their accounts or they are lying.

If they are willing to go on record and be filmed in order to clarify this like Brooks did their accounts would hold more weight.

As it stands their accounts are insufficient to discount the infinitely more solid and heavily corroborated north of the citgo testimony that was filmed on location.

If the north of the station claim is correct it stands to reason that some witnesses would be plants.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:41 PM   #284
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Why?

You want to help?

Go ahead and make calls.

Doubling up isn't an issue. These guys need a lot of follow up.
I'd like to be able to confirm your claim that you, in fact, sent anyone anything.

I'd also be interested in what the "various authorities and media" had to say regarding the material you sent them.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:42 PM   #285
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
The most notable fact is that he admitted that he "flinched" when he saw the plane and jumped in his car.

Clearly he deduced the plane being hit and embellished these details.

It's impossible for the plane where they all saw it to have caused the physical damage.

I don't believe I will be able to get another interview with Lagasse or Brooks.

I doubt anyone else will either.
I can get you another interview with Brooks and Lagasse, you can add it to your film. Done right here: http://memory.loc.gov/learn/collections/sept11/history.html

Lagasse Interview for you to add

Books iterview on what happen on 9/11, you can add this,

Do you have thesse interviews yet? If not, why not include them as evidence?

Last edited by beachnut; 29th March 2007 at 02:23 PM.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:42 PM   #286
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I have not lied. We have contacted authorities and media and we will continue to do so.

The list of contacts that we made is irrelevant to this thread or the north side claim and I have no inclination to share that information with you.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:44 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
I have not lied. We have contacted authorities and media and we will continue to do so.

The list of contacts that we made is irrelevant to this thread or the north side claim and I have no inclination to share that information with you.
Evasion noted.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:46 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Good question.

No there is not.

You have about 20 total that merely mention the poles in their accounts. (they saw them after the fact)

Only 2 specifically state that they "saw" the light poles get clipped.

Wanda Ramey and an anonymous military man.

They either deduced it and embellished their accounts or they are lying.

If they are willing to go on record and be filmed in order to clarify this like Brooks did their accounts would hold more weight.

As it stands their accounts are insufficient to discount the infinitely more solid and heavily corroborated north of the citgo testimony that was filmed on location.

If the north of the station claim is correct it stands to reason that some witnesses would be plants.
I think you missed a few....

Here's a computer programmer:

Afework Hagos, a computer programmer, was on his way to work but stuck in a traffic jam near the Pentagon when the plane flew over. "There was a huge screaming noise and I got out of the car as the plane came over. Everybody was running away in different directions. It was tilting its wings up and down like it was trying to balance. It hit some lampposts on the way in."

Here's a priest:

"The traffic was very slow moving, and at one point just about at a standstill," said McGraw, a Catholic priest at St. Anthony Parish in Falls Church.
"I was in the left hand lane with my windows closed. I did not hear anything at all until the plane was just right above our cars." McGraw estimates that the plane passed about 20 feet over his car, as he waited in the left hand lane of the road, on the side closest to the Pentagon.
"The plane clipped the top of a light pole just before it got to us, injuring a taxi driver, whose taxi was just a few feet away from my car.
"I saw it crash into the building," he said. "My only memories really were that it looked like a plane coming in for a landing. I mean in the sense that it was controlled and sort of straight. That was my impression," he said.



Unknown woman:
We live in Arlington, VA just outside of Washington, DC in a high-rise building on the eight floor. Our balcony faces the city, with a panoramic view of the Pentagon, National Airport, and the entire downtown area of Washington, DC. We were watching the events unfolding on TV in New York. Then, at about 9:40 am Eastern Daylight Time, my husband and I heard an aircraft directly overhead. At first, we thought it was the jets that sometimes fly overhead. However, it appeared to be a small commercial aircraft. The engine was at full throttle.
First, the plane knocked down a number of street lamp poles, then headed directly for the Pentagon and crashed on the lawn near the west side the Pentagon. A huge fireball exploded with thick black smoke.
BBC News, Sep. 11, 2001
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:48 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
The most notable fact is that he admitted that he "flinched" when he saw the plane and jumped in his car.

Clearly he deduced the plane being hit and embellished these details.
So you are cherry picking his testimony to support your belief of a flyover that no one witnessed?
Quote:

It's impossible for the plane where they all saw it to have caused the physical damage.
Wrong!! It was impossible for them to see a north of citgo flyover BECAUSE of the physical evidence.
Quote:

I don't believe I will be able to get another interview with Lagasse or Brooks. I doubt anyone else will either.
Why? Don't they accept your theory? Or have they now been 'Compromised' as reliable witnesses?
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:49 PM   #290
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
(...)the infinitely more solid and heavily corroborated north of the citgo testimony that was filmed on location.
You seem to be saying that because four witnesses all say the plane flew north of Citgo, this makes it "heavily corroborated" and you seem to imply that because it was filmed on location, this makes it even more valid.

Am I correct?

/S
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:52 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by HyJinX View Post
I think you missed a few....

Here's a computer programmer:

Afework Hagos, a computer programmer, was on his way to work but stuck in a traffic jam near the Pentagon when the plane flew over. "There was a huge screaming noise and I got out of the car as the plane came over. Everybody was running away in different directions. It was tilting its wings up and down like it was trying to balance. It hit some lampposts on the way in."
Does not claim he literally "saw" them get clipped.

Quote:
Here's a priest:

"The traffic was very slow moving, and at one point just about at a standstill," said McGraw, a Catholic priest at St. Anthony Parish in Falls Church.
"I was in the left hand lane with my windows closed. I did not hear anything at all until the plane was just right above our cars." McGraw estimates that the plane passed about 20 feet over his car, as he waited in the left hand lane of the road, on the side closest to the Pentagon.
"The plane clipped the top of a light pole just before it got to us, injuring a taxi driver, whose taxi was just a few feet away from my car.
"I saw it crash into the building," he said. "My only memories really were that it looked like a plane coming in for a landing. I mean in the sense that it was controlled and sort of straight. That was my impression," he said.
We personally interviewed him. He specifically told us that he did NOT see the light poles get clipped and merely saw them on the ground after the fact. Notice how he, like Afework Hagos, does not claim that he literally "saw" them get clipped.

Quote:
Unknown woman:
We live in Arlington, VA just outside of Washington, DC in a high-rise building on the eight floor. Our balcony faces the city, with a panoramic view of the Pentagon, National Airport, and the entire downtown area of Washington, DC. We were watching the events unfolding on TV in New York. Then, at about 9:40 am Eastern Daylight Time, my husband and I heard an aircraft directly overhead. At first, we thought it was the jets that sometimes fly overhead. However, it appeared to be a small commercial aircraft. The engine was at full throttle.
First, the plane knocked down a number of street lamp poles, then headed directly for the Pentagon and crashed on the lawn near the west side the Pentagon. A huge fireball exploded with thick black smoke.
BBC News, Sep. 11, 2001
This is DS Khavkin. She was in the apartments that were even further west than the sheraton. It would have been impossible for her to see the light poles from that location. "Small commercial aircraft"?
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:53 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
I have not lied. We have contacted authorities and media and we will continue to do so.

The list of contacts that we made is irrelevant to this thread or the north side claim and I have no inclination to share that information with you.
That's your choice, but I don't understand why. It would seem to be in your best interest to proudly proclaim what people, groups, organizations, authorities you are reaching out to trying to gain justice. I can only think of a couple of reasons why you wouldn't want to share;

1. You are not telling the truth and are afraid we will find out.
2. You are telling the truth but are afraid we will find out the results.

Even with #2, the upside for you is you get to say you tried but were thwarted.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:53 PM   #293
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Lyte, why didn't "they" crash the plane in the Pentagon?
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:54 PM   #294
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Only 2 specifically state that they "saw" the light poles get clipped.

Wanda Ramey and an anonymous military man.

Then I say

It's the high level of corroboration of the extremely general and simple claim that the light poles got hit. Is all that matters here


sound familiar?
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:57 PM   #295
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Quote:
The most notable fact is that he admitted that he "flinched" when he saw the plane and jumped in his car.

Clearly he deduced the plane being hit and embellished these details.
I'd be interested in hearing Lagasse's account of this rather than your opinions. If he says he saw the plane and the building at a point of inevitable collision this must go in as his tetimony. Seeing the impact trumps seeing the path and if he saw the impact you'll have to live with the consequences. You infer from the 'flinching' comment that he did not see impact. Sorry, we ned to hear him say it. If I see a plane scream by me toward the Pentagon I'm going to spend the extra second to watch it all the way in and I find it hard to believe he would not either. Again, only waht he has to say about this has any bearing. You cannot deduce that he is wrong about impact because of the impossibility of his path and impact being both true. He could simply be wrong about the path.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:57 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Does not claim he literally "saw" them get clipped.



We personally interviewed him. He specifically told us that he did NOT see the light poles get clipped and merely saw them on the ground after the fact. Notice how he, like Afework Hagos, does not claim that he literally "saw" them get clipped.



This is DS Khavkin. She was in the apartments that were even further west than the sheraton. It would have been impossible for her to see the light poles from that location. "Small commercial aircraft"?
Why didn't you interview these people on camera to support your claims? As it stands now...I'll need to take your word for it...and given that you haven't really earned much credibility thus far...I'm inclined to believe them and not you. That can change...but you'll need to conduct better research to cover all angles to support yours...not just throw your angle out there, throw a few witnesses at me (all who saw the plane hit), tell me not to believe all they say...but those parts that you tell me to believe and then tell me I'm not being a critical thinker because you make it impossible to trust you. Sorry man...I commend you on all the effort to put this together...but it just doesn't hold water against the physical evidence and the many other eye-witnesses that just don't corroborate your few.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:58 PM   #297
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Originally Posted by SLOB View Post
You seem to be saying that because four witnesses all say the plane flew north of Citgo, this makes it "heavily corroborated" and you seem to imply that because it was filmed on location, this makes it even more valid.

Am I correct?

/S
'

Yes it is heavily corroborated.

The fact that it was filmed on location makes it stronger testimony then the previous accounts from them or others because.....

a. There is no room for misinterpretation by the reader and/or reporter.

b. It gives them additional credibility because they were WILLING to go on record on video on location.

c. Being videotaped testimony it captures the certainty they have in their claims and gives the viewer the opportunity to analyze body language, inflections etc.

d. It allows the user to literally SEE the same point of view as the witnesses!

There is a MASSIVE difference and degree of accuracy in this testimony as compared to reading 2nd hand published accounts on the internet without having a clue as to what the witness could really see or where they really were.
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Old 29th March 2007, 01:59 PM   #298
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Lyte....NO ONE SAW A FLYOVER.

You are an embarrassment to your own movement.

Have you any idea how retarded you must be in order for that to happen?
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:01 PM   #299
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Lyte, i ask you again. The conspirators went to all this trouble to not crash the plane into the Pentagon, yet they crashed two other planes in the WTC towers.

Why?
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:01 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by A W Smith View Post
Then I say

It's the high level of corroboration of the extremely general and simple claim that the light poles got hit. Is all that matters here


sound familiar?
Find them and get them to confirm or deny their initial claims on video on location and you might have something here.

As it stands we have no way of knowing if these accounts are legitimate at all.

Wanda Ramey is allegedly a cop (we couldn't find her). I would LOVE to see if she would directly contradict Lagasse and Brooks. (if she exists)
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:02 PM   #301
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Find them and get them to confirm or deny their initial claims on video on location and you might have something here.

As it stands we have no way of knowing if these accounts are legitimate at all.

Wanda Ramey is allegedly a cop (we couldn't find her). I would LOVE to see if she would directly contradict Lagasse and Brooks. (if she exists)
Don't your two cop witnesses work for the Government?
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:04 PM   #302
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Originally Posted by Pardalis View Post
Lyte, i ask you again. The conspirators went to all this trouble to not crash the plane into the Pentagon, yet they crashed two other planes in the WTC towers.

Why?
They used planes as diversions while the actual destruction of the towers was completed with pre-planted explosives.

Same MO in Arlington.

Perhaps they didn't want the plane to hit the pentagon because they wanted more control over the damage since no catastrophic destruction of the entire building was planned.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:05 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Find them and get them to confirm or deny their initial claims on video on location and you might have something here.

As it stands we have no way of knowing if these accounts are legitimate at all.

Wanda Ramey is allegedly a cop (we couldn't find her). I would LOVE to see if she would directly contradict Lagasse and Brooks. (if she exists)
If we did find them. And they confirmed what was reported they said. On location. Would you or would you not conclude that your witnesses were mistaken? And that the assumptions of your flyover theory are grossly incorrect?
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:06 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
They used planes as diversions while the actual destruction of the towers was completed with pre-planted explosives.

Same MO in Arlington.

Perhaps they didn't want the plane to hit the pentagon because they wanted more control over the damage since no catastrophic destruction of the entire building was planned.
Thank you. Stundied.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:06 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by HyJinX View Post
Don't your two cop witnesses work for the Government?
Yeah so?

Clearly they exist.

Clearly they were willing to talk.

The fact that they are govt employees not pushing a conspiracy theory gives them credibility.

They were honestly relaying what they saw.

They all saw the plane in the same place and the notion that it was on the opposite side of the station is ABSURD to them.

"0% chance" "Less than zero!"
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:08 PM   #306
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Quote:
They used planes as diversions while the actual destruction of the towers was completed with pre-planted explosives.
Ah, I thought you were going to say there was a missle. And what of the secuity camera video. Something shot accross the lawn, or what then?
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:09 PM   #307
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Originally Posted by HyJinX View Post
Don't your two cop witnesses work for the Government?
Most likely they are contract security working for the government.

Impossible to tell from the photos. I notice Sergeants chevron pins on the collar of one of the cops, but it could be a rank within his company rather than within the military.

Where I work, the military cops wear military uniform. Contract cops wear a different uniform.

Edited to add: If you want to get in touch with the SGT's. DoD emails are usually in the form of: first name (dot) last name (at) location (dot) gov.

e.g. Sargeant.Lagasse (at) pentagon.gov (this is not meant to be a link, though it's showing up that way)
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:12 PM   #308
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"0% chance" "Less than zero!"

would they not also say the same about a flyover? Again, we need to know EXACTLY waht they saw of impact. You left this hanging in the film and it was a huge oversight on your part. Sadly, I have to wonder if you left it hanging because you knew they would swear they saw inevitable impact or actual impact and then you'd have a mess of conflicting accounts. Seeing impact trumps seeing path.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:20 PM   #309
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Originally Posted by alexg View Post
"0% chance" "Less than zero!"

would they not also say the same about a flyover? Again, we need to know EXACTLY waht they saw of impact. You left this hanging in the film and it was a huge oversight on your part. Sadly, I have to wonder if you left it hanging because you knew they would swear they saw inevitable impact or actual impact and then you'd have a mess of conflicting accounts. Seeing impact trumps seeing path.
I did not leave it hanging in the least.

I was very clear and asked them direct.

They were all quite certain the plane hit but all were honest enough to admit that the fireball concealed the actual impact.

Bottom line the plane can not be what caused the physical damage.

It is ludicrous to suggest the all simultaneously hallucinated the opposite of reality.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:22 PM   #310
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Originally Posted by alexg View Post
Ah, I thought you were going to say there was a missle. And what of the secuity camera video. Something shot accross the lawn, or what then?
The DoD wouldn't even take credit for that video for years.

Frames were removed.

The "smoke trail" produces no shadow while everything else does.

It was altered.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:22 PM   #311
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Originally Posted by HyJinX View Post
Don't your two cop witnesses work for the Government?
Here are their stories back in 2001, more information on both.
Interview with Brooks and Lagasse, here: http://memory.loc.gov/learn/collections/sept11/history.html

Lagasse Interview

Books iterview ,
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:23 PM   #312
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I wonder why lyte and merc haven't contacted anyone in avaiation to get their opinion on a fly over in a 767 and what kind of pull up needs to be done, exactly when it needed to be done, so that no one would notice.

a plane is hardly an object that one would forget to see, even in a fly over.

Shall I post pics of Maho beach and how low the planes come in for landing. Its basically at the height of what A77 flew at that day, even though they are going at approach speed; it gives you an idea of how low that plane would be.

and seeing how low it was will also determine when and where, and how much power it would need to do a sudden pull up


and why would they want to fly a plane over the pentagon? Where did AA77 go ? Why not just fly the plane into the building? Why "fake" all of this, when it would have been simpler to just fly the plane into the pentagon?

Again, lyte and merc presents something too complex, when it would have just been easier to fly the damn plane into the building. Already two buildings were hit that day; no one would have been surprised if a third were hit the same way.


Just to give you an idea on how low the plane would have been:

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Old 29th March 2007, 02:24 PM   #313
Calcas
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Perhaps they didn't want the plane to hit the pentagon because they wanted more control over the damage since no catastrophic destruction of the entire building was planned.
You just keep getting more and more deluded, don't you?

"They" had no problem rigging both towers to explode and collapse killing, perhaps, tens of thousands of civilians.

But, they didn't want a catastrophic destruction of the Pentagon.

I really think you're gonna wind up in a rubber room soon.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:25 PM   #314
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Quote:
Bottom line the plane can not be what caused the physical damage.

It is ludicrous to suggest the all simultaneously hallucinated the opposite of reality.
That's irrelevant if it is equally ludicrous that they are wrong about impact! What you didn't clarify was how INEVITABLE impact was. I could say I saw the impact and under cross I'd have to back off it what I actually saw was plane and building nose to face but just missed impact detail. In my mind nothing less than their personal clarification on this point will do.

Look, I'm giving you something. Their path testimony is really something. I am a bit mystified by it. But it's not as airtight as you are hoping. Odder things have happened.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:25 PM   #315
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
The DoD wouldn't even take credit for that video for years.
false


Quote:
Frames were removed.
100% false. As explained to you numerous times, the security footage was filmed at 1 frame per second.

Quote:
The "smoke trail" produces no shadow while everything else does.
false

Quote:
It was altered.
100% false.


how many errors are you going to make in just one post?
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:27 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by CHF View Post
Lyte....NO ONE SAW A FLYOVER.

You are an embarrassment to your own movement.

Have you any idea how retarded you must be in order for that to happen?
Many people saw what they believed to be other planes including one that allegedly "shadowed" the AA jet and veered off over the pentagon as soon as there was an explosion.

There may have been hundreds that saw the plane fly away.

They were simply told it was a different plane.

I'm sorry but we understand that you think the movement revolves around the LC board but it does not.

That board has just as many of you guys there then it does "twoofers" and the Pentagon section is run by RP who has a personal stake in his 757 impact conspiracy theory coupled with unlimited ego and pride.

The "movement" has embraced this data.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:28 PM   #317
DavidJames
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Originally Posted by Arus808 View Post
I wonder why lyte and merc haven't contacted anyone in avaiation to get their opinion on a fly over in a 767 and what kind of pull up needs to be done, exactly when it needed to be done, so that no one would notice.
Probably for the same reason they haven't contacted any authorities with their "evidence", they are afraid of the response. I know your question was probably rhetorical, but I couldn't help myself
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:31 PM   #318
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Originally Posted by Arus808 View Post
false
False.
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:33 PM   #319
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
All are quite certain of the simple claim of what side of the station the plane flew.

And their descriptions of this very general and simple detail independently corroborate each other.
Lagasse was quite certain of the simple claim of where the poles and the cab were. And his description of this very simple detail is corroborated by the physical evidence.
Quote:
The notion that they all simultaneously made the exact same ludicrous mistake about such a simple claim during an event of this magnitude goes beyond the realm of reason.
There are two possibilities: 1)Their claim about the flightpath was wrong, and the plane took a different path (planes can do this). 2) Their claim about the flightpath was right, and the lightpoles and cab quickly ran from where Lagasse saw them to where they were found by investigators (lightpoles can...wait, no they can't do this).
Quote:
You are not thinking objectively.
Perhaps I know a bit more about human perception and memory than you do. Or perhaps you know how Lagasse can be so certain that the picture is wrong about the posts and the cab.

Wait--he disagrees with the photo that YOU SHOW HIM! Did you doctor the photos? Did you move the location of the posts and the cab? Either he is mistaken, or you are!
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Old 29th March 2007, 02:34 PM   #320
Arus808
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Originally Posted by Lyte Trip View Post
Many people saw what they believed to be other planes including one that allegedly "shadowed" the AA jet and veered off over the pentagon as soon as there was an explosion.
doesn't mean there was a fly over

1) there is and was confirmed a c130 who was in the area before the crash. As he was interviewed, he mentioned even seeing the plane (AA77) in the area and expressed that he thought it was odd
2) the other plane in the area has been unconfirmed by any credible site or news source.

Quote:
There may have been hundreds that saw the plane fly away.
Wrong. They reported seeing A plane . Not "the" plane. As stated again, what they could have seen was the c130 plane that was ALREADY IN THE Area at the time of the crash.

Quote:
They were simply told it was a different plane.
False. And that is conjecture on your part. You can't deduced from any testimony that it was different plane since many eyewitnesses who were interviewed soon after the event stated they saw the plane hit the pentagon.

Quote:
I'm sorry but we understand that you think the movement revolves around the LC board but it does not.
false. the movement revolved around the inane statements by individuals who think they know everything.

Quote:
That board has just as many of you guys there then it does "twoofers" and the Pentagon section is run by RP who has a personal stake in his 757 impact conspiracy theory coupled with unlimited ego and pride.
false. there are far more woo people there than there are any jrefers there.

Quote:
The "movement" has embraced this data.
false. they haven't.
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