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Tags bigfoot , Bob Gimlin , Patterson-Gimlin film , Roger Patterson

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Old 6th February 2018, 05:42 PM   #1881
William Parcher
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Yeah, Roger said that they tracked Patty for 3.5 miles before losing her sign on pine needles. That would be a slow process to follow whatever sign was being left and might require dismounting numerous times or even doing the whole tracking event on foot while pulling your horse.

Maybe that lie was supposed to tie in with another lie told about Gimlin being a tracker with Indian ancestry. But then that partnership fell apart and the story didn't work out. The rather monumental tracking excursion bit got dumped from the already-inconsistent narrative. The timeline given doesn't even allow for the hours it would have taken to do the tracking trip and then still do everything else.

Gimlin doesn't talk about the tracking and people who question him at lectures seem to know to avoid that subject. The bent stirrup lie is avoided as well.
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Old 6th February 2018, 10:32 PM   #1882
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Gimlin was an experienced tracker. So was Bob Titmus.

No explanation required
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Old 7th February 2018, 06:12 AM   #1883
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Originally Posted by HarryHenderson View Post
And as that's contradiction's long running corollary, one can't bend a stirrup by his horse falling on him. As in it being essentially a physical impossibility. Of course in theory metal stirrups could bend, but in 1968 they weren't using metal stirrups on their western saddles, they had already bent wood (of all things) stirrups. A closer look at any of the clear video of P & G on their horses should show what stirrups they used. Those wood stirrups are basically bullet proof. A fully shod 1,500# horse could bounce up and down on just one of them with all four hooves at once and probably never affect it.

Proving your point, it's just a stupid detail RP made up that he thought gave it credibility (i.e. why would they say a stirrup bent if it didn't actually happen and who would really question it if it didn't) that he could never take back. Gimlin was right, there was no horse rearing or falling or bending going on, but their story had to have some kind of unique, definitive detail and Bob definitely wasn't hired on as creative director.
So what bent stirrup was Patterson showing to people then? Patterson was even limping, apparently. What was Patterson's prop stirrup?

https://books.google.com/books?id=0_...tirrup&f=false
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2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break?
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Old 7th February 2018, 07:08 AM   #1884
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How about this?

Roger is fooling people, so he grabs a cheap metal stirrup from a rocking horse, bends it, and carries it around with him to show the "RUBES" the evidence of the horse falling on him. He would never show that to a real outdoor person, because they'd laugh at him.

Here is the exact stirrup I'm thinking of.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-195....c100012.m1985
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Old 7th February 2018, 08:23 AM   #1885
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Most riders use stirrups they like, and have owned for years, just like their boots. Roger may have been using stirrups he’d had forever, or he may have even made his own.
Or, since he was using Bob’s horse he may have bent Bob’s stirrup, which sounds like something he would do.
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Old 7th February 2018, 08:47 AM   #1886
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
He would never show that to a real outdoor person, because they'd laugh at him.
A "real outdoor person" wouldn't laugh if that person was already a Bigfoot believer. Patterson understood the psychology of Bigfooters and so he only associated with them. Gimlin still does the same thing.
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Old 7th February 2018, 12:07 PM   #1887
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
A "real outdoor person" wouldn't laugh if that person was already a Bigfoot believer. Patterson understood the psychology of Bigfooters and so he only associated with them. Gimlin still does the same thing.
A real outdoor person, wouldn't be a Bigfoot believer. They might be part of the hoax, but for my point, a 'real outdoor person' doesn't include Bigfoot Believers.
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Old 7th February 2018, 05:51 PM   #1888
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Originally Posted by LTC8K6 View Post
So what bent stirrup was Patterson showing to people then? Patterson was even limping, apparently. What was Patterson's prop stirrup?
It's funny, I laugh at the board sometimes when people debate endlessly (or it just feels like that) about the tiniest of (mostly inconsequential) details of something and now I seem to be right in there doing just that. I apologize.

So anyway, with no picture of him doing it we don't know that he showed anyone anything stirrup-wise, it just says he did. Even if he did show somebody something, who knows what it was from. And he could be limping from the horse falling on him in general, independent of his foot. Or his wife coulda kicked him in the balls the night before.

It's true that bendable metal stirrups do exist and they even make a metal stirrup called a bent stirrup. That they're also called 'stirrups' is their only relation to this though. My contention is (and has been) that considering the kind of saddles they were inevitably using, western saddles, they had stirrups that can't actually be re-bent (and stay re-bent) once they're initially created (as bent wood). They would break long before deforming permanently. Akin to trying to reduce the size of your kitchen sink by squeezing it real hard. That is to say there's ALWAYS been a huge missing piece in this puzzle and it's exactly what you think it is, the so-called bent stirrup. It's because it doesn't exist, just like the beast.

Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
How about this?

Roger is fooling people, so he grabs a cheap metal stirrup from a rocking horse, bends it, and carries it around with him to show the "RUBES" the evidence of the horse falling on him. He would never show that to a real outdoor person, because they'd laugh at him.

Here is the exact stirrup I'm thinking of.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-195....c100012.m1985
And even potentially true, but again the idea he'd somehow be using metal stirrups on their saddles in the manner they ride makes no sense whatsoever. Equivalent to the notion of deliberately putting street tires on a motorcycle for use off-roading. Metal stirrups would be dumb (low bearing surface area), and in 1968 especially, quite antithetical to their being self described cowboys who use western saddles.
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Old 7th February 2018, 06:18 PM   #1889
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Originally Posted by HarryHenderson View Post
So anyway, with no picture of him doing it we don't know that he showed anyone anything stirrup-wise, it just says he did. Even if he did show somebody something, who knows what it was from...
He showed the bent stirrup to Al Hodgson and Syl McCoy. Hodgson would go on to recall and talk about it without ever asking, "what stirrup are you talking about, Roger never showed me a bent stirrup".

I think that Patterson purposely bent a stirrup to show local Bigfooters right after the claimed filming. It certainly didn't have to come from the actual saddle that he had been using - that was still back at Bluff Creek with the horses. I don't know if Patterson did go on to show others the stirrup or brought it to lectures and the film roadshow.
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Old 7th February 2018, 06:22 PM   #1890
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Originally Posted by HarryHenderson View Post
and in 1968 especially,
It was 1967, FWIW.
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Old 8th February 2018, 01:22 PM   #1891
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So the horse tumbles over (and is this little Peanuts we're talking about here?) and presumably lands on its side, trapping the stirrup beneath . . . its ribs? The stirrup bends but no mention of cracked ribs for the horse?
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Old 8th February 2018, 02:18 PM   #1892
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
It was 1967, FWIW.
I knew that.

Originally Posted by The Shrike View Post
So the horse tumbles over (and is this little Peanuts we're talking about here?) and presumably lands on its side, trapping the stirrup beneath . . . its ribs? The stirrup bends but no mention of cracked ribs for the horse?
Exactly! In addition to western saddles not even possessing the necessary elements, the practical application of the forces required to bend any kind of in-use saddle stirrup makes the premise of his horse falling on him and "bending" one completely absurd. The actual forces needed would kill both horse and rider long before any stirrup bending occurs. Which shouldn't really be a surprise considering Patterson is a literal king of absurd premises.
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Old 8th February 2018, 03:00 PM   #1893
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I make my own saddles and stirrups. Look at this stirrup I made that was bent when my horse fell on me when I filmed the Bigfoot.

Yeah, I see. That stirrup looks like it's more flimsy and bendable compared to the ones you buy.

Yeah, but I don't buy anything that I can make myself.
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Old 8th February 2018, 05:56 PM   #1894
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Originally Posted by HarryHenderson View Post
I knew that.
You were just testing me to see if I was powered on and paying attention.
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Old 12th February 2018, 02:26 PM   #1895
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Originally Posted by The Shrike View Post
So the horse tumbles over (and is this little Peanuts we're talking about here?) and presumably lands on its side, trapping the stirrup beneath . . . its ribs? The stirrup bends but no mention of cracked ribs for the horse?
I'm sure old timers here have seen this interview, Green questioning Gimlin, but for any newbies, Gimlin changes up the storyline a bit -- Patterson's horse didn't take a fall:

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/interviews/john.htm

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Old 12th February 2018, 03:32 PM   #1896
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Originally Posted by jerrywayne View Post
I'm sure old timers here have seen this interview, Green questioning Gimlin, but for any newbies, Gimlin changes up the storyline a bit -- Patterson's horse didn't take a fall:

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/interviews/john.htm
The stirrup story just got a lot worse (even if he did fall), he was mounted on sheep. Gimlin: "...this wasn't a full size horse Roger was riding either. It was a pony, a small horse." Green replies: "Yeah I've seen those little horses, he used to haul them in a Volkswagen bus." Amateur stirrup bending isn't a game for little horses.
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Old 13th February 2018, 03:13 PM   #1897
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Move over "wood apes." Now we have Forest Yetis. Anyway, Gimlin comments on state cryptid issue:
http://www.thenorthernlight.com/2018...ion-yet-again/
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Old 13th February 2018, 09:19 PM   #1898
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Originally Posted by jerrywayne View Post
Move over "wood apes." Now we have Forest Yetis. Anyway, Gimlin comments on state cryptid issue:
http://www.thenorthernlight.com/2018...ion-yet-again/
They're aiming pretty low with Washington state. Forest "Gump" Yeti™, the Official Cryptid of Amazon® would be way more fruitful.
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Old 14th February 2018, 12:53 PM   #1899
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She'd probably have better luck with the PNW Tree Octopus.
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q...wiki&FORM=IGRE
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Old 14th February 2018, 01:00 PM   #1900
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Originally Posted by jerrywayne View Post
Move over "wood apes." Now we have Forest Yetis. Anyway, Gimlin comments on state cryptid issue:
http://www.thenorthernlight.com/2018...ion-yet-again/
It wouldn't be totally unprecedented. IIRC, Wyoming declared the jackalope to be its official "mythical beast".


There is considerably more evidence for the existence of jackalopes than there is for bigfeets. Damn near every bar or touristy restaurant in the state has the head of one mounted on the wall.

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Old 14th February 2018, 01:26 PM   #1901
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Originally Posted by CORed View Post
It wouldn't be totally unprecedented. IIRC, Wyoming declared the jackalope to be its official "mythical beast".


There is considerably more evidence for the existence of jackalopes than there is for bigfeets. Damn near every bar or touristy restaurant in the state has the head of one mounted on the wall.
My ex-wife, a graduate from Yale no less, once took a trip out west and proudly brought back a jackalope postcard and told me she had viewed a stuffed jackalope at a gas station. She knew I would be excited since I was interested in cryptids. I replied by starting off with a snarky "You're a graduate of Yale, right?, and you think ....."
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Old 14th February 2018, 01:51 PM   #1902
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Originally Posted by jerrywayne View Post
My ex-wife, a graduate from Yale no less, once took a trip out west and proudly brought back a jackalope postcard and told me she had viewed a stuffed jackalope at a gas station. She knew I would be excited since I was interested in cryptids. I replied by starting off with a snarky "You're a graduate of Yale, right?, and you think ....."
The Bigfoot version.....you graduated from grade school right?, and you think there's a giant monkey man roaming the U.S.?
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Old 14th February 2018, 04:06 PM   #1903
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Originally Posted by jerrywayne View Post
My ex-wife, a graduate from Yale no less, once took a trip out west and proudly brought back a jackalope postcard and told me she had viewed a stuffed jackalope at a gas station. She knew I would be excited since I was interested in cryptids. I replied by starting off with a snarky "You're a graduate of Yale, right?, and you think ....."
Well, I think the rule for jackalopes is that none of the locals seriously believe they are real, but it is perfectly acceptable to try to convince gullible tourists that they are real.
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Old 15th February 2018, 05:43 AM   #1904
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Originally Posted by CORed View Post
Well, I think the rule for jackalopes is that none of the locals seriously believe they are real, but it is perfectly acceptable to try to convince gullible tourists that they are real.
That is the rule for any folk-story.

Snipe hunt being the base-line. Gullible scouts go to summer camp for the first time, older scouts and adults convince the younger ones that the Snipe is a real creature, even to the point of getting the younger ones to carry a paper bag around to look for it.

Locals in Petoskey area of Michigan would tell people to beware of cougars in the area all the way back to the 70's, despite the complete lack of cougars in lower Michigan at that time.

Likewise in Petoskey area, locals would tell of Native Americans still living in the woods, bending trees. They even knew where to go to show you where the bent trees were.

Rochester Michigan in the 70's, at that time, it was suburb still being carved out of the woods, anyone who lived near the woods would try to convince the city folk that they could see Bigfoot walking along the edge of the tree line. First hand account of locals making fake bigfoot tracks in the woods.
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Old 26th March 2018, 05:41 AM   #1905
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Does anyone remember the link or article that broke down the Patterson tracks starting with the Shipton Print, talking about how Krantz made it into the Sasquatch, and Roger Patterson took it from there.

It was very detailed, and explained how the Yeti folklore came from Asia to the Western US.

It also was detailed about the british expeditions to the himalayas to search for the yeti.
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Old 26th March 2018, 06:05 AM   #1906
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Forget it, I found it
http://www.thebermudatriangle.org/ht..._jury-rig.html

GIGANTOPITHECUS THE JURY RIGGED BIGFOOT
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Old 30th March 2018, 05:03 PM   #1907
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Forget it, I found it
http://www.thebermudatriangle.org/ht..._jury-rig.html

GIGANTOPITHECUS THE JURY RIGGED BIGFOOT
I like reading Gian J. Quasar on Bigfoot. But beware. He replaces the standard Bigfootville narrative with his own even more fantastic ideas. He thinks Sasquatch is an anthropoid monkey. He links it to this hoax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Loys%27_Ape

Quasar thinks the humanlike Bigfoot tracks are fakes, while the Ruby Creek tracks are real. He sees those tracks as monkey-like (although giant), even though when Green took a tracing of a track to a zoologist he was told it was bear. Gian argues that the De Loys monkey (not ape) migrated out of South America northward.

Quasar also toys with the idea that the more human-like Sasquatch reports are relict Neanderthals, so we have two types of Sasquatch.

He is rational about the nonsense of the standard Bigfoot is Giganto narrative, but red hot for his own made up bunkum. An interesting, one of a kind fella.
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