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#321 |
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"Facts are stupid things." Ronald Reagan |
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#322 |
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Eventually, maybe. But I think when she saw him she screamed, and that's when everything started going wrong.
I think he expected to sneak in, find her sleeping, tape up her mouth, and walk off with her. Whatever he planned after that probably wasn't good -and I doubt he ever expected to get any kind of ransom. |
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#323 |
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#324 |
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Why carry the bedding down to the basement? Why not just carry Jonbenet?
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#325 |
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http://www.troubador.co.uk/book_info.asp?bookid=2499 “She would be half a planet away, floating in a turquoise sea, dancing by moonlight to flamenco guitar.” ~ Janet Fitch The Gweat and Tewwible Winged One ![]() |
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#326 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jun 2003
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Maybe, but I would think writing three pages wearing gloves would be difficult. Further, I believe there was some evidence of him, somewhere. I just don't think it was entirely unexpected, so he escaped being considered as a suspect.
A tutor? A person that helped with the pageants? A coworker who visited now and then? A friend-of-a-friend? Someone on the outskirts, but known to be in the house, so that whatever evidence he left wasn't examined closely enough. |
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http://www.troubador.co.uk/book_info.asp?bookid=2499 “She would be half a planet away, floating in a turquoise sea, dancing by moonlight to flamenco guitar.” ~ Janet Fitch The Gweat and Tewwible Winged One ![]() |
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#327 |
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http://www.troubador.co.uk/book_info.asp?bookid=2499 “She would be half a planet away, floating in a turquoise sea, dancing by moonlight to flamenco guitar.” ~ Janet Fitch The Gweat and Tewwible Winged One ![]() |
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#328 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Nov 2002
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I find the ransom note very odd, I find the pineapple info odd, the flashlight odd, and the missing part of the paintbrush odd.
I think that the strangulation occurred when Jonbenet was alive due to the marks on her neck. Possibly the garrote was used initially in some sort of torture game? Where it was tightened until Jonbenet passed out, and then released so she would recover? Then she was eventually strangled to death with it. As far as the term "bizarre"...well whoever killed Jonbenet is a bizarre person, so that fact that we see bizarre actions is to be expected. I had not seen this pic before. Is this in fact her hand? If so, what are the marks from? http://i0.wp.com/www.nationalenquire...nfession-6.jpg |
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#329 |
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"Facts are stupid things." Ronald Reagan |
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#330 |
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http://i12.tinypic.com/2qwhfzc.jpg
http://i0.wp.com/www.nationalenquire...nfession-6.jpg Well, one of these pics is altered. ![]() |
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#331 |
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"Facts are stupid things." Ronald Reagan |
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#332 |
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#333 |
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#334 |
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#335 |
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But this blanket was apparently left in the dryer, it was not actually from the bed. So it was retrieved from the dryer and then taken to the basement. There was also one of her pink nightgowns with it, which was also apparently in the dryer.
https://adriaen22.files.wordpress.co...4939633723.jpg I suppose it's possible that the perp did indeed get the blanket out of the dryer, and picked up the nightgown accidentally along with it. |
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#336 |
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"Facts are stupid things." Ronald Reagan |
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#337 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Well, if the initial goal was to get her out of the house (as some including myself believe), having a blanket to cover her makes some sense. Although it is night, there is no guarantee the street will be empty, and seeing a stranger carrying a neighbor's kid will arouse more suspicion than someone carrying a blanket.
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One line of thought was that she was strangled first, then finished with a blow to the head. (This theory was put forward as an explanation why there was little blood... the strangulation limited blood flow to the head.) Another line of thought is that she was struck first (but the blow didn't pierce the skin), then strangled a little later (perhaps after waiting a while for her to wake up after the blow). |
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#338 |
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Part of the trouble is that these JonBenet internet forums is that they tend to be biased. It's just the same in the Jeffrey MacDonald case forums. I have been banned on several forums in the past, I don't think for any good or fair reason. Jameson's forum was always an intruder did it forum, but even Jameson thinks that Fleet White is innocent and she quite likes Fleet's pal Spade. That's absurdly credulous.
The FBI was mentioned by Judge Carnes in her 2003 ruling as arranging a media campaign against the Ramseys. That might include Fox News and CBS. There was an FBI man from Denver who turned up on the day JonBenet's body was discovered, I think called Ron Walker, who made some silly remark that Patsy looked at him through splayed hands. I'm not suggesting Ron Walker was involved in the Lockheed Martin child sex ring, but the FBI's work in the Jeffrey MacDonald case included fabricated evidence and forensic fraud. Malone of the FBI is still under investigation by the Department of Justice for his bad police work and false testimony in many cases. The FBI needs to up its game and employ professional criminal investigators. There is a bit about this matter from a recent internet posting: "Sig wrote: New rules at WS for discussing the JonBenet case: "From now on, we will only discuss people who were in the house the night JonBenet died. Kolar's book is THE handbook of facts and common sense conclusions in the JBR case. Unless you can find something the police have not, we will discuss the only viable people in this case: John, Patsy, or Burke. I am not stopping you from discussing your theory, just from discussing your theory at WS" Well, at least ol' Pigface is no longer making a pretense of being unbiased. Looks like Fleet White's personal friend Tricia, of Windchime pedo fame, has finally found a way to gag the few members left who stubbornly remain curious about her friend White's role in this case." |
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#339 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Simple answer... he didn't. He wrote the note before hand, with the initial goal of kidnapping her, but his plans changed for some reason (maybe she struggled more than he expected.)
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After all, why did Jack the Ripper dissect bodies in the streets after his kills? I'm sure to Jack he had a reasonable explanation for his actions, but as a bystander we're left with just guesses and feelings that "its strange". If we ever identified the JonBenet killer, we might find that he hated the Ramseys because they fired his dad, or that John ran over his dog. We might find that he got his ideas from watching 80s action movies, or watched snuff films. Until then we can only guess at his motives and reasons for his actions. |
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#340 | ||
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This is how the Ramsey case author Schiller in PMPT described the tunnel vision FBI man Ron Walker. The problem with Walker is that, like the Boulder Police Department, he jumped to conclusions and disregarded leads and suspects. You assume nothing in a murder investigation. It was never a complete investigation. It never went further than the Ramseys. Now it is Burke. The FBI never moved "outward in circles" as they are supposed to do so:
"At Boulder police headquarters, Det. Sgt. Larry Mason got a page from the Ramsey house: "We've got a body." "Oh, *******," Mason said, half aloud. "Ron," he told FBI Special Agent Ron Walker, "it's a homicide." Walker, an experienced FBI profiler, knew that finding JonBenet's body in her own home meant there had probably never been a kidnapping. In the case of a homicide where the dead child is found in the parents' home, the FBI's standard procedure is to investigate the parents and the immediate family first and then move outward in circles."
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#341 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Like nearly everything in this crime, the marks can be interpreted in a couple different ways. It is one theory that they are fingernail marks, but it is not a certainty. I believe they are petechial hemorrhages from the rope and not fingernail marks, although she was definitely alive when she was strangled. I think that is also how they know the head injury came first.
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#342 |
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No, the blow to the head had to be first. It caused swelling of the brain, which took some time, thus the "at least 45 minutes before the strangulation." The strangulation happened while her heart was beating, as per the petechial hemorrhaging around her neck and in her eyes.
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#343 |
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#344 |
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#345 |
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"Facts are stupid things." Ronald Reagan |
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#346 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Who said he was "tidy"?
Most people don't have a photographic memory, and the house had a lot of people wandering through it. If a pad of paper was moved, who would have really noticed? (The fact that the killer was unsophisticated didn't mean he would automatically wreck the place unnecessarily.)
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What I said was that either 1) he didn't think it was necessary (as another poster stated, criminals aren't necessarily all that smart), or 2) he was frazzled after killing someone (as most people might be) and didn't think of it.
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Killers often have strange compulsions to do things that don't make sense to normal people. Why did Jack the Ripper have a compulsion to dissect his victims, even though it increased the risk of being captured? Why did Zodiac and BTK feel the need to taunt police?
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Nothing about this crime indicates any sort of sophistication on the part of the criminal. The fact that he wasn't caught appears to be due to a combination of bad police work (not properly securing the crime scene, focusing on the wrong people) and pure luck. The only people insinuating that an invader would have to have been "clever" are inside jobbers who for some reason think that people can't walk into a room without gushing blood over everything and depositing semen on ever flat surface.
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The problem is that inside jobbers, in their attempt to prove their point, build up strawmen, and distort things I've posted. You've certainly done so yourself. Here's a suggestion... if you think it was done as an inside job, then tell us how it might have happened. Give us a plausible narrative, from the time the family gets home until the body is found, that covers all the evidence, and explains basic motivations, and where people were located/what they were doing. Then you will see just how much people have to "force puzzle pieces to fit". (The fact that nobody has been able to come up with a complete "inside job" narrative should tell you something.) Much like 9/11 conspiracy theorists, JonBenet "inside jobbers" are taking their own misconceptions, biases and ignorance, sniping at one explanation because they think its flawed, but then are unable to come up with their own story, because their own story would not just be flawed, but an absolute train wreck. |
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#347 |
Penultimate Amazing
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#348 |
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#349 |
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The cops screwed this up, the evidence points to John Ramsey, with a flashlight, and Patsy not knowing anything about it.
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#350 |
Penultimate Amazing
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#351 |
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"I'm 'willing to admit' any fact that can be shown to be evidential and certain." -- Vortigern99 "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace." -- Jimi Hendrix |
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#352 |
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"I'm 'willing to admit' any fact that can be shown to be evidential and certain." -- Vortigern99 "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace." -- Jimi Hendrix |
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#353 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Out of all the theories, (the invader, Burke did it with parents covering it up, Patsy did it alone, both parents did it), your theory makes the least amount of sense.
Handwriting analysis has ruled out the husband as the author of the note. (This is based on comparison samples written both before and after the murder.) That alone should rule him out. Then you also have the mother, who would be living with someone who killed her daughter and not noticed anything (especially since it would have taken a little time to write the note, stage the crime, etc., all the time his wife doesn't notice he's not in bed.). |
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#354 |
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#355 |
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I already did. I gave you the original police theory.
I do think it was an accident, but I think it involved Burke. I think the motive of the cover up was so that they did not lose their son and their daughter. Alternatively, it could have been an accident with Patsy and the cover up was to save her from prosecution. I cannot get past the fact that the ransom note specifically said JBR would be killed/beheaded if they so much as "talked to a dog" or called the police. The first thing they did was to call the police and... this is where it gets really weird... they proceeded to call a dozen various people to come to the house. They made sure she would die, didn't they? |
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#356 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
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They probably wouldn't just watch movies Patsy wanted. But statistically speaking, action movies usually provide more of an attraction to younger males than older males.
Again, I'm not saying middle age people never watch action movies. I'm not saying action movies are only watched by 20-something men. And if everything were equal and you had an unknown killer referencing lines from a movie like Deadpool or The Dark Knight (to give more modern examples) I'd say that there is a higher probability of the killer being a young male than an older male, and an even better chance that it was from a middle aged woman.
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From box office mojo: Suicide Squad: 76% of people who saw it were under 35, even though they make up only around 28% of the population. In other words, young people were more than twice as likely to see Suicide squad than old people Deadpool: 47% of the audience under 25. (This despite that only around 14% of the population fell in the 18-25 age range) In other words, a young person was more than 3 times more likely to see Deadpool than an old person Now, I would love to be able to dig up the statistics for movies like speed. But its not practical. But, you should notice a trend: Movies that are action movies tend to bring in a higher portion of young people.
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This is certainly not definitive proof. But, its just one more thing that points away from it being an inside job. |
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#357 |
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http://www.troubador.co.uk/book_info.asp?bookid=2499 “She would be half a planet away, floating in a turquoise sea, dancing by moonlight to flamenco guitar.” ~ Janet Fitch The Gweat and Tewwible Winged One ![]() |
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#358 |
Non credunt, semper verificare
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#359 |
Illuminator
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"We're so rich, so popular, so charmed no one can really hurt us." But are we certain they actually invited all those people? Or did they call one person, who then called ten others? About ten years ago my son made an offhand comment to a friend on the phone, and accidentally drew a crowd of people because the other boy told everyone he knew. |
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http://www.troubador.co.uk/book_info.asp?bookid=2499 “She would be half a planet away, floating in a turquoise sea, dancing by moonlight to flamenco guitar.” ~ Janet Fitch The Gweat and Tewwible Winged One ![]() |
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#360 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 12,295
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Actually no you didn't.
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(I could also mention it also doesn't explain how unidentified hairs could have gotten on the duct tape since they don't match anything from inside the house.)
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And Burke, a 9 year old, is shipped off to school, and is subjected to multiple police interviews, yet at no point did he ever let it slip that he did something. 9 year olds generally aren't that smart.
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