Elizabeth Warren Ancestry Thread - Page 3

acbytesla · 11th September 2018, 06:24 AM

Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows

Very similar to Navin Johnson (The Jerk), who grew up mistakenly believing he was an African-American. Johnson was the inventor of Opti-Grab for glasses, and became a millionaire just like Warren.

Hey, don't knock the opti-grab. I still have a pair. People exaggerated the cross-eyed side effect.

d4m10n · 11th September 2018, 06:25 AM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

Because our ethnicity is one of those things that isn't supposed to matter.

To whom?

https://hr.harvard.edu/diversity-inclusion

LSSBB · 11th September 2018, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by d4m10n

...but seriously what is wrong with claiming your ethnic heritage?

My wife is only around 1½ to 2% Native American (according to 23andme, depending on statistical confidence level) but she is nevertheless a card-carrying member of her tribe. I cannot know with certainty whether this helped her win acceptance from Harvard, but it probably didn't hurt.

Those of you who've never lived in Oklahoma may well be surprised at the number of people here who claim sone tribal affiliation, either formally or else as part of longstanding family lore.

The issue is in cases where there are a limited set of positions, using your genetic heritage as a differentiator. Should being of British Royalty help you?

Of course, then that brings up the question on whether that heritage has historically been a disadvantage, or in some cases currently is - due to human bias, if not institutional. Then the further question becomes how far back to go to correct wrongs, and also whether recruiting to increase diversity increases the educational experience of all members.

As in all things, there aren't easy answers. IMO.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 06:28 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

I didn't say your use denied access. I'm saying they are denied access through other systematic problems that members of the dominant culture do not face while selling something developed through that culture.

Yeah but that has nothing to do with cultural appropriation.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 06:32 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

Yeah but that has nothing to do with cultural appropriation.

It has everything to do with cultural appropriation. That is one of the key legs of cultural appropriation.

d4m10n · 11th September 2018, 07:50 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

It has everything to do with cultural appropriation. That is one of the key legs of cultural appropriation.

What aspects of Native American culture (if any) has Senator Warren been "appropriating" during her career?

(Assuming that this cultural appropriation subthread is somehow relevant to the OP topic.)

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by d4m10n

What aspects of Native American culture (if any) has Senator Warren been "appropriating" during her career?

(Assuming that this cultural appropriation subthread is somehow relevant to the OP topic.)

Someone brought up cultural appropriation. To explain why this isn't cultural appropriation, you have to explain cultural appropriation.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 08:42 AM

Originally Posted by LSSBB

Of course, then that brings up the question on whether that heritage has historically been a disadvantage, or in some cases currently is - due to human bias, if not institutional. Then the further question becomes how far back to go to correct wrongs, and also whether recruiting to increase diversity increases the educational experience of all members.

I'm still waiting for my reparations from the Saracens for killing my ancestors at Tours...

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 08:52 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

I'm still waiting for my reparations from the Saracens for killing my ancestors at Tours...

I hope you get it.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 09:10 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

It has everything to do with cultural appropriation. That is one of the key legs of cultural appropriation.

Make up your mind. First you said that the culture being appropriated had to have been oppressed, which I addressed, and then you said that "the minority culture is denied opportunity to exploit their own heritage", which I denied, and then you switched to "I'm saying they are denied access through other systematic problems that members of the dominant culture do not face while selling something developed through that culture", which is no longer about cultural appropriation. You don't seem to know what you're arguing.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

I hope you get it.

No you don't. It'd be a ridiculous request. I'm not those persons and neither are they.

Regnad Kcin · 11th September 2018, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows

Very similar to Navin Johnson (The Jerk), who grew up mistakenly believing he was an African-American. Johnson was the inventor of Opti-Grab for glasses, and became a millionaire just like Warren.

Yes, yes...”very” similar.

Maybe just stick to quote dumping.

carlitos · 11th September 2018, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Distracted1

I agree with her most of the time, and think she would do a fine job as POTUS. Yet I have an even more superficial reason for thinking she would have a difficult time winning -her voice. It sounds like a caricature of a condescending grade school teacher's. I would that that were not the case- but I find the sound of her voice distracts from the content of her words.

Me too**. I also find Hillary!'s monotone off-putting.

Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows

Very similar to Navin Johnson (The Jerk), who grew up mistakenly believing he was an African-American. Johnson was the inventor of Opti-Grab for glasses, and became a millionaire just like Warren.

**about the voice, not about her doing a fine job as POTUS

Dr. Keith · 11th September 2018, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Regnad Kcin

Yes, yes...”very” similar.

Maybe just stick to quote dumping.

If he had gone with the full eggplant scene it would have worked better. Although the why does he hate these cans scene is far funnier . . .

kellyb · 11th September 2018, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith

If he had gone with the full eggplant scene it would have worked better. Although the why does he hate these cans scene is far funnier . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tcwz8-EfFYE

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

Make up your mind. First you said that the culture being appropriated had to have been oppressed, which I addressed, and then you said that "the minority culture is denied opportunity to exploit their own heritage", which I denied, and then you switched to "I'm saying they are denied access through other systematic problems that members of the dominant culture do not face while selling something developed through that culture", which is no longer about cultural appropriation. You don't seem to know what you're arguing.

It is called clarification. The oppression is the systematic denial of access. That is cultural appropriation. I tried to speed through it, but I wasn't clear. It is why the adoption of rock n roll (while record producers denied contracts to African americans) and hair braids (Jenner is a trendsetter while women are harangued for violating dress policy for decades) are appropriation.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

No you don't. It'd be a ridiculous request. I'm not those persons and neither are they.

You can't tell me what my hopes are.

Dr. Keith · 11th September 2018, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by kellyb

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tcwz8-EfFYE

You're not carnival personnel!

Damn, what a great scene. Thanks for proving my point . . . whatever it was.

d4m10n · 11th September 2018, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by LSSBB

Then the further question becomes how far back to go to correct wrongs, and also whether recruiting to increase diversity increases the educational experience of all members.

A sticky wicket indeed.

If you go back to 1890s, at least one of my kids' ancestors was on the "Final Rolls of Citizens and Freedmen of the Five Civilized Tribes in Indian Territory." Between then and the 1990s, her descendants became more-or-less fully assimilated into mainstream white American Christian culture. At what point were various historical wrongs finally righted? Hard to say.

p.s. I'm still unclear on why people think Sen. Warren did something wrong.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

It is called clarification. The oppression is the systematic denial of access. That is cultural appropriation.

No, that's not what cultural appropriation is.

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

You can't tell me what my hopes are.

Yes I can. You know you were replying to a facetious comment. Stop it.

Dr. Keith · 11th September 2018, 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by d4m10n

p.s. I'm still unclear on why people think Sen. Warren did something wrong.

She didn't do anything wrong. A political opponent tried to claim she did and the president made up a childish nick name that stuck.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

No, that's not what cultural appropriation is.

Yes I can. You know you were replying to a facetious comment. Stop it.

Then we will just have to agree to disagree.

Just because you meant it flippantly doesn't mean I don't take it seriously.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

Then we will just have to agree to disagree.

No, we don't. You're wrong by definition. That's simply not what the term means.

Quote:

Just because you meant it flippantly doesn't mean I don't take it seriously.

Bob, I mentioned that I'm waiting for reparations from "Saracens" for an event that transpired 1100+ years ago.

Think, please.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

No, we don't. You're wrong by definition. That's simply not what the term means.

Bob, I mentioned that I'm waiting for reparations from "Saracens" for an event that transpired 1100+ years ago.

Think, please.

I understand you don't think you need it. I think you do.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

No, we don't. You're wrong by definition. That's simply not what the term means.

Bob, I mentioned that I'm waiting for reparations from "Saracens" for an event that transpired 1100+ years ago.

Think, please.

How about this definition...

Where people from a group that oppressed or oppresses another group mimics or represents cultural artifacts or manners of the oppressed group in a way that expresses or reinforces psychological elements of the racist ideology inherent in the colonialist project responsible for the oppression.

BStrong · 11th September 2018, 11:04 AM

As long as she doesn't attempt to install slot machines in the Senate chamber she'll be OK.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 11:04 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

I understand you don't think you need it. I think you do.

That'd mean that every human on Earth would be owed reparations by someone, just because an ancestor of theirs was wronged by someone at some time.

Yes, another case of a "principle" you want to push to its full, logical and ridiculous limit, pragmatic and reasonable considerations be damned.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 11:06 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

That'd mean that every human on Earth would be owed reparations by someone, just because an ancestor of theirs was wronged by someone at some time.

Yes, another case of a "principle" you want to push to its full, logical and ridiculous limit, pragmatic and reasonable considerations be damned.

Correct

carlitos · 11th September 2018, 11:07 AM

Why stop at humans? Let's pay the remaining Bison reparations.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by carlitos

Why stop at humans? Let's pay the remaining Bison reparations.

I'm open to the idea

Stacyhs · 11th September 2018, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by d4m10n

A sticky wicket indeed.

If you go back to 1890s, at least one of my kids' ancestors was on the "Final Rolls of Citizens and Freedmen of the Five Civilized Tribes in Indian Territory." Between then and the 1990s, her descendants became more-or-less fully assimilated into mainstream white American Christian culture. At what point were various historical wrongs finally righted? Hard to say.

p.s. I'm still unclear on why people think Sen. Warren did something wrong.

They must condemn Warren in order to support Dear Leader.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 11:10 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

How about this definition...

Where people from a group that oppressed or oppresses another group mimics or represents cultural artifacts or manners of the oppressed group in a way that expresses or reinforces psychological elements of the racist ideology inherent in the colonialist project responsible for the oppression.

Examples?

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

Correct

Yeah, you're not supposed to admit to trolling, usually.

Either that, or you've never figured out that principles are actually interconnected, and can't therefore be taken to their logical limits.

C_Felix · 11th September 2018, 11:13 AM

Who
the
hell
cares?

kellyb · 11th September 2018, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by BStrong

As long as she doesn't attempt to install slot machines in the Senate chamber she'll be OK.

I'm going to pass this one on to the Warren 2020 campaign. Thanks.

d4m10n · 11th September 2018, 11:32 AM

Originally Posted by kellyb

I'm going to pass this one on the the Warren 2020 campaign. Thanks.

Please tell them I'd like to see Indian taco trucks on every corner.

BobTheCoward · 11th September 2018, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

Examples?

Yeah, you're not supposed to admit to trolling, usually.

Either that, or you've never figured out that principles are actually interconnected, and can't therefore be taken to their logical limits.

The latter

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by BobTheCoward

The latter

You really should interact with some humans, then.

theprestige · 11th September 2018, 11:49 AM

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Diversity admissions and hiring in academia is in a stupid place right now. Both Warren and Harvard participated cynically in this stupidity. In the end, their behavior didn't mean much. But it does let Warren in for some pointing and laughing. The epithet, "Fauxcahontas", is the stupid prize she won. Being in the wrong place at the wrong time, and leaving a paper trail, basically.

There's really no way for her to fix it, I think. Other than going back in time and not putting it on her application. The genie is already out of the bottle.

Belz... · 11th September 2018, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by theprestige

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Diversity admissions and hiring in academia is in a stupid place right now. Both Warren and Harvard participated cynically in this stupidity. In the end, their behavior didn't mean much. But it does let Warren in for some pointing and laughing. The epithet, "Fauxcahontas", is the stupid prize she won. Being in the wrong place at the wrong time, and leaving a paper trail, basically.

There's really no way for her to fix it, I think. Other than going back in time and not putting it on her application. The genie is already out of the bottle.

Here's the thing, though: did she really think she had indian ancestry? If so, where's the stupid game?

d4m10n · 11th September 2018, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

Here's the thing, though: did she really think she had indian ancestry? If so, where's the stupid game?

My question exactly.

As I've mentioned more than once, loads of phenotypically white people have some significant native ancestry, especially here in Oklahoma.

11th September 2018, 06:24 AM	#81
acbytesla Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 21,302	Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows Very similar to Navin Johnson (The Jerk), who grew up mistakenly believing he was an African-American. Johnson was the inventor of Opti-Grab for glasses, and became a millionaire just like Warren. Hey, don't knock the opti-grab. I still have a pair. People exaggerated the cross-eyed side effect.
	__________________ “ A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence. ” ― David Hume

11th September 2018, 06:25 AM	#82
d4m10n Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Mounts Farm Posts: 3,811	Originally Posted by JoeMorgue Because our ethnicity is one of those things that isn't supposed to matter. To whom? https://hr.harvard.edu/diversity-inclusion
	__________________ I'm a happy SINner on the Skeptic Ink Network! Background Probability: Against Irrationality, Innumeracy, and Ignobility http://skepticink.com/backgroundprobability/

11th September 2018, 06:26 AM	#83
LSSBB Devilish Dictionarian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: An elusive house at Bachelors Grove Cemetery Posts: 19,950	Originally Posted by d4m10n ...but seriously what is wrong with claiming your ethnic heritage? My wife is only around 1½ to 2% Native American (according to 23andme, depending on statistical confidence level) but she is nevertheless a card-carrying member of her tribe. I cannot know with certainty whether this helped her win acceptance from Harvard, but it probably didn't hurt. Those of you who've never lived in Oklahoma may well be surprised at the number of people here who claim sone tribal affiliation, either formally or else as part of longstanding family lore. The issue is in cases where there are a limited set of positions, using your genetic heritage as a differentiator. Should being of British Royalty help you? Of course, then that brings up the question on whether that heritage has historically been a disadvantage, or in some cases currently is - due to human bias, if not institutional. Then the further question becomes how far back to go to correct wrongs, and also whether recruiting to increase diversity increases the educational experience of all members. As in all things, there aren't easy answers. IMO.
	__________________ "You must not let your need to be right be more important than your need to find out what's true." - Ray Dalio, Principles Last edited by LSSBB; 11th September 2018 at 06:27 AM.

11th September 2018, 06:28 AM	#84
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward I didn't say your use denied access. I'm saying they are denied access through other systematic problems that members of the dominant culture do not face while selling something developed through that culture. Yeah but that has nothing to do with cultural appropriation.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 07:50 AM	#86
d4m10n Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Mounts Farm Posts: 3,811	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward It has everything to do with cultural appropriation. That is one of the key legs of cultural appropriation. What aspects of Native American culture (if any) has Senator Warren been "appropriating" during her career? (Assuming that this cultural appropriation subthread is somehow relevant to the OP topic.)
	__________________ I'm a happy SINner on the Skeptic Ink Network! Background Probability: Against Irrationality, Innumeracy, and Ignobility http://skepticink.com/backgroundprobability/ Last edited by d4m10n; 11th September 2018 at 07:51 AM. Reason: added parenthetical

11th September 2018, 06:32 AM	#85
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... Yeah but that has nothing to do with cultural appropriation. It has everything to do with cultural appropriation. That is one of the key legs of cultural appropriation.

11th September 2018, 08:40 AM	#87
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by d4m10n What aspects of Native American culture (if any) has Senator Warren been "appropriating" during her career? (Assuming that this cultural appropriation subthread is somehow relevant to the OP topic.) Someone brought up cultural appropriation. To explain why this isn't cultural appropriation, you have to explain cultural appropriation.

11th September 2018, 08:42 AM	#88
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by LSSBB Of course, then that brings up the question on whether that heritage has historically been a disadvantage, or in some cases currently is - due to human bias, if not institutional. Then the further question becomes how far back to go to correct wrongs, and also whether recruiting to increase diversity increases the educational experience of all members. I'm still waiting for my reparations from the Saracens for killing my ancestors at Tours...
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 08:52 AM	#89
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... I'm still waiting for my reparations from the Saracens for killing my ancestors at Tours... I hope you get it.

11th September 2018, 09:10 AM	#90
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward It has everything to do with cultural appropriation. That is one of the key legs of cultural appropriation. Make up your mind. First you said that the culture being appropriated had to have been oppressed, which I addressed, and then you said that "the minority culture is denied opportunity to exploit their own heritage", which I denied, and then you switched to "I'm saying they are denied access through other systematic problems that members of the dominant culture do not face while selling something developed through that culture", which is no longer about cultural appropriation. You don't seem to know what you're arguing.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 09:11 AM	#91
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward I hope you get it. No you don't. It'd be a ridiculous request. I'm not those persons and neither are they.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 09:25 AM	#92
Regnad Kcin Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 9,281	Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows Very similar to Navin Johnson (The Jerk), who grew up mistakenly believing he was an African-American. Johnson was the inventor of Opti-Grab for glasses, and became a millionaire just like Warren. Yes, yes...”very” similar. Maybe just stick to quote dumping.
Regnad Kcin Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 9,281	__________________ My heros are Alex Zanardi and Evelyn Glennie.

11th September 2018, 10:09 AM	#93
carlitos "más divertido" Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 19,887	Originally Posted by Distracted1 I agree with her most of the time, and think she would do a fine job as POTUS. Yet I have an even more superficial reason for thinking she would have a difficult time winning -her voice. It sounds like a caricature of a condescending grade school teacher's. I would that that were not the case- but I find the sound of her voice distracts from the content of her words. Me too*. I also find Hillary!'s monotone off-putting. Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows* Very similar to Navin Johnson (The Jerk), who grew up mistakenly believing he was an African-American. Johnson was the inventor of Opti-Grab for glasses, and became a millionaire just like Warren. **about the voice, not about her doing a fine job as POTUS
	Last edited by carlitos; 11th September 2018 at 10:58 AM. Reason: clarification on "me too" moment.

11th September 2018, 10:09 AM	#94
Dr. Keith Not a doctor. Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 18,285	Originally Posted by Regnad Kcin Yes, yes...”very” similar. Maybe just stick to quote dumping. If he had gone with the full eggplant scene it would have worked better. Although the why does he hate these cans scene is far funnier . . .
	__________________ Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God. He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa If I had a pet panda I would name it Snowflake.

11th September 2018, 10:16 AM	#95
kellyb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 11,119	Originally Posted by Dr. Keith If he had gone with the full eggplant scene it would have worked better. Although the why does he hate these cans scene is far funnier . . . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tcwz8-EfFYE
	__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts ~ Bertrand Russell I am proud to say that Henry Kissinger is not my friend.

11th September 2018, 10:23 AM	#96
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... Make up your mind. First you said that the culture being appropriated had to have been oppressed, which I addressed, and then you said that "the minority culture is denied opportunity to exploit their own heritage", which I denied, and then you switched to "I'm saying they are denied access through other systematic problems that members of the dominant culture do not face while selling something developed through that culture", which is no longer about cultural appropriation. You don't seem to know what you're arguing. It is called clarification. The oppression is the systematic denial of access. That is cultural appropriation. I tried to speed through it, but I wasn't clear. It is why the adoption of rock n roll (while record producers denied contracts to African americans) and hair braids (Jenner is a trendsetter while women are harangued for violating dress policy for decades) are appropriation.

11th September 2018, 10:25 AM	#97
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... No you don't. It'd be a ridiculous request. I'm not those persons and neither are they. You can't tell me what my hopes are.

11th September 2018, 10:26 AM	#98
Dr. Keith Not a doctor. Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 18,285	Originally Posted by kellyb https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tcwz8-EfFYE You're not carnival personnel! Damn, what a great scene. Thanks for proving my point . . . whatever it was.
	__________________ Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God. He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa If I had a pet panda I would name it Snowflake.

11th September 2018, 10:36 AM	#99
d4m10n Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Mounts Farm Posts: 3,811	Originally Posted by LSSBB Then the further question becomes how far back to go to correct wrongs, and also whether recruiting to increase diversity increases the educational experience of all members. A sticky wicket indeed. If you go back to 1890s, at least one of my kids' ancestors was on the "Final Rolls of Citizens and Freedmen of the Five Civilized Tribes in Indian Territory." Between then and the 1990s, her descendants became more-or-less fully assimilated into mainstream white American Christian culture. At what point were various historical wrongs finally righted? Hard to say. p.s. I'm still unclear on why people think Sen. Warren did something wrong.
	__________________ I'm a happy SINner on the Skeptic Ink Network! Background Probability: Against Irrationality, Innumeracy, and Ignobility http://skepticink.com/backgroundprobability/

11th September 2018, 10:39 AM	#100
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward It is called clarification. The oppression is the systematic denial of access. That is cultural appropriation. No, that's not what cultural appropriation is. Originally Posted by BobTheCoward You can't tell me what my hopes are. Yes I can. You know you were replying to a facetious comment. Stop it.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 10:40 AM	#101
Dr. Keith Not a doctor. Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 18,285	Originally Posted by d4m10n p.s. I'm still unclear on why people think Sen. Warren did something wrong. She didn't do anything wrong. A political opponent tried to claim she did and the president made up a childish nick name that stuck.
	__________________ Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God. He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa If I had a pet panda I would name it Snowflake.

11th September 2018, 10:45 AM	#102
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... No, that's not what cultural appropriation is. Yes I can. You know you were replying to a facetious comment. Stop it. Then we will just have to agree to disagree. Just because you meant it flippantly doesn't mean I don't take it seriously.

11th September 2018, 10:52 AM	#103
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward Then we will just have to agree to disagree. No, we don't. You're wrong by definition. That's simply not what the term means. Quote: Just because you meant it flippantly doesn't mean I don't take it seriously. Bob, I mentioned that I'm waiting for reparations from "Saracens" for an event that transpired 1100+ years ago. Think, please.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 10:56 AM	#104
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... No, we don't. You're wrong by definition. That's simply not what the term means. Bob, I mentioned that I'm waiting for reparations from "Saracens" for an event that transpired 1100+ years ago. Think, please. I understand you don't think you need it. I think you do.

11th September 2018, 11:02 AM	#105
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... No, we don't. You're wrong by definition. That's simply not what the term means. Bob, I mentioned that I'm waiting for reparations from "Saracens" for an event that transpired 1100+ years ago. Think, please. How about this definition... Where people from a group that oppressed or oppresses another group mimics or represents cultural artifacts or manners of the oppressed group in a way that expresses or reinforces psychological elements of the racist ideology inherent in the colonialist project responsible for the oppression.

11th September 2018, 11:04 AM	#106
BStrong Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: San Francisco Posts: 11,997	As long as she doesn't attempt to install slot machines in the Senate chamber she'll be OK.
	__________________ "When a man who is honestly mistaken, hears the truth, he will either cease being mistaken or cease being honest." - Anonymous "Dulce bellum inexpertīs." - Erasmus

11th September 2018, 11:04 AM	#107
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward I understand you don't think you need it. I think you do. That'd mean that every human on Earth would be owed reparations by someone, just because an ancestor of theirs was wronged by someone at some time. Yes, another case of a "principle" you want to push to its full, logical and ridiculous limit, pragmatic and reasonable considerations be damned.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 11:06 AM	#108
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by Belz... That'd mean that every human on Earth would be owed reparations by someone, just because an ancestor of theirs was wronged by someone at some time. Yes, another case of a "principle" you want to push to its full, logical and ridiculous limit, pragmatic and reasonable considerations be damned. Correct

11th September 2018, 11:07 AM	#109
carlitos "más divertido" Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 19,887	Why stop at humans? Let's pay the remaining Bison reparations.

11th September 2018, 11:07 AM	#110
BobTheCoward Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 16,616	Originally Posted by carlitos Why stop at humans? Let's pay the remaining Bison reparations. I'm open to the idea

11th September 2018, 11:08 AM	#111
Stacyhs Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 7,173	Originally Posted by d4m10n A sticky wicket indeed. If you go back to 1890s, at least one of my kids' ancestors was on the "Final Rolls of Citizens and Freedmen of the Five Civilized Tribes in Indian Territory." Between then and the 1990s, her descendants became more-or-less fully assimilated into mainstream white American Christian culture. At what point were various historical wrongs finally righted? Hard to say. p.s. I'm still unclear on why people think Sen. Warren did something wrong. They must condemn Warren in order to support Dear Leader.
Stacyhs Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 7,173

11th September 2018, 11:10 AM	#112
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details Posts: 81,402	Originally Posted by BobTheCoward How about this definition... Where people from a group that oppressed or oppresses another group mimics or represents cultural artifacts or manners of the oppressed group in a way that expresses or reinforces psychological elements of the racist ideology inherent in the colonialist project responsible for the oppression. Examples? Originally Posted by BobTheCoward Correct Yeah, you're not supposed to admit to trolling, usually. Either that, or you've never figured out that principles are actually interconnected, and can't therefore be taken to their logical limits.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

11th September 2018, 11:13 AM	#113
C_Felix Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Just outside Raleigh, NC Posts: 2,905	Who the hell cares?
	__________________ Eqinsu Ocha! Eqinsu Ocha!

11th September 2018, 11:25 AM	#114
kellyb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 11,119	Originally Posted by BStrong As long as she doesn't attempt to install slot machines in the Senate chamber she'll be OK. I'm going to pass this one on to the Warren 2020 campaign. Thanks.
	__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts ~ Bertrand Russell I am proud to say that Henry Kissinger is not my friend. Last edited by kellyb; 11th September 2018 at 11:40 AM.

11th September 2018, 11:32 AM	#115
d4m10n Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Mounts Farm Posts: 3,811	Originally Posted by kellyb I'm going to pass this one on the the Warren 2020 campaign. Thanks. Please tell them I'd like to see Indian taco trucks on every corner.
	__________________ I'm a happy SINner on the Skeptic Ink Network! Background Probability: Against Irrationality, Innumeracy, and Ignobility http://skepticink.com/backgroundprobability/