Theresa's troll factory smears Putin by association with antisemitic Anglo nutjobs

Childlike Empress · 13th December 2018, 06:06 AM

So the UK state-sponsored "Integrity Initiative" has been caught spreading disinformation about Corbyn and others, insinuating that they work as tools for the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin.

Originally Posted by John Ferguson

A secret UK Government-funded infowars unit based in Scotland sent out social media posts attacking Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Party.

On the surface, the cryptically named Institute for Statecraft is a small charity operating from an old Victorian mill in Fife.

But explosive leaked documents passed to the Sunday Mail reveal the organisation’s Integrity Initiative is funded with £2million of Foreign Office cash and run by military intelligence specialists.

The “think tank” is supposed to counter Russian online propaganda by forming “clusters” of friendly journalists and “key influencers” throughout Europe who use social media to hit back against disinformation.

But our investigation has found worrying evidence the shadowy programme’s official Twitter account has been used to attack Corbyn, the Labour Party and their officials. [...]

baron · 13th December 2018, 07:41 AM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

So the UK state-sponsored "Integrity Initiative" has been caught spreading disinformation about Corbyn and others, insinuating that they work as tools for the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin.

Clearly Corbyn does not work for Putin. Even Putin wouldn't employ someone as incompetent as him.

Abooga · 13th December 2018, 10:01 AM

I´m quite curious about what´s going to come out of this. They´ve even influenced to avoid the appointment of a Spanish minister.

https://novaramedia.com/2018/12/10/u...oreign-policy/

Childlike Empress · 13th December 2018, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

I´m quite curious about what´s going to come out of this. They´ve even influenced to avoid the appointment of a Spanish minister.

https://novaramedia.com/2018/12/10/u...oreign-policy/

Great link, thanks.

Originally Posted by Aaron Bastani

[...] A 2014 YouGov poll showed that 59% of Brits felt the empire was something to be proud of, while only 19% thought it was something to be ashamed about. Initially I was surprised the former figure was so high. But when you think about the levels of ignorance purposefully cultivated by the media and political establishment about what Britain does in the world, those numbers start to make sense. There is a democratic cancer at the heart of Britain’s foreign policy and it is enabled by a complex bestriding the military, think tanks and the media. That, in short, is exactly where the [Integrity Initiative] sought to insert itself. Such an initiative isn’t about defending democracy, but undermining it.

dudalb · 13th December 2018, 11:59 AM

I have to give it to Putin for one thing:He has done something that no Soviet Premeir every did;Putin has found useful idiots to support him on both the left and the right.

dudalb · 13th December 2018, 12:04 PM

Of course the OP also defends the slaughter of Bosnisns by the Serbs....

Myriad · 13th December 2018, 12:09 PM

This just in: social media trolls with a political agenda accuse other social media trolls with a political agenda of being social media trolls with a political agenda. Details at eleven.

Belz... · 13th December 2018, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin.

I think you're taking your act a bit too far here.

Norman Alexander · 13th December 2018, 12:20 PM

The Daily Record?? The Daily Mail?? THAT'S your sources??

Mycroft · 13th December 2018, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by dudalb

I have to give it to Putin for one thing:He has done something that no Soviet Premeir every did;Putin has found useful idiots to support him on both the left and the right.

This.

Childlike Empress · 13th December 2018, 01:16 PM

Originally Posted by Myriad

This just in: social media trolls with a political agenda accuse other social media trolls with a political agenda of being social media trolls with a political agenda. Details at eleven.

You are not funny. Which is offensive. In reality, people like me, who understand that the propaganda apparatus "the 'West" has built up is ridiculous, do for free what said apparatus is accusing "the other side" of doing professionally. Namely exposing the spin put on things by the mighty Wurlitzer. In reality, there's a crumbling Empire with unlimited amounts of cash in a situation where any truth shined on it is dangerous This news item is just one of the more and more frequent that come in and your lame, frightened post is just more evidence of. Ahem.

Polaris · 13th December 2018, 01:20 PM

Originally Posted by baron

Clearly Corbyn does not work for Putin. Even Putin wouldn't employ someone as incompetent as him.

Ahem...

https://static.politico.com/dims4/de...mp-ap-1160.jpg

Edited by Agatha:

Edited for rule 5. Please do not hotlink unless the originating site expressly permits it

fagin · 13th December 2018, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

You are not funny. Which is offensive. In reality, people like me, who understand that the propaganda apparatus "the 'West" has built up is ridiculous, do for free what said apparatus is accusing "the other side" of doing professionally. Namely exposing the spin put on things by the mighty Wurlitzer. In reality, there's a crumbling Empire with unlimited amounts of cash in a situation where any truth shined on it is dangerous This news item is just one of the more and more frequent that come in and your lame, frightened post is just more evidence of. Ahem.

Haha, you really should be on stage.

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

.....the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin.

angrysoba · 13th December 2018, 02:23 PM

Poor Puty! Can’t catch a break! Where would he be without his swooning fans?

Information Analyst · 13th December 2018, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin.

LOL! Top comedy.

Childlike Empress · 13th December 2018, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by fagin

Haha, you really should be on stage.

I am. You just can't see it.

Mycroft · 13th December 2018, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

I am. You just can't see it.

I've long suspected you of putting on an act, but you never break character.

Childlike Empress · 13th December 2018, 06:22 PM

My antics aside, there's nothing stopping you from discussing the topic, which is sirius. In the UK there's a state-sponsored "think tank" using weaponized information against the political opposition.

dudalb · 13th December 2018, 06:31 PM

I sort of like the nickname "Vlad The Impaler" for Puty.

plague311 · 13th December 2018, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

My antics aside, there's nothing stopping you from discussing the topic, which is sirius. In the UK there's a state-sponsored "think tank" using weaponized information against the political opposition.

Haha isn't that Putin's MO? Isn't that literally page 4 in the Putin Employee Handbook? Where are my pearls?

Childlike Empress · 13th December 2018, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by plague311

Haha isn't that Putin's MO? Isn't that literally page 4 in the Putin Employee Handbook? Where are my pearls?

Haha Hobbit Island as bad as Putinstan! Genius.

Mycroft · 13th December 2018, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

My antics aside, there's nothing stopping you from discussing the topic, which is sirius. In the UK there's a state-sponsored "think tank" using weaponized information against the political opposition.

What's to discuss, exactly? Some people are against Putin, and you don't like that?

I sort of get that it makes you upset, I don't understand why you think anyone else should share your feelings. Most people don't think dictators and oligarchs form an ideal government, and therefore don't see Putin as the hero.

Abooga · 14th December 2018, 01:23 AM

More about this:

https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201...isinformation/

Mainstream media not really giving this much coverage.

Abooga · 14th December 2018, 01:26 AM

Originally Posted by Myriad

This just in: social media trolls with a political agenda accuse other social media trolls with a political agenda of being social media trolls with a political agenda. Details at eleven.

In these type of cases I don´t think the sensible thing to do is to look the other way, instead we should ask for the whole issue to be brought to light, ask for transparency etc.

3point14 · 14th December 2018, 01:34 AM

Originally Posted by Mycroft

What's to discuss, exactly? Some people are against Putin, and you don't like that?

I sort of get that it makes you upset, I don't understand why you think anyone else should share your feelings. Most people don't think dictators and oligarchs form an ideal government, and therefore don't see Putin as the hero.

You're missing the point. A lot.

The point is that the UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to influence the UK public by smearing that the leader of HM opposition.

That's not party money being used to smear the opposition, that's public money, obtained through taxation used for partisan, political purposes.

When the party in power clandestinely use the apparatus of government to stay in power in this way, there's a problem.

Childlike Empress · 14th December 2018, 12:19 PM

British Security Service Infiltration, the Integrity Initiative and the Institute for Statecraft

Originally Posted by Craig Murray

[...] I have a great deal more to tell you about Mr Edney and his organisation next week, and the extraordinary covert disinformation war the British government wages online, attacking British citizens using British taxpayers’ money. Please note in the interim I am not even a smidgeon suicidal, and going to be very, very careful crossing the road and am not intending any walks in the hills.

I am not alleging Mr Bracey-Lane is an intelligence service operative who previously infiltrated the Labour Party and the Sanders campaign. He may just be a young man of unusually heterodox and vacillating political opinions. He may be an undercover reporter for the Canary infiltrating the Institute for Statecraft. All these things are possible, and I have no firm information.

But one of the activities the Integrity Initiative sponsors happens to be the use of online trolls to ridicule the idea that the British security services ever carry out any kind of infiltration, false flag or agent provocateur operations, despite the fact that we even have repeated court judgements against undercover infiltration officers getting female activists pregnant. The Integrity Initiative offers us a glimpse into the very dirty world of surveillance and official disinformation. If we actually had a free media, it would be the biggest story of the day. [...]

fuelair · 14th December 2018, 12:48 PM

Originally Posted by Polaris

Ahem...

https://static.politico.com/dims4/de...mp-ap-1160.jpg

Now, now you know you shouldn't be posting pics of venal odiferous orange
waste waiting to be flushed down the commode into the sewer system...…...

fuelair · 14th December 2018, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by angrysoba

Poor Puty! Can’t catch a break! Where would he be without his swooning fans?

"Pootin' Putin the Russian that's tootin' (and lootin')!!!!!!!"

dudalb · 14th December 2018, 12:55 PM

Originally Posted by Abooga

More about this:

https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201...isinformation/

Mainstream media not really giving this much coverage.

Because it's a bunch of crap.maybe?
GOd, that site is like a parody of a Russian Propaganda site.

Childlike Empress · 14th December 2018, 01:09 PM

And eagerly they spam. Because nothing else is left. Sad.

b does what he always does so well - tying it all together: British Spies Infiltrated Bernie Sanders' Campaign?

Originally Posted by b

[...] While Craig Murray is not alleging that Simon Bracey-Lane is a British secret service mole who spied on the Bernie Sanders campaign the idea seems not too far off. The Integrity Initiative was launched in 2015. Bracey-Lane infiltrated the Sanders campaign in early 2016.

We do know that British intelligence services were heavily involved in the operation against the Trump campaign. A 'former' MI6 officer, Christopher Steele, wrote the fake dirty dossier about Trump's alleged relations with Russia. Also involved was Sergej Skripal who was latter 'novichocked', probably after he threatened to blow the whistle about the whole operation. "Take care that Clinton gets elected" was likely the order the British government handed down. Its services failed to deliver.

Now we learn that other operations were underway with regards to Sanders and also against Jeremy Corbyn. Craig Murray seems to have learned more and promises to tell it in a future installment. There are several other people who are digging further into the issue and we can expect that this will develop into an even more serious scandal.

The anglo-american anti-Russian campaign, of which the Integrity Initiative is a part, seems to have a much wider target field than Russia. It is used to press for censorship of all unwelcome opinion that runs against the 'deep state' ordered narrative. It is used to undermine political opposition to the campaign domestically as well as abroad. And, as Murray says, we can expect it to become even more dirty as it proceeds.

Childlike Empress · 14th December 2018, 01:33 PM

Oh, just in time, not only has a follow-up been posted on MoA, but it's based on a new, yet-to-be-fully-explored third data dump.

Mycroft · 14th December 2018, 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by 3point14

You're missing the point. A lot.

I'm not missing her point at all, I just fail to see it as the urgent issue that needs attention.

Originally Posted by 3point14

The point is that the UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to influence the UK public by smearing that the leader of HM opposition.

Not exactly.

The UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to counter Russian propaganda, and in doing that a half dozen or so tweets were made pointing out that a prominent UK politician is supportive of the same message being put out by the Russian propagandists.

I guess maybe somebody should have made a rule that you only counter the propaganda you know came from Russia, and should politely ignore when that same propaganda is echoed by the local politicians that are supposed to be loyal to the UK and not Russia.

Originally Posted by 3point14

That's not party money being used to smear the opposition, that's public money, obtained through taxation used for partisan, political purposes.

I know Trump supporters who feel the same way when our intel agencies contradict his latest conspiritard tweet.

That our government should act against Russian propaganda shouldn't be a partisan issue, but it becomes one because that propaganda benefited one party over another. Under those circumstances it becomes problematic countering foreign influences in a way that is “non-partisan” from the point of view of the party benefiting from that same foreign influence.

Originally Posted by 3point14

When the party in power clandestinely use the apparatus of government to stay in power in this way, there's a problem.

The problem you see can be addressed with a stern write-up being added to someone’s personnel file, the problem of having the head of a major political party running interference for the propaganda arm of their nation’s enemies seems to me to be the more urgent issue requiring a lot more effort.

As a US citizen living in the age of Trump, you have my complete sympathies.

caveman1917 · 15th December 2018, 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

the propaganda apparatus "the 'West" has built up is ridiculous, do for free what said apparatus is accusing "the other side" of doing professionally.

Yeah you can easily determine what the Western apparatus is doing by listening to what they accuse the other side of doing.

"Russia is interfering in Ukraine's internal affairs" = "We are interfering in Ukraine's internal affairs."

"Russia is manipulating Wikipedia" = "We are manipulating Wikipedia"

"Russia is interfering in elections" = "We are interfering in elections"

"Russia is using Facebook to spread disinformation" = "We are using Facebook to spread disinformation"

and so on and so forth. It's really pretty trivial to know what the West is up to just by listening to what they accuse the others of.

Childlike Empress · 15th December 2018, 01:13 AM

Indeed.

Childlike Empress · 15th December 2018, 12:53 PM

After exploration, b strikes again: The 'Integrity Initiative' - A Military Intelligence Operation, Disguised As Charity, To Create The "Russian Threat"

Includes direct connection to Pablo Miller, Sergei Skripal's handler and fellow Salisbury citizen. And Christopher Steele pal.

Mycroft · 15th December 2018, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

After exploration, b strikes again: The 'Integrity Initiative' - A Military Intelligence Operation, Disguised As Charity, To Create The "Russian Threat"

Includes direct connection to Pablo Miller, Sergei Skripal's handler and fellow Salisbury citizen. And Christopher Steele pal.

Yet when you read the actual documents they cite, the documents don't support their claims.

This document:

https://www.pdf-archive.com/2018/12/...nformation.pdf

Is a proposal to counter Russian disinformation and it outlines all the steps one would want to take to counter an organized disinformation campaign. Moon of Alabama (and similar sources) portrays it as its own disinformation campaign without citing any additional evidence necessary to make that jump.

Nowhere in that document is it suggested that they put out disinformation on their own to counter Russian disinformation.

When you consider that Moon of Alabama is very likely part of that very same Russian propaganda campaign they want to counter, its "analysis" becomes laughable.

So again, what you’re “exposing” is nothing more than the UK taking some steps to counter what we know the Russians are doing, only adding an alarmist and sinister spin to it.

Captain_Swoop · 15th December 2018, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by 3point14

You're missing the point. A lot.

The point is that the UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to influence the UK public by smearing that the leader of HM opposition.

That's not party money being used to smear the opposition, that's public money, obtained through taxation used for partisan, political purposes.

When the party in power clandestinely use the apparatus of government to stay in power in this way, there's a problem.

Quite right. That's MI5's job.

Childlike Empress · 15th December 2018, 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by Mycroft

This document

.... wasn't even cited in the current article you replied to, and in yesterday's article MoA said the following about it, which is directly backed even by a screenshot:

Originally Posted by b

A "strictly confidential" proposal by the French company Lexfo to spread the Integrity Initiative's state-sponsored propaganda through an offensive online influence campaigns for a monthly pay per language of €20-40.000. The proposal also includes an offer for "counter activism" through "negative PR, legal actions, ethical hack back, etc." for €50,000 per month.

The offer claims that the company can launch hundreds of "news" pieces per day on as many websites. It notably also offers to "edit" Wikipedia articles.

In short: This proposal describes large disinformation operations under the disguise of fighting alleged Russian disinformation.

It is at the core what the Integrity Initiative, which obviously requested the proposal, is about.

Just because you pretend the claims about "Russian disinformation" are true doesn't mean these efforts using weaponized information and third party troll factories aren't disinformation on their own.

abaddon · 15th December 2018, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Belz...

I think you're taking your act a bit too far here.

Yep, that was a troll too far. Putin and freedom in the same sentence. It is to laugh.

Mycroft · 15th December 2018, 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

.... wasn't even cited in the current article you replied to, and in yesterday's article MoA said the following about it, which is directly backed even by a screenshot:

It was cited in the Moon of Alabama article which made the claim of the UK disinformation campaign, and was the only document in that article that came close to (but missed actually providing) evidence of a UK disinformation campaign.

That article was linked by the current article, and provides the "foundation" this whole line of bull poop is based on.

Originally Posted by Childlike Empress

Just because you pretend the claims about "Russian disinformation" are true doesn't mean these efforts using weaponized information and third party troll factories aren't disinformation on their own.

Oh absolutely, but your speculation that it's disinformation isn't in itself proof. It's just speculation.

And substituting speculation for evidence is the hallmark of conspiracy kookery. Or, as the case may be, disinformation.

13th December 2018, 06:06 AM	#1
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Theresa's troll factory smears Putin by association with antisemitic Anglo nutjobs So the UK state-sponsored "Integrity Initiative" has been caught spreading disinformation about Corbyn and others, insinuating that they work as tools for the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. Originally Posted by John Ferguson A secret UK Government-funded infowars unit based in Scotland sent out social media posts attacking Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Party. On the surface, the cryptically named Institute for Statecraft is a small charity operating from an old Victorian mill in Fife. But explosive leaked documents passed to the Sunday Mail reveal the organisation’s Integrity Initiative is funded with £2million of Foreign Office cash and run by military intelligence specialists. The “think tank” is supposed to counter Russian online propaganda by forming “clusters” of friendly journalists and “key influencers” throughout Europe who use social media to hit back against disinformation. But our investigation has found worrying evidence the shadowy programme’s official Twitter account has been used to attack Corbyn, the Labour Party and their officials. [...]

13th December 2018, 07:41 AM	#2
baron Guest Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,627	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress So the UK state-sponsored "Integrity Initiative" has been caught spreading disinformation about Corbyn and others, insinuating that they work as tools for the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. Clearly Corbyn does not work for Putin. Even Putin wouldn't employ someone as incompetent as him.
baron Guest Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,627

13th December 2018, 10:01 AM	#3
Abooga Muse Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 825	I´m quite curious about what´s going to come out of this. They´ve even influenced to avoid the appointment of a Spanish minister. https://novaramedia.com/2018/12/10/u...oreign-policy/
Abooga Muse Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 825

13th December 2018, 10:14 AM	#4
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Originally Posted by Abooga I´m quite curious about what´s going to come out of this. They´ve even influenced to avoid the appointment of a Spanish minister. https://novaramedia.com/2018/12/10/u...oreign-policy/ Great link, thanks. Originally Posted by Aaron Bastani [...] A 2014 YouGov poll showed that 59% of Brits felt the empire was something to be proud of, while only 19% thought it was something to be ashamed about. Initially I was surprised the former figure was so high. But when you think about the levels of ignorance purposefully cultivated by the media and political establishment about what Britain does in the world, those numbers start to make sense. There is a democratic cancer at the heart of Britain’s foreign policy and it is enabled by a complex bestriding the military, think tanks and the media. That, in short, is exactly where the [Integrity Initiative] sought to insert itself. Such an initiative isn’t about defending democracy, but undermining it.
	Last edited by Childlike Empress; 13th December 2018 at 10:28 AM. Reason: +quote

13th December 2018, 11:59 AM	#5
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 50,643	I have to give it to Putin for one thing:He has done something that no Soviet Premeir every did;Putin has found useful idiots to support him on both the left and the right.
	__________________ Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein.

13th December 2018, 12:04 PM	#6
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 50,643	Of course the OP also defends the slaughter of Bosnisns by the Serbs....
	__________________ Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein.

13th December 2018, 12:09 PM	#7
Myriad The Clarity Is Devastating Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Betwixt Posts: 17,645	This just in: social media trolls with a political agenda accuse other social media trolls with a political agenda of being social media trolls with a political agenda. Details at eleven.
	__________________ A zømbie once bit my sister...

13th December 2018, 12:10 PM	#8
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In a post-fact world Posts: 92,288	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. I think you're taking your act a bit too far here.
	__________________ Master of the Shining Darkness "My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward

13th December 2018, 12:20 PM	#9
Norman Alexander Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Gundungurra Posts: 9,215	The Daily Record?? The Daily Mail?? THAT'S your sources??
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

13th December 2018, 01:02 PM	#10
Mycroft High Priest of Ed Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 19,819	Originally Posted by dudalb I have to give it to Putin for one thing:He has done something that no Soviet Premeir every did;Putin has found useful idiots to support him on both the left and the right. This.
	__________________ Hamilton 68: Tracking Russian internet propaganda

13th December 2018, 01:16 PM	#11
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Originally Posted by Myriad This just in: social media trolls with a political agenda accuse other social media trolls with a political agenda of being social media trolls with a political agenda. Details at eleven. You are not funny. Which is offensive. In reality, people like me, who understand that the propaganda apparatus "the 'West" has built up is ridiculous, do for free what said apparatus is accusing "the other side" of doing professionally. Namely exposing the spin put on things by the mighty Wurlitzer. In reality, there's a crumbling Empire with unlimited amounts of cash in a situation where any truth shined on it is dangerous This news item is just one of the more and more frequent that come in and your lame, frightened post is just more evidence of. Ahem.

13th December 2018, 02:03 PM	#13
fagin Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: As far away from casebro as possible. Posts: 7,070	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress You are not funny. Which is offensive. In reality, people like me, who understand that the propaganda apparatus "the 'West" has built up is ridiculous, do for free what said apparatus is accusing "the other side" of doing professionally. Namely exposing the spin put on things by the mighty Wurlitzer. In reality, there's a crumbling Empire with unlimited amounts of cash in a situation where any truth shined on it is dangerous This news item is just one of the more and more frequent that come in and your lame, frightened post is just more evidence of. Ahem. Haha, you really should be on stage. Originally Posted by Childlike Empress .....the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin.
	__________________ There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

13th December 2018, 02:23 PM	#14
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 29,631	Poor Puty! Can’t catch a break! Where would he be without his swooning fans?
	__________________ "The thief and the murderer follow nature just as much as the philanthropist. Cosmic evolution may teach us how the good and the evil tendencies of man may have come about; but, in itself, it is incompetent to furnish any better reason why what we call good is preferable to what we call evil than we had before." "Evolution and Ethics" T.H. Huxley (1893)

13th December 2018, 02:25 PM	#15
Information Analyst Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Besźel or Ul Qoma - not sure... Posts: 10,099	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress the leader of the free world, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. LOL! Top comedy.

13th December 2018, 02:31 PM	#16
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Originally Posted by fagin Haha, you really should be on stage. I am. You just can't see it.

13th December 2018, 03:46 PM	#17
Mycroft High Priest of Ed Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 19,819	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress I am. You just can't see it. I've long suspected you of putting on an act, but you never break character.
	__________________ Hamilton 68: Tracking Russian internet propaganda

13th December 2018, 06:22 PM	#18
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	My antics aside, there's nothing stopping you from discussing the topic, which is sirius. In the UK there's a state-sponsored "think tank" using weaponized information against the political opposition.

13th December 2018, 06:31 PM	#19
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 50,643	I sort of like the nickname "Vlad The Impaler" for Puty.
	__________________ Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein.

13th December 2018, 06:57 PM	#20
plague311 Great minds think... Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: North Dakota Posts: 8,837	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress My antics aside, there's nothing stopping you from discussing the topic, which is sirius. In the UK there's a state-sponsored "think tank" using weaponized information against the political opposition. Haha isn't that Putin's MO? Isn't that literally page 4 in the Putin Employee Handbook? Where are my pearls?
	__________________ "Circumcision and death threats go together like milk and cookies." - William Parcher “There are times when the mind is dealt such a blow it hides itself in insanity. While this may not seem beneficial, it is. There are times when reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind.” - Patrick Rothfuss

13th December 2018, 07:31 PM	#21
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Originally Posted by plague311 Haha isn't that Putin's MO? Isn't that literally page 4 in the Putin Employee Handbook? Where are my pearls? Haha Hobbit Island as bad as Putinstan! Genius.

13th December 2018, 10:08 PM	#22
Mycroft High Priest of Ed Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 19,819	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress My antics aside, there's nothing stopping you from discussing the topic, which is sirius. In the UK there's a state-sponsored "think tank" using weaponized information against the political opposition. What's to discuss, exactly? Some people are against Putin, and you don't like that? I sort of get that it makes you upset, I don't understand why you think anyone else should share your feelings. Most people don't think dictators and oligarchs form an ideal government, and therefore don't see Putin as the hero.
	__________________ Hamilton 68: Tracking Russian internet propaganda

14th December 2018, 01:23 AM	#23
Abooga Muse Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 825	More about this: https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201...isinformation/ Mainstream media not really giving this much coverage.
Abooga Muse Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 825

14th December 2018, 01:26 AM	#24
Abooga Muse Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 825	Originally Posted by Myriad This just in: social media trolls with a political agenda accuse other social media trolls with a political agenda of being social media trolls with a political agenda. Details at eleven. In these type of cases I don´t think the sensible thing to do is to look the other way, instead we should ask for the whole issue to be brought to light, ask for transparency etc.
Abooga Muse Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 825

14th December 2018, 01:34 AM	#25
3point14 Pi Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 20,660	Originally Posted by Mycroft What's to discuss, exactly? Some people are against Putin, and you don't like that? I sort of get that it makes you upset, I don't understand why you think anyone else should share your feelings. Most people don't think dictators and oligarchs form an ideal government, and therefore don't see Putin as the hero. You're missing the point. A lot. The point is that the UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to influence the UK public by smearing that the leader of HM opposition. That's not party money being used to smear the opposition, that's public money, obtained through taxation used for partisan, political purposes. When the party in power clandestinely use the apparatus of government to stay in power in this way, there's a problem.
3point14 Pi Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 20,660	__________________ Up the River! Anyone that wraps themselves in the Union Flag and also lives in tax exile is a [redacted]

14th December 2018, 12:19 PM	#26
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	British Security Service Infiltration, the Integrity Initiative and the Institute for Statecraft Originally Posted by Craig Murray [...] I have a great deal more to tell you about Mr Edney and his organisation next week, and the extraordinary covert disinformation war the British government wages online, attacking British citizens using British taxpayers’ money. Please note in the interim I am not even a smidgeon suicidal, and going to be very, very careful crossing the road and am not intending any walks in the hills. I am not alleging Mr Bracey-Lane is an intelligence service operative who previously infiltrated the Labour Party and the Sanders campaign. He may just be a young man of unusually heterodox and vacillating political opinions. He may be an undercover reporter for the Canary infiltrating the Institute for Statecraft. All these things are possible, and I have no firm information. But one of the activities the Integrity Initiative sponsors happens to be the use of online trolls to ridicule the idea that the British security services ever carry out any kind of infiltration, false flag or agent provocateur operations, despite the fact that we even have repeated court judgements against undercover infiltration officers getting female activists pregnant. The Integrity Initiative offers us a glimpse into the very dirty world of surveillance and official disinformation. If we actually had a free media, it would be the biggest story of the day. [...]

14th December 2018, 12:48 PM	#27
fuelair Banned Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 58,581	Originally Posted by Polaris Ahem... https://static.politico.com/dims4/de...mp-ap-1160.jpg Now, now you know you shouldn't be posting pics of venal odiferous orange waste waiting to be flushed down the commode into the sewer system...…...
fuelair Banned Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 58,581

14th December 2018, 12:52 PM	#28
fuelair Banned Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 58,581	Originally Posted by angrysoba Poor Puty! Can’t catch a break! Where would he be without his swooning fans? "Pootin' Putin the Russian that's tootin' (and lootin')!!!!!!!"
fuelair Banned Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 58,581

14th December 2018, 12:55 PM	#29
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 50,643	Originally Posted by Abooga More about this: https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201...isinformation/ Mainstream media not really giving this much coverage. Because it's a bunch of crap.maybe? GOd, that site is like a parody of a Russian Propaganda site.
	__________________ Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein. Last edited by dudalb; 14th December 2018 at 12:57 PM.

14th December 2018, 01:09 PM	#30
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	And eagerly they spam. Because nothing else is left. Sad. b does what he always does so well - tying it all together: British Spies Infiltrated Bernie Sanders' Campaign? Originally Posted by b [...] While Craig Murray is not alleging that Simon Bracey-Lane is a British secret service mole who spied on the Bernie Sanders campaign the idea seems not too far off. The Integrity Initiative was launched in 2015. Bracey-Lane infiltrated the Sanders campaign in early 2016. We do know that British intelligence services were heavily involved in the operation against the Trump campaign. A 'former' MI6 officer, Christopher Steele, wrote the fake dirty dossier about Trump's alleged relations with Russia. Also involved was Sergej Skripal who was latter 'novichocked', probably after he threatened to blow the whistle about the whole operation. "Take care that Clinton gets elected" was likely the order the British government handed down. Its services failed to deliver. Now we learn that other operations were underway with regards to Sanders and also against Jeremy Corbyn. Craig Murray seems to have learned more and promises to tell it in a future installment. There are several other people who are digging further into the issue and we can expect that this will develop into an even more serious scandal. The anglo-american anti-Russian campaign, of which the Integrity Initiative is a part, seems to have a much wider target field than Russia. It is used to press for censorship of all unwelcome opinion that runs against the 'deep state' ordered narrative. It is used to undermine political opposition to the campaign domestically as well as abroad. And, as Murray says, we can expect it to become even more dirty as it proceeds.

14th December 2018, 01:33 PM	#31
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Oh, just in time, not only has a follow-up been posted on MoA, but it's based on a new, yet-to-be-fully-explored third data dump.

14th December 2018, 09:52 PM	#32
Mycroft High Priest of Ed Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 19,819	Originally Posted by 3point14 You're missing the point. A lot. I'm not missing her point at all, I just fail to see it as the urgent issue that needs attention. Originally Posted by 3point14 The point is that the UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to influence the UK public by smearing that the leader of HM opposition. Not exactly. The UK government paid UK taxpayer money to a third party to attempt to counter Russian propaganda, and in doing that a half dozen or so tweets were made pointing out that a prominent UK politician is supportive of the same message being put out by the Russian propagandists. I guess maybe somebody should have made a rule that you only counter the propaganda you know came from Russia, and should politely ignore when that same propaganda is echoed by the local politicians that are supposed to be loyal to the UK and not Russia. Originally Posted by 3point14 That's not party money being used to smear the opposition, that's public money, obtained through taxation used for partisan, political purposes. I know Trump supporters who feel the same way when our intel agencies contradict his latest conspiritard tweet. That our government should act against Russian propaganda shouldn't be a partisan issue, but it becomes one because that propaganda benefited one party over another. Under those circumstances it becomes problematic countering foreign influences in a way that is “non-partisan” from the point of view of the party benefiting from that same foreign influence. Originally Posted by 3point14 When the party in power clandestinely use the apparatus of government to stay in power in this way, there's a problem. The problem you see can be addressed with a stern write-up being added to someone’s personnel file, the problem of having the head of a major political party running interference for the propaganda arm of their nation’s enemies seems to me to be the more urgent issue requiring a lot more effort. As a US citizen living in the age of Trump, you have my complete sympathies.
	__________________ Hamilton 68: Tracking Russian internet propaganda

15th December 2018, 12:26 AM	#33
caveman1917 Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 8,070	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress the propaganda apparatus "the 'West" has built up is ridiculous, do for free what said apparatus is accusing "the other side" of doing professionally. Yeah you can easily determine what the Western apparatus is doing by listening to what they accuse the other side of doing. "Russia is interfering in Ukraine's internal affairs" = "We are interfering in Ukraine's internal affairs." "Russia is manipulating Wikipedia" = "We are manipulating Wikipedia" "Russia is interfering in elections" = "We are interfering in elections" "Russia is using Facebook to spread disinformation" = "We are using Facebook to spread disinformation" and so on and so forth. It's really pretty trivial to know what the West is up to just by listening to what they accuse the others of.
caveman1917 Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 8,070	__________________ "Ideas are also weapons." - Subcomandante Marcos "We must devastate the avenues where the wealthy live." - Lucy Parsons "Let us therefore trust the eternal Spirit which destroys and annihilates only because it is the unfathomable and eternal source of all life. The passion for destruction is a creative passion, too!" - Mikhail Bakunin

15th December 2018, 01:13 AM	#34
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	Indeed.

15th December 2018, 12:53 PM	#35
Childlike Empress Ewige Blumenkraft Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Ivory Tower Posts: 19,106	After exploration, b strikes again: The 'Integrity Initiative' - A Military Intelligence Operation, Disguised As Charity, To Create The "Russian Threat" Includes direct connection to Pablo Miller, Sergei Skripal's handler and fellow Salisbury citizen. And Christopher Steele pal.

15th December 2018, 01:29 PM	#36
Mycroft High Priest of Ed Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 19,819	Originally Posted by Childlike Empress After exploration, b strikes again: The 'Integrity Initiative' - A Military Intelligence Operation, Disguised As Charity, To Create The "Russian Threat" Includes direct connection to Pablo Miller, Sergei Skripal's handler and fellow Salisbury citizen. And Christopher Steele pal. Yet when you read the actual documents they cite, the documents don't support their claims. This document: https://www.pdf-archive.com/2018/12/...nformation.pdf Is a proposal to counter Russian disinformation and it outlines all the steps one would want to take to counter an organized disinformation campaign. Moon of Alabama (and similar sources) portrays it as its own disinformation campaign without citing any additional evidence necessary to make that jump. Nowhere in that document is it suggested that they put out disinformation on their own to counter Russian disinformation. When you consider that Moon of Alabama is very likely part of that very same Russian propaganda campaign they want to counter, its "analysis" becomes laughable. So again, what you’re “exposing” is nothing more than the UK taking some steps to counter what we know the Russians are doing, only adding an alarmist and sinister spin to it.
	__________________ Hamilton 68: Tracking Russian internet propaganda