ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Reply
Old 4th January 2019, 02:23 PM   #1
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Millions Of Women In India Join Hands To Form A 385-Mile Wall

NPR: Millions Of Women In India Join Hands To Form A 385-Mile Wall Of Protest

Think about that.

Quote:
They called it the "women's wall" ó vanitha mathil in the local language of Malayalam.

According to government estimates published in the Indian press, somewhere between 3.5 million and 5 million women lined up on National Highway 66, a long stretch of road that runs along the country's western coast. The "wall" stretched out 385 miles. Organizers said it was a continuous chain from one end of the state to the other, but some critics say there were gaps.

Kerala is roughly the size of Switzerland and has a population of about 35 million.
Women have a long way to go to gain equal rights in India.

I don't have CNN or MSNBC anymore. Does anyone know if they covered the event? I've seen the rioting covered as women try to get the right to enter an important temple and extremists men are rioting because of it.

Quote:
On Wednesday, the day after the gender wall demonstration, Indian media reports emerged of two women under the age of 50 finally managing to visit the sacred shrine. The women were escorted by police into the temple in complete secrecy in the wee hours of the dawn. They were given police protection to avoid the mobs that had kept women at bay previously. They have since been taken to an undisclosed location.

On Thursday, right-wing groups declared a hartal ó a strike involving the closure of shops, usually following a sorrowful event. Violent protests erupted in the state as mobs took to the streets hurling stones and crude bombs. One person was killed and 14 others were injured. State police arrested 745 people.

That same day, a third woman visited the temple amid the protests.

For Madhavan, the violence was distressing but did not dampen her spirit.

"Social change doesn't happen in a day," she says. "It needs time. But with these small steps, we've made it easier for the next generation to embrace it. In this way, the wall of women marks a new dawn for feminism in India."
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 02:32 PM   #2
Shadowdweller
Muse
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 718

(Aside from the ensuing violence, naturally)
Shadowdweller is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 03:25 PM   #3
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 30,923
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I don't have CNN or MSNBC anymore. Does anyone know if they covered the event?
You lost me. You don't have CNN or MSNBC anymore? Can't you just go to CNN.com and search for the story or something? I mean, I was about to do just that, to try to answer your question. But then it occurred to me that you could do exactly the same thing, and your question is probably more interesting to you than to me anyway. Good luck!
theprestige is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 04:07 PM   #4
NWO Sentryman
Proud NWO Gatekeeper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,833
India's and China's demographics (due to unintended consequences of family planning policies) mean that there are less women than men, and if you think Incels in the US are bad, oh boy the current issues in China/India are going to make that look tame.
__________________
If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you? - FireGarden on the Middle East
NWO Sentryman is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 04:34 PM   #5
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 41,608
Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
India's and China's demographics (due to unintended consequences of family planning policies) mean that there are less women than men, and if you think Incels in the US are bad, oh boy the current issues in China/India are going to make that look tame.
Three cheers for abortion!
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 04:35 PM   #6
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 30,923
And polyamory!
theprestige is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 04:50 PM   #7
Whip
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 1,148
at least someone built a wall. amirite?
Whip is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 04:52 PM   #8
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 30,923
Originally Posted by Whip View Post
at least someone built a wall. amirite?
Walls don't do anything, though. They're a waste of resources, when they're not actually making access easier. Am I right?
theprestige is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 04:59 PM   #9
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
 
quadraginta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Central Vale of Humility
Posts: 22,793
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Three cheers for abortion!

Or maybe misogyny.
__________________
"It never does just what I want, but only what I tell it."
"A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened."
quadraginta is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 06:37 PM   #10
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
You lost me. You don't have CNN or MSNBC anymore? Can't you just go to CNN.com and search for the story or something? I mean, I was about to do just that, to try to answer your question. But then it occurred to me that you could do exactly the same thing, and your question is probably more interesting to you than to me anyway. Good luck!
I'm not looking to see if CNN posted a story, I'm asking if they've covered the women in TV news reports and if they've given it as much time as the riots over the women entering the sacred temple.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 06:38 PM   #11
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
India's and China's demographics (due to unintended consequences of family planning policies) mean that there are less women than men, and if you think Incels in the US are bad, oh boy the current issues in China/India are going to make that look tame.
Is there some relevance here to the OP?
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 09:40 PM   #12
shemp
a flimsy character...perfidious and despised
 
shemp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: People's Democratic Republic of Planet X
Posts: 29,137
So, doing the math, all Trump needs is about 25 million Indian women. Shouldn't be a problem for a chick magnet like him!
__________________
"Shemp, you are the one fixed point in an ever-changing universe." - Beady

"I don't want to live in a world without shemp." - Quarky

"...just as a magnet attracts iron filings, Trump attracts, and is attracted to, louts." - George Will
shemp is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 11:06 PM   #13
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 41,608
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Is there some relevance here to the OP?
Yes, and it's pretty plainly stated in the quote: the gender imbalance will make all the problems the protesters are complaining about worse.
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 11:12 PM   #14
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,534
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I'm not looking to see if CNN posted a story, I'm asking if they've covered the women in TV news reports and if they've given it as much time as the riots over the women entering the sacred temple.


Gotta love how theprestige doesn't realize that what CNN covers on air and on their website is, *mild shock*, different.

And yet theprestige operated on that incorrect information to make some weird kind of "you're lazy" gotcha.

"Durrr... why are we even on a discussion forum when all information could be Googled?"
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th January 2019, 11:15 PM   #15
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,534
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Three cheers for abortion!

Yeah like abortion has anything at all to do with that. Please keep your pet woo infatuations out of threads where they have no relevance.
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 12:51 AM   #16
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Yes, and it's pretty plainly stated in the quote: the gender imbalance will make all the problems the protesters are complaining about worse.
OK, it makes no sense to me but whatever.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 04:38 AM   #17
Roboramma
Penultimate Amazing
 
Roboramma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 11,628
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Yes, and it's pretty plainly stated in the quote: the gender imbalance will make all the problems the protesters are complaining about worse.
As that poster points out the same gender imbalance has arisen in China, yet women in China don't face anything approaching similar problems to those faced by women in India.

So perhaps something other than that gender imbalance is responsible.
__________________
"... when people thought the Earth was flat, they were wrong. When people thought the Earth was spherical they were wrong. But if you think that thinking the Earth is spherical is just as wrong as thinking the Earth is flat, then your view is wronger than both of them put together."
Isaac Asimov

Last edited by Roboramma; 5th January 2019 at 04:47 AM. Reason: fixing a weird typo
Roboramma is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 04:45 AM   #18
baron
Philosopher
 
baron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,534
Quote:
...some critics say there were gaps.
LOL! Critics. Meh, there were gaps so it doesn't count! Nerrrrr!
__________________
"I am a liar as well as a dwarf!"
baron is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 04:51 AM   #19
Mojo
Mostly harmless
 
Mojo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 30,693
Originally Posted by Roboramma View Post
As that poster points out the same gender imbalance has arisen in China, yet women in China don't face anything approaching similar problems to those faced by women in India.

Something to do with this?
__________________
"You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield

"The poor mystic homeopaths feel like petted house-cats thrown at high flood on the breaking ice." - Leon Trotsky
Mojo is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 07:53 AM   #20
pharphis
Graduate Poster
 
pharphis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,807
"gender wall demonstration" is a very weird label for it. Just reminds me of the joke that women are "people of gender"
pharphis is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 02:50 PM   #21
mgidm86
Illuminator
 
mgidm86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,963
Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
Gotta love how theprestige doesn't realize that what CNN covers on air and on their website is, *mild shock*, different.

And yet theprestige operated on that incorrect information to make some weird kind of "you're lazy" gotcha.

"Durrr... why are we even on a discussion forum when all information could be Googled?"
Durrr...

Search Link

People still use Google?
__________________
Franklin understands certain kickbacks you obtain unfairly are legal liabilities; however, a risky deed's almost never detrimental despite extra external pressures.
mgidm86 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 02:57 PM   #22
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Durrr...

Search Link

People still use Google?
The CNN video in that search result is not an on-air segment. It's an online video story.

Could you find an on-air news clip?

I was hoping people who watch CNN could tell us what they saw.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 04:13 PM   #23
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 41,608
Originally Posted by Roboramma View Post
As that poster points out the same gender imbalance has arisen in China, yet women in China don't face anything approaching similar problems to those faced by women in India.

So perhaps something other than that gender imbalance is responsible.
I didn't say the gender imbalance caused it, I said the imbalance will make it worse.
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 04:50 PM   #24
NWO Sentryman
Proud NWO Gatekeeper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,833
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Is there some relevance here to the OP?
Due to sex selective abortions, there are less women than men in both China and India, and it already is setting back the clock on women's rights in both countries. Zeihan talks specifically about Chinese issues in this blog post but it's a good indicator for issues in southeast Asia.
__________________
If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you? - FireGarden on the Middle East
NWO Sentryman is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 05:17 PM   #25
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
Due to sex selective abortions, there are less women than men in both China and India, and it already is setting back the clock on women's rights in both countries. Zeihan talks specifically about Chinese issues in this blog post but it's a good indicator for issues in southeast Asia.
This thread is not about abortion, don't try to kill it by dragging it down that road.

As for the impact of a shortage of women, your logic makes zero sense. Women don't have any bargaining weight because men need wives. If anything it's the opposite. In the lower classes their families have to pay for husbands for the girls and some are still being killed because the in-laws don't think the dowry was big enough.

Women in India are beginning to assert their rights in many areas. No doubt globalization leads to people all over the world seeing the rights others enjoy and finding like-minded people to join together. In India there have been movements to force the police to arrest rapists and prosecute dowry murderers.

This particular movement is connected to the women forcing their way into a prominent Hindu Temple and some extremists men resisting and rioting. The courts ruled in favor of the women and amazingly the police are actually supporting the move.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 05:20 PM   #26
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
One might look at some of the posts in this thread and wonder what it is that has drawn some of our resident right-wingers in. Women's religious rights in India is somehow a right wing issue?

Curious minds want to know.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 5th January 2019 at 05:22 PM.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 05:24 PM   #27
Roboramma
Penultimate Amazing
 
Roboramma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 11,628
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I didn't say the gender imbalance caused it, I said the imbalance will make it worse.
Okay, that's much more reasonable. I'm not convinced it will have that effect, but I can see the logic.

I do think that in spite of how bad things are for women in India, they are getting better, not worse, in general.
__________________
"... when people thought the Earth was flat, they were wrong. When people thought the Earth was spherical they were wrong. But if you think that thinking the Earth is spherical is just as wrong as thinking the Earth is flat, then your view is wronger than both of them put together."
Isaac Asimov
Roboramma is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 05:48 PM   #28
applecorped
Rotten to the Core
 
applecorped's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 18,597
Walls are bad
__________________
All You Need Is Love.
applecorped is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 05:56 PM   #29
EHocking
Philosopher
 
EHocking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,668
Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Walls are bad, míkay?
FTFY
__________________
"A closed mouth gathers no feet"
"Ignorance is a renewable resource" P.J.O'Rourke
Prayer: "a sophisticated way of pleading with thunderstorms." T.Pratchett
"It's all god's handiwork, there's little quality control applied", Fox26 reporter on Texas granite
Forum Birdwatching Webpage
EHocking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 05:57 PM   #30
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by Roboramma View Post
Okay, that's much more reasonable. I'm not convinced it will have that effect, but I can see the logic.....
I can't.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 07:32 PM   #31
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 41,608
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I can't.
That's not surprising.

In a normally functioning market, the value of a good increases if it becomes more scarce. So from a purely market perspective, one might expect that if women become more scarce, their value as sexual partners should increase, and this should give them more bargaining power.

But sexual relations are not simply another market. Women are not always granted bargaining power over their own bodies. Whatever sexual market value increase might be occurring because of the gender imbalance, women are not the beneficiaries.

Instead, the extreme mismatch between sexual supply and demand creates a whole host of social pathologies which end up hurting women. Large groups of young men with little prospect for sexual pairing misbehave. They don't start treating women better in hopes of wooing them, they start treating them worse out of resentment. The same effects can be seen in polygamous societies: high-status men with multiple women reduce the available pool for low-status men, creating the same effect that a gender imbalance does. It's no coincidence that polygamous societies are horrible places for women. China and India are on the road to reproducing some of those pathologies.
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 08:16 PM   #32
pharphis
Graduate Poster
 
pharphis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,807
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
This thread is not about abortion, don't try to kill it by dragging it down that road.

As for the impact of a shortage of women, your logic makes zero sense. Women don't have any bargaining weight because men need wives. If anything it's the opposite. In the lower classes their families have to pay for husbands for the girls and some are still being killed because the in-laws don't think the dowry was big enough.

Women in India are beginning to assert their rights in many areas. No doubt globalization leads to people all over the world seeing the rights others enjoy and finding like-minded people to join together. In India there have been movements to force the police to arrest rapists and prosecute dowry murderers.

This particular movement is connected to the women forcing their way into a prominent Hindu Temple and some extremists men resisting and rioting. The courts ruled in favor of the women and amazingly the police are actually supporting the move.
Just men? mostly men?
pharphis is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 08:36 PM   #33
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by pharphis View Post
Just men? mostly men?
Actually yes, it was only men.

Check out the news reports.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 08:39 PM   #34
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
That's not surprising.

In a normally functioning market, the value of a good increases if it becomes more scarce. So from a purely market perspective, one might expect that if women become more scarce, their value as sexual partners should increase, and this should give them more bargaining power.

But sexual relations are not simply another market. Women are not always granted bargaining power over their own bodies. Whatever sexual market value increase might be occurring because of the gender imbalance, women are not the beneficiaries.

Instead, the extreme mismatch between sexual supply and demand creates a whole host of social pathologies which end up hurting women. Large groups of young men with little prospect for sexual pairing misbehave. They don't start treating women better in hopes of wooing them, they start treating them worse out of resentment. The same effects can be seen in polygamous societies: high-status men with multiple women reduce the available pool for low-status men, creating the same effect that a gender imbalance does. It's no coincidence that polygamous societies are horrible places for women. China and India are on the road to reproducing some of those pathologies.
None of this has jack **** to do with the women's protest in India. You might want to start with the actual history of Hindus excluding menstruating women. It's a common them oppressing women in many African ethnic groups as well.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 5th January 2019 at 08:40 PM.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 09:09 PM   #35
pharphis
Graduate Poster
 
pharphis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,807
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Actually yes, it was only men.

Check out the news reports.
I didn't see that in the OP article. Was there another one you had in mind?

I don't doubt that there were men who were outraged and all the crappy stuff that follows from that (hateful rhetoric, violence, etc.) but I'd be shocked if it was exclusively men - after all, it's not like cultural practices and tradition are endorsed and controlled solely by men.
pharphis is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 09:51 PM   #36
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by pharphis View Post
I didn't see that in the OP article. Was there another one you had in mind?

I don't doubt that there were men who were outraged and all the crappy stuff that follows from that (hateful rhetoric, violence, etc.) but I'd be shocked if it was exclusively men - after all, it's not like cultural practices and tradition are endorsed and controlled solely by men.
I suppose it was a big mistake on my part believing people in this forum had a clue about such a major current event. Now I see either neither story was on CNN or no one who watches mainstream news has yet found their way to this thread.

Guardian: Protests break out in India after two women enter temple - Court ruling allows women to offer prayers in temple in Kerala after centuries-long ban
Quote:
Protests have broken out in the Indian state of Kerala, where groups of angry traditionalists waving black flags blocked traffic and staged demonstrations outside government offices to oppose the entry of two women into a Hindu temple.

Police used teargas and water cannon to disperse the protesters outside government buildings in the state capital of Thiruvananthapuram, according to local news channels. The police intervened after clashes between Bharatiya Janata party and Communist party workers.

The BJP, which rules India, opposes the entry of women into the Sabarimala temple in the southern state. The Communists, who rule Kerala, support the right of women to pray at the temple.
Atheists are always to blame:
Quote:
The BJP’s head in Kerala, PS Sreedharan Pillai, called the visit “a conspiracy by the atheist rulers to destroy the Hindu temples”. Speaking to local television news channels, he said: “Let all the devotees come forward and protest this.”...

For three months, Kerala has been the scene of an angry showdown between Hindu traditionalists and supporters of the supreme court ruling that women of all ages must be allowed to enter the temple. ...

On Tuesday, hundreds of thousands of women in Kerala formed a human chain 380 miles (610km) long across the length of the state to demonstrate their support for gender equality. The “women’s wall” rally was backed by the government.
I saw the riots covered on France24 (the TV news I have left (Comcast cancelled my RT news). But I only saw the wall of women online.

It's amazing what stories fail to be covered on the MSN.

I also get DW: Mass arrests in India amid protests over women entering forbidden Hindu temple
Police have detained hundreds in India's Kerala state as Hindu hardliners tried to shut down businesses in protest over the Sabarimala Temple. Meanwhile, another woman entered the shrine of the celibate god Ayyappa.


Hardliners are men though I believe there is one woman in one of those photos.

Hindu hardliners step up campaign to block Indian temple to women
Quote:
Hindu hardliners step up campaign to block Indian temple to women
This is a huge deal in India as evidenced by how many people are involved in this event.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 5th January 2019 at 09:53 PM.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 10:05 PM   #37
Lambchops
Muse
 
Lambchops's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Norvegr
Posts: 900
MRA's gonna MRA.
__________________
Proud Dirtbag Leftist.
Lambchops is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 10:53 PM   #38
pharphis
Graduate Poster
 
pharphis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,807
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I suppose it was a big mistake on my part believing people in this forum had a clue about such a major current event. Now I see either neither story was on CNN or no one who watches mainstream news has yet found their way to this thread.

Guardian: Protests break out in India after two women enter temple - Court ruling allows women to offer prayers in temple in Kerala after centuries-long ban

Atheists are always to blame:

I saw the riots covered on France24 (the TV news I have left (Comcast cancelled my RT news). But I only saw the wall of women online.

It's amazing what stories fail to be covered on the MSN.

I also get DW: Mass arrests in India amid protests over women entering forbidden Hindu temple
Police have detained hundreds in India's Kerala state as Hindu hardliners tried to shut down businesses in protest over the Sabarimala Temple. Meanwhile, another woman entered the shrine of the celibate god Ayyappa.


Hardliners are men though I believe there is one woman in one of those photos.

Hindu hardliners step up campaign to block Indian temple to women

This is a huge deal in India as evidenced by how many people are involved in this event.
I followed that link to another after reading this summary,
Quote:
After the ruling, several women tried to reach the shrine but were forced to retreat by activists comprising ordinary women and political groups, including the BJP.
It was paraphrasing the quote below from the below article.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-exposed-thigh

Quote:
Bands of male and female demonstrators have formed cordons and hurled rocks at the women who have tried to reach the inner sanctum. None of the women have succeeded so far.
pharphis is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 10:58 PM   #39
pharphis
Graduate Poster
 
pharphis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,807
Originally Posted by Lambchops View Post
MRA's gonna MRA.
Thank you for your insightful input
pharphis is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th January 2019, 11:29 PM   #40
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 70,908
Originally Posted by pharphis View Post
I followed that link to another after reading this summary,

It was paraphrasing the quote below from the below article.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-exposed-thigh
Oh heaven forbid I said males when they are merely predominate but there are a few females in the crowd.

This is about a gender issue. Women are not dirty because they menstruate. And isolating menstruating women is a male dominant move.

You want to discuss it? Let's discuss it. Don't get all snowflakey though about the fact this is about men oppressing women, unlike some of our other debates.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:48 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.