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Old 23rd June 2021, 09:48 AM   #241
Gamolon
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
How do you know who needed the money more than me?
You mean to tell me you think out of all the people who played the lottery, not one person may have needed it more than you?

You truly believe that?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 09:54 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Lots of people have some kind of premonition that they will win. Sometimes they do win, sometimes they don't. If they do, are they also being helped by the angels of karma?
I don't know. But on the very first lottery draw my mother dreamed four numbers and they won. Maybe it runs in the family.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 09:56 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
You mean to tell me you think out of all the people who played the lottery, not one person may have needed it more than you?

You truly believe that?
Like I keep saying, my winnings were a very small fraction of the big prize.
As I recall several people won six numbers and shared £20 million. They did not need my paltry winnings.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 09:57 AM   #244
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
So just because they were of high quality? The bits that aren't inspired are the...lower quality bits?

So anything of really high quality is inspired by the spirit world? The Upanishads, Ridley Scott's Aliens, the Peter Gabriel album So...these are all exceptional quality versions of their form of media. Are they all inspired?

What if someone disagrees on the quality of a piece of media? What if something thinks that your spirit inspired painting was bad and insipid? What if someone finds 2001:A Space Odyssey boring like my mother does? I don't, I think it's glorious cinema.

It can't just be quality because people have very different opinions on what is quality.
Ahem.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 09:57 AM   #245
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
The big winners divided £20 million between them, they did not need my £1182
You're focusing on the amounts when we're trying to focus on the claim of just desserts. You claim it was inconsequential that you won a thousand pounds, but you still can't explain why your needs were so much more deserving than the other people who entered, might have won £1.182, and had far more noble things to do with it than buy themselves a computer.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 09:59 AM   #246
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
How do you know who needed the money more than me?
You're the one claiming that your needs were so universally laudable that the spirit world chose to intervene and give the money to you. In order for you to make that claim, you're the one who would need to know what the needs of other other potential winners were, and how they intended to spend them money. We're not on the hook to demonstrate this; you are.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:00 AM   #247
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Like I keep saying, my winnings were a very small fraction of the big prize.
As I recall several people won six numbers and shared £20 million. They did not need my paltry winnings.
So you basically took part in helping angels go against God's rules and are trying to justify by saying it was just a small amount?

Your version makes it seem like God has no control over his angels and spirits. He puts down the laws and rules they just do what they want anyways.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:01 AM   #248
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I cannot dissect the entire Upanishads, and bible to pieces on this thread.
It is the work of years.
Agreed. If, hypothetically, someone spent years studying either of those texts and came to a well-considered belief that they were inspired, or conversely that they weren't inspired, would you respect their findings even though they differed from yours?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:04 AM   #249
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I don't know. But on the very first lottery draw my mother dreamed four numbers and they won. Maybe it runs in the family.
I have a better explanation.

They chose to put your soul incarnation for it to take away money from another incarnation that desperately needed that money as NOT getting that money made it suffer because it NEEDED to suffer.

Is that a possibility Scorpion?

Last edited by Gamolon; 23rd June 2021 at 10:10 AM.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:12 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
You're the one claiming that your needs were so universally laudable that the spirit world chose to intervene and give the money to you. In order for you to make that claim, you're the one who would need to know what the needs of other other potential winners were, and how they intended to spend them money. We're not on the hook to demonstrate this; you are.
How can I know about other winners. In any case I did not used black magic to fix the lottery. A spirit or angel gave me the numbers. Maybe they though I deserved a chance to get onto the internet. In any case I have paid the money back several times over trying to win the lottery again. But I knew it was wrong to expect them to give me a big win so I have not bothered doing the lottery for a couple of years now.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:14 AM   #251
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Agreed. If, hypothetically, someone spent years studying either of those texts and came to a well-considered belief that they were inspired, or conversely that they weren't inspired, would you respect their findings even though they differed from yours?
I would just regard it as their opinion.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:17 AM   #252
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
I have a better explanation.

They chose to put your soul incarnation for it to take away money from another incarnation that desperately needed that money as NOT getting that money made it suffer because it NEEDED to suffer.

Is that a possibility Scorpion?
Be real, I don't know how much of a fraction of £20 million pounds £1182 is but I am confident the big winners did not need my money. However I did.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:19 AM   #253
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
How can I know about other winners.
Exactly. Your claim fails because you really don't know whether you were the most deserving recipient.

Quote:
In any case I did not used black magic to fix the lottery.
No one claimed you did.

Quote:
A spirit or angel gave me the numbers. Maybe they though I deserved a chance to get onto the internet.
Or maybe that's just what you decided to believe, and maybe none of this is in any way evidence of the existence of a spirit world.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:20 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I would just regard it as their opinion.
Would you agree with that opinion? Why, or why not?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:21 AM   #255
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
Ahem.
I am confident that the quality of the Upanishads means they were largely inspired. I think many people are inspired unbeknown to them. I cannot say who, but Dickens comes to mind.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:23 AM   #256
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Would you agree with that opinion? Why, or why not?
I would agree if they thought the Upanishads were inspired.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:26 AM   #257
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I would agree if they thought the Upanishads were inspired.
Is that the same as saying you would agree with their opinion only if it matched yours?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:27 AM   #258
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Is that the same as saying you would agree with their opinion only if it matched yours?
Yes. I would have no regard for the opinion of someone who did not believe the Upanishads were inspired and inspiring.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy

Last edited by Scorpion; 23rd June 2021 at 10:29 AM.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:41 AM   #259
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Yes. I would have no regard for the opinion of someone who did not believe the Upanishads were inspired and inspiring.
But that presents a new problem for you. You claim not to be an expert in that text, and you concede that it would require years for someone to become an expert. But now you're telling me the expertise you conceded would be necessary is subordinate to your non-expert assessment -- in effect, that it doesn't matter what anyone else knows if they disagree with you.

Can you really not see how astonishingly arrogant your position is?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:43 AM   #260
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I am confident that the quality of the Upanishads means they were largely inspired. I think many people are inspired unbeknown to them. I cannot say who, but Dickens comes to mind.
Why do you think Dickens was inspired, the quality of his writing?

Because I can't stand Dickens' writing. I think his stories are great but he's a terrible writer. Why is your opinion on the quality of his work more important than mine?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:44 AM   #261
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
But that presents a new problem for you. You claim not to be an expert in that text, and you concede that it would require years for someone to become an expert. But now you're telling me the expertise you conceded would be necessary is subordinate to your non-expert assessment -- in effect, that it doesn't matter what anyone else knows if they disagree with you.

Can you really not see how astonishingly arrogant your position is?
I don't have to be an expert to know the spiritual virtue of the teachings I have read in the Upanishads.
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:46 AM   #262
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
Why do you think Dickens was inspired, the quality of his writing?

Because I can't stand Dickens' writing. I think his stories are great but he's a terrible writer. Why is your opinion on the quality of his work more important than mine?
No, the quality of his stories and the richness of his characters. You cannot deny he had a great imagination.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:46 AM   #263
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I don't have to be an expert to know the spiritual virtue of the teachings I have read in the Upanishads.
But what if someone with equal conviction thought there was no spiritual value?

I don't think there is any spiritual value in them

Further, how does one measure spiritual value? How can you tell what works have spiritual value and which do not?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:47 AM   #264
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
No, the quality of his stories and the richness of his characters. You cannot deny he had a great imagination.
Ok but what if I thought that his stories and characters sucked? Why am I wrong and you are right?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:47 AM   #265
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I don't have to be an expert to know the spiritual virtue of the teachings I have read in the Upanishads.
That directly contradicts what you said earlier:

Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I think most of the Upanishads were inspired. Because of their quality.
I cannot dissect the entire Upanishads, and bible to pieces on this thread.
It is the work of years.
You refrained from responding in detail regarding the claimed inspired nature of the Upanishads because you lacked the required expertise. You may not now claim that no such expertise is required.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:50 AM   #266
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
Ok but what if I thought that his stories and characters sucked? Why am I wrong and you are right?
I hardly think I stand alone in thinking Dickens stories are classics.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 10:55 AM   #267
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
That directly contradicts what you said earlier:



You refrained from responding in detail regarding the claimed inspired nature of the Upanishads because you lacked the required expertise. You may not now claim that no such expertise is required.
Lead me from the unreal to the real.
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
Sri Ramakrishna
Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:00 AM   #268
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The Lord is enshrined in the hearts of all.
The Lord is the supreme reality.
Rejoice in him through renunciation.
Covet nothing. All belongs to the Lord.

The Isha Upanishad
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
Sri Ramakrishna
Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:01 AM   #269
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I hardly think I stand alone in thinking Dickens stories are classics.
So what? Why does that matter?

Are there any hugely popular authors you don't like? I imagine you would say that they were not inspired. Why is your opinion the only one that matters?

Also I note that YET AGAIN you are ignoring parts of my posts to you and only responding to snippets.

How can you tell when an author is inspired Scorpion? If it is quality what about when people disagree on the quality of a work?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:01 AM   #270
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Be real, I don't know how much of a fraction of £20 million pounds £1182 is but I am confident the big winners did not need my money. However I did.
I am being real.

Your incarnation could have been chosen to receive that money instead of someone who needed it, which made them suffer because that's what the AoK decided.

What if an incarnation needed that money to pay rent and they couldn't because you took it, as foreseen by the AoK, which caused said incarnation to get kicked out of their dwelling causing said incarnation to suffer. Suffering which was needed according the AoK who had foreseen it.

You're saying that scenario isn't possible at all?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:02 AM   #271
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Now you're just quoting non sequitur bits that you like. You haven't explained anything, and you haven't even begun to defend why your colossal arrogance is acceptable.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:03 AM   #272
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Lead me from the unreal to the real.
Lead me from darkness to light.
Lead me from death to immortality.

OM shanti shanti shanti
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
The Lord is enshrined in the hearts of all.
The Lord is the supreme reality.
Rejoice in him through renunciation.
Covet nothing. All belongs to the Lord.

The Isha Upanishad
So your response to being shown an contradiction in your reasoning is to babble incoherently? You really need to revisit the assertion that you must be right and all your critics must be wrong.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:04 AM   #273
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
I am being real.

Your incarnation could have been chosen to receive that money instead of someone who needed it, which made them suffer because that's what the AoK decided.

What if an incarnation needed that money to pay rent and they couldn't because you took it, as foreseen by the AoK, which caused said incarnation to get kicked out of their dwelling causing said incarnation to suffer. Suffering which was needed according the AoK who had foreseen it.

You're saying that scenario isn't possible at all?
Someone who won a share of £20 million did not need my money to pay rent, they could buy houses.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:05 AM   #274
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
So your response to being shown an contradiction in your reasoning is to babble incoherently? You really need to revisit the assertion that you must be right and all your critics must be wrong.
I do not consider the Upanishads to be babble, I am letting them speak for me.
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
Sri Ramakrishna
Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:09 AM   #275
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
So what? Why does that matter?

Are there any hugely popular authors you don't like? I imagine you would say that they were not inspired. Why is your opinion the only one that matters?

Also I note that YET AGAIN you are ignoring parts of my posts to you and only responding to snippets.

How can you tell when an author is inspired Scorpion? If it is quality what about when people disagree on the quality of a work?
I said I am not alone on my view of Dickens. It is not just my opinion that he is a master story teller. As for other authors I don't read much fiction. But I highly rate Herman Hesse.

I cannot say which authors are inspired.
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
Sri Ramakrishna
Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:11 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I do not consider the Upanishads to be babble, I am letting them speak for me.
In the context of my challenge, they are meaningless babble. Can you reconcile your contradictory statements?
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:15 AM   #277
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
In the context of my challenge, they are meaningless babble. Can you reconcile your contradictory statements?
You do not have to be an expert to recognize the virtue of the Upanishads.
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
Sri Ramakrishna
Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:22 AM   #278
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
You do not have to be an expert to recognize the virtue of the Upanishads.
That does not address the contradiction I illustrated. Try again.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:23 AM   #279
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Someone who won a share of £20 million did not need my money to pay rent, they could buy houses.
You're missing the point Scorpion. Intentionally I believe.

There could have been an incarnation that needed the amount of money to help pay their rent so they wouldn't get kicked out of their dwelling. The AoK had foreseen that this particular incarnation WOULD get kicked out and would suffer the determined amount that was needed to bring balance to said soul/incarnation. In order to do that, they gave the winning numbers to a different soul/incarnation to cause the other soul to suffer the amount needed.

That's not a possibility? How can it NOT be. It matches your beliefs to a tee.
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Old 23rd June 2021, 11:29 AM   #280
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
You're missing the point Scorpion. Intentionally I believe.

There could have been an incarnation that needed the amount of money to help pay their rent so they wouldn't get kicked out of their dwelling. The AoK had foreseen that this particular incarnation WOULD get kicked out and would suffer the determined amount that was needed to bring balance to said soul/incarnation. In order to do that, they gave the winning numbers to a different soul/incarnation to cause the other soul to suffer the amount needed.

That's not a possibility? How can it NOT be. It matches your beliefs to a tee.
I doubt the angels of karma run around checking the needs of millions of people who play the lottery every week to see if they need the money.
In any case the person would have to be psychically susceptible to the spiritual influence for the said angels to be able to help them pick the numbers.
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You see many stars in the sky at night, but not when the sun rises. Can you therefore say there are no stars in the heavens during the day? O man because you cannot find God in the days of your ignorance, say not that there is no God.
Sri Ramakrishna
Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
Leo Tolstoy
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