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Tags wtc7 , wtc , smoke , dave vonkleist , 911 conspiracy theory , cloud

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Old 31st March 2007, 06:12 AM   #1
MaGZ
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The VonKleist video reexamined

In this video Dave VonKleist attempts to resolve the question concerning the white cloud of smoke that appears behind WTC 7. He obtained the CNN video and concludes the white cloud of smoke was the result of WTC 2 falling. I think VonKleist is wrong. The white cloud is the result of an explosion which occurred moments after the crash of flight 175 into WTC 2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4p8Pxc3604
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Old 31st March 2007, 06:27 AM   #2
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vonKleist is a certified moron. He has zero qualifications for the 'analysis' in his video. He continually raises questions that exist only in his fevered imagination. A well-written debunking of his video, In Plane Site, was featured in The New American. TNA is a publication of the John Birch Society. vonKleist hallucinated the exposure of his garbage theories into a personal attack by the magazine.

Anyone that blindly accepted Thierry Meyssann's Pentagon website has no business offering analysis.
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Old 31st March 2007, 06:33 AM   #3
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MaGZ Safety Watch Bulletin

We have one(1) consecutive post(s) without mentioning evil jooz.


MaGz, bubbie... the important thing about following whack-ass CTers is that sometimes they get things right and sometimes the video gets it right for them.

If there was ever evidence of your selective researching, this is it! Did you actually look at the whole thing? The camera zooms out and in and anyone with marginally correct vision can see that WTC 2 is going down in the background. How can you possibly think that's one of your missile hits from "moments after" 175 hit the south tower?
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Old 31st March 2007, 06:34 AM   #4
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Yes I pointed that out to you in the "dont eat me" thread.
Vonkleist states in his narration 3:20 into the video
Quote:

Until more evidence is discovered to support the contention of a separate explosion at the world trade center.I think its safe to assume that this rising plume was the first of many, which were the result of the collapsing south tower. which was hidden from view in this camera angle
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Old 31st March 2007, 07:06 AM   #5
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At least VonKleist corrected this garbage. Hard to believe he and the other 'researchers' who promoted it couldn't have found a few other videos or photographs taken from different angles before they published it.
VERY hard to believe.

As it is their stuff is out there still ready to snare the occasional idiot who stumbles over it, the kind of idiot who, once these images are carved into their pathetic excuse for a brain, will go on believeing it for ever, simply because it got there first.

Why is VonKleist retracting it now MagZ? Did they get to him? Is the video he showed fake, which clearly shows the tower collapsing at the same time this plume rises?
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Old 31st March 2007, 07:13 AM   #6
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Oh that is hillarious. How can you even show your face here now MagZ. If you watch the full clip, as others have pointed out, they show the tower collapsing EARLIER, then go to the live picture of the plume...

IT WAS FROM THE COLLAPSE OF WTC...End of Story.

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 07:42 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
Oh that is hillarious. How can you even show your face here now MagZ. If you watch the full clip, as others have pointed out, they show the tower collapsing EARLIER, then go to the live picture of the plume...

IT WAS FROM THE COLLAPSE OF WTC...End of Story.

TAM
Actually, this has been sort of bugging me...... Is MaGZ getting so desperate for material that he couldn't even bother watching or listening to the whole thing? (Maybe couldn't turn the sound up because mommy was sleeping upstairs?)

MaGZ... Really, I'm seriously curious. Are you really this clueless to post a video and commentary that clearly makes you out to have zero comprehension? Were you just testing to see if we were paying attention? Surely you know by now that we can read, write, add, subtract, etc.....?
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Old 31st March 2007, 09:44 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by MaGZ View Post
In this video Dave VonKleist attempts to resolve the question concerning the white cloud of smoke that appears behind WTC 7. He obtained the CNN video and concludes the white cloud of smoke was the result of WTC 2 falling. I think VonKleist is wrong. The white cloud is the result of an explosion which occurred moments after the crash of flight 175 into WTC 2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4p8Pxc3604
I'm with Foolmewunz on this one. That post was just a joke. It had to be. No one's that dumb.
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:21 PM   #9
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An explosion while the Twin Towers are standing

At 1:11 into the video you see the CNN footage of the white cloud (explosion from the missile that hit on the 14th floor of WTC 7) while the Twin Towers are still standing. You can clearly see the tops of the two buildings.
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:30 PM   #10
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This is a 1:1 jpg version of the time period you are mentioning.

There is no "two towers" standing. The line in the middle is the corner, and the two rectangular panels are different sides of the one tower. There is no other tower behind the dust. You are insane.

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:33 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
Oh that is hillarious. How can you even show your face here now MagZ. If you watch the full clip, as others have pointed out, they show the tower collapsing EARLIER, then go to the live picture of the plume...

IT WAS FROM THE COLLAPSE OF WTC...End of Story.

TAM
In the Tom Clancy interview on CNN all the footage being shown was listed as being shown "EARLIER". The mistake you are making is assuming all the "EARLIER" footage is being replayed in the ordered that it occurred. In the Clancy interview it does start off with the collapse of WTC 2, however later they play the white cloud explosion which occurred on CNN at 9:04. Both the white cloud and the resulting dust cloud from the collapse of WTC 2 are different in shape. Understand?
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:36 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by MaGZ View Post
In the Tom Clancy interview on CNN all the footage being shown was listed as being shown "EARLIER". The mistake you are making is assuming all the "EARLIER" footage is being replayed in the ordered that it occurred. In the Clancy interview it does start off with the collapse of WTC 2, however later they play the white cloud explosion which occurred on CNN at 9:04. Both the white cloud and the resulting dust cloud from the collapse of WTC 2 are different in shape. Understand?
MagZ:

The picture I have posted is from the EXACT time period (1:11....read it on the image) you just stated shows us "two towers". It clearly, does not. Are you on drugs?

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:38 PM   #13
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you know what. I know I cant convince you. Thank god I do not care to. Lets just allow the fence sitters to decide for themselve...lol

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:39 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...eeedb4e13a.jpg

This is a 1:1 jpg version of the time period you are mentioning.

There is no "two towers" standing. The line in the middle is the corner, and the two rectangular panels are different sides of the one tower. There is no other tower behind the dust. You are insane.

TAM
The roof lines are uneven: there are two towers standing. The WTC 2 roof line is lower that WTC 1 because it is father away.
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:41 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by MaGZ View Post
The roof lines are uneven: there are two towers standing. The WTC 2 roof line is lower that WTC 1 because it is father away.
yes because the roof line of the south tower is already on the ground!!!
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:44 PM   #16
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I know exactly what you are talking about and it is merely a result of the shaity resolution of the clip. Find me the original, high resolution clip and then lets look at it together...

As I watch the entire clip, including the one after the 1:11 version, the one that Vonkelist asks us to watch after, which is more clearer, but obviously the same clip from the same channel...your "uneven rooflines" appear even, and you can see the tower radio tower standing as it should be...

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:45 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
you know what. I know I cant convince you. Thank god I do not care to. Lets just allow the fence sitters to decide for themselve...lol

TAM
I think you realize you are wrong, but are too embarrassed to admit it.
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:51 PM   #18
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Here, this is what I see.

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:53 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by MaGZ View Post
I think you realize you are wrong, but are too embarrassed to admit it.
Even if I was wrong, which I am not, I would not be embarrassed by it child. I say child, because only a child would assume a grown up would be too embarrassed to admit they are wrong about something like this. I am trying to clarify it for you.

As I said, I will leave it for the sane to decide.

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:56 PM   #20
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Two different events

These are two different events. The wind was blowing in different directions at 9:04 and 10:05am

http://911studies.com/911photostudies119.htm
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Old 31st March 2007, 04:58 PM   #21
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what are you talking about?

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:01 PM   #22
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Jack White is wrong, and has mislabeled the time of the first camera still as 9:04AM.

simple

thanks for playing.

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:15 PM   #23
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you are accepting a CT websites time of 9:04. corroborate this please

also, the pictures are at different angles, left to right and in elevation, no comparison

show mw any other picture of the ground cloud anywhere, where we have a better view

VonKlesist shows you the collapse line movung down in the video, that proved it, you ignored it, you are an idiot, end of story.
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:21 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by alexg View Post
you are accepting a CT websites time of 9:04. corroborate this please

also, the pictures are at different angles, left to right and in elevation, no comparison

show mw any other picture of the ground cloud anywhere, where we have a better view

VonKlesist shows you the collapse line movung down in the video, that proved it, you ignored it, you are an idiot, end of story.
The 9:04 time comfirmed by CNN

http://www.thepowerhour.com/911_anal...-explosion.htm
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:31 PM   #25
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How many times a day do i need to spank your butt?

Wrong again on the CNN video. time stamp says 9:58

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


You must be enjoy being debunked over and over again.
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:36 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
you know what. I know I cant convince you. Thank god I do not care to. Lets just allow the fence sitters to decide for themselve...lol

TAM
125 guests at JREF (fence sitters online as I post)...wow.

Only 3 of them visiting the JREF Conspiracy Forum.

Interesting.

MM

p.s. Ahh sure you'd admit you were wrong T.A.M...ya right..that'll be the day.
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:40 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by MerryMelodies View Post
125 guests at JREF (fence sitters online as I post)...wow.

Only 3 of them visiting the JREF Conspiracy Forum.

Interesting.

MM

p.s. Ahh sure you'd admit you were wrong T.A.M...ya right..that'll be the day.
So why are you here then? Your certainly not going to convince any of us until you bring some facts to the table.
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:42 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Miragememories View Post
p.s. Ahh sure you'd admit you were wrong T.A.M...ya right..that'll be the day.

He does and he has.

Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
Originally Posted by 8den View Post
Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
The answer is technically no, but they likely think Mark won't take the time to seek legal action for using his likeness in a film without his permission.
<snip>
Technically because the confrontation happened in a public space Mark loses his right to privacy, but seeing as this is a protracted argument, and focuses on mark, an argument could be made, that is a breach of privacy.
I am no lawyer, so I will assume you are correct. Thank you sir.
<snip>
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:43 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Miragememories View Post
125 guests at JREF (fence sitters online as I post)...wow.

Right, and all the registered users couldn't possibly be fence sitters.
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:45 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
Jack White is wrong, and has mislabeled the time of the first camera still as 9:04AM.

simple

thanks for playing.

TAM
I have look at the video again and I will admit that I was wrong when I said both towers were standing when the white cloud appeared. THIS white cloud was from the collapse of WTC 2. My apologies.

However, there was a white cloud but not this one.

I can prove it if you have the Naudet video "9/11."
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:45 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Miragememories View Post
125 guests at JREF (fence sitters online as I post)...wow.

Only 3 of them visiting the JREF Conspiracy Forum.

Interesting.

MM

p.s. Ahh sure you'd admit you were wrong T.A.M...ya right..that'll be the day.
Well the total guest count at JREF now shows 211. 56 viewing CT subforum. You must be able to view more than me, cause it doenst tell me how many are members versus guests on a particular subforum.

tAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:47 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Hokulele View Post
He does and he has.
lol...MM knows I do admit when I am wrong, I just havent been proven wrong by him yet...right MM
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:48 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by MaGZ View Post
I have look at the video again and I will admit that I was wrong when I said both towers were standing when the white cloud appeared. THIS white cloud was from the collapse of WTC 2. My apologies.

However, there was a white cloud but not this one.

I can prove it if you have the Naudet video "9/11."
I do not, but when you find this, please, bring it forward for us to discuss.

Thank you for admitting your error...It takes a big man to do so.

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:48 PM   #34
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how long do you suppose those two three fourteen guests stay at this JREF sub forum MerryMelodies?
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Last edited by A W Smith; 31st March 2007 at 05:58 PM. Reason: oops more guests here than i thought
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:50 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
lol...MM knows I do admit when I am wrong, I just havent been proven wrong by him yet...right MM

Of course! This example was for all 3 of those fence-sitters.
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:53 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by MaGZ View Post
I have look at the video again and I will admit that I was wrong when I said both towers were standing when the white cloud appeared. THIS white cloud was from the collapse of WTC 2. My apologies.

However, there was a white cloud but not this one.

I can prove it if you have the Naudet video "9/11."
Which Naudet segment? I can have it here in five mins. Shouldn't you put on a pair of lederhozen or something so your butt wont hurt so much?
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Old 31st March 2007, 05:55 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Miragememories View Post
125 guests at JREF (fence sitters online as I post)...wow.

Only 3 of them visiting the JREF Conspiracy Forum.

Interesting.

MM

p.s. Ahh sure you'd admit you were wrong T.A.M...ya right..that'll be the day.
MM....I went into "Current users" and counted on the first 4 pages of "Guests" at least 14 who were on a thread within the CT subforum...

TAM
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Old 31st March 2007, 06:12 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by A W Smith View Post
Which Naudet segment? I can have it here in five mins. Shouldn't you put on a pair of lederhozen or something so your butt wont hurt so much?
Could you provide the section where the cameraman films the crash of flight 175 into WTC 2 from the corner of Vesey and Church and a minute or two thereafter?

Also I need Jules Naudet (if he was the brother inside WTC 1 lobby) footage at the time of the crash of flight 175 into WTC 2. He is pointing his camera toward the east and is filming the falling debris from WTC 2 above falling into the plaza while he remains inside the WTC 1 lobby.
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Old 31st March 2007, 06:23 PM   #39
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What I saw in the Naudet video

I have view the Naudet video several times. I can describe what I saw. In the video you will see the white cloud twice from two different cameras.

On the corner of Vesey and Church a cameraman films flight 175 crashing into WTC 2 then a few seconds after the explosion of the aircraft into the building there is an abrupt cut in the film. (This is where the missile hit WTC 7) After the cut the terrified cameraman runs north on Church Street and cowers against a tall building. He focuses his camera toward the intersection of Vesey and Church and you see the white cloud drift across the intersection. The white cloud was the result of the missile hit onto WTC 7.

Inside the lobby of WTC 1 one of the Naudet brothers films the falling debris coming form the crash of flight 175 into WTC 2. He films the white cloud of smoke coming form WTC 7 drifting toward WTC 2.
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Old 31st March 2007, 06:47 PM   #40
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Okay, MaGZ - this one's closed. Truth 1 - MaGZ 0.

Now go find the parts of the Naudet film you're talking about, and post the links if you want to discuss them. Otherwise, you're just Chris Brown bremembering parts of a film.

ETA: Good on ya for admitting your error, though. Maybe there's hope, yet.
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