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Old 19th March 2019, 07:38 PM   #641
Foolmewunz
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Seems like Donnie's schedule indicates almost zilch in the way of meetings or panels to discuss the "emergency". His most-public events of the past two weeks have been meetings with furriners who would have nothing to offer on the topic, a pass-out-the-paper-towels trip to Alabama, a couple of rounds of golf with pros, and maniacal tweeting sessions. Business as usual, in other words.

I think we can safely qualify just what the "emergency" consists of. "Waaaah, they won't give me the money I want for my white-elephant-boondoggle! How'm I gonna get elected if I don't have a wall to pose in front of!!??"
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Old 19th March 2019, 07:52 PM   #642
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It could be an almost deliberate move by Trump to give the Courts every reason to strike down his Emergency, so he can campaign on "Give me more PWR to I can control everything!"
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Old 19th March 2019, 09:15 PM   #643
Norman Alexander
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
It could be an almost deliberate move by Trump actual not-insane-but-evil GOP backroom wonks to give the Courts every reason to strike down his Emergency, so he can campaign on "Give me more PWR to I can control everything!"
Donny doesn't know what time of day it is after someone tells him. So I doubt he could figure out any deliberate shenanigans involving constitutional law.
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Old 19th March 2019, 09:42 PM   #644
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Originally Posted by beren View Post
Who thinks that? Please be specific.
Anarchists. As far as I can remember, I've seen a total of one single anarchist on this site, and I don't think they post here anymore.

Anyone else is a figment of conservative imagination.

Edit: I seem to have been wrong.
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Old 19th March 2019, 09:47 PM   #645
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Interesting. Do you often define people who disagree with you as idiots?



The problem is that you are misrepresenting the question, and over-analysing the problem. Deliberately, I might add, since you've already been told this more than once. Your continued confusion can't be given the benefit of the doubt at this stage.



Yes, there is an actual problem with illegal immigration, and yes, the situation can be improved. No, a wall is not the best solution, and no, you can't solve it entirely. Does this create problems for your brain?
Did you just call me an idiot?

What a massive strawman...

I don't know where to begin to pick your post apart. It's damned near the "not even wrong" category.
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Old 19th March 2019, 10:01 PM   #646
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Donny doesn't know what time of day it is after someone tells him. So I doubt he could figure out any deliberate shenanigans involving constitutional law.
"Tommy doesn't know what day it is
He doesn't know who Jesus was or what praying is"

Sorry, ear worm controlling my brain.
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Old 19th March 2019, 11:08 PM   #647
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Like the War on Drugs, the war on migrants isn't interested in adressing the causes, only in punishment.
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Old 19th March 2019, 11:27 PM   #648
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Why can't we secure the border to ensure no more illegal crossings.
Declare Amnesty for those illegals who have been here 10+ years and have been law abiding (other than by coming/working here illegally).
Let them apply for citizenship and grant them citizenship. Let's welcome them to their new civic duty of paying income taxes.
They really should pay some sort of fine for not paying income tax for those 10 years they were here if they were working.

For those who have been here less than 10 years, send them back out and let them come in again legally (provided these folks are not criminals with records of course).
This grand bargain was proposed 14 years ago.

The Secure America and Orderly Immigration Act would have done pretty much what you suggest. George W. Bush, John McCain and Teddy Kennedy championed it. But some extremely vile people hammered it as "amnesty." Versions that called for illegal immigrants paying a fine and getting a misdemeanor record also inspired hatred, fear and threats. The Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2007 inspired much the same reaction. Everything you've thought of, others have too, including quite a few Republicans. It was not politically doable.

There is nothing, IMO, that will satisfy the "secure the borders first" crowd, except for a big, beautiful 40-foot-tall, 2000-mile long wall. In the meantime, a substantial fence act was passed and many new border agents were approved. Turns out the U.S. can't hire them fast enough to staff at these levels. It's been tried and is not even controversial, but in practice it isn't happening.

Many also went ballistic at the idea of a guest worker program that would have matched employers and temporary farm labor.

The border is never going to be secure enough to satisfy people who insist the U.S. has done nothing to make the border more secure.

And, unintended consequence: It's a viable theory that ramped-up security encouraged more family immigration. Migrant workers that used to slip in and out of the country feared they would no longer be able to do so, so rather than risk permanent separation they moved their families up here as well.

Everything you suggest is reasonable and I hope that someday soon such legislation will be viable, but at present it's not. Farm-state Republicans wouldn't even agree to mandate that all employers use E-Verify to vet potential hires. And imagine the reaction if Congress proposed a tamper-resistant, biometric ID card that would make it relatively easy to tell who is in the country legally.

Jeff Flake traded his vote on the tax cut for vague assurances that DACA issues would be fixed legislatively. Why he trusted McConnell is beyond me. That simple thing, which has a lot of legislative support, can't happen because Senate Republicans are unwilling to address it as a standalone issue.

Just in case you really believe the fix is simple, please believe me, it's not. There is a lot of hatred and fear involved as well as money, some of it from private-prison operators who want to see more people detained because they can get contracts for ludicrously expensive detention facilities. In some cases the detainees are being paid $1 to $3 a day to maintain the facilities - while operators get literally hundreds of dollars a day for each immigrant. Your tax dollars at work.

I'm not saying Democrats don't have any culpability. They do. But they are not the ones making any reasonable reform impossible. Republicans keep their heads down because there are some very nasty people out there who will make death threats to any lawmaker who proposes any halfway decent reform such as the measures you say you support.
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Old 20th March 2019, 01:36 AM   #649
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Our inaction on immigration reform as a Country is shameful. No matter which side one supports they're all accountable. I had hoped Obama would get something done. He wasn't my guy, but I really thought he could fix the immigration issues. Now Trump is at bat, and likewise he has taken on the problem that has been passed down by one President after another since Reagan. If he passes it on without action I'll likely vote Independent or Green party next election as it would seem Neither Republican nor Democrat is up to the task. It's well past time that someone did something right on immigration reform. All eyes on Trump at the moment.

Chris B.
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Old 20th March 2019, 05:19 AM   #650
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Did you just call me an idiot?
....where?

Quote:
What a massive strawman...
...where? YOU said that anyone who is intelligent has to agree with you. By definition this means that anyone who disagrees with you on this issue is an idiot. Those are your words, not mine.

Quote:
I don't know where to begin to pick your post apart. It's damned near the "not even wrong" category.
Which parts? The last paragraph should have enough substance for you to respond, if you weren't desperately trying to avoid admitting to being wrong.
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Old 20th March 2019, 07:18 AM   #651
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
....where?







...where? YOU said that anyone who is intelligent has to agree with you. By definition this means that anyone who disagrees with you on this issue is an idiot. Those are your words, not mine.







Which parts? The last paragraph should have enough substance for you to respond, if you weren't desperately trying to avoid admitting to being wrong.
Oh dear. False dilemma: "Intelligent" vs. "Idiot".

The last paragraph has almost no resemblence to the simplistic and loaded question Bob and I answered "no" to. I get that you don't get the massive loading of that question, but that's entirely your problem.
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Old Yesterday, 02:33 AM   #652
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Oh dear. False dilemma: "Intelligent" vs. "Idiot".

The last paragraph has almost no resemblence to the simplistic and loaded question Bob and I answered "no" to. I get that you don't get the massive loading of that question, but that's entirely your problem.
Exactly what I said earlier. You are utterly incapable of even considering that your interpretation might be wrong. It's your way, or you're not intelligent. But not stupid. Oh, no. Not intelligent doesn't mean stupid.

Pull the other one.
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