IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags 2020 elections , donald trump , election conspiracies , Trump controversies , Trump supporters

Reply
Old 11th January 2021, 05:05 AM   #881
Dave Rogers
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
 
Dave Rogers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 32,425
Originally Posted by Susheel View Post
Remember the parades he wanted?
Still possible. I'd be happy to supply the tumbrel.

Dave
__________________
There is truth and there are lies.

- President Joseph R. Biden, January 20th, 2021
Dave Rogers is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 05:40 AM   #882
carlosy
Critical Thinker
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 412
Originally Posted by Susheel View Post
I don't think that Trump has the intellect to go that route. His response to stuff he doesn't like is basically just stamping his feet and flinging stuff around and bawling. It takes a lot of effort to impose and maintain Martial law.
Since when does he need intellect?
It's enough if some of the crazies around him planting the idea in his head.
carlosy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 06:39 AM   #883
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Sorth Dakonsin
Posts: 25,064
Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
I can imagine he might declare that he wants martial law to be imposed on the 19th. If the people he declares it to have any sense, their response will be "Yes sir, we'll get back to you on the details," followed by insurmountable difficulties in contacting them for the next 48 hours.

Dave
They should tell him they'll be ready... in two weeks.
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 06:40 AM   #884
slyjoe
Master Poster
 
slyjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ
Posts: 2,597
Is martial law even a thing under the Constitution?
__________________
"You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade
slyjoe is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 06:45 AM   #885
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 31,579
Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
Is martial law even a thing under the Constitution?
People have spent entire legal careers trying to answer just one various sub-question to that.

Yes, no, sorta, maybe, Yes with But, No with an except... all are sorta accurate answers to that question.
__________________
Yahtzee: "You're doing that thing again where when asked a question you just discuss the philosophy of the question instead of answering the bloody question."
Gabriel: "Well yeah, you see..."
Yahtzee: "No. When you are asked a Yes or No question the first word out of your mouth needs to be Yes or No. Only after that have you earned the right to elaborate."
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 06:51 AM   #886
slyjoe
Master Poster
 
slyjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ
Posts: 2,597
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
People have spent entire legal careers trying to answer just one various sub-question to that.

Yes, no, sorta, maybe, Yes with But, No with an except... all are sorta accurate answers to that question.
So, like Trump talks. You hear what you want to hear.

Especially given the Posse Comitatus Act, it seems the Army couldn't be used. So, since you can't have a coup without an army (according to some here), it doesn't seem you could use the Army to enforce martial law.
__________________
"You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade
slyjoe is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:14 AM   #887
Horatius
NWO Kitty Wrangler
 
Horatius's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 29,163
Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
So, like Trump talks. You hear what you want to hear.

Especially given the Posse Comitatus Act, it seems the Army couldn't be used. So, since you can't have a coup without an army (according to some here), it doesn't seem you could use the Army to enforce martial law.


One of the fun things about attempting a coup - you don't have to follow the rules.

The question "Can Trump use the Army to stay in power?" won't, can't be answered by reference to rules, laws or traditions. The real answer will only come when he gives an order, and we see if the Army obeys it or not.

I'd guess "Not", but that has little to do with the law, and everything to do with the willingness of the Army to obey the law.
__________________
Obviously, that means cats are indeed evil and that ownership or display of a feline is an overt declaration of one's affiliation with dark forces. - Cl1mh4224rd
Horatius is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:25 AM   #888
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 31,579
Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
So, like Trump talks. You hear what you want to hear.

Especially given the Posse Comitatus Act, it seems the Army couldn't be used. So, since you can't have a coup without an army (according to some here), it doesn't seem you could use the Army to enforce martial law.
Well because at the end of the day at a certain point in government you reach a level so high that questions of "technically legal" become pointless.

If the President does something and Congress and the Supreme Court either agree with it or don't actively and effectively counter him questions of whether or not what he does is "legal" become amazingly academic.

And Trump more than any other President before him has leaned hard into the "Everything I do is legal until somebody stops me" mentality.
__________________
Yahtzee: "You're doing that thing again where when asked a question you just discuss the philosophy of the question instead of answering the bloody question."
Gabriel: "Well yeah, you see..."
Yahtzee: "No. When you are asked a Yes or No question the first word out of your mouth needs to be Yes or No. Only after that have you earned the right to elaborate."

Last edited by JoeMorgue; 11th January 2021 at 07:39 AM.
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:33 AM   #889
timhau
NWO Litter Technician
 
timhau's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Looks like Finland. Smells like Finland. Quacks like Finland. Where the hell am I?
Posts: 14,513
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Well at least one GOP Senator would have to show up. A quorum of 51 Senators is required to conduct business.
Having seen Mitt Romney's speech from Wednesday night, I'm pretty sure he will be there.

Too bad he ran in 2012, not 2016.
__________________
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realised that the Lord, in his wisdom, doesn't work that way. I just stole one and asked Him to forgive me.
- Emo Philips
timhau is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:37 AM   #890
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
 
thaiboxerken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 31,717
They invaded the Capitol wanting to kill Pelosi, Pence and others in order to install Trump as the "rightful" POTUS....


But we can't call it a coup?
__________________
1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.
thaiboxerken is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:40 AM   #891
Meadmaker
Penultimate Amazing
 
Meadmaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 25,543
Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
Is martial law even a thing under the Constitution?
There's a halfway decent wikipedia article on that. Basically, there is the possibility of suspension of habeas corpus, which basically means the government can lock people up without giving a reason, which is basically martial law.

For more info, try wikipedia. I think the term I looked up was "martial law in the US".
__________________
Yes, yes. I know you are right. But would it hurt you to provide some information?
Meadmaker is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:44 AM   #892
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 31,629
Originally Posted by timhau View Post
Having seen Mitt Romney's speech from Wednesday night, I'm pretty sure he will be there.

Too bad he ran in 2012, not 2016.
Why ?

Let's say that he ran in 2016 and was successful, would there have been any significant difference in policy ?

Would he have tried to dismantle the ACA ?

Would he have implemented a tax cut and exploded the deficit ?

Would he have taken every opportunity to add conservatives to SCOTUS ?

Would he have decreased environmental protections ?

The only possible difference IMO would have been w.r.t. the response to Covid, but there are still enough idiots in charge of states to ensure a massive death toll in any case.
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:47 AM   #893
timhau
NWO Litter Technician
 
timhau's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Looks like Finland. Smells like Finland. Quacks like Finland. Where the hell am I?
Posts: 14,513
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Why ?
Because he isn't a ing fascist.
__________________
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realised that the Lord, in his wisdom, doesn't work that way. I just stole one and asked Him to forgive me.
- Emo Philips
timhau is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:50 AM   #894
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 31,629
Originally Posted by timhau View Post
Because he isn't a ing fascist.
True, but if it doesn't make an appreciable difference to the policies then why is it better.

Indeed, if he's more likely to get said policies enacted because he's a far more competent politician and legislator and if he's far more likely to get re-elected then a Romney victory in 2016 could have been even worse for the US.
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:50 AM   #895
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 31,579
"LOL but any Republican would have been just as bad...." is how we got Trump in the first place.
__________________
Yahtzee: "You're doing that thing again where when asked a question you just discuss the philosophy of the question instead of answering the bloody question."
Gabriel: "Well yeah, you see..."
Yahtzee: "No. When you are asked a Yes or No question the first word out of your mouth needs to be Yes or No. Only after that have you earned the right to elaborate."
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:56 AM   #896
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 31,629
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
"LOL but any Republican would have been just as bad...." is how we got Trump in the first place.
How so ?

For all the sound and fury, President Trump has been a comparative failure as President. He hasn't really managed to get much of his legislative agenda passed, relying instead on relatively impotent Executive Orders, and he's managed to fail to get re-elected and has lost the House and Senate along the way.

A seasoned political operator like Romney would likely have achieved far more and would have had 8 years to do it in. The underclass who voted for President Trump would still have been there and still have voted GOP but would be responding to quieter dog whistles.
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:57 AM   #897
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 31,579
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
How so ?
BECAUSE IF MITT ROMNEY HAD WON IN 2016 AND LOST IN 2020 A MOB OF MORMONS WOULDN'T HAVE STAGED A COUP.
__________________
Yahtzee: "You're doing that thing again where when asked a question you just discuss the philosophy of the question instead of answering the bloody question."
Gabriel: "Well yeah, you see..."
Yahtzee: "No. When you are asked a Yes or No question the first word out of your mouth needs to be Yes or No. Only after that have you earned the right to elaborate."
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:57 AM   #898
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
 
thaiboxerken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 31,717
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
"LOL but any Republican would have been just as bad...." is how we got Trump in the first place.
Maybe, but I believe a significant portion of Republicans who ran in 2016 are just as fascist. The entire party is driving towards fascism and has been for decades.
__________________
1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.
thaiboxerken is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 07:59 AM   #899
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Sorth Dakonsin
Posts: 25,064
I find it weirdly prescient that the reflection on the bulletproof glass in front of Trump during his insurgency speech forms a big "X". At first I thought it might have been a Confederate flag, but I knew that couldn't be the case. Apparently it's some scaffolding or something at just the right angle.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg trumpx.jpg (56.9 KB, 12 views)
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:06 AM   #900
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 31,629
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
BECAUSE IF MITT ROMNEY HAD WON IN 2016 AND LOST IN 2020 A MOB OF MORMONS WOULDN'T HAVE STAGED A COUP.
True, they wouldn't have, but then again the wouldn't have needed to try because he would have more than likely been quietly re-elected.

He could then have got back to GOP business as usual:
  • Hamstringing and/or repealing the ACA
  • Implementing unafforable tax cuts for the rich
  • Repealing necessary environmental and worker protections
  • Attacking civil rights
  • Demonising the poor and minorities
  • Removing women's reproductive rights
  • Junking science and experts

IMO the lesson the GOP have learned from President Trump isn't that they shouldn't elect a demagogue and attempt a coup if he's not re-elected but rather that they should choose a more competent demagogue who would obviate the need for a coup (because he is re-elected) or who would make a far better job of carrying out the coup should it be required.
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:18 AM   #901
Dave Rogers
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
 
Dave Rogers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 32,425
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Would he have tried to dismantle the ACA ?
Given that it was essentially his own policy adopted by the Democrats as something they could actually force through, quite possibly not.

Dave
__________________
There is truth and there are lies.

- President Joseph R. Biden, January 20th, 2021
Dave Rogers is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:20 AM   #902
Wudang
BOFH
 
Wudang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: People's Republic of South Yorkshire
Posts: 13,588
Apologies if it's been posted before but over in the Computer section cow_cat posted

http://www.internationalskeptics.com...5#post13356525


Originally Posted by cow_cat View Post
Parler is a sloppily hacked together, joke of a social-media site which has so many security flaws, this just happened.

TL;DR, the entire Parler database, including deleted posts (which weren't actually deleted, just removed from public view), images and their metadata (locations, IP address of uploader etc), account information, and even verified account information has been downloaded and stored in various places online.
__________________
"Your deepest pools, like your deepest politicians and philosophers, often turn out more shallow than expected." Walter Scott.
Wudang is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:25 AM   #903
Lithrael
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,049
In the alternate universe where some other republican won in 2016, someone is posting “can you imagine Trump’s administration responding to COVID? We might have had a quarter million deaths” and someone else is replying “come on, be realistic, nobody would screw it up that badly. TDS”
Lithrael is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:28 AM   #904
gnome
Penultimate Amazing
 
gnome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,278
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
True, but if it doesn't make an appreciable difference to the policies then why is it better.

Indeed, if he's more likely to get said policies enacted because he's a far more competent politician and legislator and if he's far more likely to get re-elected then a Romney victory in 2016 could have been even worse for the US.
Not at all. True, we might have had a Republican more successful at enacting Republican priorities and staying in office, but having an unstable idiot in the white house, and having our whole democracy at risk from agitated mobs, is NOT BETTER.

Quoting Chidi: "That's worse. You do get how that's worse, right?"
__________________

gnome is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:28 AM   #905
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 31,629
Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
Given that it was essentially his own policy adopted by the Democrats as something they could actually force through, quite possibly not.

Dave
Hasn't stopped him from touting an alternative:

Quote:
Sen. Mitt Romney (R-Utah) said Wednesday that he has a new plan to replace ObamaCare.

“It's a replacement for ObamaCare,” Romney told The Hill. “We're ready with that, but we'll see what kind of support we get.”
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...lace-obamacare
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:30 AM   #906
TragicMonkey
Poisoned Waffles
 
TragicMonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Monkey
Posts: 59,750
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Hasn't stopped him from touting an alternative:



https://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...lace-obamacare
Romney did have a plan. A wonderful plan! But he accidentally left the binders full of his plan on top of his car, where the dog ate it.
__________________
You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.
TragicMonkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:41 AM   #907
Jack by the hedge
Safely Ignored
 
Jack by the hedge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,986
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
BECAUSE IF MITT ROMNEY HAD WON IN 2016 AND LOST IN 2020 A MOB OF MORMONS WOULDN'T HAVE STAGED A COUP.
Indeed. A mob of Mormons won't do. It's awfully close, but not quite right.
Jack by the hedge is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 08:45 AM   #908
shemp
a flimsy character...perfidious and despised
 
shemp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: People's Democratic Republic of Planet X
Posts: 40,873
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
BECAUSE IF MITT ROMNEY HAD WON IN 2016 AND LOST IN 2020 A MOB OF MORMONS WOULDN'T HAVE STAGED A COUP.
FTFY
__________________
If being a twat was a TV show, Trump would be the boxed set.
"...just as a magnet attracts iron filings, Trump shemp attracts, and is attracted to, louts." - George Will
"[shemp is] a most notable coward, an infinite and endless liar, an hourly promise breaker, the owner of no one good quality." - Shakespeare
shemp is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:00 AM   #909
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 3,712
Originally Posted by cosmicaug View Post
Well, this is interesting.

https://twitter.com/jsrailton/status/1348115530654347266

These are not lone actors.

Why are they staged there?

Did they come into the Capitol building?

If they did not, did they plan to?

Are they related to the group of 100 LARPers I mentioned above?

P.S. My referring of them as LARPers is not meant to diminish the seriousness of what they represent. At one point what they do can become something else other than pretending. On the 6th, that could have meant dead politicians.
Those look like the feds who went in to extract Babbit after she was shot. They left with her and didn't return.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:07 AM   #910
Fizil
Muse
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 691
Seems the Democrats have decided to wimp out on impeachment. Instead of an impeachment resolution being made today, a resolution asking Pence to invoke the 25th was put forth, and presumably they will be debating it tomorrow.



Utterly toothless, and frankly playing politics instead of doing what needs to be done...


I guess this isn't true, apparently there was a second short session after the morning session where they introduced the impeachment motion. I have no idea why they did it in a separate session, maybe it was a parliamentary procedure thing.

Last edited by Fizil; 11th January 2021 at 10:16 AM.
Fizil is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:07 AM   #911
slyjoe
Master Poster
 
slyjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ
Posts: 2,597
Originally Posted by Fizil View Post
Seems the Democrats have decided to wimp out on impeachment. Instead of an impeachment resolution being made today, a resolution asking Pence to invoke the 25th was put forth, and presumably they will be debating it tomorrow.



Utterly toothless, and frankly playing politics instead of doing what needs to be done...
Also posted in the Second Impeachment thread.
__________________
"You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade
slyjoe is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:18 AM   #912
pgwenthold
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 20,228
Originally Posted by eerok View Post
I think so, too. The insurrectionists would certainly have harmed members of Congress if they'd got their hands on them. It might be difficult for some people to wrap their heads around it, but there it is. It's absolutely abominable and unforgivable.
Dozens of Capitol security police were injured in some way.

Two were killed.

But they were just protestors who got a little zealous?

One of the guys who was climbing the walls of the Capitol claimed he just got caught up in it and went overboard. He was shown wearing climbing gear. Because, you know, doesn't everyone just show up prepared to scale walls.
__________________
"As your friend, I have to be honest with you: I don't care about you or your problems" - Chloe, Secret Life of Pets
pgwenthold is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:19 AM   #913
The Great Zaganza
Maledictorian
 
The Great Zaganza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 14,878
Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
They invaded the Capitol wanting to kill Pelosi, Pence and others in order to install Trump as the "rightful" POTUS....


But we can't call it a coup?
you can, but that might entice the TrumpChumps to invade the Capitol wanting to kill Pelosi, Pence and others in order to install Trump as the "rightful" POTUS.
__________________
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so
The Great Zaganza is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:20 AM   #914
pgwenthold
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 20,228
Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
I really, really want to go on Facebook and call out all my Republican Friends, but so far I've avoided most political posting. Most of their feeds are probably hidden from my view anyway. And I know it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference, anyway.
I know that my Facebook is all pretty good because I have not seen a single post whining about Trump being banned in my feed.

Granted, I have very few friends, and most of it is conversation about running and Boston Terrier pictures @staceyhs
__________________
"As your friend, I have to be honest with you: I don't care about you or your problems" - Chloe, Secret Life of Pets
pgwenthold is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:28 AM   #915
Meadmaker
Penultimate Amazing
 
Meadmaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 25,543
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Why ?

Let's say that he ran in 2016 and was successful, would there have been any significant difference in policy ?

Would he have tried to dismantle the ACA ?

Would he have implemented a tax cut and exploded the deficit ?

Would he have taken every opportunity to add conservatives to SCOTUS ?

Would he have decreased environmental protections ?

The only possible difference IMO would have been w.r.t. the response to Covid, but there are still enough idiots in charge of states to ensure a massive death toll in any case.
I don't hate Trump because of his policies. I hate him because of his character.

Romney wouldn't be carrying on like Trump did in the wake of a failed re-election attempt.
__________________
Yes, yes. I know you are right. But would it hurt you to provide some information?
Meadmaker is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:33 AM   #916
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 31,629
Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I don't hate Trump because of his policies.
You're pro deficit ?

You're pro releasing poisonous chemicals into the environment ?

You're pro the 1% getting richer and richer while the middle classes are slipping backwards ?

You're anti civil rights ?

You're pro voter suppression and disenfranchisement ?

I guess it takes all kinds.


Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
I hate him because of his character.

Romney wouldn't be carrying on like Trump did in the wake of a failed re-election attempt.
You're right, not least because he almost certainly would have been re-elected but he'd have handled defeat more magnanimously knowing that would make it far more likely that the GOP could carry on as usual.
The Don is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:36 AM   #917
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
 
thaiboxerken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 31,717
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
You're pro deficit ?

You're pro releasing poisonous chemicals into the environment ?

You're pro the 1% getting richer and richer while the middle classes are slipping backwards ?

You're anti civil rights ?

You're pro voter suppression and disenfranchisement ?

I guess it takes all kinds.
I'm not sure if Meadmaker is, but the GOP is all of that and more. Republicans aren't against fascism, they are the party of fascism. They just want to be more subtle about it again now that they see the Trump style of fascism fail.
__________________
1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.

Last edited by thaiboxerken; 11th January 2021 at 09:38 AM.
thaiboxerken is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:40 AM   #918
varwoche
Penultimate Amazing
 
varwoche's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Puget Sound
Posts: 15,467
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
You're pro deficit ?

You're pro releasing poisonous chemicals into the environment ?

You're pro the 1% getting richer and richer while the middle classes are slipping backwards ?

You're anti civil rights ?

You're pro voter suppression and disenfranchisement ?

I guess it takes all kinds.
I'm guessing that Meadmaker doesn't agree with these policies, but doesn't think they merit hate. However, he might want to consider the policy of separating kids from their parents and locking them in cages.
__________________
To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot.
varwoche is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:47 AM   #919
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 3,712
Originally Posted by Wudang View Post
Apologies if it's been posted before but over in the Computer section cow_cat posted

http://www.internationalskeptics.com...5#post13356525
If true (and it does explain a few things) that's very good news.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 11th January 2021, 09:51 AM   #920
Meadmaker
Penultimate Amazing
 
Meadmaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 25,543
Originally Posted by The Don View Post
You're pro deficit ?

You're pro releasing poisonous chemicals into the environment ?

You're pro the 1% getting richer and richer while the middle classes are slipping backwards ?

You're anti civil rights ?

You're pro voter suppression and disenfranchisement ?

I guess it takes all kinds.
That's not the point. I voted for Obama. I've never voted for any Republican presidential candidate. (Exception: In 2016, I voted for John Kasich in the primary, specifically so I could cast a vote against Donald Trump.) I disagree with a lot of what Mitt Romney would have done in office, but he's not a bad person.

Trump is a bad person.

And I do think that has been reflected in the way he governs. His incompetence in the pandemic handling is, in my opinion, a direct result of his character deficiencies. A conservative Republican who was not a narcissist would have done much better.
__________________
Yes, yes. I know you are right. But would it hurt you to provide some information?
Meadmaker is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:54 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.