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Old 11th March 2019, 12:52 PM   #1
Drewbot
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Committing a Hate Crime While Transgender and Black

If you could think of an absolutely INVERSE-GENERIC-HATECRIME, I think it would be this one.

Quote:
A woman was arrested after police say she went on a spree of hate attacks using some type of pepper-spray-like liquid on random strangers.

She was identified by police as Thomas J. Heard, a 37-year-old transgender woman from the Bronx.
https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=uiKqS_1552200534
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Old 11th March 2019, 01:04 PM   #2
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C'mon, man. That's not fair. Just post it in the "massive wave" thread.
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Old 11th March 2019, 03:58 PM   #3
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Great example of bad reporting!

Quote:
She was identified by police as Thomas J. Heard, a 37-year-old transgender woman from the Bronx.
Why does the article mention transgender? He attacked men and women, which tells me that gender isn't the issue or reason for it being a hate crime. I guess they wanted to be thorough?

Or did they? They forgot a few important facts.

- They do not mention that all the victims were white.
- They do not mention the suspects race in the entire article.

Why is it a hate crime? How are we supposed to know without these details?

Why deliberately omit the most key details of the incident? Now I have to point it out and get called a racist at ISF, just because the reporter was afraid to tell the whole story.

Watch the top video you can see many of these attacks as they happened. He walks by one woman and kicks her in the leg. I'll call him she in person if he asks, but not here.

Here's a better article:

https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/03...-spray-attack/

Quote:
The man says he tried to approach the suspect but backed off when she pulled a knife. Moments later, they helped lead police to 37-year-old Thomas Herd, who was taken to St. Barnabas Hospital, where she is set to undergo a mental evaluation before facing charges.

Quote:
In total, police say 11 white New Yorkers were all attacked over the weekend. Officers are still trying to confirm that Herd is the person they’re searching for in the Friday crime spree.
Looks like the same person in the videos.
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Old 11th March 2019, 04:27 PM   #4
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Wow. Mentally unstable person does bad ****. Lucky he wasn't white. He could have been in the White House when he did that.
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Old 11th March 2019, 04:52 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Great example of bad reporting!



Why does the article mention transgender? He attacked men and women, which tells me that gender isn't the issue or reason for it being a hate crime. I guess they wanted to be thorough?

Or did they? They forgot a few important facts.

- They do not mention that all the victims were white.
- They do not mention the suspects race in the entire article.

Why is it a hate crime? How are we supposed to know without these details?

Why deliberately omit the most key details of the incident? Now I have to point it out and get called a racist at ISF, just because the reporter was afraid to tell the whole story.

Watch the top video you can see many of these attacks as they happened. He walks by one woman and kicks her in the leg. I'll call him she in person if he asks, but not here.

Here's a better article:

https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/03...-spray-attack/






Looks like the same person in the videos.
Probably to explain why "She" is called "Thomas"

Edit and the Hate crime thing is because she ranted about hating white people before spraying them.
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000

Last edited by cullennz; 11th March 2019 at 04:55 PM.
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:10 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Wow. Mentally unstable person does bad ****. Lucky he wasn't white. He could have been in the White House when he did that.
Are you calling a transgender mentally unstable?
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:23 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Are you calling a transgender mentally unstable?
If the Men's size 12 pumps fit....
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:26 PM   #8
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Wait now, how do we know he is transgender, and not just a cross-dresser?
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Old 11th March 2019, 05:28 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
If the Men's size 12 pumps fit....
That's just a sexy drag queen.
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Old 11th March 2019, 06:21 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Are you calling a transgender mentally unstable?
For being transgender, no. For being unbalanced and stabby and dangerous, yes.
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Old 11th March 2019, 06:28 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
For being transgender, no. For being unbalanced and stabby and dangerous, yes.


Hey, get out of here with all that nuance 'n ******
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Old 11th March 2019, 06:32 PM   #12
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And as I often do with these, threads, I demand, DEMAND, I say! that the police take immediate action against this person.


Quote:
Moments later, they helped lead police to 37-year-old Thomas Herd, who was taken to St. Barnabas Hospital, where she is set to undergo a mental evaluation before facing charges.

Well. Okay then.



Seriously. When will The Usual Suspects figure out that it's not the "Xing while Y" part of these threads that are the problem. It's the completely different reactions of the police prosecutors, and the public at large to these events that's the problem.
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Old 12th March 2019, 01:35 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
Seriously. When will The Usual Suspects figure out that it's not the "Xing while Y" part of these threads that are the problem. It's the completely different reactions of the police prosecutors, and the public at large to these events that's the problem.
I don't think that's the main point of the thread. The title-choice is just extra "pwning the libs". The main point is to have a thread which to point to in order to dismiss any issues with racism, sexism or other form of bigotry they are forced in to a position to defend. They now have this thread and the Justin Smollet thread. That covers most minorities they want to be able to dismiss.
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Old 12th March 2019, 01:45 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I don't think that's the main point of the thread. The title-choice is just extra "pwning the libs". The main point is to have a thread which to point to in order to dismiss any issues with racism, sexism or other form of bigotry they are forced in to a position to defend. They now have this thread and the Justin Smollet thread. That covers most minorities they want to be able to dismiss.
I just assumed it was just to show there are idiots on all sides of every spectrum.
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:09 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I just assumed it was just to show there are idiots on all sides of every spectrum.
That's not necessary to show. That can be justly assumed. The fact that they tend to gravitate to one side and that there's no equivalence isn't the point either.
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:16 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
That's not necessary to show. That can be justly assumed. The fact that they tend to gravitate to one side and that there's no equivalence isn't the point either.
Just my personal point of view, but the equivalence is every where if you actually look.

It is just some of it is more subtle and less idiots in everyones face
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

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Old 12th March 2019, 02:37 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Just my personal point of view, but the equivalence is every where if you actually look.

It is just some of it is more subtle and less idiots in everyones face
If you're blinded by a clinical need to be seen as the "rational center" you mean. Bothsidesism is basically just apologism.
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:45 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
If you're blinded by a clinical need to be seen as the "rational center" you mean. Bothsidesism is basically just apologism.
No it isn't

It is at worst pragmatism

But by all means, keeping wearing that eye patch
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:53 AM   #19
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In fact I can't believe you posted "rational center" is bad on a fricken Skeptics forum
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:54 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
In fact I can't believe you posted "rational center" is bad on a fricken Skeptics forum
Because the center isn't necessarily rational. When one party expresses an extreme position and the other party expresses a normal position, the mid point between the two isn't the 'rational' position.
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Last edited by uke2se; 12th March 2019 at 02:56 AM.
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Old 12th March 2019, 03:01 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Because the center isn't necessarily rational.
Well it obviously depends on the context, does it not?

And in this context so far we have idiots on both sides of the whole left right crap I detest.
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 12th March 2019, 03:11 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Well it obviously depends on the context, does it not?

And in this context so far we have idiots on both sides of the whole left right crap I detest.
Detest it or not, it's a shorthand to describe differing ideologies. It's a fact that the US right wing have moved to more extreme positions. It's also a fact that the US left hasn't until recently. The new progressive wing in the House is moving the Democrats to the left, but they are still well to the right of European Social Democrats.

It's not rational to take a stance in the middle of these two and cast equal blame on both sides, because both sides sure aren't to blame in equal measures. Doing so is interlectual cowardice.
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Old 12th March 2019, 03:49 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Detest it or not, it's a shorthand to describe differing ideologies. It's a fact that the US right wing have moved to more extreme positions. It's also a fact that the US left hasn't until recently. The new progressive wing in the House is moving the Democrats to the left, but they are still well to the right of European Social Democrats.

It's not rational to take a stance in the middle of these two and cast equal blame on both sides, because both sides sure aren't to blame in equal measures. Doing so is interlectual cowardice.
Too be perfectly blunt I don't live in the US. What I see isn't hampered by either sides in-objectivity and from what I have seen it works both ways.

I live in a country where the vast majority tend to be center right/center left, and they actually have the capacity to decide govt, with, while not small, hardly dangerous parties doing the far either way stuff.

It would surprise me immensely if your average American person didn't just want the country to run smoothly and create as least hassles to them as possible, while keeping un-employment low, house prices steady and taxes within affordable levels
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 12th March 2019, 03:59 AM   #24
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Look we all know being black and trans is all the reasons the police need to arrest someone anyway, why bother adding to it?

You can always nail them on a charge of false personation

https://www.nyclu.org/en/press-relea...se-personation
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Old 12th March 2019, 04:00 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
If you could think of an absolutely INVERSE-GENERIC-HATECRIME, I think it would be this one.



https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=uiKqS_1552200534
Attacking random strangers is the exact opposite of a hate attack.
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Old 12th March 2019, 04:00 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Too be perfectly blunt I don't live in the US. What I see isn't hampered by either sides in-objectivity and from what I have seen it works both ways.

I live in a country where the vast majority tend to be center right/center left, and they actually have the capacity to decide govt, with, while not small, hardly dangerous parties doing the far either way stuff.

It would surprise me immensely if your average American person didn't just want the country to run smoothly and create as least hassles to them as possible, while keeping un-employment low, house prices steady and taxes within affordable levels

I don't live in the US either, but the thread we're posting in is about a US phenomena.

I think that there's something going on in US culture that isn't happening to as large a degree in yours and mine. Much of this has to do with US history and, going back as far as the civil war and beyond. In order to discuss this, we really need to attempt to understand the context.
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Old 12th March 2019, 04:03 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I don't live in the US either, but the thread we're posting in is about a US phenomena.

I think that there's something going on in US culture that isn't happening to as large a degree in yours and mine. Much of this has to do with US history and, going back as far as the civil war and beyond. In order to discuss this, we really need to attempt to understand the context.
Fair points

A bit of regional leeway in thinking in order
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 12th March 2019, 07:25 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I don't live in the US either, but the thread we're posting in is about a US phenomena.

I think that there's something going on in US culture that isn't happening to as large a degree in yours and mine. Much of this has to do with US history and, going back as far as the civil war and beyond. In order to discuss this, we really need to attempt to understand the context.
This is the whole ball o' wax in a phrase. Politics, racism, the tribal posturing...it all boils down to this weird Us v Them mentality in the States.

This is what I find fascinating about the LWB threads. It's where this divisive thinking meets the road, and skepticism is tossed aside in favor of the narrative, and far more blatantly than even in Politics. Posters on these hallowed fora will claim 'we should remain impartial and wait for the facts' on one thread, but 'racism happens all the time, so this tale must be racist' on another. I am confident it is not an issue of history, politics, or even race. It's about divisiveness by any means necessary.
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Old 12th March 2019, 07:31 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
If the Men's size 12 pumps fit....
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
That's just a sexy drag queen.
Pumps are more of a business casual drag queen. Unless you find that hot. Not judging.
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Old 12th March 2019, 10:47 AM   #30
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I think the takeaway from a crime like this, and the Jussie Smollett incident, is that there were 7000 hate crimes reported in the US in 2017 or 2018, I can't remember which, and you see the news stories, and the articles about hate crimes, and realize that they only seem to mention the ones where whites are committing the crimes.

I wonder if they have broken down the stats.

It was just assumed , by me anyway, that if it was a hate crime, the minority was always the victim.
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Old 12th March 2019, 01:15 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I don't think that's the main point of the thread. The title-choice is just extra "pwning the libs". The main point is to have a thread which to point to in order to dismiss any issues with racism, sexism or other form of bigotry they are forced in to a position to defend. They now have this thread and the Justin Smollet thread. That covers most minorities they want to be able to dismiss.
Counter point from someone in the center who finds both sets of people stupid.

Both sides have became more concerned with being the perfect liberal or the perfect conservative that they have given up any debate, and have settled for petty fighting.

Neither of these sides have goals any loftier than " piss off the other guy" , these threads are not meant to inform, or to sway, but simply to rile up the other side and feel good doing it.

If you want to wallow in the mud, by all means do so, but don't pretend is anything more than that. And especially don't point at the guy next to you and claim he is dirty.
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:01 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Probably to explain why "She" is called "Thomas"

Edit and the Hate crime thing is because she ranted about hating white people before spraying them.
It wasn't in the article. All we knew from that is that a transgender person attacked people in the street and it's a hate crime.

Another article I read used "they" and "the suspect" in their version, not she or he. But it did mention why it was a hate crime and that it was racial and not about gender.

I just find it curious to deliberately omit the most important details of a story.
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:08 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
It wasn't in the article. All we knew from that is that a transgender person attacked people in the street and it's a hate crime.

Another article I read used "they" and "the suspect" in their version, not she or he. But it did mention why it was a hate crime and that it was racial and not about gender.

I just find it curious to deliberately omit the most important details of a story.

It was another article on it I read

Quote:
The first Bronx attack took place on Friday at 2 p.m. A 55-year-old white man was walking with his wife along a busy commercial section of East 187th Street, when Ms. Heard stopped them, used an obscenity to announce her hatred for Caucasians and then sprayed the man in the face with pepper spray, the police said.

On Saturday, the police said, Ms. Heard accosted a man and a woman at 4:30 p.m. as they walked together near the corner of Crotona Avenue and East 187th Street. She asked the woman if she was white, then sprayed her in the face with pepper spray, the police said. She also brandished a “sharp object” as a weapon, the police said.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/11/n...ay-attack.html
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:10 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
It wasn't in the article. All we knew from that is that a transgender person attacked people in the street and it's a hate crime.

Another article I read used "they" and "the suspect" in their version, not she or he. But it did mention why it was a hate crime and that it was racial and not about gender.

I just find it curious to deliberately omit the most important details of a story.
Sorry

Re-read your post. Missed the bit where you saw it in another article

We get inundated with the race and gender of victims every 2 minutes, for some weird reason

Maybe they just thought they would add the offender in as well
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Old 12th March 2019, 02:42 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by New York Times
Ms. Heard stopped them, used an obscenity to announce her hatred for Caucasians and then sprayed the man in the face with pepper spray, the police said.
I wonder what that obscenity would be. There really isn't an obscene word used specifically for white people (that I know of). We know that the "N" word is regarded as obscene. The "N" word is even censored here at ISF.

But words like honky, cracker, peckerwood, or whatever else used as derogatory towards white people just do not seem to be obscene.
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Old 12th March 2019, 03:22 PM   #36
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Wigger.
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Old 12th March 2019, 03:48 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
I wonder what that obscenity would be. There really isn't an obscene word used specifically for white people (that I know of). We know that the "N" word is regarded as obscene. The "N" word is even censored here at ISF.

But words like honky, cracker, peckerwood, or whatever else used as derogatory towards white people just do not seem to be obscene.

Obscenity to announce their hatred might mean swearing

"You ******** Honky. **** you honkys are all a ******* *****. I hate you ******** honkys"
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Old 12th March 2019, 04:50 PM   #38
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I don't know if anybody says honky anymore. I don't know if a white person would be offended if they heard it.

Wigger might backfire if it was used by a black person. And it's just not going to be offensive. It basically is used to describe a white person who tries to be like a black person.
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Old 12th March 2019, 10:32 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Archie Gemmill Goal View Post
Attacking random strangers is the exact opposite of a hate attack.
Actually not attacking anybody would be the opposite.

But it seems in this case the "random strangers" were not selected entirely randomly.
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Old 12th March 2019, 11:38 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Obscenity to announce their hatred might mean swearing



"You ******** Honky. **** you honkys are all a ******* *****. I hate you ******** honkys"
I always thought Honkey was slang for someone from Hong Kong. How the hell is that an insult for a person with genetically pinky/beige/ lightly tanned skin?
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