Argentina’s Son-of-Sam Presidential Election

Solitaire · 20th October 2023, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Argentina’s Son-of-Sam Presidential Election

Javier Milei was on his best behavior. Speaking before the Council
of the Americas at the opulent Alvear Palace Hotel in August, the
far-right congressman and sudden favorite in the Argentine presidential
election scheduled for October 22 laid out his vision for a society rooted
in private property, the invisible hand of the market, and an amorphous
notion of libertad (freedom), the latter of which he used almost
interchangeably with the former.

By his accounting, the government (or “ungovernment,” as he called it)
had robbed the people of $25 billion, while saddling future generations
of Argentines with taxes in the form of debt. Attendees at the conference,
whose sponsors included such multinationals as Amazon Web Services,
Bayer, and Chevron, sat obediently as he argued that social justice was
simply a form of “robbing from one person to give to another.”

The libertarian candidate for the coalition La Libertad Avanza (Freedom
Advances, LLA) invoked the neoclassical economist Milton Friedman,
arguing that it was the moral responsibility of business owners to earn
as much as they could. He also said that his country would become
a world power in the next 35 to 50 years by embracing the principles
of “freedom”—a statement he would reiterate weeks later when he
told The Economist that it was his aim to make Argentina “great again.”

I use to argue that "People didn't get the government they deserve,
but instead, get something worse." But what caught my eye about
this was a libertarian calling for the use of another governments
fiat currency. Nothing predicted about the future – intelligent robots,
flying cars, or space colonies — contained the idea of a pro-government
libertarian. Such a thing seems impossible, but here we are.

dudalb · 20th October 2023, 02:22 PM

"Don't Cry For Me, Argentina"...

PitPat · 20th October 2023, 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by Solitaire

I use to argue that "People didn't get the government they deserve,
but instead, get something worse." But what caught my eye about
this was a libertarian calling for the use of another governments
fiat currency. Nothing predicted about the future – intelligent robots,
flying cars, or space colonies — contained the idea of a pro-government
libertarian. Such a thing seems impossible, but here we are.

Wow, that whole article is worth a read and very well sourced and researched - thanks for sharing that.

Kind of sounds like another country I know where it's very polarized based on age, sex, race, income, education, etc. As if we need another unstable country in the world.

The Atheist · 20th October 2023, 11:07 PM

Argentina is and has been a basket case for decades. This is just the latest in a long list of idiotic or corrupt leaders they've had.

Nice place apart from the politics, so I hear.

Trebuchet · 21st October 2023, 09:03 AM

I visited there for work several decades ago when Menem was president. Is he still around?

dudalb · 21st October 2023, 02:47 PM

No doubt the current Argetnine goverment has messed up big time; but Milei is bad news. Demogogues always are.

SpitfireIX · 21st October 2023, 07:54 PM

Maybe he'll decide that invading ~~las Malvinas~~ the Falklands is a good way to distract the population from all their economic problems.

Lukraak_Sisser · 22nd October 2023, 01:54 AM

Well, someone that dedicated to freedom is of course going to be a major help to civil rights.
The freedom to marry whoever you want, the freedom to unionize, the freedom to have an abortion etc etc.
All things I'm sure such a freedom loving person will introduce at once.

Frank Newgent · 22nd October 2023, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by SpitfireIX

Maybe he'll decide that invading ~~las Malvinas~~ the Falklands is a good way to distract the population from all their economic problems.

Rural bus stop memorial in northwest Argentina to a local kid who died in on the Argentine warship General Belgrano, sunk by the British.

Frank Newgent · 23rd October 2023, 06:03 AM

What will happen to the opposition leader's votes? Will her supporters back the "chainsaw plan" of libertarian lawmaker Javier Milei? Or will they cast blank ballots? Will Serio Massa be able to win them over with his pitch for a “great national agreement"?

https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...-run-off.phtml

dudalb · 23rd October 2023, 02:16 PM

Originally Posted by Frank Newgent

What will happen to the opposition leader's votes? Will her supporters back the "chainsaw plan" of libertarian lawmaker Javier Milei? Or will they cast blank ballots? Will Serio Massa be able to win them over with his pitch for a “great national agreement"?

https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...-run-off.phtml

Just read his chainsaw plan includes his ditching the Peso and adapitng another countrie's curency. Man is incredbkly ignorant for somebody who is an economist.s
Proof that too much Ayn Rand rots the brain.

Brainster · 24th October 2023, 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by dudalb

Just read his chainsaw plan includes his ditching the Peso and adapitng another countrie's curency. Man is incredbkly ignorant for somebody who is an economist.s
Proof that too much Ayn Rand rots the brain.

I don't know why you think dollarizing the economy is a bad idea; it has been done successfully in El Salvador and Ecuador. Given that Argentina is experiencing triple-digit inflation this year, it certainly seems like they need a change. It does mean that monetary policy is out of their control, but that may be a feature, not a bug.

Abooga · 25th October 2023, 12:24 AM

He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents.

An interesting idea that he proposed, he wants to enact "male abortion rights". The right for men to reject the paternity of a child for a limited time after conception. If the woman wants to have the child she can have it on her own. It´s an intriguing idea. Why should women have the right to abort even if the man doesn´t want to, but men have no say one way or the other? I find hard to argue against it in terms of "rights", but I guess it would have very bad societal effects...

Silly Green Monkey · 25th October 2023, 04:55 PM

Question becomes whether the right of the man to have generative sex without consequence trumps the right of the child to have the support of two parents. Same question everywhere the notion comes up.

Brainster · 25th October 2023, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by Abooga

He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents.

An interesting idea that he proposed, he wants to enact "male abortion rights". The right for men to reject the paternity of a child for a limited time after conception. If the woman wants to have the child she can have it on her own. It´s an intriguing idea. Why should women have the right to abort even if the man doesn´t want to, but men have no say one way or the other? I find hard to argue against it in terms of "rights", but I guess it would have very bad societal effects...

Generally called "Choice for Men" or C4M for short. If the woman is wealthy or otherwise able to care for the kid without the help of society, then no problem, but once they go on welfare the state is going to try to claw that money back anywhere they can, and the dad is the obvious target.

Darat · 26th October 2023, 01:14 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents.

An interesting idea that he proposed, he wants to enact "male abortion rights". The right for men to reject the paternity of a child for a limited time after conception. If the woman wants to have the child she can have it on her own. It´s an intriguing idea. Why should women have the right to abort even if the man doesn´t want to, but men have no say one way or the other? I find hard to argue against it in terms of "rights", but I guess it would have very bad societal effects...

It's quite straightforward, the pregnant parent is allowed to unilaterally abort a fetus, that applies to all pregnant people regardless of sex.

Darat · 26th October 2023, 01:22 AM

Originally Posted by Silly Green Monkey

Question becomes whether the right of the man to have generative sex without consequence trumps the right of the child to have the support of two parents. Same question everywhere the notion comes up.

There is, except in cases where the female has no reproductive organs, always a risk of conception when a male and a female have sex, contraceptives are not 100% reliable. It is up to the male if they wish to accept that risk or not and therefore be in the position of eventually becoming the parent of a child. (Of course in the case of rape or sexual assault of the male different pathways open up but I am assuming we are talking about consensual sex.)

Frank Newgent · 26th October 2023, 07:04 AM

First post-election surveys forecast different winners

https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...0-points.phtml

dann · 28th October 2023, 05:41 AM

The dog whisperer sounds as rational as Sidney Powell:

Quote:

Javier Milei’s campaign has collapsed. Last night, Milei – looking really unwell – gave a career-ending interview that mixed megalomania and signs of mental illness. Here, he complains of loud voices distracting him – but the studio is empty. It’s over
David Adler (Twitter/X, Oct 27, 2023)

Other tweets disagree.

Javier Milei and his violent manners to demand silence | Episodes of libertarian anger in interviews and conferences (EsDeLatino, Oct 27, 2023)

Argentina, candidate Milei uncomfortable during the interview: «It’s difficult to talk to all these voices»: but the studio is empty – The video (Italy24, Oct 28, 2023)

Frank Newgent · 12th November 2023, 08:11 PM

Milei posts bizarre list rejecting ‘fake news,’ denies having sex with his sister

The far-right candidate also denied talking to his dead dog, Conan

https://buenosairesherald.com/politi...ith-his-sister

The Atheist · 13th November 2023, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents.

He's going to give it a college try - allowing everyone unfettered access to guns isn't smart. Might make the soccer more entertaining.

Frank Newgent · 15th November 2023, 09:55 PM

anti-Milei political ad with AI generated Clockwork Orange imagery...

https://www.instagram.com/p/CzHFDv9Oy10/

The Atheist · 16th November 2023, 01:56 AM

Classy. I thought some of Milei's photos looked like he was trying to achieve the Alex de Large/Trump mugshot look.

PitPat · 16th November 2023, 02:09 AM

And at the Middle East and Ukraine thing, got it figured out I think.

Biden will ask what's this South America thing about again? Tony?

"No I prefer Antony"

Yeah sorry, Anthony. Got a lot on my mind. So again, what's going on in South America again?

SpitfireIX · 19th November 2023, 06:00 PM

From CNN:

Far-right outsider Javier Milei wins Argentina’s presidency

Javier Milei has won Argentina’s presidential elections in provisional results, wrenching his country to the right with a bombastic anti-establishment campaign that drew comparisons to former US President Donald Trump – all against the backdrop of one of the world’s highest inflation rates.

His rival Sergio Massa conceded the run-off vote on Sunday evening in a brief speech even before official results were announced. “Milei is the president elected for the next 4 years,” said Massa, adding that he had already called Milei to congratulate him.

Provisional results so far show Milei with over 55% of votes (13,781,154) with more than 94% of votes counted, according to data from the country’s National Electoral Chamber, which has not yet declared an official winner.

Norman Alexander · 19th November 2023, 08:24 PM

Test case for Trumpism. Let's see how far down the fascist toilet it goes with Trump el-Lite.

Trausti · 19th November 2023, 09:35 PM

Norman Alexander · 19th November 2023, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by Trausti

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F_V6xZ6X...jpg&name=small

He's going to be the trasher-in-chief, not president.

angrysoba · 19th November 2023, 10:46 PM

Originally Posted by Trausti

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F_V6xZ6X...jpg&name=small

Is that real?

Lukraak_Sisser · 19th November 2023, 11:19 PM

Venezuela : Populist wins, screws up economy
Poland : Populist win, screws up justice system and democracy
Turkey: Populists wins, screws up justice system, democracy and economy
Hungary: Populist win, screws up justice system, democracy
UK: Populist win, screws up economy, healthcare system
US: Populists wins, screws up economy, damages democracy and justice system
Brazil: Populist wins, screws up economy

Argentine: Let's vote in a populist, he'll shake up the system!

(win/wins depending on whether it was a political party or more a single person)

Abooga · 20th November 2023, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser

Venezuela : Populist wins, screws up economy
Poland : Populist win, screws up justice system and democracy
Turkey: Populists wins, screws up justice system, democracy and economy
Hungary: Populist win, screws up justice system, democracy
UK: Populist win, screws up economy, healthcare system
US: Populists wins, screws up economy, damages democracy and justice system
Brazil: Populist wins, screws up economy

Argentine: Let's vote in a populist, he'll shake up the system!

(win/wins depending on whether it was a political party or more a single person)

Those economies etc. were already quite damaged...

Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh!

The Atheist · 20th November 2023, 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh!

In the case of Argentine, you can't entirely blame them. Their economy has been a basket-case for decades and the choice was status quo or a shake-up.

angrysoba · 20th November 2023, 03:11 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

Those economies etc. were already quite damaged...

Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh!

Originally Posted by The Atheist

In the case of Argentine, you can't entirely blame them. Their economy has been a basket-case for decades and the choice was status quo or a shake-up.

No matter how bad things are, they can always get worse.

So apparently he wants to privatize healthcare and education. No doubt a good way to cut spending, but that’s not going to be good for anyone but the rich.

Also, who is a climate change denier in 2023? That seems extremely retrograde.

ETA: I suppose the answer is a Friedman-esque libertarian.

Andy_Ross · 20th November 2023, 03:43 AM

MAGATs are singing the new president's praises.

Andy_Ross · 20th November 2023, 07:13 AM

A video of the President listing the government departments he's going to get rid of.
Sports and Tourism
Culture
Environment and Development
Women and Equality
Public Works
Science, Technology and Innovation
Labour
Employment and Social Security
Education
Transport
Health
Social Development

https://twitter.com/RpsAgainstTrump/...oLODQBqIg&s=19

Gulliver Foyle · 20th November 2023, 07:31 AM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Test case for Trumpism. Let's see how far down the fascist toilet it goes with Trump el-Lite.

Six months before the Argentinian economy is murdered.

Gulliver Foyle · 20th November 2023, 07:33 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

Those economies etc. were already quite damaged...

Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh!

The idiots who vote for them and their far right fellow travellers like yourself.

Lukraak_Sisser · 20th November 2023, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by Abooga

Those economies etc. were already quite damaged...

Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh!

Yes, and in each case the populists who were 'going to fix it all!!!' made things worse while at the same time looting what they could for themselves and their cronies at a level unseen before. You'd think the pattern would be clear.

Norman Alexander · 20th November 2023, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by Andy_Ross

A video of the President listing the government departments he's going to get rid of.
Sports and Tourism
Culture
Environment and Development
Women and Equality
Public Works
Science, Technology and Innovation
Labour
Employment and Social Security
Education
Transport
Health
Social Development

https://twitter.com/RpsAgainstTrump/...oLODQBqIg&s=19

No more support for football or the tango, I guess.

The Great Zaganza · 20th November 2023, 01:13 PM

He is completely deranged.

20th October 2023, 02:06 PM	#1
Solitaire Neoclinus blanchardi Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 2,906	Argentina’s Son-of-Sam Presidential Election Quote: Argentina’s Son-of-Sam Presidential Election Javier Milei was on his best behavior. Speaking before the Council of the Americas at the opulent Alvear Palace Hotel in August, the far-right congressman and sudden favorite in the Argentine presidential election scheduled for October 22 laid out his vision for a society rooted in private property, the invisible hand of the market, and an amorphous notion of libertad (freedom), the latter of which he used almost interchangeably with the former. By his accounting, the government (or “ungovernment,” as he called it) had robbed the people of $25 billion, while saddling future generations of Argentines with taxes in the form of debt. Attendees at the conference, whose sponsors included such multinationals as Amazon Web Services, Bayer, and Chevron, sat obediently as he argued that social justice was simply a form of “robbing from one person to give to another.” The libertarian candidate for the coalition La Libertad Avanza (Freedom Advances, LLA) invoked the neoclassical economist Milton Friedman, arguing that it was the moral responsibility of business owners to earn as much as they could. He also said that his country would become a world power in the next 35 to 50 years by embracing the principles of “freedom”—a statement he would reiterate weeks later when he told The Economist that it was his aim to make Argentina “great again.” I use to argue that "People didn't get the government they deserve, but instead, get something worse." But what caught my eye about this was a libertarian calling for the use of another governments fiat currency. Nothing predicted about the future – intelligent robots, flying cars, or space colonies — contained the idea of a pro-government libertarian. Such a thing seems impossible, but here we are.
	__________________ Schrodinger's cat walks into a bar. And doesn't.

20th October 2023, 11:07 PM	#4
The Atheist The Grammar Tyrant Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 34,492	Argentina is and has been a basket case for decades. This is just the latest in a long list of idiotic or corrupt leaders they've had. Nice place apart from the politics, so I hear.
	__________________ The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.

21st October 2023, 09:03 AM	#5
Trebuchet Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Port Townsend, Washington Posts: 38,281	I visited there for work several decades ago when Menem was president. Is he still around?
	__________________ Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.

21st October 2023, 07:54 PM	#7
SpitfireIX Philosopher Join Date: May 2007 Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana, USA Posts: 6,058	Maybe he'll decide that invading ~~las Malvinas~~ the Falklands is a good way to distract the population from all their economic problems.
	__________________ "My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." --Carl Schurz

22nd October 2023, 05:51 PM	#9
Frank Newgent Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 7,130	Originally Posted by SpitfireIX Maybe he'll decide that invading ~~las Malvinas~~ the Falklands is a good way to distract the population from all their economic problems. Rural bus stop memorial in northwest Argentina to a local kid who died in on the Argentine warship General Belgrano, sunk by the British.
	__________________ Disturbances of the semantic reactions in connection with faulty education and ignorance must be considered as sub-microscopic colloidal lesions - Alfred O. Korzybski Last edited by Agatha; 23rd November 2023 at 06:36 AM. Reason: shrink page-stretching picture

20th October 2023, 02:22 PM	#2
dudalb Suspended Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 60,126	"Don't Cry For Me, Argentina"...

20th October 2023, 10:36 PM	#3
PitPat Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 6,531	Originally Posted by Solitaire I use to argue that "People didn't get the government they deserve, but instead, get something worse." But what caught my eye about this was a libertarian calling for the use of another governments fiat currency. Nothing predicted about the future – intelligent robots, flying cars, or space colonies — contained the idea of a pro-government libertarian. Such a thing seems impossible, but here we are. Wow, that whole article is worth a read and very well sourced and researched - thanks for sharing that. Kind of sounds like another country I know where it's very polarized based on age, sex, race, income, education, etc. As if we need another unstable country in the world.

21st October 2023, 02:47 PM	#6
dudalb Suspended Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 60,126	No doubt the current Argetnine goverment has messed up big time; but Milei is bad news. Demogogues always are.

22nd October 2023, 01:54 AM	#8
Lukraak_Sisser Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 5,195	Well, someone that dedicated to freedom is of course going to be a major help to civil rights. The freedom to marry whoever you want, the freedom to unionize, the freedom to have an abortion etc etc. All things I'm sure such a freedom loving person will introduce at once.

23rd October 2023, 06:03 AM	#10
Frank Newgent Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 7,130	What will happen to the opposition leader's votes? Will her supporters back the "chainsaw plan" of libertarian lawmaker Javier Milei? Or will they cast blank ballots? Will Serio Massa be able to win them over with his pitch for a “great national agreement"? https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...-run-off.phtml
	__________________ Disturbances of the semantic reactions in connection with faulty education and ignorance must be considered as sub-microscopic colloidal lesions - Alfred O. Korzybski

23rd October 2023, 02:16 PM	#11
dudalb Suspended Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 60,126	Originally Posted by Frank Newgent What will happen to the opposition leader's votes? Will her supporters back the "chainsaw plan" of libertarian lawmaker Javier Milei? Or will they cast blank ballots? Will Serio Massa be able to win them over with his pitch for a “great national agreement"? https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...-run-off.phtml Just read his chainsaw plan includes his ditching the Peso and adapitng another countrie's curency. Man is incredbkly ignorant for somebody who is an economist.s Proof that too much Ayn Rand rots the brain.

24th October 2023, 09:27 PM	#12
Brainster Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 20,303	Originally Posted by dudalb Just read his chainsaw plan includes his ditching the Peso and adapitng another countrie's curency. Man is incredbkly ignorant for somebody who is an economist.s Proof that too much Ayn Rand rots the brain. I don't know why you think dollarizing the economy is a bad idea; it has been done successfully in El Salvador and Ecuador. Given that Argentina is experiencing triple-digit inflation this year, it certainly seems like they need a change. It does mean that monetary policy is out of their control, but that may be a feature, not a bug.
	__________________ My new blog: Recent Reads. 1960s Comic Book Nostalgia Visit the Screw Loose Change blog.

25th October 2023, 12:24 AM	#13
Abooga Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,020	He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents. An interesting idea that he proposed, he wants to enact "male abortion rights". The right for men to reject the paternity of a child for a limited time after conception. If the woman wants to have the child she can have it on her own. It´s an intriguing idea. Why should women have the right to abort even if the man doesn´t want to, but men have no say one way or the other? I find hard to argue against it in terms of "rights", but I guess it would have very bad societal effects...
Abooga Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,020

25th October 2023, 04:55 PM	#14
Silly Green Monkey Cowardly Lurking in the Shadows of Greatness Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Arizona Posts: 5,654	Question becomes whether the right of the man to have generative sex without consequence trumps the right of the child to have the support of two parents. Same question everywhere the notion comes up.
	__________________ Normal is just a stereotype.

25th October 2023, 05:34 PM	#15
Brainster Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 20,303	Originally Posted by Abooga He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents. An interesting idea that he proposed, he wants to enact "male abortion rights". The right for men to reject the paternity of a child for a limited time after conception. If the woman wants to have the child she can have it on her own. It´s an intriguing idea. Why should women have the right to abort even if the man doesn´t want to, but men have no say one way or the other? I find hard to argue against it in terms of "rights", but I guess it would have very bad societal effects... Generally called "Choice for Men" or C4M for short. If the woman is wealthy or otherwise able to care for the kid without the help of society, then no problem, but once they go on welfare the state is going to try to claw that money back anywhere they can, and the dad is the obvious target.
	__________________ My new blog: Recent Reads. 1960s Comic Book Nostalgia Visit the Screw Loose Change blog.

26th October 2023, 01:14 AM	#16
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 112,595	Originally Posted by Abooga He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents. An interesting idea that he proposed, he wants to enact "male abortion rights". The right for men to reject the paternity of a child for a limited time after conception. If the woman wants to have the child she can have it on her own. It´s an intriguing idea. Why should women have the right to abort even if the man doesn´t want to, but men have no say one way or the other? I find hard to argue against it in terms of "rights", but I guess it would have very bad societal effects... It's quite straightforward, the pregnant parent is allowed to unilaterally abort a fetus, that applies to all pregnant people regardless of sex.
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

26th October 2023, 01:22 AM	#17
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 112,595	Originally Posted by Silly Green Monkey Question becomes whether the right of the man to have generative sex without consequence trumps the right of the child to have the support of two parents. Same question everywhere the notion comes up. There is, except in cases where the female has no reproductive organs, always a risk of conception when a male and a female have sex, contraceptives are not 100% reliable. It is up to the male if they wish to accept that risk or not and therefore be in the position of eventually becoming the parent of a child. (Of course in the case of rape or sexual assault of the male different pathways open up but I am assuming we are talking about consensual sex.)
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

26th October 2023, 07:04 AM	#18
Frank Newgent Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 7,130	First post-election surveys forecast different winners https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...0-points.phtml
	__________________ Disturbances of the semantic reactions in connection with faulty education and ignorance must be considered as sub-microscopic colloidal lesions - Alfred O. Korzybski

28th October 2023, 05:41 AM	#19
dann Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 19,223	The dog whisperer sounds as rational as Sidney Powell: Quote: Javier Milei’s campaign has collapsed. Last night, Milei – looking really unwell – gave a career-ending interview that mixed megalomania and signs of mental illness. Here, he complains of loud voices distracting him – but the studio is empty. It’s over David Adler (Twitter/X, Oct 27, 2023) Other tweets disagree. Javier Milei and his violent manners to demand silence \| Episodes of libertarian anger in interviews and conferences (EsDeLatino, Oct 27, 2023) Argentina, candidate Milei uncomfortable during the interview: «It’s difficult to talk to all these voices»: but the studio is empty – The video (Italy24, Oct 28, 2023)
	__________________ /dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

12th November 2023, 08:11 PM	#20
Frank Newgent Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 7,130	Milei posts bizarre list rejecting ‘fake news,’ denies having sex with his sister The far-right candidate also denied talking to his dead dog, Conan https://buenosairesherald.com/politi...ith-his-sister
	__________________ Disturbances of the semantic reactions in connection with faulty education and ignorance must be considered as sub-microscopic colloidal lesions - Alfred O. Korzybski

13th November 2023, 09:43 AM	#21
The Atheist The Grammar Tyrant Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 34,492	Originally Posted by Abooga He will have a hard time to do worse than previous presidents. He's going to give it a college try - allowing everyone unfettered access to guns isn't smart. Might make the soccer more entertaining.
	__________________ The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.

15th November 2023, 09:55 PM	#22
Frank Newgent Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 7,130	anti-Milei political ad with AI generated Clockwork Orange imagery... https://www.instagram.com/p/CzHFDv9Oy10/
	__________________ Disturbances of the semantic reactions in connection with faulty education and ignorance must be considered as sub-microscopic colloidal lesions - Alfred O. Korzybski

16th November 2023, 01:56 AM	#23
The Atheist The Grammar Tyrant Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 34,492	Classy. I thought some of Milei's photos looked like he was trying to achieve the Alex de Large/Trump mugshot look.
	__________________ The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.

16th November 2023, 02:09 AM	#24
PitPat Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 6,531	And at the Middle East and Ukraine thing, got it figured out I think. Biden will ask what's this South America thing about again? Tony? "No I prefer Antony" Yeah sorry, Anthony. Got a lot on my mind. So again, what's going on in South America again?

19th November 2023, 06:00 PM	#25
SpitfireIX Philosopher Join Date: May 2007 Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana, USA Posts: 6,058	From CNN: Far-right outsider Javier Milei wins Argentina’s presidency Javier Milei has won Argentina’s presidential elections in provisional results, wrenching his country to the right with a bombastic anti-establishment campaign that drew comparisons to former US President Donald Trump – all against the backdrop of one of the world’s highest inflation rates. His rival Sergio Massa conceded the run-off vote on Sunday evening in a brief speech even before official results were announced. “Milei is the president elected for the next 4 years,” said Massa, adding that he had already called Milei to congratulate him. Provisional results so far show Milei with over 55% of votes (13,781,154) with more than 94% of votes counted, according to data from the country’s National Electoral Chamber, which has not yet declared an official winner.
	__________________ "My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." --Carl Schurz

19th November 2023, 08:24 PM	#26
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 16,174	Test case for Trumpism. Let's see how far down the fascist toilet it goes with Trump el-Lite.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

19th November 2023, 09:35 PM	#27
Trausti Critical Thinker Join Date: Apr 2023 Posts: 458
Trausti Critical Thinker Join Date: Apr 2023 Posts: 458

19th November 2023, 09:46 PM	#28
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 16,174	Originally Posted by Trausti https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F_V6xZ6X...jpg&name=small He's going to be the trasher-in-chief, not president.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

19th November 2023, 10:46 PM	#29
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 35,278	Originally Posted by Trausti https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F_V6xZ6X...jpg&name=small Is that real?
	__________________ Слава Україні! **** Putin!

19th November 2023, 11:19 PM	#30
Lukraak_Sisser Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 5,195	Venezuela : Populist wins, screws up economy Poland : Populist win, screws up justice system and democracy Turkey: Populists wins, screws up justice system, democracy and economy Hungary: Populist win, screws up justice system, democracy UK: Populist win, screws up economy, healthcare system US: Populists wins, screws up economy, damages democracy and justice system Brazil: Populist wins, screws up economy Argentine: Let's vote in a populist, he'll shake up the system! (win/wins depending on whether it was a political party or more a single person)

20th November 2023, 12:54 AM	#31
Abooga Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,020	Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser Venezuela : Populist wins, screws up economy Poland : Populist win, screws up justice system and democracy Turkey: Populists wins, screws up justice system, democracy and economy Hungary: Populist win, screws up justice system, democracy UK: Populist win, screws up economy, healthcare system US: Populists wins, screws up economy, damages democracy and justice system Brazil: Populist wins, screws up economy Argentine: Let's vote in a populist, he'll shake up the system! (win/wins depending on whether it was a political party or more a single person) Those economies etc. were already quite damaged... Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh!
Abooga Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,020

20th November 2023, 02:15 AM	#32
The Atheist The Grammar Tyrant Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 34,492	Originally Posted by Abooga Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh! In the case of Argentine, you can't entirely blame them. Their economy has been a basket-case for decades and the choice was status quo or a shake-up.
	__________________ The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.

20th November 2023, 03:11 AM	#33
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 35,278	Originally Posted by Abooga Those economies etc. were already quite damaged... Whose fault is it that people like Milei and Trump get elected? Their predecessors´. Politicians who want to maintain a corrupt and ineffective status quo that is already damaging the economuy, democracy etc., people suffering those effects will elect whoever promises to shake up things. D´uh! Originally Posted by The Atheist In the case of Argentine, you can't entirely blame them. Their economy has been a basket-case for decades and the choice was status quo or a shake-up. No matter how bad things are, they can always get worse. So apparently he wants to privatize healthcare and education. No doubt a good way to cut spending, but that’s not going to be good for anyone but the rich. Also, who is a climate change denier in 2023? That seems extremely retrograde. ETA: I suppose the answer is a Friedman-esque libertarian.
	__________________ Слава Україні! **** Putin! Last edited by angrysoba; 20th November 2023 at 03:12 AM.

20th November 2023, 03:43 AM	#34
Andy_Ross Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 46,390	MAGATs are singing the new president's praises.
	__________________ Formerly known as Captain Swoop

20th November 2023, 07:13 AM	#35
Andy_Ross Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 46,390	A video of the President listing the government departments he's going to get rid of. Sports and Tourism Culture Environment and Development Women and Equality Public Works Science, Technology and Innovation Labour Employment and Social Security Education Transport Health Social Development https://twitter.com/RpsAgainstTrump/...oLODQBqIg&s=19
	__________________ Formerly known as Captain Swoop Last edited by Andy_Ross; 20th November 2023 at 07:15 AM.