Continuation General Israel/Palestine discussion thread - Part 4

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

How ya gonna get millions of Palestinians from the West Bank into Gaza?

Cattle cars? Death march through the desert?

Like this... and/or like this...

From here

Quote:

Some recognized genocides, such as the Holocaust and the genocide of the Tutsis in Rwanda, took place over specific periods of time and were characterized by mass killings. But colonial genocide is a slow-moving process. The policies of colonial destruction of Indigenous peoples took place insidiously and over decades. The acts of violence and intent to destroy are structural, systemic and cut across multiple administrations and political leaders.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

How ya gonna get millions of Palestinians from the West Bank into Gaza?

Cattle cars? Death march through the desert?

Motor coaches. VanHools and Volvos.
The encouragement to go to the NewState and be afforded a rather generous supply of
Money. Opportunity. Housing.
How does ANY State come into being?
How did Israel come into existence? Money. Opportunity. Housing.
(800,000 Jews from all over the Arab world got kicked out of those Muslim countries in the early 1950's and arrived here with little more than the clothes on their backs)

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by webfusion

Motor coaches. VanHools and Volvos.
The encouragement to go to the NewState and be afforded a rather generous supply of
Money. Opportunity. Housing.
How does ANY State come into being?
How did Israel come into existence? Money. Opportunity. Housing.
(800,000 Jews from all over the Arab world got kicked out of those Muslim countries in the early 1950's and arrived here with little more than the clothes on their backs)

The Palestinians in the West Bank already have homes. The only way you can get them to move to Gaza is by force. At the barrel of a gun, threat of death. You gonna do that?

[webfusion]

https://www.politico.eu/article/isra...g-itself-apart

The Left is in paroxysms of pain.
Their world is coming apart.
HAMAS has basically screwed them all, from France to Spain to Italy to Canada.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

The Palestinians in the West Bank already have homes. The only way you can get them to move to Gaza is by force. At the barrel of a gun, threat of death. You gonna do that?

You are being very racist, by assuming that Palestinians ANYWHERE (Paris, London, Toronto, Detroit, Ramallah, Jenin, etc) are incapable of packing their stuff and taking advantage of an international support effort to build a NewState.

Let's just say, I'm a Palestinian who manages to earn $4,000 annually for my entire family.
My home is a tin shack.
I'm handed keys to a beautiful home, I'm provided work in the hotels/resorts, and I can earn $40,000 a year and my kids get to attend Gaza University on a full scholarship. I'll be able to travel freely without having to ever talk to or see an Israeli Jew checking my credentials, with two paid vacations annually, at first from elArish airfield, and then, from Yassir Arafat International. If I want to visit the Islamic Holy Sites, I'll be up into Hebron and al-Quds on a high-speed maglev link (20 minutes). Or, if I prefer, the Saudis will issue me a Pilgrimage Voucher that entails an all-expenses covered Haj journey.

THAT's what awaits millions of Palestinians, if they're interested.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by webfusion

You are being very racist, by assuming that Palestinians ANYWHERE (Paris, London, Toronto, Detroit, Ramallah, Jenin, etc) are incapable of packing their stuff and taking advantage of an international support effort to build a NewState....

Says the guy who is calling for millions of Muslims to be ethnically cleansed to a tiny little desert prison, so as to create Lebensraum for Der Judenstaat.

The only way you will get millions of Muslims to abandon their homes and their lands in the West Bank, is by threat of death. The world will not allow this to occur.

I guess the USA and Canada can handle 6 million Jewish refugees but it wont be pretty.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Says the guy who is calling for millions of Muslims to be ethnically cleansed to a tiny little desert prison, so as to create Lebensraum for Der Judenstaat.

The only way you will get millions of Muslims to abandon their homes and their lands in the West Bank, is by threat of death. The world will not allow this to occur.

I guess the USA and Canada can handle 6 million Jewish refugees but it wont be pretty.

The land area of the West Bank is 2,173 sq. miles. It's rugged terrain, and landlocked.
Israel is 8,550 sq.miles. (including a vast uninhabited desert of the Arava and Negev).
Did you ever consider that we Jews consider this a 'little desert prison" (no way out from North, East, South and the sea to our backs). Right now, we're being beseiged as airlines refuse to fly here. Ships are cancelling (Royal Caribbean announces they're not booking trips here for 2024). ElAl is converting aircraft to cargo configuration, to assist in supplying the nation, as primary cargo airlines have abandoned this route.

When I tell you that Gaza has not yet seen the worst of our counter-attack, that's the truth.
Don't get too far ahead of yourself talking about how the WestBank Palestinians will fare.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by webfusion

The land area of the West Bank is 2,173 sq. miles. It's rugged terrain, and landlocked.
Israel is 8,550 sq.miles. (including a vast uninhabited desert of the Arava and Negev).
Did you ever consider that we Jews consider this a 'little desert prison" (no way out from North, East, South and the sea to our backs). Right now, we're being beseiged as airlines refuse to fly here. Ships are cancelling (Royal Caribbean announces they're not booking trips here for 2024). ElAl is converting aircraft to cargo configuration, to assist in supplying the nation, as primary cargo airlines have abandoned this route.

When I tell you that Gaza has not yet seen the worst of our counter-attack, that's the truth.
Don't get too far ahead of yourself talking about how the WestBank Palestinians will fare.

You didn't answer my question. How you gonna get the Arabs out of the West Bank if they refuse to leave? Via cattle car? Death march through the desert?

Best be careful, those nukes on the American sub could target Tehran, Damascus, Beirut..... or Tel Aviv.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

You didn't answer my question. How you gonna get the Arabs out of the West Bank if they refuse to leave? Via cattle car? Death march through the desert?

By using that false epithet.

Calling the Palestinians Arabs because they speak Arabic is like calling the Mexican natives Hispanics because they speak Spanish.

And then the Xenophobic supremacist Settler Colonialists use fallacies and propaganda such as "Land Without a people for a people without a land" and "Squatters" and then turn around and say "they are arabs and there are many arab states why don't they just go there to where they came from and leave us poor oppressed homeless Settler Colonialists with that little piece of land that does not belong to them... but was promised by the god 65% of us do not believe in to a guy 100% of sane people know was a myth".

Insisting on falsely labeling the Palestinians, "Arabs" is like insisting on calling the Australian Aborigine, or the Inuits... British.

Arabs... just like the mythical Hebrews of the Bible were conquerors and pillages of Palestine and just like the Egyptians and Assyrians and Babylonians and Persians and Greeks and Romans and Franks and British... and the most recent Europeans from Germany and Poland and Russia... and INDIA and Africa and USA and England etc. etc.

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Best be careful, those nukes on the American sub could target Tehran, Damascus, Beirut..... or Tel Aviv.

Oops... sorry it was a technical error... and life goes on.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

You didn't answer my question. How you gonna get the Arabs out of the West Bank if they refuse to leave? Via cattle car? Death march through the desert?

I did answer, plainly.

Palestinians want a better life. They are no different than anyone who realizes the advantages of moving to somewhere other than where they are.
I provided a list of advantages, and TheWorld™ would certainly offer the financial means and the impetus for it all to come about.

Dude, it's just a distance of 37 miles from Gaza to Hebron. They can take an Uber (in Israel it's GETT).

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by webfusion

I did answer, plainly.

Palestinians want a better life. They are no different than anyone who realizes the advantages of moving to somewhere other than where they are.
I provided a list of advantages, and TheWorld™ would certainly offer the financial means and the impetus for it all to come about.

Dude, it's just a distance of 37 miles from Gaza to Hebron. They can take an Uber (in Israel it's GETT).

Why don't the Israelis do the same?

Why not let the Palestinians go to Canada or America or England... why a desert in Egypt?

REVERSE EXODUS!!!

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Leumas

Why don't the Israelis do the same?

Why not let the Palestinians go to Canada or America or England... why a desert in Egypt?

REVERSE EXODUS!!!

Palestinians already go to Canada, America, England, France, Spain, Germany, wherever...

But, as you should know, N.Sinai was part of 'Historical Palestine' and in 1982, half of the area of "Palestinian Lands" in the town of Rafah was truncated and cut-off by the Egyptians building a fence. Families were divided, the free passage of Palestinians was restricted, access to elArish was denied.
https://www.smh.com.au/world/middle-...11-p59nic.html

How is it possible that people cannot even recall what happened in 1982?

[Cosmic Yak]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

The suggestion was dismissed by most of Israel’s interlocutors — who include the United States and Britain — because of the risk that such a mass displacement could become permanent. These countries fear that such a development might destabilize Egypt and lock significant numbers of Palestinians out of their homeland, according to the diplomats, who spoke anonymously in order to discuss a sensitive matter more freely.

Curious, then, that one of the biggest stumbling blocks to any peace deal has been the so-called 'right of return' of Palestinian 'refugees'.
First- to explain the quote marks. For centuries, 'Palestinian' meant anyone living in Palestine: the current usage denoting a distinct and separate nation is essentially a fiction. The vast majority of them were itinerant, migratory labourers, following seasonal work around the region. Many of them- as has been noted here before- were not originally from Palestine, and a fair number of them were not even Arabs. Some of them arrived as recently as 1946.
Fast-forward to the present day. There are now millions of self-identifying Palestinians in the Middle East. Most of them were not born in either the West Bank or Gaza, and most have never visited Palestine.
The 'right of return' to homes they may well have only occupied fleetingly, and on a temporary basis, which a good number left of their own volition (there is massive argument among historians to this day about how many were forced off and how many left of their own free will), and to which most Palestinians today have very little connection is not the absolute, written-in-stone moral imperative that many seem to believe it to be.
Now, if they were somehow allowed to enter Israel, that would massively destabilise that country. To allow some 5 million immigrants into a nation of 9 million, and moreover, immigrants that do not share any of the cultural or religious values of Israel, and who in all likelihood hate Israel and hate the Jews, would destroy Israel as we know it.
I suspect this is the real reason for the dogged insistence on the 'right if return': it's more about how this would destroy Israel from the inside out, rather than a genuine desire to see families return to claimed ancestral roots that are highly tenuous. This is merely my opinion, though.
Please note that I am not in any way denying that Arabs were forced off their land. The creation of Israel was a calamity for many Palestinian Arabs. However, demanding an action that realistically could not be achieved, is not helpful.
For some to oppose temporarily settling Palestinians in Egypt, on the grounds that it would destabilise that country, whilst simultaneously insisting on the permanent destabilisation of Israel though an almost identical action, appears to me to be hypocritical and misguided.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

By using that false epithet.

Calling the Palestinians Arabs because they speak Arabic is like calling the Mexican natives Hispanics because they speak Spanish.

And then the Xenophobic supremacist Settler Colonialists use fallacies and propaganda such as "Land Without a people for a people without a land" and "Squatters" and then turn around and say "they are arabs and there are many arab states why don't they just go there to where they came from and leave us poor oppressed homeless Settler Colonialists with that little piece of land that does not belong to them... but was promised by the god 65% of us do not believe in to a guy 100% of sane people know was a myth".

Insisting on falsely labeling the Palestinians, "Arabs" is like insisting on calling the Australian Aborigine, or the Inuits... British.

Arabs... just like the mythical Hebrews of the Bible were conquerors and pillages of Palestine and just like the Egyptians and Assyrians and Babylonians and Persians and Greeks and Romans and Franks and British... and the most recent Europeans from Germany and Poland and Russia... and INDIA and Africa and USA and England etc. etc.





Oops... sorry it was a technical error... and life goes on.

The Palestinians aren't Arabs???

LOL, since when?

And how is this an insult?

Weird man, just weird.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

The Palestinians aren't Arabs???

LOL, since when?

And how is this an insult?

Weird man, just weird.

Another example of this

Originally Posted by dudlab

...little knowledge of history.Nothing is more danerous then somebody who has a little knowledge of something but thinks he is an expert.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

By using that false epithet.

Calling the Palestinians Arabs because they speak Arabic is like calling the Mexican natives Hispanics because they speak Spanish.

And then the Xenophobic supremacist Settler Colonialists use fallacies and propaganda such as "Land Without a people for a people without a land" and "Squatters" and then turn around and say "they are arabs and there are many arab states why don't they just go there to where they came from and leave us poor oppressed homeless Settler Colonialists with that little piece of land that does not belong to them... but was promised by the god 65% of us do not believe in to a guy 100% of sane people know was a myth".

Insisting on falsely labeling the Palestinians, "Arabs" is like insisting on calling the Australian Aborigine, or the Inuits... British.

Arabs... just like the mythical Hebrews of the Bible were conquerors and pillages of Palestine and just like the Egyptians and Assyrians and Babylonians and Persians and Greeks and Romans and Franks and British... and the most recent Europeans from Germany and Poland and Russia... and INDIA and Africa and USA and England etc. etc.





Oops... sorry it was a technical error... and life goes on.

Suggesting that it is pejorative or insult to call the Palestinians "Arabs" is one of the most historically flawed arguments I have ever seen on this forum. You should really step back immediately before you dig all the way to China.

Seriously. I don't want to release the kraken but I will if you force me.

[webfusion]

Cosmic Yak, I really appreciated the 'right to return' argument you demolished in post #53 above (Refugees).
Couldn't have said it better myself.

I am counting the days until that feeble fence across the Philadelphi route is smashed down by the crush of civilians gathering in that sector after leaving the north of Gaza, and the "border crossing" at Rafah is breached, with the Palestinians of Sinai and the Palestinians of Gaza reuniting, and maybe, just maybe, taking matters into their own hands, and bypassing Hamas.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Suggesting that it is pejorative or insult to call the Palestinians "Arabs" is one of the most historically flawed arguments I have ever seen on this forum. You should really step back immediately before you dig all the way to China.

Seriously. I don't want to release the kraken but I will if you force me.

I did not say it is a "pejorative or insult" did I?

I suggest you read my post carefully and think about it before you start strawmanning it.

And while you are at it find out the HISTORY that you evidently do not know.

After that if you still need any further explanation of what I said then I can elucidate further.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Leumas

I did not say it is a "pejorative or insult" did I?

I suggest you read my post carefully and think about it before you start strawmanning it.

And while you are at it find out the HISTORY that you evidently do not know.

After that if you still need any further explanation of what I said then I can elucidate further.

Leaumas, I am pretty sure you used the word epithet (which is a synonym of "insult" and "perjorative")

"An epithet is a term of abuse." -- from Oxford Dictionary.

By the way, your posts are becoming increasingly more and more personal, and condescending.
Post your arguments, your links, your ongoing references, your opinions.
Keep elucidating, it's entertaining (and yes, even educational).

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

I did not say it is a "pejorative or insult" did I?

I suggest you read my post carefully and think about it before you start strawmanning it.

And while you are at it find out the HISTORY that you evidently do not know.

After that if you still need any further explanation of what I said then I can elucidate further.

Your claim, is ignorantly absurd.

See the updated 1968 Charter for the Palestine Liberation Organization:

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/plocov.asp

Article 1:
Palestine is the homeland of the Arab Palestinian people; it is an indivisible part of the Arab homeland, and the Palestinian people are an integral part of the Arab nation.

Article 2:
Palestine, with the boundaries it had during the British Mandate, is an indivisible territorial unit.

Article 3:
The Palestinian Arab people possess the legal right to their homeland and have the right to determine their destiny after achieving the liberation of their country in accordance with their wishes and entirely of their own accord and will.

Article 4:
The Palestinian identity is a genuine, essential, and inherent characteristic; it is transmitted from parents to children. The Zionist occupation and the dispersal of the Palestinian Arab people, through the disasters which befell them, do not make them lose their Palestinian identity and their membership in the Palestinian community, nor do they negate them.

Article 5:
The Palestinians are those Arab nationals who, until 1947, normally resided in Palestine regardless of whether they were evicted from it or have stayed there. Anyone born, after that date, of a Palestinian father - whether inside Palestine or outside it - is also a Palestinian.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak

Curious, then, that one of the biggest stumbling blocks to any peace deal has been the so-called 'right of return' of Palestinian 'refugees'.
First- to explain the quote marks. For centuries, 'Palestinian' meant anyone living in Palestine: the current usage denoting a distinct and separate nation is essentially a fiction.

But the right of "return" for Europeans following a particular religion to a land they claim is promised to them 4200 years ago, by a god 65% of Israelis do not believe exists to a MYTHICAL character in a fairy tales... is legitimate?

Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak

...the current usage denoting a distinct and separate nation is essentially a fiction.

But people worshiping a particular god from China and India and Africa and Germany and Poland and Russia and every where around the world... were a nation?

And these people of all the distinct and separate nations from around the world have more "right to return" and displace people from their ancestral lands and farms and cities and houses because Zionist Settler Colonials falsify history and reality and decency and morality in order to rationalize for themselves their ethnic cleansing and apartheid and racism and genocide?

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Your claim, is ignorantly absurd.

See the updated 1968 Charter for the Palestine Liberation Organization:

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/plocov.asp

Article 1:
Palestine is the homeland of the Arab Palestinian people; it is an indivisible part of the Arab homeland, and the Palestinian people are an integral part of the Arab nation.

Article 2:
Palestine, with the boundaries it had during the British Mandate, is an indivisible territorial unit.

Article 3:
The Palestinian Arab people possess the legal right to their homeland and have the right to determine their destiny after achieving the liberation of their country in accordance with their wishes and entirely of their own accord and will.

Article 4:
The Palestinian identity is a genuine, essential, and inherent characteristic; it is transmitted from parents to children. The Zionist occupation and the dispersal of the Palestinian Arab people, through the disasters which befell them, do not make them lose their Palestinian identity and their membership in the Palestinian community, nor do they negate them.

Article 5:
The Palestinians are those Arab nationals who, until 1947, normally resided in Palestine regardless of whether they were evicted from it or have stayed there. Anyone born, after that date, of a Palestinian father - whether inside Palestine or outside it - is also a Palestinian.

The people who wrote those articles are as ignorant of history and reality as you are.


And you still do not understand that calling those people Arabs has been a justification for Zionist settler colonialists from Russia and Poland and Germany and even India and Africa to deny the ownership of the land they were born unto for millennia of generations and to snatch their lands and farms and cities and houses... claiming the propaganda lies that they "come from other lands" just like those Europeans (and other places) Zionist settler colonials and thus have no more claim to the land than they do.... since they are "arabs".

Speaking a language of one's conqueror after centuries of occupation does not make the conquered become the same ethnicity as the conqueror.

And if only you knew the history... the REAL history... not the propaganda and lies repeated even by the ignorant clueless Palestinians themselves too.

[webfusion]

The 'Arab World' consists of 22 countries in the Middle East and North Africa: Algeria, Bahrain, the Comoros Islands, Djibouti, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Libya, Morocco, Mauritania, Oman, Palestine, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Tunisia, the United Arab Emirates, and Yemen.

Israel is less than 22,000 sq.miles of land area.
It is home to a robust mixture of people.
Including Ba'hai. Name another place on earth that the Ba'hai are comfortable in. (Iran?)

"...ethnic cleansing and apartheid and racism and genocide?" You hit the superfecta with that sentence.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by webfusion

Leaumas, I am pretty sure you used the word epithet (which is a synonym of "insult" and "perjorative")

Do you have a dictionary? Use it.

Originally Posted by webfusion

"An epithet is a term of abuse." -- from Oxford Dictionary.

No it is not... I do not know what "oxford" dictionary you are using but

epithet

​an adjective or phrase that is used to describe somebody/something’s character or most important quality, especially in order to give praise or criticism

• The film is long and dramatic but does not quite earn the epithet ‘epic’.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by webfusion

The 'Arab World' consists of 22 countries in the Middle East and North Africa: Algeria, Bahrain, the Comoros Islands, Djibouti, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Libya, Morocco, Mauritania, Oman, Palestine, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Tunisia, the United Arab Emirates, and Yemen.

So? Does that justify taking one of those by LGBTQ people because they are severely persecuted and discriminated against all around the world where they come from?

Maybe we should carve out the area believed to be Sodom and give it to them?

Originally Posted by webfusion

Name another place on earth that the Ba'hai are comfortable in.

Australia, Canada, the USA, England, etc. etc.

So you are saying that a cult of Iranians have more rights to the land of the Palestinians because they are persecuted for their cultic believes in Iran than the Palestinians who should be ethnically cleansed of their ancestral homes and carted off to an "Arab" country to make space for some Iranian cult members?

Originally Posted by webfusion

"...ethnic cleansing and apartheid and racism and genocide?" You hit the superfecta with that sentence.

Yup... it is what Israel is... and you just admitted it above.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Leumas

The people who wrote those articles are as ignorant of history and reality as you are.

I suggest you write some letters to the Palestine Liberation Organization and explain to them the errors within their Charter
They really need your input.

1320 18th Street, NW Suite # 200, Washington D.C.20036

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Leumas

By using that false epithet.
....
And then the Xenophobic supremacist Settler Colonialists use fallacies and propaganda such as "Land Without a people for a people without a land" and "Squatters" and then turn around and say "they are arabs and there are many arab states why don't they just go there to where they came from and leave us poor oppressed homeless Settler Colonialists with that little piece of land that does not belong to them... but was promised by the god 65% of us do not believe in to a guy 100% of sane people know was a myth".
...

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Your claim, is ignorantly absurd.

But it has just been proven arrantly correct by this post

Originally Posted by webfusion

The 'Arab World' consists of 22 countries in the Middle East and North Africa: Algeria, Bahrain, the Comoros Islands, Djibouti, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Libya, Morocco, Mauritania, Oman, Palestine, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Tunisia, the United Arab Emirates, and Yemen.

Israel is less than 22,000 sq.miles of land area.
It is home to a robust mixture of people.
Including Ba'hai. Name another place on earth that the Ba'hai are comfortable in. (Iran?)

"...ethnic cleansing and apartheid and racism and genocide?" You hit the superfecta with that sentence.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by webfusion

I suggest you write some letters to the Palestine Liberation Organization and explain to them the errors within their Charter
They really need your input.

1320 18th Street, NW Suite # 200, Washington D.C.20036

Ah... so now you are singing the accolades of the Palestinian Authority as an authority you trust?

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Leumas

Do you have a dictionary? Use it.

Dictionary.com (which is, obviously, a decent dictionary source) says: "a word, phrase, or expression used invectively as a term of abuse or contempt, to express hostility, etc."

(definition #3)

Not sure what you're trying to achieve with this, but it's not working.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

The people who wrote those articles are as ignorant of history and reality as you are.


And you still do not understand that calling those people Arabs has been a justification for Zionist settler colonialists from Russia and Poland and Germany and even India and Africa to deny the ownership of the land they were born unto for millennia of generations and to snatch their lands and farms and cities and houses... claiming the propaganda lies that they "come from other lands" just like those Europeans (and other places) Zionist settler colonials and thus have no more claim to the land than they do.... since they are "arabs".

Speaking a language of one's conqueror after centuries of occupation does not make the conquered become the same ethnicity as the conqueror.

And if only you knew the history... the REAL history... not the propaganda and lies repeated even by the ignorant clueless Palestinians themselves too.

Wow, you think you know more about the Palestinians than the Palestinian people themselves???

It's somehow an attack to acknowledge they are Arabs?

Talk about white arrogance and white privilege, telling non-white people who they are and what they are and what their history is.

Unbelievable.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Leumas

Ah... so now you are singing the accolades of the Palestinian Authority as an authority you trust?

I have no particular axe to grind with the PLO/PNA right now. (the PLO -- Fatah -- is not equal to the PNA, but rather, one party in a coalition of government, which, honestly, also includes the political branch of Hamas!)

It was you, however, that indicated they are wrong.
I merely suggested you could contact them, and explain your position.
Be sure to say that you're providing the correct information to them in order to dispel "the propaganda and lies repeated even by the ignorant clueless Palestinians themselves."

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Wow, you think you know more about the Palestinians than the Palestinian people themselves???

Historical truths are objective and can be discerned by any educated person... I do not have to be a Palestinian to know Palestinian historical facts.

It is also yet another irrefragable fact that PROPAGANDA lies distort any truths... just like the Nazis were not descended from Übermenschen Aryans from Atlantis just because some German guys said it and believed it.

The Master Race

Quote:

The Nazi theorist Alfred Rosenberg believed that the "Nordic race" was descended from Proto-Indo-Europeans, who he believed had pre-historically dwelt on the North German Plain and may have ultimately originated on the lost island of Atlantis. The Nazis declared that the Aryans were superior to all other races, and believed they were entitled to expand territorially. The actual policy that was implemented by the Nazis resulted in the Aryan certificate. This document, which was required by law for all citizens of the Reich, was the "Lesser Aryan certificate" (Kleiner Ariernachweis) and could be obtained through an Ahnenpass, which required the owner to trace their lineage through baptism, birth certificates, or certified proof thereof that all grandparents were of "Aryan descent".

Originally Posted by Hercules56

It's somehow an attack to acknowledge they are Arabs?

Yet another strawmanning... I suggest you read my post again and slowly and carefully... and read the proof for its words in this post.

Originally Posted by Hercules56

Talk about white arrogance and white privilege, telling non-white people who they are and what they are and what their history is.

Haha... it does not matter what color one is... FACTS can be learned by anyone who cares to LEARN about them... and ignorant people of any color do not know the FACTS and thus can be taught them by anyone of no matter what color.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

Historical truths are objective and can be discerned by any educated person... I do not have to be a Palestinian to know Palestinian historical facts.

It is also yet another irrefragable fact that PROPAGANDA lies distort any truths... just like the Nazis were not descended from Übermenschen Aryans from Atlantis just because some German guys said it and believed it.

The Master Race






Yet another strawmanning... I suggest you read my post again and slowly and carefully... and read the proof for its words in this post.





Haha... it does not matter what color one is... FACTS can be learned by anyone who cares to LEARN about them... and ignorant people of any color do not know the FACTS and thus can be taught them by anyone of no matter what color.

So you think you know more about the Palestinians then the Palestinians themselves and the greater Arab community.

White privilege at its finest.

[webfusion]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

So you think you know more about the Palestinians than the Palestinians themselves and the greater Arab community.

*snip*

Apparently yes, that's exactly what he (or she) is claiming.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by webfusion

Leaumas, I am pretty sure you used the word epithet (which is a synonym of "insult" and "perjorative")

"An epithet is a term of abuse." -- from Oxford Dictionary.

epithet (from the Oxford dictionary)

​an adjective or phrase that is used to describe somebody/something’s character or most important quality, especially in order to give praise or criticism

• The film is long and dramatic but does not quite earn the epithet ‘epic’.

So it was NOT from the Oxford dictionary... was it?

Originally Posted by webfusion

Dictionary.com (which is, obviously, a decent dictionary source) says: "a word, phrase, or expression used invectively as a term of abuse or contempt, to express hostility, etc."

(definition #3)

Epithet (from Dictionary.com)

noun

1. any word or phrase applied to a person or thing to describe an actual or attributed quality:
   “Richard the Lion-Hearted” is an epithet of Richard I.
   
   
2. a characterizing word or phrase firmly associated with a person or thing and often used in place of an actual name, title, or the like,

   as “man's best friend” for “dog.”

3. a word, phrase, or expression used invectively as a term of abuse or contempt, to express hostility, etc.:

   He demeans his female employees by addressing them with sexist epithets.

4. Botany, Zoology. specific epithet.

So you chose to strawman the THIRD meaning that you decided suits your purposes to strawman my post???

And yes... you strawmanned that third meaning... if you read it properly it does not say that the word epithet MEANS it is a pejorative or insult... the meaning given in that THIRD entry means that a term that is pejorative is an epithet... not that the word epithet is a synonym for the word pejorative.

So you used Dictionary.com... and wrongly called it The Oxford Dictionary...

Then you used the THRID meaning instead of the 1st or second.

Then you misunderstood what that third entry is saying.

All in the effort to misunderstand the words of my post....

WOW....

Originally Posted by webfusion

Not sure what you're trying to achieve with this, but it's not working.

ETA: in fact I am very sure what you are doing here... but it clearly is not working because fortunately these days CORRECT INFORMATION is readily available to debunk any attempts at giving out wrong information.

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

epithet (from the Oxford dictionary)

​an adjective or phrase that is used to describe somebody/something’s character or most important quality, especially in order to give praise or criticism

• The film is long and dramatic but does not quite earn the epithet ‘epic’.

So it was NOT from the Oxford dictionary... was it?




Epithet (from Dictionary.com)

noun

1. any word or phrase applied to a person or thing to describe an actual or attributed quality:
   “Richard the Lion-Hearted” is an epithet of Richard I.
   
   
2. a characterizing word or phrase firmly associated with a person or thing and often used in place of an actual name, title, or the like,

   as “man's best friend” for “dog.”

3. a word, phrase, or expression used invectively as a term of abuse or contempt, to express hostility, etc.:

   He demeans his female employees by addressing them with sexist epithets.

4. Botany, Zoology. specific epithet.

So you chose to strawman the THIRD meaning that you decided suits your purposes to strawman my post???

And yes... you strawmanned that third meaning... if you read it properly it does not say that the word epithet MEANS it is a pejorative or insult... the meaning given in that THIRD entry means that a term that is pejorative is an epithet... not that the word epithet is a synonym for the word pejorative.

So you used Dictionary.com... and wrongly called it The Oxford Dictionary...

Then you used the THRID meaning instead of the 1st or second.

Then you misunderstood what that third entry is saying.

All in the effort to misunderstand the words of my post....

WOW....




ETA: in fact I am very sure what you are doing here... but it clearly is not working because fortunately these days CORRECT INFORMATION is readily available to debunk any attempts at giving out wrong information.

Please explain why the Palestinians are not Arabs, and its offensive and ignorant to label them as such.

[Leumas]

Originally Posted by Hercules56

So you think you know more about the Palestinians then the Palestinians themselves and the greater Arab community.

Yes... that is what being educated and reading things that are not the Quran or the Bible or other fairy tales and propaganda as if they were facts, means.

Originally Posted by Hercules56

White EDUCATION privilege at its finest.

[Hercules56]

Hmmm, even the UN calls them "Palestinian Arabs".

https://www.un.org/unispal/history/

[Hercules56]

Originally Posted by Leumas

Yes... that is what being educated and reading things that are not the Quran or the Bible or other fairy tales and propaganda as if they were facts, means.

Seems like when it comes to Palestinian history, you believe everybody is stupid except for you.

Huh.

Now please explain to us why the PLO is wrong and the United Nations is wrong, because the Palestinians are not Arabs and it is ignorant and offensive to call them such.

[Thermal]

* glances back at the rails the discussion seems to have flown off of*