U.S. investigates aborted FedEx landing in Texas, two planes cleared for same runway - Page 2

smartcooky · 6th February 2023, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by sarge

All true…..but it is an important distinction that it isn’t up to a pilot to know not to proceed past or stop in an ILS Critical Area. It is the responsibility of a controller to give such an instruction. I haven’t listen to a recording of any of the ATC chatter, but I suspect that both the SW and the FedEx flights were in complete compliance with ATC instructions and required required environment procedures.

Agree... this definitely seems like a controller issue to me.

BowlOfRed · 7th February 2023, 01:10 AM

Originally Posted by smartcooky

Originally Posted by BowlOfRed

How would having a pilot on board change things? I assume it would be programmed to do something similar to what is done today: follow the last given flight plan unless TCAS goes off.

Although I'll bet a non-zero number of those communication failures were not equipment failure.

TCAS RA function is disabled on the ground (usually by the "weight on wheels" switches")... for obvious reasons.

My statement about TCAS was unrelated to anything happening on the ground. It was assuming you were already in the air and lost communication.

jt512 · 7th February 2023, 01:59 AM

I've never been Cat III certified, but this seems to me to be 99.99% controller error. That said, I suspect those FedEx pilots are asking themselves why they didn't abort that approach as soon as the controller cleared another plane to take off in front of them.

6th February 2023, 08:12 PM	#41
smartcooky Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Nelson, New Zealand Posts: 23,118	Originally Posted by sarge All true…..but it is an important distinction that it isn’t up to a pilot to know not to proceed past or stop in an ILS Critical Area. It is the responsibility of a controller to give such an instruction. I haven’t listen to a recording of any of the ATC chatter, but I suspect that both the SW and the FedEx flights were in complete compliance with ATC instructions and required required environment procedures. Agree... this definitely seems like a controller issue to me.
	__________________ What is Woke? It is a term that means "awakened to the needs of others". It means to be well-informed, thoughtful, compassionate, humble and kind. Woke people are keen to make the world a better, fairer place for everyone, But, unfortunately, it has also become a pejorative used by racists, homophobes and misogynists on the political right, to describe people who possess a fully functional moral compass.

7th February 2023, 01:59 AM	#43
jt512 Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,995	I've never been Cat III certified, but this seems to me to be 99.99% controller error. That said, I suspect those FedEx pilots are asking themselves why they didn't abort that approach as soon as the controller cleared another plane to take off in front of them.
jt512 Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,995

7th February 2023, 01:10 AM	#42
BowlOfRed Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Silicon Valley Posts: 2,287	Originally Posted by smartcooky Originally Posted by BowlOfRed How would having a pilot on board change things? I assume it would be programmed to do something similar to what is done today: follow the last given flight plan unless TCAS goes off. Although I'll bet a non-zero number of those communication failures were not equipment failure. TCAS RA function is disabled on the ground (usually by the "weight on wheels" switches")... for obvious reasons. My statement about TCAS was unrelated to anything happening on the ground. It was assuming you were already in the air and lost communication.