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Old 19th July 2019, 11:04 PM   #321
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
That position was untenable and I have abandoned it.
That’s good to know. How was this announced?
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Old 20th July 2019, 01:04 AM   #322
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Originally Posted by zooterkin View Post
That’s good to know. How was this announced?
I certainly wasn't aware that was the case.
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Old 20th July 2019, 01:49 AM   #323
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
My position is that when it comes to exercising the right to free speech, there is no principled distinction between the two.
There may be no "principled distinction" between the two (although I hold there is) but there are as others have provided clear examples to demonstrate actual emperical distinctions, and the legal systems of countries ike the USA and the UK have legislated for these emperical differences.
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Old 20th July 2019, 02:14 AM   #324
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Citizens should not need to justify themselves to the government, in order to exercise their rights. Quite the opposite: The government needs to justify themselves to their citizens, in order to infringe on a right. What you're talking about is privilege. I think it's a mistake to think of human rights as if they were government privileges.
And TR didn't have the right to do what he did. That's why he's going to jail.

So if you want to argue that he SHOULD have the right to do it then I think you should attempt to show that changing the rules should have some value or benefit.

He was harassing the defendants and encouraging others to do the same. He was rabble rousing. If you class that as something that should be allowed as a right to free speech then your definition of a right to free speech has little merit.
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Old 20th July 2019, 02:52 AM   #325
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Prohibiting jokes about bombs in airports is entirely consistent with the principle that the government should have to justify itself, when infringing on a right.
As courts have to when they put temporary reporting restrictions in place.
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Old 20th July 2019, 04:27 AM   #326
Archie Gemmill Goal
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Originally Posted by P.J. Denyer View Post
As courts have to when they put temporary reporting restrictions in place.
I would quite happily have a no reporting rule on any ongoing trial. There is no need for it as far as I can see.

Report on the outcome once a verdict has been rendered.
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Old 20th July 2019, 04:37 AM   #327
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Any pub in any town. It's pretty much across the board in my experience.
https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/...20190719187587
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Old 21st July 2019, 05:02 AM   #328
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The Bellend of Belmarsh tried to intimidate a pensioner on Day One and got decked. Karma

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/lat...ison-edl-fight
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Old 21st July 2019, 06:02 AM   #329
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Doesn't pass the sniff test.
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Old 21st July 2019, 06:06 AM   #330
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Originally Posted by zooterkin View Post
That’s good to know. How was this announced?
How did you misunderstand that previous post of mine so badly?
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Old 21st July 2019, 06:08 AM   #331
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Originally Posted by bluesjnr View Post
I certainly wasn't aware that was the case.
My bad. Next time, I'll be sure to send you a Save the Date and a link to the gift registry, so you don't miss it.
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Old 21st July 2019, 09:34 AM   #332
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Doesn't pass the sniff test.

His supporters say it's "completely fake news":

Originally Posted by tr.news
The mainstream media, including, The Daily Star and The Mirror are reporting that Tommy Robinson has been ‘punched to the ground by another inmate in the showers’.

For his own protection, Tommy Robinson has been in complete isolation since arriving at Belmarsh prison. Robinson has not seen another prisoner, let alone been showering with other inmates.

This story is completely fake news.

The media have been informed that there is no truth to the story, but refuse to take it offline. [...]
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Old 21st July 2019, 09:57 AM   #333
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Not covered as far as I can see in the Guardian or Times. Mind you I'm not sure they would cover it. The Star will print any old crap, the Mirror is usually not too bad but I think they'd see this as appealing too much to their readership not to print it.
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Old 22nd July 2019, 12:16 AM   #334
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
My bad. Next time, I'll be sure to send you a Save the Date and a link to the gift registry, so you don't miss it.
...... touchy.......
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Old 22nd July 2019, 12:17 AM   #335
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Originally Posted by Archie Gemmill Goal View Post
The Bellend of Belmarsh tried to intimidate a pensioner on Day One and got decked. Karma

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/lat...ison-edl-fight
If I was going to write a prison fight scene I would reject this version as far too clichéd.

You've been had.
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Old 22nd July 2019, 12:29 AM   #336
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And the whole restaurant stood up and applauded.

Seriously.... a 70 year old hardass inmate? This comes out of the Original Fake News Mill.... the tabloids making **** up.
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Old 22nd July 2019, 01:32 AM   #337
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Originally Posted by bluesjnr View Post
If I was going to write a prison fight scene I would reject this version as far too clichéd.

You've been had.
Whether it happened or not it's still amusing. And I bet his minions are seething at the story.

And on the scale of plausibility its 100 times more realistic than the previous story put out by his admirers that he was having chats with Julian Assange in the cell above.
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Old 22nd July 2019, 04:29 AM   #338
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
It's probably worth distinguishing between reporting and gossiping since the latter was not restricted.

People interested enough to attend could go to the trials and then talk about them to anyone and everyone they met. It was only publishing/broadcasting such reports to the public at large which was temporarily restricted.
I was using "gossiping" there figuratively, rather than literally. Much trial reporting is prurient/gossipy in nature. Newspapers having to wait a bit before doing so is hardly a great hardship.
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Old 2nd August 2019, 03:10 PM   #339
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Some interesting developments here. While "Tommy" is in jail, some of his main followers (two women) have started to question why the "movement" allegedly defending Brits from Islamic grooming gangs is run by Jews from outside Britain. Which brought the Australian jew who now seems to run "Tommy"'s website and youtube channel to post an attack video on some "real NAZI" that interviewed one of the women. The "real NAZI" was in turn just interviewed by the notorious Red Ice Radio out of Sweden. I recommend that only for people who are like me interested in the inner workings of fringe movements including the far-right.

The tr.news website now apparently run by the Australian Jew "Avi Yemeni" has since published this which seems to completely contradict their take on the alleged Tommy shower incident posted above:

Originally Posted by tr.news, July 23rd
Ezra Levant [Jewish chief of "Rebel Media" out of Canada running several "alt-right" characters - CE] visited Tommy Robinson today in Belmarsh prison. Tommy has only had a couple of visitations so far since his political imprisonment.

Ezra was surprised to see that Tommy is in decent health, Tommy has access to an exercise bike and a gym to work out. His food is prepared in the hospital wing of the prison, and he also has access to a television.

So far, Tommy is being treated pretty well inside Belmarsh, and the prison governor visits him daily.

Tommy is imprisoned close to Julian Assange, and they have had conversations.

We are glad to hear that Tommy is treated well so far. However, we should not forget that isolation from human contact does affect a persons well being and mental health. [...]
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Old 2nd August 2019, 09:49 PM   #340
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What is the relevance of pointing out the religious affiliation of these individuals? I can understand bringing up the fact that they are non-Brits, but why all the "Jew this, jew that, jew jew jew jew"?
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Old 2nd August 2019, 11:48 PM   #341
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
That position was untenable and I have abandoned it. The discussion has moved on. Feel free to move with it.



Either way, please stop it.
Saying your position is now untenable and abandoned, is that a different way of saying you were wrong?
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Old 3rd August 2019, 01:33 AM   #342
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Some interesting developments here. While "Tommy" is in jail, some of his main followers (two women) have started to question why the "movement" allegedly defending Brits from Islamic grooming gangs is run by Jews from outside Britain. Which brought the Australian jew who now seems to run "Tommy"'s website and youtube channel to post an attack video on some "real NAZI" that interviewed one of the women. The "real NAZI" was in turn just interviewed by the notorious Red Ice Radio out of Sweden. I recommend that only for people who are like me interested in the inner workings of fringe movements including the far-right.

The tr.news website now apparently run by the Australian Jew "Avi Yemeni" has since published this which seems to completely contradict their take on the alleged Tommy shower incident posted above:
What a surprise, he's being treated like a prisoner in a UK prison!
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Old 3rd August 2019, 03:58 AM   #343
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Originally Posted by rayheno View Post
Saying your position is now untenable and abandoned, is that a different way of saying you were wrong?
Is this a different way of saying you're more interested in me than in my argument?
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Old 3rd August 2019, 04:10 AM   #344
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Is this a different way of saying you're more interested in me than in my argument?
Which argument, the untenable (wrong) one or your newest one?
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Old 3rd August 2019, 04:12 AM   #345
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Originally Posted by rayheno View Post
Which argument, the untenable (wrong) one or your newest one?
Either way.
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Old 3rd August 2019, 05:34 AM   #346
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Either way.
Edited by jsfisher:  Content edited to comply with Rule 12 of the Membership Agreement.

Last edited by jsfisher; 3rd August 2019 at 11:57 AM.
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Old 3rd August 2019, 08:02 AM   #347
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
<drivel snip>
Edited by jsfisher:  <snip> Content edited for compliance with Rule 12 of the Membership Agreement.

And I don't think anyone here is going to be fooled by Red Ice, with it's noxious mix of alt-right lies, conspiracy theories, paranormal and pseudohistorical nonsense, gun nuttery, and Holocaust denial.
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Old 3rd August 2019, 08:04 AM   #348
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
What is the relevance of pointing out the religious affiliation of these individuals? I can understand bringing up the fact that they are non-Brits, but why all the Jew this, jew that, jew jew jew jew"?
Given that he's quoting RIR, a fairly notorious right-wing, Holocaust denying anti-semitic organization, I think the mask's slipped.
Just visit their (((Coincidence Detector))).
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As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.
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Old 3rd August 2019, 08:04 AM   #349
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Some interesting developments here. While "Tommy" is in jail, some of his main followers (two women) have started to question why the "movement" allegedly defending Brits from Islamic grooming gangs is run by Jews from outside Britain. Which brought the Australian jew who now seems to run "Tommy"'s website and youtube channel to post an attack video on some "real NAZI" that interviewed one of the women. The "real NAZI" was in turn just interviewed by the notorious Red Ice Radio out of Sweden. I recommend that only for people who are like me interested in the inner workings of fringe movements including the far-right.

The tr.news website now apparently run by the Australian Jew "Avi Yemeni" has since published this which seems to completely contradict their take on the alleged Tommy shower incident posted above:
Another day, another repost of far-right crackpot conspiracy theory websites. At least you are keeping up your quota for the day. Can't risk losing out on those rubles.
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Old 3rd August 2019, 08:38 AM   #350
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Originally Posted by catsmate View Post
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
<drivel snip>
Edited by jsfisher:  Moderated content redacted.

And I don't think anyone here is going to be fooled by Red Ice, with it's noxious mix of alt-right lies, conspiracy theories, paranormal and pseudohistorical nonsense, gun nuttery, and Holocaust denial.
Did I just read an implied claim that ((the Jews)) are responsible for a neo-Nazi's PR machine?

Well, that is special.
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Old 3rd August 2019, 09:25 AM   #351
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UK (Eng & Wal) system

Just to point out that post-trial jurors don't chat in public about the trial; they don't give interviews etc. Indeed, they are essentially unknown.

Additionally, barristers do not give TV crews daily updates outside the court.

I dislike the reasonably recent behaviour of police officers giving their 'take' on the outcome of a trial outside the court.

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Old 4th August 2019, 10:15 AM   #352
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Originally Posted by The Common Potato View Post
Just to point out that post-trial jurors don't chat in public about the trial; they don't give interviews etc. Indeed, they are essentially unknown.
Well, there is a reason for that. It's against the law to discuss what happened in the jury room, and they are discouraged from talking about what happened in court on social media, etc.
Quote:
Do not discuss the trial with anyone until it’s finished, except with other jury members in the deliberation room.

After the trial you must not talk about what happened in the deliberation room, even with family members. You can talk about what happened in the courtroom.

Do not post comments about the trial on social media websites like Facebook or Twitter - even after the trial’s finished. This is contempt of court and you can be fined or sent to prison.
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