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Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , Andrew Bolt , autism , environmental activists , Greta Thunberg

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Old 14th November 2019, 11:49 PM   #2801
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I don't see a round earth when I walk out the front door. Therefore the earth is flat.
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Old 15th November 2019, 12:00 AM   #2802
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
I don't see a round earth when I walk out the front door. Therefore the earth is flat.
You think the earth is flat?

Ok



Good for you
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 15th November 2019, 11:59 PM   #2803
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
In summary, Greta is less disturbed than those criticising her.
Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
TBF I have noticed when people atart referring to others in the media by first names only, they tend to be a bit unreliable in their impartiality
Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
TBF Greta is kind of the perfect topic to wind up people with
Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Actually got that wrong

84%

Edit: Think Greta may not come here
Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
The world does a communal sigh of relief to find out Greta has a free ride to COP 25

All the climate change experts going to it can now hear her say listen to themselves in person.
I was catching up and had just been through the "fact-checking Breitbart" diversion and thought this was a nice segue.

Sorry, cullennz, I was actually really happy to see you say that first thing, and I was just trying to show the Thunberg-detractors something about one of "them".

Odd to see who is opposed to her, and how you aren't someone I'd have guessed would have been.
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:02 AM   #2804
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NVM
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Last edited by Orphia Nay; 16th November 2019 at 12:06 AM. Reason: Wrong thread
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:20 AM   #2805
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Originally Posted by Orphia Nay View Post
I was catching up and had just been through the "fact-checking Breitbart" diversion and thought this was a nice segue.

Sorry, cullennz, I was actually really happy to see you say that first thing, and I was just trying to show the Thunberg-detractors something about one of "them".

Odd to see who is opposed to her, and how you aren't someone I'd have guessed would have been.
Was just going with the flow, but thought doing the same thing as the disciples seemed apt.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:34 AM   #2806
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And I am not particularly opposed to her.


Just find the limelight and some weirdly credit giving quite humorous
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:42 AM   #2807
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
And I am not particularly opposed to her.


Just find the limelight and some weirdly credit giving quite humorous
Rubbish. Your posts are here for all to see.
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:52 AM   #2808
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Rubbish. Your posts are here for all to see.


If you want to point out which ones a particularly bad I am open to discussing.

Just think her management is a bit crap

And she can be personally to me irritating with some of her acting in speeches
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 03:27 AM   #2809
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I know, right. She irritates some people. How in the hell does she get away with that?
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Old 16th November 2019, 11:27 AM   #2810
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[quote=cullennz;12894045]If you want to point out which ones a particularly bad I am open to discussing.

Just think her management is a bit crap

And she can be personally to me irritating with some of her acting in speeches[/QUOTE

It is good to know you are listening to her speeches. You may learn something whether you mean to or not.
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:24 PM   #2811
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Anybody who "learned" anything meaningful from Thungberg's speeches really hasn't been paying attention.

But don't worry, government's got this. Everything is going to be OK.
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Old 16th November 2019, 12:51 PM   #2812
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
Anybody who "learned" anything meaningful from Thungberg's speeches really hasn't been paying attention.

But don't worry, government's got this. Everything is going to be OK.
Odd that you think every person knows everything about climate change that Thunberg does (and that you do). I assume you realize that everyone’s learning process involves hearing about a thing for the first time. A lot of the young people listening to Thunberg may well be hearing details that they have never heard before. At least you acknowledge that there are people who have not yet been paying attention. Those people can still be educated.

Which government do you think has “got this”? Seems that you are one who has not been paying attention. One of Thunberg’s consistent points is that governments havenot “got this”.
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:05 PM   #2813
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
I know, right. She irritates some people. How in the hell does she get away with that?
Because she has a right to.

Which is good

Just don't get offended when people point out it can irritate
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:09 PM   #2814
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Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Odd that you think every person knows everything about climate change that Thunberg does (and that you do). I assume you realize that everyone’s learning process involves hearing about a thing for the first time. A lot of the young people listening to Thunberg may well be hearing details that they have never heard before. At least you acknowledge that there are people who have not yet been paying attention. Those people can still be educated.

Which government do you think has “got this”? Seems that you are one who has not been paying attention. One of Thunberg’s consistent points is that governments havenot “got this”.
Ours

In fact our PM has called climate change "Her generations nuclear free moment"

Not that they doing any good from it.

And not that it will make any difference given the miniscule amount of emissions we comparatively emit
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:13 PM   #2815
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Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Odd that you think every person knows everything about climate change that Thunberg does (and that you do). I assume you realize that everyone’s learning process involves hearing about a thing for the first time. A lot of the young people listening to Thunberg may well be hearing details that they have never heard before. At least you acknowledge that there are people who have not yet been paying attention. Those people can still be educated.

Which government do you think has “got this”? Seems that you are one who has not been paying attention. One of Thunberg’s consistent points is that governments havenot “got this”.
Which is why she's sailing to Madrid to tell the government representatives at COP25 that they don't have this. Something they don't know, because they still need to hear it for the first time. From Greta Thunberg.

No, wait. That's silly. What does Greta's message to schoolchildren have to do with her attending COP25?
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:19 PM   #2816
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
No, wait. That's silly. What does Greta's message to schoolchildren have to do with her attending COP25?
Have you heard about profile and getting your message to a wider audience?

Some people no doubt wish she had remained a low profile student, but she is communicating to and influencing millions. That must rankle.
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:35 PM   #2817
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Which is why she's sailing to Madrid to tell the government representatives at COP25 that they don't have this. Something they don't know, because they still need to hear it for the first time. From Greta Thunberg.

No, wait. That's silly. What does Greta's message to schoolchildren have to do with her attending COP25?

COP25 is a meeting of global experts on climate change and government representatives whose portfolios are climate change.

I doubt very much she will be inspiring them with things they haven't heard or don't know.

The only reason they will probably put up with sitting and listening to her is it would look bad to not be pictured their given her profile.
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:55 PM   #2818
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I don't think conservatives "get" Thunberg at all. Her goal is to bring new visibility to climate change from the perspective of the future generations who will suffer the damages that we, the current generation, are inflicting on them by our relative inaction. In part she is angry, as I would be if my future was being threatened. In part she hopes to embarrass into some sort of action those who have done nothing so far. Many other arguments and approaches have failed to move many governments and people into doing something; perhaps some pleas from our children might help.

Everyone who has been paying attention already "knows" about climate change and therefore doesn't need Thunberg? Many people obviously haven't been paying attention. And yet more people, deniers, have gotten the facts wrong. And even many of those who have been paying attention and understand climate change have found it an inconvenient truth, one that they would prefer to ignore so that they can still make more money by selling oil, or perhaps only so they can enjoy their own huge SUV. I don't think Thunberg is herself primarily seeking to teach facts so much as to capture people's attention. She refers others to scientists for the facts.

She is an agitator. She is not attending COP25 to tell people what they haven't heard; she is attending to pressure people to act on what they already know.
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Old 16th November 2019, 02:59 PM   #2819
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
I don't think conservatives "get" Thunberg at all. Her goal is to bring new visibility to climate change from the perspective of the future generations who will suffer the damages that we, the current generation, are inflicting on them by our relative inaction. In part she is angry, as I would be if my future was being threatened. In part she hopes to embarrass into some sort of action those who have done nothing so far. Many other arguments and approaches have failed to move many governments and people into doing something; perhaps some pleas from our children might help.

Everyone who has been paying attention already "knows" about climate change and therefore doesn't need Thunberg? Many people obviously haven't been paying attention. And yet more people, deniers, have gotten the facts wrong. And even many of those who have been paying attention and understand climate change have found it an inconvenient truth, one that they would prefer to ignore so that they can still make more money by selling oil, or perhaps only so they can enjoy their own huge SUV. I don't think Thunberg is herself primarily seeking to teach facts so much as to capture people's attention. She refers others to scientists for the facts.

She is an agitator. She is not attending COP25 to tell people what they haven't heard; she is attending to pressure people to act on what they already know.
I gave up after your assumption only conservatives are idiot climate change deniers and presumably you think all of the non conservatives aren't
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 03:12 PM   #2820
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I also wish to point out that Thunberg clearly knows that whatever she might do in her travels or personal life represents a potential target for personal attacks by her opponents. And I suspect that she is also trying to present novel ways of thinking about energy sources. This is why she is traveling by sailboat, yet of course this has been attacked in this thread. It has been suggested that she should travel instead in an "extra" seat on a incompletely booked airline flight, yet clearly this does come with a greenhouse gas burden due to her weight; further does anyone really think that flying on a plane, no matter how subtle the argument, wouldn't be the basis of vicious denouncements of her as a hypocrite? Same if she traveled on a freighter: her opponents wouldn't consider the fuel per pound of cargo costs but instead focus on the total amount of fuel, and the pollution, associated with the trip.

Basically she cannot really win because anything she might do can be, and would be, distorted to put her in a bad light. But I think she is being pretty clever so far and minimizing the opportunities for he opponents to smear her.

Finally a reminder: attacking Thunberg doesn't make climate change go away.
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Old 16th November 2019, 03:19 PM   #2821
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I gave up after your assumption only conservatives are idiot climate change deniers and presumably you think all of the non conservatives aren't
Perhaps you gave up reading too quickly, because I never said that at all. The only thing I attributed to conservatives was that they didn't "get" Thunberg, as in they didn't fully understand what her goals or approach were. My reference to climate change deniers was completely separate, did not refer to conservatives, and was part of my argument that even many of those who have been paying attention would benefit from getting more facts, as urged by Thunberg.
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Old 16th November 2019, 03:30 PM   #2822
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
Perhaps you gave up reading too quickly, because I never said that at all. The only thing I attributed to conservatives was that they didn't "get" Thunberg, as in they didn't fully understand what her goals or approach were.
Understanding of her goals and approach raise questions about her goals and approach. Questions which her fan club answer with, "you don't understand her goals and approach".

And that is the thing I'm criticizing. Not Thunberg herself, but her fans' unwarranted lionization of her.
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Old 16th November 2019, 03:37 PM   #2823
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Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Odd that you think every person knows everything about climate change that Thunberg does (and that you do). I assume you realize that everyone’s learning process involves hearing about a thing for the first time. A lot of the young people listening to Thunberg may well be hearing details that they have never heard before. At least you acknowledge that there are people who have not yet been paying attention. Those people can still be educated.

Which government do you think has “got this”? Seems that you are one who has not been paying attention. One of Thunberg’s consistent points is that governments havenot “got this”.
We covered this is the climate change is being taught is schools posts but I suppose I'd have to admit that there may have been babies and toddlers in Thunberg's audience who may have gleaned some new knowledge about the subject.

By "got this" I mean that government is going to fix things. Thunberg's only message is to vote. Oh, there was that bit about leaving fossil fuels in the ground but nobody wants to do that so for now we just sit and wait for government to do their thing.
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Old 16th November 2019, 04:51 PM   #2824
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
...
Finally a reminder: attacking Thunberg doesn't make climate change go away.
Who, in these discussions, do you think needs to be reminded of that?

It's a pretty condescending thing to say..
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Old 16th November 2019, 05:33 PM   #2825
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
Perhaps you gave up reading too quickly, because I never said that at all. The only thing I attributed to conservatives was that they didn't "get" Thunberg, as in they didn't fully understand what her goals or approach were. My reference to climate change deniers was completely separate, did not refer to conservatives, and was part of my argument that even many of those who have been paying attention would benefit from getting more facts, as urged by Thunberg.
Awesome

Now you are saying no conservatives "get" Greta.

Just out of interest

Do you understand the concept that some conservatives might also be environmentalists?

As you come across as thinking this concept is mutually exclusive.
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Old 16th November 2019, 06:49 PM   #2826
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
. . . her fans' unwarranted lionization of her.
Haven't seen that at all. Have seen a whole bunch of people who say they admire her for what she is doing which is a lot more than most people on the planet. If she keeps this pace up she will pass a lot more as she gets older.

The argument you make is the same ridiculous argument a lot of claimed skeptics made against Dawkins. He's annoying! He's arrogant! He shouldn't be preaching! Basically they didn't like how Dawkins delivered his message and you don't like how Greta delivers hers. Tough! It really is none of your business how someone chooses to deliver their message. If you think there is a better way to deliver the message, get off your lazy ass and go do it.
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Old 16th November 2019, 07:00 PM   #2827
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Originally Posted by qayak View Post
Haven't seen that at all. Have seen a whole bunch of people who say they admire her for what she is doing which is a lot more than most people on the planet. If she keeps this pace up she will pass a lot more as she gets older.

The argument you make is the same ridiculous argument a lot of claimed skeptics made against Dawkins. He's annoying! He's arrogant! He shouldn't be preaching! Basically they didn't like how Dawkins delivered his message and you don't like how Greta delivers hers. Tough! It really is none of your business how someone chooses to deliver their message. If you think there is a better way to deliver the message, get off your lazy ass and go do it.
The difference being Dawkins has an education, life experience, qualifications in what he is talking about and didn't stomp his foot refusing to go to school, demand to go places, but not by plane.
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 07:19 PM   #2828
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Originally Posted by Skeptical Greg View Post
Who, in these discussions, do you think needs to be reminded of that?

It's a pretty condescending thing to say..
At least one person in this very thread doubts the extent of future warming and thinks it will arrive far more slowly than scientists predict.
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Old 16th November 2019, 08:05 PM   #2829
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
The difference being Dawkins has an education, life experience, qualifications in what he is talking about and didn't stomp his foot refusing to go to school, demand to go places, but not by plane.
No difference in the ridiculous arguments against both, though. It's ad hominems all the way down.
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Old 16th November 2019, 08:22 PM   #2830
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Originally Posted by qayak View Post
No difference in the ridiculous arguments against both, though. It's ad hominems all the way down.
How?

Specifically between Greta and Dawkins
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 08:35 PM   #2831
Steve
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
The difference being Dawkins has an education, life experience, qualifications in what he is talking about and didn't stomp his foot refusing to go to school, demand to go places, but not by plane.
Another in a long string of mature and reasoned posts. You just can’t help but reason like a 9 year old when you think about Thunberg, can you.
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Old 16th November 2019, 08:43 PM   #2832
cullennz
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Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Another in a long string of mature and reasoned posts. You just can’t help but reason like a 9 year old when you think about Thunberg, can you.
Yes, because pointing out the criticism against Greta is different than Dawkins is acting like a 9 year old.

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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 08:49 PM   #2833
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
The difference being Dawkins has an education, life experience, qualifications in what he is talking about and didn't stomp his foot refusing to go to school, demand to go places, but not by plane.
I tell you what

Why don't we go with pointing out which bit of the above post is wrong.

I will give you a free point for foot stomping as we don't know whether she actually stomped.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:25 PM   #2834
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Understanding of her goals and approach raise questions about her goals and approach. Questions which her fan club answer with, "you don't understand her goals and approach".



And that is the thing I'm criticizing. Not Thunberg herself, but her fans' unwarranted lionization of her.
She's a campaigner, like the title says. Apparently she is good at it.
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:28 PM   #2835
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I tell you what

Why don't we go with pointing out which bit of the above post is wrong.

I will give you a free point for foot stomping as we don't know whether she actually stomped.
I will accept stomping (his) foot.

I will add
- Refusing to go to school
- Demanding to go places.

The two bolded words are things you made up, along with the foot stomping. In fact, most of the criticisms you have posted in this thread are things you have made up.

There used to be a large canine in these forums who posted in a similar manner, and before that, a lumberjack. Emulating them would be poor form.
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:41 PM   #2836
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Originally Posted by Steve View Post
I will accept stomping (his) foot.

I will add
- Refusing to go to school
- Demanding to go places.

The two bolded words are things you made up, along with the foot stomping. In fact, most of the criticisms you have posted in this thread are things you have made up.

There used to be a large canine in these forums who posted in a similar manner, and before that, a lumberjack. Emulating them would be poor form.
https://www.theguardian.com/science/...climate-crisis

Quote:
This simple realisation prompted Greta Thunberg, 15, to protest in the most effective way she knew. She is on strike, refusing to go to school until Sweden’s general election on 9 September to draw attention to the climate crisis.

Her protest has captured the imagination of a country that has been struck by heatwaves and wildfires in its hottest summer since records began 262 years ago.
Won't bother with the second one as saying she refuses to take a plane and demanding to go to climate meetings is kind of.... obvious
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:44 PM   #2837
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Unless of course you think people are getting her to portray her need to get there without planes
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:45 PM   #2838
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Awesome

Now you are saying no conservatives "get" Greta.

Just out of interest

Do you understand the concept that some conservatives might also be environmentalists?

As you come across as thinking this concept is mutually exclusive.
Again, I did not say that at all. By not getting Thunberg I mean not understanding her strategy and approach. Not that conservatives cannot be environmentalists. Some are.
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:49 PM   #2839
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Originally Posted by Skeptical Greg View Post
Who, in these discussions, do you think needs to be reminded of that?

It's a pretty condescending thing to say..
You don't buy how much of the right wing attacks on Thunberg are to discredit her cause? Otherwise who would care so much about this one 16 year old?
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Old 16th November 2019, 09:59 PM   #2840
cullennz
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
Again, I did not say that at all. By not getting Thunberg I mean not understanding her strategy and approach. Not that conservatives cannot be environmentalists. Some are.
But none get her
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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