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View Poll Results: The raid was...
Absolutely a good thing - no question 132 77.19%
An outrage, a travesty - what about Magna Carta? Did she die in vain? 4 2.34%
I'll wait before I make a judgement thank you. 29 16.96%
Mar-X-Lago! 6 3.51%
Voters: 171. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11th August 2022, 01:05 PM   #361
Segnosaur
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Quote:
We're idiots if we don't make every single government decision going forward under the assumption that Putin was CCed on literally every government document handled by the White House for that 4 year period.
Except for the lack of evidence part
Except we do have evidence.

We have known cases where Trump has revealed government secrets (either to Russia, or just to the public in general). We know Russia acted to get Trump into power in 2016. We know that Trump has been subservient to Putin. We know that other members of the Trump administration have been extremely careless with security (security waivers given to people who should probably not get clearance, etc.)

We cannot know that any particular document has had its secrecy compromised, but acting under the assumption that it has been is the safest thing to do.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:08 PM   #362
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
We don't even know whether classified documents were found, much less why he kept them. Let's wait and see.
No!
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:10 PM   #363
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward
Edited by jimbob:  moderated content removed
No, we have to assume it happened without regard to evidence. The consequences for not assuming Trump passed everything to Putin are too dire not to.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:17 PM   #364
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Hell, the Ukraine would probably be part of Russia if Trump was still President. Trump was always Putin's ass licker. Putin is the only person that Trump didn't speek disparagingly about. Trump probably had KGB agents going through the files already.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:19 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Trump doesn't strike me as the Littlefinger/Varys "I have dirt on everyone" type.

Mainly because he's an idiot.
He sounds exactly like the sort to me.

So many of his detractors have made full 180s after meeting with Trump I could almost guarantee it.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:20 PM   #366
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Except we do have evidence.

We have known cases where Trump has revealed government secrets (either to Russia, or just to the public in general). We know Russia acted to get Trump into power in 2016. We know that Trump has been subservient to Putin. We know that other members of the Trump administration have been extremely careless with security (security waivers given to people who should probably not get clearance, etc.)
We also KNOW for a fact that he confiscated his translator's notes after he had his private, one-on-one meeting with Putin so that no-one other than him, Putin and the two translators would know what was discussed. That allowed Putin to disclose his version of what was discussed, with no ability to for the US to dispute this. I do not believe for one moment that The Fat Orange Turd knew what he was doing, and why. I would bet real money he did so at Putin's behest.

We also know that he insisted on using his own personal communications devices when conducting government business... business that he is supposed to conduct on a government issued secure device. No prizes for guessing why he insisted on this!

Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
No, we have to assume it happened without regard to evidence. The consequences for not assuming Trump passed everything to Putin are too dire not to.
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
We cannot know that any particular document has had its secrecy compromised, but acting under the assumption that it has been is the safest thing to do.
Both of you are absolutely, 100% correct - hope for the best but plan for the worst!
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:21 PM   #367
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Where's Trump getting "dirt?" Hell and what does dirt even mean in a post-fact world?

What news could come about any Republican Party insider that would:

A) Shock sane people like you and me.
B) Make the cult members turn on them?

Unless Trump has a secret file that proves a bunch of Republicans actually believe in facts and care other human beings (the only two things that will get you kicked out the Republican Party) I don't see what difference Chessmaster Skullduggery is going to have on the landscape.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:24 PM   #368
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Where's Trump getting "dirt?" Hell and what does dirt even mean in a post-fact world?

What news could come about any Republican Party insider that would:

A) Shock sane people like you and me.
B) Make the cult members turn on them?

Unless Trump has a secret file that proves a bunch of Republicans actually believe in facts and care other human beings (the only two things that will get you kicked out the Republican Party) I don't see what difference Chessmaster Skullduggery is going to have on the landscape.
My guess is he got a crap-ton of compromat from Russia when he started his campaign.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:26 PM   #369
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Originally Posted by ZiprHead View Post
My guess is he got a crap-ton of compromat from Russia when he started his campaign.
again, what would it be? Jim Jordan covered up sex abuse and Matt Gaetz slept with underage prostitutes. They are fine
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:29 PM   #370
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So they removed a dozen boxs. Very unlikely that classified documents, which have markings, are many of them. The feds are after more than classified docs. Interesting that DJT has not released the warrant or list of removed items but just bitched about "Witch hunt."
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:30 PM   #371
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
again, what would it be? Jim Jordan covered up sex abuse and Matt Gaetz slept with underage prostitutes. They are fine
It's much better when you actually have pics, say, of Lindsey Graham in bed with a 19 yr old (or younger) guy.

People like Gaetz and Jordan don't need compromat. They were on board from the start. Cruz and Graham and many others did complete 180s.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:30 PM   #372
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Originally Posted by ZiprHead View Post
My guess is he got a crap-ton of compromat from Russia when he started his campaign.
And I'm thinking that many of those compromised were flown to Russia to be explained what the kompromat is and what is expected of them.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...cow-on-july-4/
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:32 PM   #373
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Originally Posted by marting View Post
So they removed a dozen boxs. Very unlikely that classified documents, which have markings, are many of them. The feds are after more than classified docs. Interesting that DJT has not released the warrant or list of removed items but just bitched about "Witch hunt."
The non classified documents are still stolen property.

People are acting like the DoJ should just be cool with 14 boxes of stolen national archives property
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:32 PM   #374
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
The DOJ/FBI is going to release the search warrant and inventory of items taken to the public. Trump's big mouth made this possible because he confirmed there was a search.
Ooooohh~ <Venom lip lick...>
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:32 PM   #375
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Related news. Apparently (grain of salt, hasn't hit any of the major news sources as of this post to the best of my knowledge) there's been a LOT of other supeanos... supenas... Sopranos... goddamn word... subpoenas handed down today in Pennsylvania related to EC Vote shenangians.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:33 PM   #376
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Where's Trump getting "dirt?" Hell and what does dirt even mean in a post-fact world?

What news could come about any Republican Party insider that would:

A) Shock sane people like you and me.
B) Make the cult members turn on them?

Unless Trump has a secret file that proves a bunch of Republicans actually believe in facts and care other human beings (the only two things that will get you kicked out the Republican Party) I don't see what difference Chessmaster Skullduggery is going to have on the landscape.
Sane people are not so much the target of any dirt reveal. Its spineless toads like Kevin McCarthy and Lindsay Graham who he would have a hold over, and it would not necessarily be dirt that would make much of a public/political difference.

What if The Fat Orange Turd had evidence that McCarthy was having an affair with an intern or a staffer? That might not affect him politically, but he might not want his wife and kids to know - that could be enough to keep him in line!

What if The Fat Orange Turd had evidence that Lindsay Graham was gay, and his current lover was a black man? I don't think Graham would want that to get out, and I don't think South Carolina GOP voters would be all that thrilled!
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:34 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Sane people are not so much the target of any dirt reveal. Its spineless toads like Kevin McCarthy and Lindsay Graham who he would have a hold over, and it would not necessarily be dirt that would make much of a public/political difference.

What if The Fat Orange Turd had evidence that McCarthy was having an affair with an intern or a staffer? That might not affect him politically, but he might not want his wife and kids to know - that could be enough to keep him in line!

What if The Fat Orange Turd had evidence that Lindsay Graham was gay, and his current lover was a black man? I don't think Graham would want that to get out, and I don't think South Carolina GOP voters would be all that thrilled!
people are doing what ifs now?

sigh
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:35 PM   #378
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
What if The Fat Orange Turd had evidence that Lindsay Graham was gay, and his current lover was a black man?
The he's underage the Republicans would be fine with it.

ETA: That all being said you're probably right. It's just so hard to get a grasp on how Republican interpersonal relationships work. They don't seem to operate via any human rules. I mean I know when I call other people's wives ugly they usually aren't willing to take a bullet for me.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:40 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
And I'm thinking that many of those compromised were flown to Russia to be explained what the kompromat is and what is expected of them.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...cow-on-july-4/
Yup. It has long been known that Russia follows very closely anyone from the US of any major status. Here's a nice Russian hooker. Don't mind the video camera in her purse.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:45 PM   #380
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Hell, the Ukraine would probably be part of Russia if Trump was still President. Trump was always Putin's ass licker. Putin is the only person that Trump didn't speek disparagingly about. Trump probably had KGB agents going through the files already.
Putin gets more love from Donald then Eric.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:47 PM   #381
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Originally Posted by marting View Post
So they removed a dozen boxs. Very unlikely that classified documents, which have markings, are many of them.
Why do you say that? There were supposedly classified documents in the last batch that was taken from Mare a Lago.
Quote:
The feds are after more than classified docs. Interesting that DJT has not released the warrant or list of removed items but just bitched about "Witch hunt."
I think its pretty expected.

If Trump showed the warrant and/or the list of items that was taken, it might illustrate his guilt. If the search warrant says "Nuclear Launch codes", and the list of seized items says "Retrieved: Nuclear Launch Codes", then its hard for Trump to claim "witch hunt". (Not that I wouldn't expect republicans to try...)

If he keeps the contents of the warrant secret, the MAGAchud can continue to think Trump is somehow innocent.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:50 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
The DOJ/FBI is going to release the search warrant and inventory of items taken to the public. Trump's big mouth made this possible because he confirmed there was a search.
Trump didn't think for a moment that Garland would do this. Normally the FBI/DOJ doesn’t say a word. Trump figured he could own the narrative.
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:52 PM   #383
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Mar-a-Lago = A "Go" Alarm
or
"Arm! (A Goal)"

(I like anagrams...)
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Old 11th August 2022, 01:53 PM   #384
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//Hijack//

I'm surprised Trump kept the name and didn't rename "Trump's Beach Party Palace" or something stupid like that.
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Old 11th August 2022, 02:05 PM   #385
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
The DOJ/FBI is going to release the search warrant and inventory of items taken to the public. Trump's big mouth made this possible because he confirmed there was a search.
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Trump didn't think for a moment that Garland would do this. Normally the FBI/DOJ doesn’t say a word. Trump figured he could own the narrative.
So items seized in the search will be revealed. Any of them which relate to national security would be obliquely referred to. If there are such classified or sensitive documents in the batch Trump will have some explaining to do.

Faced with this situation my guess is that Trump will just say they were "plants" and in so doing start on another story line of lies.
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Old 11th August 2022, 02:05 PM   #386
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Trump didn't think for a moment that Garland would do this. Normally the FBI/DOJ doesn’t say a word. Trump figured he could own the narrative.
Yep, it was a pretty nifty trick for Garland to request the release and call T's bluff. Took me by surprise and I used to be a defense attorney...
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Old 11th August 2022, 02:18 PM   #387
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Trump has until 3pm tomorrow to approve the release of the info. If he doesn't (highly likely), it will go into several days of court battling, where unfortunately he gets to spin the narrative for quite some more time. That is, unless it leaks...
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Old 11th August 2022, 02:26 PM   #388
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Trump has until 3pm tomorrow to approve the release of the info. If he doesn't (highly likely), it will go into several days of court battling, where unfortunately he gets to spin the narrative for quite some more time.
Maybe one might hope it would shut up at least a few republicans.

Ok, the standard Trump cultists will never shut up. But I'm thinking people like Moscow Mitch (who probably would prefer Trump to be gone, but did make some statement calling for "transparency"). At least Garland can say "we tried...but we were blocked".
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Old 11th August 2022, 02:37 PM   #389
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Didn't Trump say earlier that he was going to release the warrant? Or was that in 'about 2 weeks'?

Trump is claiming that his lawyers were fully cooperating with the DOJ/FBI so the 'raid' came as a complete shock. This is a lie. If they'd been fully cooperating, the boxes still being kept at MaL would have been already handed over.

"The government could have had whatever they wanted, if we had it," Trump said. "Everything was fine, better than most previous Presidents, and then, out of nowhere and with no warning, Mar-a-Lago was raided, at 6:30 in the morning, by VERY large numbers of agents, and even 'safecrackers.'"

"If" they had it? Considering 12 boxes were removed, I'd say he damn well did have "it".

The highlighted: he just has to throw that in. What former presidents is he talking about? Ones who had illegally taken documents after leaving the WH? What a clown.
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Old 11th August 2022, 02:48 PM   #390
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Hell, the Ukraine would probably be part of Russia if Trump was still President. Trump was always Putin's ass licker. Putin is the only person that Trump didn't speek disparagingly about. Trump probably had KGB agents going through the files already.
Originally Posted by marting View Post
So they removed a dozen boxs. Very unlikely that classified documents, which have markings, are many of them. The feds are after more than classified docs. Interesting that DJT has not released the warrant or list of removed items but just bitched about "Witch hunt."
Yeah, I tend to agree that this is surely about more than documents. It seems too weirdly analogue in today's world that we are just talking about boxes of documents that, any day now, might fall into the wrong hands, and for that sensitive classified, and presumably time-sensitive information, to just be sitting there for almost two years.

Also, his fans, and his "totally not fans, but y'know the liberal media are untrustworthy" fans like Matt Taibbi, seem very uninterested in the contents of the warrant and are spending all of their time spouting about how this should never happen to *clutches pearls* a president of the United States who they argue should be above the law.

What's in the warrant!?
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:00 PM   #391
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
We don't even know whether classified documents were found, much less why he kept them. Let's wait and see.

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No!
You may be kidding, but you are expressing a sadly common opinion around here.
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:07 PM   #392
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Irony is dead.

Fox guest says the Mar-a-Lago search is evidence Biden doesn't plan to give up power
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:16 PM   #393
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Originally Posted by arayder View Post
So items seized in the search will be revealed. Any of them which relate to national security would be obliquely referred to. If there are such classified or sensitive documents in the batch Trump will have some explaining to do.

Faced with this situation my guess is that Trump will just say they were "plants" and in so doing start on another story line of lies.
I heard they sent 30 agents. And the only reason for sending so many agents is to have witnesses to every move and action they made at Mar A Lago. Nobody does anything alone and if was them I would say work in teams and have one person video recording what the others were doing.
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:27 PM   #394
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Originally Posted by ZiprHead View Post
After you get up off the floor from that video, watch Steve Scalise claims the FBI who raided MaL were 'rogue agents' and Steve Doocy call him on that. Scroll down to the video:

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/fox-...192622168.html
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:37 PM   #395
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
After you get up off the floor from that video, watch Steve Scalise claims the FBI who raided MaL were 'rogue agents' and Steve Doocy call him on that. Scroll down to the video:

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/fox-...192622168.html
Privileged rich white people shocked to find out what "law enforcement" means.

"They're not supposed to come after us! The king's guard is for the serfs!"
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:38 PM   #396
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Jeez!

That gunman firing on FBI building posted on Truth Social...

Quote:
The last post was from the the Ricky Shiffer account on Truth Social is from this morning. It states:

"If you don't hear from me, it is true I tried attacking the F.B.I., and it'll mean either I was taken off the internet, the F.B.I. got me, or they sent the regular cops while"
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Scary right wingers.jpg (32.2 KB, 33 views)
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:39 PM   #397
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Originally Posted by carlosy View Post
So, is it tomorrow already?
Or is it going to be a looong night?
They want to use their AR15s so badly, right? Finally.
Well, some people are taking him up on it. Of course, he will just be selling merch the whole time.
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:41 PM   #398
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Originally Posted by angrysoba View Post
Jeez!

That gunman firing on FBI building posted on Truth Social...
Social media posts suggest he was at the Capital on Jan 6 as well.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/11/u...fer-jan-6.html
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:43 PM   #399
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Originally Posted by angrysoba View Post
Yeah, I tend to agree that this is surely about more than documents. It seems too weirdly analogue in today's world that we are just talking about boxes of documents that, any day now, might fall into the wrong hands, and for that sensitive classified, and presumably time-sensitive information, to just be sitting there for almost two years.

Also, his fans, and his "totally not fans, but y'know the liberal media are untrustworthy" fans like Matt Taibbi, seem very uninterested in the contents of the warrant and are spending all of their time spouting about how this should never happen to *clutches pearls* a president of the United States who they argue should be above the law.

What's in the warrant!?
"WHAT'S IN THE BOX(ES)?"

I think if it's anything other than a severed head, somebody is bound to be disappointed.
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Old 11th August 2022, 03:43 PM   #400
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Didn't Trump say earlier that he was going to release the warrant? Or was that in 'about 2 weeks'?

Trump is claiming that his lawyers were fully cooperating with the DOJ/FBI so the 'raid' came as a complete shock. This is a lie. If they'd been fully cooperating, the boxes still being kept at MaL would have been already handed over.

"The government could have had whatever they wanted, if we had it," Trump said. "Everything was fine, better than most previous Presidents, and then, out of nowhere and with no warning, Mar-a-Lago was raided, at 6:30 in the morning, by VERY large numbers of agents, and even 'safecrackers.'"

"If" they had it? Considering 12 boxes were removed, I'd say he damn well did have "it".

The highlighted: he just has to throw that in. What former presidents is he talking about? Ones who had illegally taken documents after leaving the WH? What a clown.
If I were in a better position, I'd post a clip of William Macy from Fargo, "I'm cooperating here."
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