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Old 7th September 2017, 04:12 AM   #241
Porpoise of Life
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Otherwise if many competent posters will say to me in A&F, I shall respect it blindly.
They've been telling you for nearly fourteen years Kumar.
And you have never listened, or respected their answers.
So excuse me, but I do not believe you.
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Old 7th September 2017, 05:26 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
It is upto them. It is becoming apprentice to me, some relevant science should be possible by these discussions. Otherwise if many competent posters will say to me in A&F, I shall respect it blindly.
I think there's another Irreducible Delusion wrapped up in the oft-repeated concept of A&F, which is decidedly not a part of the scientific method.

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Old 7th September 2017, 05:43 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
They've been telling you for nearly fourteen years Kumar.
And you have never listened, or respected their answers.
So excuse me, but I do not believe you.
It simply is one sided assessment. When a person can indicate probablereasoning reasoning to Spontaneous remission of cancer, sudden death, diabetes, adsorption n even best logical definitions of prime spiritual entities n concepts n many other logical or dynamic understandings, you can not say, neither I learned nor I taught. Don't force me to deviate to present here non A&F part of science and adversed due to it since I respect all understandings having made presence.
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Old 7th September 2017, 05:52 AM   #244
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
I think there's another Irreducible Delusion wrapped up in the oft-repeated concept of A&F, which is decidedly not a part of the scientific method.

Dave
Yes therefore all these discussions. Heat is related product due to any work. It is the product of friction, chemical reaction etc. So how force energy applied or work done in prepration of remedies are accounted need to look again. U may refer my last posts of today. We are counting heating of electric wire on passing current but not current effects.
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Old 7th September 2017, 05:55 AM   #245
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Kumar, take one of your homeopathic remedies, heat it up, and you can make a nice cup of tea with it.

Or coffee if you prefer.
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Old 7th September 2017, 06:47 AM   #246
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If you're going to sell pseudoscience, you need from time to time to ring in some fresh pseudoscientific phrases, to keep the coolies bamboozled. Where do you go for science-like words and sentences?

Why, right here at ISF!
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Old 7th September 2017, 08:17 AM   #247
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Science is a common name to better understand something as per nature of that thing. Modern medicine is one healing system, homeopathy other. Science is not the property of either.
Anecdotes are not science
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Old 7th September 2017, 09:26 AM   #248
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
Why ask questions? You don't care about the real answer anyway. You just want to twist it until it looks like it agrees with you. You're using science like magic... Pretending that as long as you use the right words, you can make anything true.
Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
They've been telling you for nearly fourteen years Kumar.
And you have never listened, or respected their answers.
So excuse me, but I do not believe you.

QFT
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Old 7th September 2017, 10:49 AM   #249
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Originally Posted by ferd burfle View Post
QFT
Not right assessment. Simply, I go on discussing till I scientifically or logically satisfied and do not disrespect any understanding having mass presence nor like others to do it because things can always change on better understandings.
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Old 7th September 2017, 11:54 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Not right assessment. Simply, I go on discussing till I scientifically or logically satisfied and do not disrespect any understanding having mass presence nor like others to do it because things can always change on better understandings.
If this was true then this would be fine but if evidence to counter your claims is present it then you either ignore it or reword parts of it so that you can make it sound like it supports your claims.

When it becomes apparent that the evidence is irrefutable you leave the thread and then start an essentially identical thread months or years later.

This is why the second post in any thread you start is so often "No kumar, homoeopathy does not work"
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Old 7th September 2017, 12:39 PM   #251
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
....2

Heat is not the only product of force applied but some other changes can also happen to fully justify the applied force. On passing current through a wire, though it can heat it but also does other works.
That is basically correct. Various forms of energy can be converted to many other kinds of energy, even to several forms.

Hans
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Old 7th September 2017, 12:44 PM   #252
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Originally Posted by MRC_Hans View Post
That is basically correct. Various forms of energy can be converted to many other kinds of energy, even to several forms.

Hans
I double-dog dare you to try working A&F into that.
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Old 7th September 2017, 02:08 PM   #253
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Thumbs down Kumar: A dumb demand to read many studies on already debunked homeopathy

Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Read the pubmed links I provided about studies on homeopathy.
8 September 2017 Kumar: Idiotic demand to read many studies on already debunked homeopathy, analyze them and tell him about them!

What make the demand idiotic is that this has already been done and published in papers on PubMed, he knows it and writes "This is one sided story" !
Mojo: So people carry out systematic reviews and meta-analyses, and these show that the apparent effects of homoeopathy are illusory.
And from me:
Originally Posted by Reality Check View Post
For example: A systematic review of systematic reviews of homeopathy by Edzard Ernst (a specialist in the study of complementary and alternative medicine rejects homeopathy!).
8 September 2017 Kumar: Lies about systematic reviews of all studies that show homeopathy is no better than placebo.
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Old 7th September 2017, 02:23 PM   #254
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Thumbs down Kumar: A lie abut heat being relevant to the delusion of homeopathy

Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
How it is relevant: ...
8 September 2017 Kumar: A lie about heat being relevant to the delusion of homeopathy.

Heat is "a product or energy conversion to action/work done". Do work on something and you add energy to it. That energy can then flow to its surroundings. That flow is called heat !

8 September 2017 Kumar: A stupid "how force applied or work done for preparing the remedies will be accounted" question.
Pick up a bottle in your hand. Shake it. That is "how force applied or work done" is accounted.
Pick up a bottle in your hand. Bump it against a leather Bible. That is "how force applied or work done" is accounted.
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Old 7th September 2017, 02:32 PM   #255
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Thumbs down Kumar: The science is Absolute & Final delusion pops up yet again

Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Otherwise if many competent posters will say to me in A&F, I shall respect it blindly.
The many competent posters here are not gong to follow a delusion that science is A&F, Kumar.
8 September 2017 Kumar: The science is Absolute & Final delusion pops up yet again.
We will continue to state basic facts.
Homeopathy does not work because it has ingredients ]that are not known to cure anything and then gets rid of any active ingredients by dilution. Homeopathic remedies are sugar water or sugar pills. They will have an effect, e.g. take enough over a long period and you may get diabetes! There is no evidence that they cure anything better than a placebo.
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Old 7th September 2017, 05:40 PM   #256
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Not right assessment. Simply, I go on discussing till I scientifically or logically satisfied and do not disrespect any understanding having mass presence nor like others to do it because things can always change on better understandings.

You possess, as Dave Rogers has pointed out, the Irreducible Delusion that homeopathy is effective. You are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to your own facts.
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Old 7th September 2017, 06:11 PM   #257
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Originally Posted by MRC_Hans View Post
That is basically correct. Various forms of energy can be converted to many other kinds of energy, even to several forms.

Hans
Tks. Then how it can be said for sure that force applied and energy spent or work done for preparing remedies is fully converted into heat and dissipated? Heat is contrasted with work, is indicative on one link I had given recently. Probably heat is not the product of work done but is of friction. If so, why there can't be possibility of conversion to some other form out of many forms I have indicated. Moreover, when anything come to its specific nstural position, it appears that it get unlimited specific potential.
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Old 7th September 2017, 06:29 PM   #258
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
... Moreover, when anything come to its specific nstural position, it appears that it get unlimited specific potential.

I snipped most of your continuing torture of the language (honestly... Irma evacuees can hear the screams)... but the part I left is some stunning gibberish in your search for a justification you will never find.
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Old 7th September 2017, 07:46 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
If this was true then this would be fine but if evidence to counter your claims is present it then you either ignore it or reword parts of it so that you can make it sound like it supports your claims.

When it becomes apparent that the evidence is irrefutable you leave the thread and then start an essentially identical thread months or years later.

This is why the second post in any thread you start is so often "No kumar, homoeopathy does not work"
No but you ignore possibilities.
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Old 7th September 2017, 07:49 PM   #260
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Originally Posted by ferd burfle View Post
You possess, as Dave Rogers has pointed out, the Irreducible Delusion that homeopathy is effective. You are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to your own facts.
I am entitled my own opinion and facts.
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Old 7th September 2017, 07:51 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
No but you ignore possibilities.
But he does not ignore impossibilities, .e.g, homeopathetic efficacy.
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Old 7th September 2017, 07:53 PM   #262
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Originally Posted by fagin View Post
Kumar, take one of your homeopathic remedies, heat it up, and you can make a nice cup of tea with it.

Or coffee if you prefer.
Heat should just be a bye-product of work done for prepration of remedies not the product which should be in some other form, yet unexplored. Somewhat alike for example: side effects not real effect from a healing agent. Do you base more on side effects than real?
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Old 7th September 2017, 08:46 PM   #263
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Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
But he does not ignore impossibilities, .e.g, homeopathetic efficacy.
That is preception towards one side. To be justified, one should account both sides, equally.
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Old 7th September 2017, 10:44 PM   #264
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
That is preception towards one side. .
No.
If you meant perception, then mine is a conclusion arrived at after years of being exposed to the lies of homeopathetic believers, and study of their supposed "research".

Homeopathetic "remedies" are scientifically impossible and have never been demonstrated to have any affect better than placebo.

If you meant preception, it is you that consistently demonstrates a pre-conception on one side and that is that homeopathetic "remedies" work.

You have spent years on this forum consistently ignore all evidence presented to you that demonstrably contradicts your preconceptions of homeopathetic efficacy.
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Old 7th September 2017, 11:44 PM   #265
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Originally Posted by MRC_Hans View Post
That is basically correct. Various forms of energy can be converted to many other kinds of energy, even to several forms.

Hans
Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
No.
If you meant perception, then mine is a conclusion arrived at after years of being exposed to the lies of homeopathetic believers, and study of their supposed "research".

Homeopathetic "remedies" are scientifically impossible and have never been demonstrated to have any affect better than placebo.

If you meant preception, it is you that consistently demonstrates a pre-conception on one side and that is that homeopathetic "remedies" work.

You have spent years on this forum consistently ignore all evidence presented to you that demonstrably contradicts your preconceptions of homeopathetic efficacy.
You need to base clinical or practical observations n significance. Leave rest for research till science become A&F. In many systems there is clear apparent stimuli but still you degrade those on practical significance basis. My ultimate n A&F view.
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Old 7th September 2017, 11:53 PM   #266
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It has been clinically tested. And it doesn't work.
You're basically telling us that you're never going to listen to anything that challenges your preferred conclusion.

That's your choice, but why have you been trying to trick this forum into agreeing with you for fourteen years?
What do you hope to gain?
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Old 8th September 2017, 12:17 AM   #267
Kumar
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
It has been clinically tested. And it doesn't work.
You're basically telling us that you're never going to listen to anything that challenges your preferred conclusion.

That's your choice, but why have you been trying to trick this forum into agreeing with you for fourteen years?
What do you hope to gain?
I simply try to know better unless provided. No one can force other to take any particular agent but can give his views. No one here is kid who can be deviated. My personal option is to opt well existing agents consistent since long back. New one need to go through severe field applications for many many years.
Likewise, no one is entitled to damage or discourage people to opt any well approved system by regulating authorities. Leave this work to govt n regulating agencies. Sorry.
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Old 8th September 2017, 12:26 AM   #268
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
That is preception towards one side. To be justified, one should account both sides, equally.

No. A compromise between a correct position and a wrong position is wrong.
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Old 8th September 2017, 12:28 AM   #269
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Heat should just be a bye-product of work done for prepration of remedies not the product which should be in some other form, yet unexplored.

Heat is not information. It doesn't help you.
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Old 8th September 2017, 12:43 AM   #270
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Heat is not information. It doesn't help you.
Yes there for I am not making base of heat disppitation during remedy preprations. I am checking other base from many relevant terms as indicated by me in this topic.
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Old 8th September 2017, 12:43 AM   #271
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
I simply try to know better unless provided. No one can force other to take any particular agent but can give his views. No one here is kid who can be deviated. My personal option is to opt well existing agents consistent since long back. New one need to go through severe field applications for many many years.
Likewise, no one is entitled to damage or discourage people to opt any well approved system by regulating authorities. Leave this work to govt n regulating agencies. Sorry.

My god.
The screams... they're getting loud again.
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Old 8th September 2017, 12:46 AM   #272
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
No. A compromise between a correct position and a wrong position is wrong.
We need to define what is true? An only positive or an only negative or a balance.We do account real effects(positives) along with side effects(negatives).
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Old 8th September 2017, 01:30 AM   #273
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
I am entitled my own opinion and facts.
At this point you make it clear that any kind of conversation with you is pointless; anything disagreeing with your delusion will simply be rejected because you have chosen it not to be a fact. This is an inevitable side effect of an Irreducible Delusion.

Dave
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Old 8th September 2017, 01:50 AM   #274
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
We need to define what is true? An only positive or an only negative or a balance.We do account real effects(positives) along with side effects(negatives).
There are good sides and bad sides to the truth, but there is only one truth.

Hans
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Old 8th September 2017, 02:00 AM   #275
MRC_Hans
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Tks. Then how it can be said for sure that force applied and energy spent or work done for preparing remedies is fully converted into heat and dissipated? Heat is contrasted with work, is indicative on one link I had given recently. Probably heat is not the product of work done but is of friction. If so, why there can't be possibility of conversion to some other form out of many forms I have indicated. Moreover, when anything come to its specific nstural position, it appears that it get unlimited specific potential.
We cannot say it is only converted to heat. For instance, some is converted to noise.

But that is what we have been discussing: What kind of energy could it be?

Such energy must have at least three properties:

1) It must be able to persist through all the many process steps that a homeopathic remedy goes through.

2) It must be able to accurately reflect the complex properties of the MT.

3) It must somehow be able to transfer that information to the human body.

... And of course, such information must somehow have relevance for curing diseases, but that is another topic.

I don't know of any such energy form, and you, Kumar, have certainly not been able to suggest any, either.

Perhaps you should start by suggesting where such energy might come from, because it can't come from the processing. Simple logic will tell you that if it comes from the processing, it will reflect properties of the processing, and not the MT. In other words, it has to be there from the start.

Hans
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Old 8th September 2017, 02:04 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by MRC_Hans View Post
There are good sides and bad sides to the truth, but there is only one truth.

Hans
Yes and that is A&F. When we shall achieve it, neither there will be multiplicity in POVs nor "half truth is often a great lie".
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Old 8th September 2017, 02:19 AM   #277
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Originally Posted by MRC_Hans View Post
We cannot say it is only converted to heat. For instance, some is converted to noise.

But that is what we have been discussing: What kind of energy could it be?

Such energy must have at least three properties:

1) It must be able to persist through all the many process steps that a homeopathic remedy goes through.

2) It must be able to accurately reflect the complex properties of the MT.

3) It must somehow be able to transfer that information to the human body.

... And of course, such information must somehow have relevance for curing diseases, but that is another topic.
Very rightly said. Thanks. Apart these three there can be one more(non-placebo) but that is very much beyond this topic.

Quote:
I don't know of any such energy form, and you, Kumar, have certainly not been able to suggest any, either.

Perhaps you should start by suggesting where such energy might come from, because it can't come from the processing. Simple logic will tell you that if it comes from the processing, it will reflect properties of the processing, and not the MT. In other words, it has to be there from the start.

Hans
That is what we have to find. May come by wild search or by chance like apple falling logic..

Such energy may only come either from applied energy or work done for remedy prepration or by some chemical or structural modification. It appear certain disppited heat during this process do not fully convert input energies.

Moreover, if you have read many types indicated by me previously(can be some more) related to molecular interactions and one more of developing potentiality due to coming on specific natural position, probably we all may find some justification(not only me). Best wishes for it.
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Old 8th September 2017, 02:24 AM   #278
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
At this point you make it clear that any kind of conversation with you is pointless; anything disagreeing with your delusion will simply be rejected because you have chosen it not to be a fact. This is an inevitable side effect of an Irreducible Delusion.

Dave
I slightly correct: I am entitled my own opinion and all are entitled to facts.

No, simply carry on, you may change your feeling, because my intentions are not bad but simply, I want to see maximum. Thanks
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Old 8th September 2017, 04:21 AM   #279
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Originally Posted by fagin View Post
Kumar, take one of your homeopathic remedies, heat it up, and you can make a nice cup of tea with it.

Or coffee if you prefer.
Milk should be added afterwards, as this sets the strength of the tea.

This is a far more interesting line of discussion for this thread to now take.
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Old 8th September 2017, 05:14 AM   #280
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
It has been clinically tested. And it doesn't work.
You're basically telling us that you're never going to listen to anything that challenges your preferred conclusion.

That's your choice, but why have you been trying to trick this forum into agreeing with you for fourteen years?
What do you hope to gain?
Originally Posted by MRC_Hans View Post
We cannot say it is only converted to heat. For instance, some is converted to noise.

But that is what we have been discussing: What kind of energy could it be?

Such energy must have at least three properties:

1) It must be able to persist through all the many process steps that a homeopathic remedy goes through.

2) It must be able to accurately reflect the complex properties of the MT.

3) It must somehow be able to transfer that information to the human body.

... And of course, such information must somehow have relevance for curing diseases, but that is another topic.

I don't know of any such energy form, and you, Kumar, have certainly not been able to suggest any, either.

Perhaps you should start by suggesting where such energy might come from, because it can't come from the processing. Simple logic will tell you that if it comes from the processing, it will reflect properties of the processing, and not the MT. In other words, it has to be there from the start.

Hans
Sorry, since your above post is quite justified, I have to give full respect and thought to it. Hence pls ignore my previous reply and I shall repharse ir bit later.
Tks.
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